An unending source of bile and vitriol

[Keith Wilson]

Sorry, but you blokes don't get to decide. You can sit there and make public statements and gird your egos with virtuous pronouncements, and feel yourselves superior for it, but in the end, it's not your call.

You're wrong; it is our call. This is still a democracy, and the decisions about what our government does are in the end subject to the will of the voters. Blathering on endlessly about what ought to be done, and the virtues and faults of elected officials, is one of the things virtuous citizens of a functioning democracy do. You may prefer a more streamlined system; examples abound, but they don't have a good record. And after blathering, we go out and vote. Sorry SB, for all its tedium, confusion and faults, this is how democracy works. Deal with it.

[Sky Blue]

You don't get to decide, Keith. Indeed, this immigration bill is probably not what you would have.

[Keith Wilson]

I don't get to decide, myself, today. We do get to decide, however, and I will do my level best to ensure stupid, vengeful, racist, xenophobic cruelty has no place in US government policy.

[Garret]

You don't get to decide, Keith. Indeed, this immigration bill is probably not what you would have.

But we (theoretically anyway: gerrymandering, etc.) get to decide who decides.

Deciding who those people should be needs to be discussed - unless you're a lockstep party voter of course.

[Sky Blue]

I don't get to decide, myself, today. Wedo get to decide, however, and I will do my level best to ensure stupid vengeful racist xenophobic cruelty has no place in US government policy.

Whatever. The inscription on the Statue of Liberty is a statement of idealism, not policy. The inscription is not the law and never has been.

[LeeG]

Exactly. To avoid unpleasantness in their home country - wars, famines, poverty, oppression, all the standard things that go wrong - and to come someplace they have a better chance. Why else would people emigrate? Sometimes it's more of one factor, sometimes more of another, but at bottom it's all from the same list.

And remember, those who are lazy, lacking ambition, content with things as they are, unwilling to take risks, unwilling to try new things, willing to put up with a lot of crap rather than change - those folks and their descendants are still in Norway, or Germany, or Ireland, or Italy, or Mexico, or China, or various other sh!thole counties around the world.

and SB responds with....”you blokes....”

[bobbys]

I don't get to decide, myself, today. We do get to decide, however, and I will do my level best to ensure stupid, vengeful, racist, xenophobic cruelty has no place in US government policy.

.

We are not a country if we have no borders.

. So you get to decide our rules have no meaning and we are the world.

Then you play moral judge and deem anyone wanting borders are racist, vengeful,etc?

[bobbys]

Whatever. The inscription on the Statue of Liberty is a statement of idealism, not policy. The inscription is not the law and never has been.

.

People were turned away then.

[John of Phoenix]

I don't get to decide, myself, today. We do get to decide, however, and I will do my level best to ensure stupid, vengeful, racist, xenophobic cruelty has no place in US government policy.

Those of us who despise it will do our best to end it. Racists who adore it will do their best to spread it.

We ALL get to decide.

[Canoez]

.

We are not a country if we have no borders.

. So you get to decide our rules have no meaning and we are the world.

Then you play moral judge and deem anyone wanting borders are racist, vengeful,etc?

We have borders.

We have border controls.

You will never build a wall and keep people in or out. History is replete with that lesson.

If Trump's wall is so important, why isn't he building one to keep all the Canadians out? (Apologies to the Canadians here...)

Should we have immigration controls? Yes. Should they be based in Trump's ethno-centered racism? No.

[StevenBauer]

Is it time yet for massive protests all across the country? Or do we have to wait ‘til trump fires Mueller?

[Sky Blue]

Somehow the Left has conned themselves into thinking that immigration to the US is a right absolute and those that do not share this view are irredeemably racist.

[bobbys]

We have borders.

We have border controls.

You will never build a wall and keep people in or out. History is replete with that lesson.

If Trump's wall is so important, why isn't he building one to keep all the Canadians out? (Apologies to the Canadians here...)

Should we have immigration controls? Yes. Should they be based in Trump's ethno-centered racism? No.

.

You believe we have secure borders. ?.

Guess what the easter bunny does not paint those eggs.

The kardishians are not virgins ..

Santa brought me a red ryder bb gun.......wait a second.......

[bamamick]

Unfortunately very many people are going to suffer for it in the meantime, but soon the old white men's day will be over and things will be changed for the better, forever. The old white men will do anything they can to protect their immediate future but they know their time is coming. Obama's time scared the hell out of them because they saw that pretty much everyone immigrating, if given a vote, would vote Democrat. And instead of trying to be reasonable and figure out a way to allow these hard working people a place in our society they took the 180 degree path and decided to build a wall. Whether it gets built physically or not doesn't matter, it's there, right now.

But hopefully not for long.

Mickey Lake

[SMARTINSEN]

Nigerian immigrants are better educated on the whole than Americans. 40% vs 30% with at lest a 4 yr degree. These are the very people we should encourage, regardless of race.

Edit to add, this dovetails well with Mickey's comment above.

[Keith Wilson]

Whatever. The inscription on the Statue of Liberty is a statement of idealism, not policy. The inscription is not the law and never has been.

Of course not. The US has had spasms of fearful xenophobic nativist bullsh!t over and over again, many time in our history, and you and those who agree with you are having one now. The job of the rest of us is to prevent fear, hatred, and misguided selfishness from turning into law.

[Sky Blue]

Nigerian immigrants are better educated on the whole than Americans. 40% vs 30% with at lest a 4 yr degree. These are the very people we should encourage, regardless of race.

It's true. The Left wants this to be about race.

[Sky Blue]

Of course not. The US has had spasms of fearful xenophobic nativist bullsh!t over and over again, many time in our history, and you and those who agree with you are having one now. The job of the rest of us is to prevent fear, hatred, and misguided selfishness from turning into law.

What do you mean "agree with me?" All I've said is that he asks a very good question, even if rudely so.

[Keith Wilson]

What do you mean "agree with me?" All I've said is that he asks a very good question, even if rudely so.

Yeah, right. "Awww, shucks, all I'm doing is just asking questions." Yet you 'couldn't be more pleased' with the job Mr Trump is doing. If you hang out with the pigs, you'll end up with bad-smelling stains on your pants.

One way or another, whatever policies you personally support, the job of the rest of us is to prevent fear, hatred, and misguided selfishness from turning into law.

[John of Phoenix]

Yeah, right. "Awww, shucks, all I'm doing is just asking questions." Yet you 'couldn't be more pleased' with the job Mr Trump is doing. If you hang out with the pigs, you'll end up with bad-smelling stains on your pants.

One way or another, whatever policies you personally support, the job of the rest of us is to prevent fear, hatred, and misguided selfishness from turning into law.

trump thinks he gets away with that "That's not what I just said" crap so the acolytes think they can do it too. Talk about delusional.

[bobbys]

trump thinks he gets away with that crap so the acolytes think they can do it too. Talk about delusional.

.

Riding keiths coat tails.........

[John of Phoenix]

Decoder ring? Anyone?

[Tom Montgomery]

Sorry, but you blokes don't get to decide. You can sit there and make public statements and gird your egos with virtuous pronouncements and feel yourselves superior for it, but in the end, it's not your call.

What nonsense. We blokes recognize a ****bird when he squawks and we have every right to call him and his defenders out.

What are any of you doing about this issue, tangibly, in the real world, apart from making pronouncements on an internet forum about woodenboats?

I contribute monitarily to both the DNC and to state and local Democratic candidates in the hope they will drive out the miserable creatures.

P.S. It pleases me no end that our “pronouncements” on this “internet forum about woodenboats” bothers you so.

[downthecreek]

Sorry, but you blokes don't get to decide. You can sit there and make public statements and gird your egos with virtuous pronouncements and feel yourselves superior for it, but in the end, it's not your call.

What are any of you doing about this issue, tangibly, in the real world, apart from making pronouncements on an internet forum about woodenboats?

Still stuck in the groove.

[isla]

.

Riding keiths coat tails.........

You remind me of Carla from Cheers. You walk by, throw out a one-liner, then disappear. Except Carla was amusing

[Figment]

What do you mean "agree with me?" All I've said is that he asks a very good question, even if rudely so.

Forget about the rudeness, focus on the content; What, exactly, is very good about the question?

[Old Dryfoot]

It's undeniable. The "man" is a racist pig.

https://www.vox.com/2016/7/25/122708...racism-history

[Keith Wilson]

Decoder ring? Anyone?

Dude! Getcher big feet off my coat tails!

[Hugh Conway]

What do you mean "agree with me?" All I've said is that he asks a very good question, even if rudely so.

It's a very good question why we want more educated, harder working, people to come to the US, start businesses, and make our nation more prosperous? Let's be honest - like Trump you don't give a damn about the answer, that's well known and easy to find. Hint: Nigerian-Americans are the best educated immigrant group in the US (well more than the US average) and have a median income well above the US median.

He took his little phone lap last night to his friends, you take yours here.

[Ralphie Boy]

Even if you disregard for a moment Trumps's immigration policies, his statement reached a new low.

When the President of one of the richest countries on earth refers to some of the poorest countries as "sh--holes", he shows just what a despicable creature he is.

Not sure how anyone with a conscience can defend that statement. All I see here is his supporters trying to change the subject.

Do they realize that the whole world is unfortunately forced to listen to what comes out of Trump's bloated disgusting mouth? Do they realize that for better or worse this POS is representing our country to the world? If Trump was the CEO of America the board would fire him - for all the damage he's done to the company's brand!

[Osborne Russell]

It's true. The Left wants this to be about race.

Ja, it's plain to see he wants Norwegians because they're socialists.

[birlinn]

Ja, it's plain to see he wants Norwegians because they're socialists.

Unless he had Anders Breivik in mind....

[Osborne Russell]

Trump did not run as a moral candidate. Spare us the outrage. No one cares.

BS. He owes his office to the evangelicals, and to the alt right, who promote the "clash of civilizations" paradigm. That's morality on a supernatural, and on a world-historical scale, respectively.

One thing he has done is to put a sharp point on the question, what's worse, immoral or amoral?

[JimD]

Showed up on facebook. True?

[Old Dryfoot]

Showed up on facebook. True?

Yes.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/12/30/us/emm...ire/index.html

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/12/o...el-mensah.html

Then Mensah dashed toward the flames again and reached the fourth floor in a desperate effort to save a fifth person. This brave soul from what Trump would describe as a s-hole country, the kind of person Trump was insulting, never made it out. Mensah’s body was found high in the building’s wreckage.

A few days ago, the Army posthumously awarded Mensah the Soldier’s Medal, its highest award for heroism outside of combat, and New York State awarded him its Medal for Valor. The citation on the state medal reads: “His courageous and selfless act in the face of unimaginable conditions are consistent with the highest traditions of uniformed service.”

Who better embodies our nation’s values? A politician with a history of racist comments who took five deferments to escape military duty in the Vietnam War, including one for heel spurs? Or a heroic Ghanaian immigrant and soldier who dies in a fire while rescuing others?