A Gentry sailing canoe.......sort of....

[amish rob]

Re: A Gentry sailing canoe.......sort of....

Whassat? Nice hat and a slicker looking sail.

The old canoe. I’m getting less acrobatic with each year. The trimaran project (ahem) will be a replacement. I was thinking of straight sailing canoe, but The Boss doesn’t want me out in a wee tippy boat any more.

The boat is just a goofy sharpie-esque boat with a little flare and a bit of arc to the bottom. The sail is,one I dreamed up and had a friend make. He’s a real wizard.

Incidentally, this is one of the later trips in the boat. I never quite got used to the push/pull tiller.

The boat has been permanently converted into a fishing canoe for my FIL, and the sail is on loan. The mast is now the mizzen mast on orange boat. Will be anyhow.

Peace,
Robert

P.S. That hat is a match to one my wife owns. I am somewhat of a hat guy, actually. Maybe twenty, total. People who are balding like hats.

[amish rob]

Re: A Gentry sailing canoe.......sort of....

Hi Matt, the nylon in this damp weather looks awfull. It looked the same as the last batch i ordered, but it seems to behave a bit different and relaxes a lot more. Looks good under a hot sun, would look crap on a wet weekend. No doubt it is still incredibly tough, but i am dissapointed. Marcin Bobber over on a Facebook SOF site is sending me some samples of a tighter weave nylon, maybe that will work better on the next one.
Glad to hear you have sorted your tinkering with the board, im happy with what i did and it works well now that i have stops to limit movement. Nice view!

I’d rather go back to cotton duck than use nylon. Any nylon. I hate nylon for skinning boats. One I went to polyester, I was hooked. I’ll never skin with anything but, again.

But, that’s me, and my own quirks. One reason I am reticent to advise. Who cares about what I like? Haha

Peace,
Stitch Witchington

[tink]

Re: A Gentry sailing canoe.......sort of....

Your thoughts and wisdom are always welcome,

I wish I could find suitable polyester here in the UK - not treated

from post 91 a Trimaran - in my case a simple canoe with outriggers has a lot of mileage, also obsessed with a idea of a Skin on Frame Peapod and if I ever move somewhere more suitable a Duck Punt - perhaps I just take what I like from each and come up with something new.

[tink]

Re: A Gentry sailing canoe.......sort of....

Hi Matt, the nylon in this damp weather looks awfull. It looked the same as the last batch i ordered, but it seems to behave a bit different and relaxes a lot more. Looks good under a hot sun, would look crap on a wet weekend. No doubt it is still incredibly tough, but i am dissapointed. Marcin Bobber over on a Facebook SOF site is sending me some samples of a tighter weave nylon, maybe that will work better on the next one.
Glad to hear you have sorted your tinkering with the board, im happy with what i did and it works well now that i have stops to limit movement. Nice view!

Such a pity we can’t get untreated Polyester here in Europe, I asked on the Facebook group but didn’t get anything. Nylon is probably OK on a skinny canoe but with the extra span on something bigger a bigger issue. It is easy to get hold of reinforced PVC as used by many commercial SOF folder and Yostwerks ( http://www.yostwerks.org/MainMenu.html ) but again long span might be an issue.

On a side note how much do you feel the skin adds to the rigidity of the canoe? Do you notice less stiffness when the skin has stretched?

[tink]

Re: A Gentry sailing canoe.......sort of....

These guys are using hemp, not as tough as nylon more expensive but shrinks. Some of their videos should white boats on which the skin looks poor but I think the newer ones are the brown skin ones and they look good.

http://www.a-mare.es/en/

[John B]

Re: A Gentry sailing canoe.......sort of....

An acquaintance of mine used a material sold as ' horse cover' material. Evidently its a blend of poly and something, looks very successful to my eye, and he thinks its very tough. Perhaps its just thicker?
Any knowledge on that approach?

[skaraborgcraft]

Re: A Gentry sailing canoe.......sort of....

.

On a side note how much do you feel the skin adds to the rigidity of the canoe? Do you notice less stiffness when the skin has stretched?

None. I would say the whole frame is so well constructed the skin really just keeps the water out, i may aswell have wrapped it in cling-film. The Polyester can be obtained easily from Dyson in the US, but like you, i was hoping for a source closer to home. I have some samples coming from Poland, will let you know.....

[Matt young]

Re: A Gentry sailing canoe.......sort of....

Skaraborgcraft, thank you for letting us know how the nylon preforms. Too bad you can’t get polyester in Europe. Let me know if I can help, I will be ordering some very soon. I am happy to mail you or Tink what you want, from the USA. It it makes sense?

[tink]

None. I would say the whole frame is so well constructed the skin really just keeps the water out, i may aswell have wrapped it in cling-film. The Polyester can be obtained easily from Dyson in the US, but like you, i was hoping for a source closer to home. I have some samples coming from Poland, will let you know.....

Thanks, did some very crude modelling yesterday. It might be crude and conclusions obvious but certainly gives you a feel for the stiffness and how to improve it.








Going to do more tests adding a skin, if the skin doesn’t add any stiffness think removable reinforced PVC may be my direction, easy to get and relatively cheap.
Had reports that the material from Dyson is hard to get through customs

https://tinkboats.wordpress.com

http://proasail.blogspot.co.uk

What I get up to
https://youtu.be/X9NZEyvpb_Y Streaker dinghy
https://youtu.be/oni-3rJzxqQ Sail Canoe
https://youtu.be/eW078PPgJak Proa

[skaraborgcraft]

Re: A Gentry sailing canoe.......sort of....

Had reports that the material from Dyson is hard to get through customs

https://tinkboats.wordpress.com

http://proasail.blogspot.co.uk

What I get up to
https://youtu.be/X9NZEyvpb_Y Streaker dinghy
https://youtu.be/oni-3rJzxqQ Sail Canoe
https://youtu.be/eW078PPgJak Proa

Im sure you can get it through, but maybe only with paying an import duty charge. The racelite rudder fittings i got from Duckworks ended up almost twice the price after Swedish customs hit me with import tax.

Im sure with a more flexible/lashed frame, the skin might add some stiffness, but with nylon being able to stretch 300%, its value in that regard is zero.

[MN Dave]

Re: A Gentry sailing canoe.......sort of....

Hi Matt, the nylon in this damp weather looks awfull. It looked the same as the last batch i ordered, but it seems to behave a bit different and relaxes a lot more. Looks good under a hot sun, would look crap on a wet weekend. No doubt it is still incredibly tough, but i am dissapointed. Marcin Bobber over on a Facebook SOF site is sending me some samples of a tighter weave nylon, maybe that will work better on the next one.
Glad to hear you have sorted your tinkering with the board, im happy with what i did and it works well now that i have stops to limit movement. Nice view!

The way I was taught to stretch the Nylon is to sew it about 3-4" short and dunk it in water before stretching it over the canoe. It seems to stay pretty tight. We had to compensate for the tension with some extra rocker in the frame to prevent hogging. We also use 2-part PU, which is a much tougher material than paints, varnishes and construction adhesive. The skin stays tight after a week in the Boundary Waters.

I understand that some people have strong preferences for either Nylon or Dacron. The guys I work with started with Nylon, tried Dacron for a while and settled on Nylon. It was not a very strong preference. I think that if they had started with Dacron and then tried Nylon, they would have settled on Dacron. My take on it that the one you get more familiar with first tends to be your preference.

None. I would say the whole frame is so well constructed the skin really just keeps the water out, i may aswell have wrapped it in cling-film. The Polyester can be obtained easily from Dyson in the US, but like you, i was hoping for a source closer to home. I have some samples coming from Poland, will let you know.....

I have been working with frames that are much lighter, like Platt Monfort's, and the skin seems to add some rigidity. The 17 1/2 ft canoes weigh about 40 lbs.

[Matt young]

Re: A Gentry sailing canoe.......sort of....

That is good information Dave.

I recently emailed Dyson about a fabric order and also asked him about shipping to Sweden and the UK. He can do it no problem, he said it is a bit spendy. About $70 for two kayaks worth of material. Than I also don’t know what kind of tariff Sweden would then drop on it, as Skar has talked about.

[skaraborgcraft]

Re: A Gentry sailing canoe.......sort of....

I have had some samples of another nylon from a guy on a SOF facebook group, kind of local down the road in Poland. This stuff is of a far tighter weave than the stuff from Germany, and i will give it a go on the next yak. I will get a picture for reference later.
I only ever recall one occasion of having a package from the US get import duty in the UK, yet everything in Sweden from outside of the EU has been stopped and charges applied, the last duty of 3 times the value on a 36 year old scratched and bent aluminium bash plate for my old XL250! Not even a system to question the charge.