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Thread: Power of touch

  1. #1
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    Default Power of touch

    Interesting article, particularly in view of that representative who called a colleague ‘gay’, when he touched his hand. Lots of pathology out there!

    https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/12/0...gtype=Homepage
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  2. #2
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    This past week a friend inadvertently stepped in front of a woman who was walking past. No big deal, but as he apologized he reached up and touched her shoulder. It was a very human response, but we teased him that he was now guilty of harassment.

    Touch is very human. Without it, I think we lose our mental health. It's amazing how a few can ruin life for so many of us.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Agree; and you’re not far off about ‘harassment ‘. It’s in the eye of the beholder.

    Good times.
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Nuture, not nature, it is learned behaviour, and some have great aversion to being touched.

    I know men that would lash out if you touched them, and I know a woman that would back up off the end of a dock before she would let someone (anyone) hug her.

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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Just keep your hands to yourself and everything should work out fine.

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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Its also somewhat cultural, in some societies it perfectly OK for men to hold hands in public, it certainly doesn't mean they are gay.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    We are group or herd animals, in that we live in family groups. if a child is not touched, as in rubbed, massaged, cuddled thy will grow up badly maladjusted. You are conversing with some one that this happened to.

    Society has become very sexualised, everything one does in normal human interaction today supposedly is a sexual move. Excuse me? most women do absolutly nothing for me, and anyway, I'm married. Yes, to me , that is the end of it. there is only one person alive I want to do rude an naughty things with.

    Maybe, it's a power thing, or, they have issues and they want to punish someone for their pain

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Quote Originally Posted by George Jung View Post
    Agree; and you’re not far off about ‘harassment ‘. It’s in the eye of the beholder.
    Sometimes, perhaps. But very often not. Repeated behaviour, physical or verbal, ranging from relatively minor to blatantly offensive, that is obviously unwelcome to the person on the receiving end - must surely be counted as deliberate harassment by any decent observer of either gender.

    That's what many people, mostly women, put up with every day and if people in general, mostly men, shrug it off as being "in the eye of the beholder" then they are no better than "fellow travellers" at best. As for men who go into innocent victim mode - "oh, poor us - however are we to know what to do???" - the answer is quite simple. Just STOP IT (you dimwitted little pr*ck) And if you are not one of those men but don't like being tarred with the same brush - your enemy is not the harassed, but the harassers. Same for goes female harassers.

    Incidentally, I very much doubt if you Dr. J, are, in fact, such a fellow traveller
    "Mozart is the heart's touchstone" (Edwin Fischer)

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Hmmm... by appearances, I didn't convey my perspective very well. I very much avoid harrassing any and all - I've absolutely no interest in saying/doing anything that makes any woman uncomfortable (can't say the same for some guys - sometimes they need a 'gentle reminder'), and - in those instances, such as this one - I try to avoid any repeat performance, if whatever I've said or done is ill-received. But as we're all a bit 'off' or different in our preferences - what 97% of my contacts are very comfortable with - but 3% are not - I find myself winnowing my offerings. I seldom step in it - but I"m aiming for 100%.

    AFA being a dimwitted little pr!ck - well, that seems a bit harsh. On the other foot, it'd likely be harrassment.
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  10. #10
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Touch all you (both) want. But get permission first. Otherwise, keep your grubby mitts to yourself.
    There is no rational, logical, or physical description of how free will could exist. It therefore makes no sense to praise or condemn anyone on the grounds they are a free willed self that made one choice but could have chosen something else. There is no evidence that such a situation is possible in our Universe. Demonstrate otherwise and I will be thrilled.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    i'm "handsy" when i talk with people. not grabbin your rear or anything, but a hand on the shoulder is pretty normal for me. i'll give anyone a hug if they need one. my kids give/get hugs constantly around our house. when i'm driving in the car i'm usually holding the hand of any family member riding beside me (wife and kids) or at least tapping out the bass line on a knee.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Yes - but some folks abhor being 'touched'. If that's a habit, it's one best changed. Too easy to 'touch a shoulder', not even realize you've done so - and maybe have offended someone. Just comes down to behavior modification.
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Quote Originally Posted by George Jung View Post
    Yes - but some folks abhor being 'touched'. If that's a habit, it's one best changed. Too easy to 'touch a shoulder', not even realize you've done so - and maybe have offended someone. Just comes down to behavior modification.

    oh, i try not to do it. but sometimes i don't notice until it's already done. the consequence of being aware of it though, is that i find myself avoiding conversations entirely so i don't have to worry about it.

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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Quote Originally Posted by Foster Price View Post
    Its also somewhat cultural, in some societies it perfectly OK for men to hold hands in public, it certainly doesn't mean they are gay.
    There is a lot of cultural difference. In some cultures the comfort "boundary" is about one foot out, in others it is further. So if you look down at a multi cultural gathering it is in constant churn as one lot try to close the gap with the person they are conversing with and the other steps back to maintain their wider "space".
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Quote Originally Posted by AlanMc View Post
    oh, i try not to do it. but sometimes i don't notice until it's already done. the consequence of being aware of it though, is that i find myself avoiding conversations entirely so i don't have to worry about it.
    i like to joke, tend toward ‘up-beat’. Some folks don’t care for that, so I tone it down. Those having a bad day, in particular. In those cases, I keep a visit short and to the point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peerie Maa View Post
    There is a lot of cultural difference. In some cultures the comfort "boundary" is about one foot out, in others it is further. So if you look down at a multi cultural gathering it is in constant churn as one lot try to close the gap with the person they are conversing with and the other steps back to maintain their wider "space".
    yes. Guilty!
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Quote Originally Posted by AlanMc View Post
    oh, i try not to do it. but sometimes i don't notice until it's already done. the consequence of being aware of it though, is that i find myself avoiding conversations entirely so i don't have to worry about it.
    That's why they invented pockets. Keep your hands in them.
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  17. #17
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Yeah. It helps!
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    I'm Italian, touching is in our DNA. :-)
    Gerard>
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  19. #19
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    ‘The beatings will continue until morale improves’. We’re here to help!
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  20. #20
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    There's a lot of things they didn't tell me when I signed on with this outfit....

  21. #21
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Quote Originally Posted by George Jung View Post

    AFA being a dimwitted little pr!ck - well, that seems a bit harsh. On the other foot, it'd likely be harrassment.
    It's meant to be harsh. Women tend to be harsh (in their own minds and between themselves) about sex pests. But I hope it was clear that this was aimed at the pests - not the majority of men who have achieved a measure (and we, male and female, cannot hope for more) of civilisation. Amongst whom I cautiously (only knowing one personally) count amongst the denizens of this place - including the good doctor!

    And there are certainly some silly women who decide to take offence when none is intended (and give the rest of us a bad name) Such as those that get shirty if a man holds a door for them. As far as I am concerned, there is not enough ordinary kindness and consideration in the world that we can afford to stamp any of it down.

    A few weeks ago I was accosted by a man who watched me coming along the pontoon from my boat. He had a pretty determined "go", trying to impress me with his collection of vintage cars, winters in the Mediterranean etc. Said he wanted to learn to sail - could I teach him? Would I like to come out to dinner with him? Kept glancing at my wedding ring and then asked me if I was married, because he had heard I was on my own. Well, that's sadly true, now. But it doesn't mean I am on the prowl...... I was pleasant, polite (yes - pleasant and polite are in my repertoire ) and gently informed him that I was not interested. He then grabbed me and kissed me full on the mouth, before taking his leave.

    I wasn't offended, because nothing about the conversation or his manner suggested that he was anything worse than a socially awkward, not very attractive and lonely man. The same episode could have felt very different if I had sensed a different attitude and intention.

    Mind you, I suspect it was really the boat he was after. Reminded me of the famous advertisement - "gentleman would like to meet lady with boat. Please send photo of boat" !
    "Mozart is the heart's touchstone" (Edwin Fischer)

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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Williamson View Post
    That's why they invented pockets. Keep your hands in them.
    My bubble is about 3' in front and 1' or so at my sides and back.
    R


    hahaha, if only that were a solution. i'm SUPER fidgety as well. you should see me at a restaurant when my wife isn't there to take everything away from me. waiting for food i'll tear up napkins, play with the salt, plat with the silverware, throw straw paper balls.... drives her nuts. there's also no candles in my house b/c i will RUIN them.

  23. #23
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    I will offer my hand to the female flight attendants whey they are stepping out of the hotel van. Their choice if they choose to take it. AFAIK that's the ONLY time I touch a member of the opposite sex that is not an immediate family member.
    Fight Entropy, build a wooden boat!

  24. #24
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    I think that this world needs MORE touch. I don't mean in the creepy sense, but rather in the human/humane/we're mammals who need touch to be whole sense. And so I touch people. Always aware that they may not welcome/enjoy it, and ready to dial it back accordingly.

    But also always pushing the envelope just ever so slightly, as my own view of folks who shy away is that they are - for a wide variety of potential reasons - alienated from their humanity. Sometimes such folks flinch initially, then lean in as they realize 'that's just David'. Some even come to welcome the contact, and reciprocate/initiate. Some merely to accept. Which is a good first step.
    David G
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  25. #25
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    I think that this world needs MORE touch. I don't mean in the creepy sense, but rather in the human/humane/we're mammals who need touch to be whole sense. And so I touch people. Always aware that they may not welcome/enjoy it, and ready to dial it back accordingly.

    But also always pushing the envelope just ever so slightly, as my own view of folks who shy away is that they are - for a wide variety of potential reasons - alienated from their humanity. Sometimes such folks flinch initially, then lean in as they realize 'that's just David'. Some even come to welcome the contact, and reciprocate/initiate. Some merely to accept. Which is a good first step.
    David, this is a truly cringe worthy post. I'm surprised you don't get slapped in the face on a regular basis.
    There is no rational, logical, or physical description of how free will could exist. It therefore makes no sense to praise or condemn anyone on the grounds they are a free willed self that made one choice but could have chosen something else. There is no evidence that such a situation is possible in our Universe. Demonstrate otherwise and I will be thrilled.

  26. #26
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    I think that this world needs MORE touch. I don't mean in the creepy sense, but rather in the human/humane/we're mammals who need touch to be whole sense. And so I touch people. Always aware that they may not welcome/enjoy it, and ready to dial it back accordingly.

    But also always pushing the envelope just ever so slightly, as my own view of folks who shy away is that they are - for a wide variety of potential reasons - alienated from their humanity. Sometimes such folks flinch initially, then lean in as they realize 'that's just David'. Some even come to welcome the contact, and reciprocate/initiate. Some merely to accept. Which is a good first step.
    I could not agree with you more.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by downthecreek View Post
    It's meant to be harsh. Women tend to be harsh (in their own minds and between themselves) about sex pests. But I hope it was clear that this was aimed at the pests - not the majority of men who have achieved a measure (and we, male and female, cannot hope for more) of civilisation. Amongst whom I cautiously (only knowing one personally) count amongst the denizens of this place - including the good doctor!

    And there are certainly some silly women who decide to take offence when none is intended (and give the rest of us a bad name) Such as those that get shirty if a man holds a door for them. As far as I am concerned, there is not enough ordinary kindness and consideration in the world that we can afford to stamp any of it down.

    A few weeks ago I was accosted by a man who watched me coming along the pontoon from my boat. He had a pretty determined "go", trying to impress me with his collection of vintage cars, winters in the Mediterranean etc. Said he wanted to learn to sail - could I teach him? Would I like to come out to dinner with him? Kept glancing at my wedding ring and then asked me if I was married, because he had heard I was on my own. Well, that's sadly true, now. But it doesn't mean I am on the prowl...... I was pleasant, polite (yes - pleasant and polite are in my repertoire ) and gently informed him that I was not interested. He then grabbed me and kissed me full on the mouth, before taking his leave.

    I wasn't offended, because nothing about the conversation or his manner suggested that he was anything worse than a socially awkward, not very attractive and lonely man. The same episode could have felt very different if I had sensed a different attitude and intention.

    Mind you, I suspect it was really the boat he was after. Reminded me of the famous advertisement - "gentleman would like to meet lady with boat. Please send photo of boat" !
    I cannot imagine doing that to a woman. I'm surprised (and impressed) by your reaction.
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  28. #28
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    And again: You touchy types can get together and touch each other up and down all you want. Maybe your mommies didn't touch you enough when you were babies and this is how you compensate. Or maybe you were touched so endlessly you can't imagine living any other way. Whatever. But you do not get to tell other people what they need just because you are so needy yourselves. And you especially do not get to touch women because in your insecure opinion you think they need to be touched. They get to decide when and if they need to be touched. You do not get to decide for them. Do you not understand how many women are sickened by the practice of men deciding when and how they should be touched? Their bodies. Their rights.
    Last edited by JimD; 12-19-2017 at 12:47 PM.
    There is no rational, logical, or physical description of how free will could exist. It therefore makes no sense to praise or condemn anyone on the grounds they are a free willed self that made one choice but could have chosen something else. There is no evidence that such a situation is possible in our Universe. Demonstrate otherwise and I will be thrilled.

  29. #29
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Quote Originally Posted by JimD View Post
    David, this is a truly cringe worthy post. I'm surprised you don't get slapped in the face on a regular basis.
    A strong reaction. I'm sorry you feel that way. But I don't get slapped. In fact, I've never been slapped as a result of this attitude. Let me suggest once again that our world, YOUR world, would be a better place with more touching. Such a strong reaction is what my poker buddies would call a 'tell'. Don't take my word for it though. Discuss it with your therapist. If you don't have one... maybe find one?
    David G
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  30. #30
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    Default Re: Power of touch



    Kevin
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  31. #31
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    I love that scene and that movie, which is all the greater now for how innocently and unintentionally politically incorrect it has become.

  32. #32
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Quote Originally Posted by John of Phoenix View Post
    I cannot imagine doing that to a woman. I'm surprised (and impressed) by your reaction.
    Touching other people is a skill that requires timing, body language, and an acute sense of anothers comfort zone. Some folks just don't have all these skills.

    I know a lot of huggers, kissers ans I love you-ers but I can spot someone who is uncomfortable 50' away and give them the room they need, if that changes in the future I'm all in.
    PaulF

  33. #33
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Quote Originally Posted by JimD View Post
    And again: You touchy types can get together and touch each other up and down all you want. Maybe your mommies didn't touch you enough when you were babies and this is how you compensate. But you do not get to tell other people what they need just because you are so needy yourselves. And you especially do not get to touch women because in your insecure opinion you think they need to be touched. They get to decide when and if they need to be touched. You do not get to decide for them. Do you not understand how many women are sickened by the practice of men deciding when and how they should be touched? Their bodies. Their rights.

    wow, that's a whole lotta wrong in such a short post.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlanMc View Post
    wow, that's a whole lotta wrong in such a short post.
    So you're saying not their bodies? Not their rights? Unless of course the woman happens to be your daughter or your wife and then suddenly it's 'How dare you!' Small wonder so many women are so angry and fed up and speaking out.
    There is no rational, logical, or physical description of how free will could exist. It therefore makes no sense to praise or condemn anyone on the grounds they are a free willed self that made one choice but could have chosen something else. There is no evidence that such a situation is possible in our Universe. Demonstrate otherwise and I will be thrilled.

  35. #35
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    Default Re: Power of touch

    Quote Originally Posted by JimD View Post
    So you're saying not their bodies? Not their rights? Unless of course the woman happens to be your daughter or your wife and then suddenly it's 'How dare you!' Small wonder so many women are so angry and fed up and speaking out.


    doubling down on the wrong. solid.

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