Page 1 of 3 12 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 35 of 86

Thread: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Sharon, MA
    Posts
    17,485

    Default Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    This guy is getting more dangerous, day by day.

    ANKARA/WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Turkey threatened on Tuesday to cut diplomatic ties with Israel if U.S. President Donald Trump recognizes Jerusalem as the Israeli capital, joining a mounting chorus of voices saying the move would unleash turmoil.

    Senior U.S. officials told Reuters some officers in the State Department were also deeply concerned and the European Union, the Palestinian Authority, Saudi Arabia and the Arab League all warned any such declaration would have repercussions across the region.

    A senior U.S. official told Reuters last week that Trump was likely to make the announcement on Wednesday, though his adviser and son-in-law Jared Kushner said over the weekend no final decision had been made.

    Such a decision would break with decades of U.S. policy that Jerusalem’s status must be decided in negotiations.

    Israel captured Arab East Jerusalem in the 1967 Middle East war. It later annexed it, declaring the whole of the city as its capital. The declaration is not recognized internationally and Palestinians want Jerusalem as the capital of their future state.

    “Mr. Trump, Jerusalem is the red line of Muslims,” Turkey’s President Tayyip Erdogan told a parliamentary meeting of his ruling AK Party.

    “This can go as far as severing Turkey’s ties with Israel. I am warning the United States not to take such a step which will deepen the problems in the region.”

    Israel’s Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has so far declined to speculate on what Trump might say.

    But Israel Katz, Israel’s minister of intelligence and transport, took to Twitter to reject Turkey’s threat and reiterate Israel’s position on the ancient city, which is one of a long list of stumbling blocks in years of failed peace talks with the Palestinians.

    “We don’t take orders or accept threats from the president of Turkey,” he wrote.

    “There would be no more righteous or proper an historical move now than recognizing Jerusalem, the Jewish people’s capital for the past 3000 years, as the capital of the State of Israel.”

    Two U.S. officials said on condition of anonymity that news of the plan to recognize Jerusalem as Israel’s capital had kicked up resistance from the State Department’s Near Eastern Affairs bureau (NEA), which deals with the region.

    “Senior (officials) in NEA and a number of ambassadors from the region expressed their deep concern about doing this,” said one official, saying that the concerns focused on “security”.

    The State Department referred questions to the White House. The White House did not immediately respond to requests for comment.

    A fourth U.S. official said the consensus U.S. intelligence estimate on U.S. recognition ofJerusalem as Israel’s capital was that it would risk triggering a backlash against Israel, and also potentially against U.S. interests in the Middle East.

    U.S. allies added their warnings.

    The European Union’s top diplomat, Federica Mogherini, said on Tuesday that “any action that would undermine” peace efforts to create two separate states for the Israelis and the Palestinians “must absolutely be avoided”.

    Speaking alongside U.S. Secretary of State Rex Tillerson in Brussels, she said Jerusalem’s status would have to be agreed through negotiations.

    The EU’s 28 foreign ministers will discuss the matter with Netanyahu in Brussels next Monday, to be followed by a similar meeting with Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas early next year, she added.

    Nabil Shaath, adviser to Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas, told journalists gathered on the outskirts of Jerusalem near Bethlehem that any announcement along those lines would wreck peace efforts.

    “If Mr. Trump really tomorrow or the day after tomorrow comes up and says that ‘I recognize united Jerusalem to be the capital of the state of Israel’ he has destroyed every chance that he will play to get the deal of the century that he has been talking about”.

    The Arab League and Saudi Arabia repeated past warnings, following statements by France and Jordan in recent days.

    The diplomats and leaders did not spell out what the consequences might be of any announcement. Past Israeli-Palestinian rifts have deteriorated into protests, attacks and fighting and further destabilised the region.

    A fifth U.S. official said concerns of Palestinian and other Arab leaders about endorsing Israel’s claim to Jerusalem were being taken into account but no final decisions had been made.

    Daniel Benjamin, a former U.S. counter terrorism official now at Dartmouth University, had a simple message: “This is playing with fire.
    "Fact is that which enough people believe. Truth is determined by how fervently they believe it."
    --- Charles Pierce







  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Port Richey
    Posts
    11,411

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    It's what happens when you get a bunch of amateurs with zero foreign policy experience, knowledge or training making decisions.
    Tom

    "Leave the gun, take the cannolis"

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Fredericton, New Brunswick
    Posts
    32,502

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    I'll take "Armageddon" for $500, Alex.
    If I use the word "God," I sure don't mean an old man in the sky who just loves the occasional goat sacrifice. - Anne Lamott

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Jerome, Aridzonia Apu Mingus
    Posts
    5,825

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    TRMP can always be counted on to do the worst possible thing when it comes to anyone other than himself.

    I think it's interesting that SCOTUS just yesterday allowed the full implimentation of the Muslim travel ban to take effect.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Victoria BC
    Posts
    8,085

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    72 hours notice, then turn the whole city to glass. That's the best way to solve the Jerusalem problem.
    Nosce te ipsum

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Northeast
    Posts
    13,742

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Might?
    "The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails."
    -William A. Ward



  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    3,971

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Look at the "bright" side. Deepening the problems in the middle east will work wonders for sales of weaponry and support services, thereby creating jobs, jobs jobs.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Sep 1999
    Location
    Louisville, Kentucky
    Posts
    23,887

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East




    Deja Moo: The feeling that you have heard this bull before.


  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    New jersey
    Posts
    2,499

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Nothings happening on that move of the embassy or even calling Jerusalem the Capitol till Bibi and Sheldon say so.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Marietta, GA
    Posts
    8,654

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Why does the US think it has the right to tell a foreign nation where it's capitol should be?
    Some days I think my country is about due for a serious b***h slapping.
    Fight Entropy, build a wooden boat!

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Northeast
    Posts
    13,742

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Quote Originally Posted by Reynard38 View Post
    Why does the US think it has the right to tell a foreign nation where it's capitol should be?
    Some days I think my country is about due for a serious b***h slapping.
    I'm thinking that's coming.
    "The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails."
    -William A. Ward



  12. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Traverse City MI and Charlotte NC
    Posts
    3,151

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Quote Originally Posted by ccmanuals View Post
    It's what happens when you get a bunch of amateurs with zero foreign policy experience, knowledge or training making decisions.
    Yeah, boy. Them pros with experience, knowledge and training have managed to make the ME the peaceful area we see since 2000. Bombs, more bombs, sanctions, assasinations, puppet "governments" and more bombs.

    It's certainly possible now to make things even worse, but don't let's pin any medals on the professionals.
    Well, Mr. Botard, do you still deny all rhinocerotic evidence?

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    afloat with at least 6' of water under me.
    Posts
    51,531

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    But, Trump says he knows more about everything, better than the military, obviously more than the Intelligence crowd and way more than the State Department.He won't let anyone meddle!

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Hell
    Posts
    82,360

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    i hope he does it
    Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Sitka, AK
    Posts
    25,184

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Quote Originally Posted by Reynard38 View Post
    Why does the US think it has the right to tell a foreign nation where it's capitol should be?
    Some days I think my country is about due for a serious b***h slapping.
    Uh, Israel claims Jerusalem as it's capital. So Trump is proposing to recognize that fact.

    Jerusalem (/dʒəˈruːsələm/; Hebrew: יְרוּשָׁלַיִם Yerushalayim[jeruʃaˈlajim]; Arabic: القُدس al-Quds[alˈqʊds])[note 2] is a city in the Middle East, located on a plateau in the Judaean Mountains between the Mediterranean and the Dead Sea.
    Israelis and Palestinians both claim Jerusalem as their capital, as the State of Israel maintains its primary governmental institutions there while the State of Palestine ultimately foresees the city as its seat of power; however, neither claim is widely recognized internationally.[note 3]
    Do note that Israel already uses the city as it's capital, the Palestinians do not.

    Today, the status of Jerusalem remains one of the core issues in the Israeli–Palestinian conflict. During the 1948 Arab–Israeli War, West Jerusalem was among the areas captured and later annexed by Israel while East Jerusalem, including the Old City, was captured and later annexed by Jordan. Israel captured East Jerusalem from Jordan during the 1967 Six-Day War and subsequently annexed it into Jerusalem, together with additional surrounding territory.[note 5]
    In basically two Arab-Israeli wars, Israel won, and took Jerusalem. Which goes back to the old adage... "To the victors belong the spoils."
    "Simple minds discuss people, Average minds discuss things, and Great minds discuss ideas".

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    victoria, australia. (1 address now)
    Posts
    45,193

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Well it's not the first, or last time that will happen.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Richmond, Virginia
    Posts
    3,969

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Can someone explain how declaring Jerusalem the Israeli Capital is in the interests of the USA?
    Skip

    ---This post is delivered with righteous passion and with a solemn southern directness --
    ...........fighting against the deliberate polarization of politics...

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Marietta, GA
    Posts
    8,654

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Quote Originally Posted by BrianW View Post
    Uh, Israel claims Jerusalem as it's capital. So Trump is proposing to recognize that fact.



    Do note that Israel already uses the city as it's capital, the Palestinians do not.



    In basically two Arab-Israeli wars, Israel won, and took Jerusalem. Which goes back to the old adage... "To the victors belong the spoils."
    So we'd be the only nation, other than Israel of course, to recognize Jerusalem as the Capitol. Gotcha.
    Kinda like the US being the ONLY nation to leave the Paris climate agreememt.

    Thanks for clearing that up.
    Fight Entropy, build a wooden boat!

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    central cal
    Posts
    11,151

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    You know what we really need, right?

    Some supra national governmental apparatus.

    Hey! How about some corporations that make more money than most states, and the banks that own them. Shoot, they all share the same corporate board members, anyway. Well, I mean, a few overlap with big oil, too, of course.

    Yeah.

    Peace,
    Morgan Prescott Rothschild Walton Rockefeller III

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Jan 2002
    Location
    victoria, australia. (1 address now)
    Posts
    45,193

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Let's see, there's the threats of nuking NK (and most of SK and a bit of China as collateral damage), an even further meltdown in the ME and it's surrounds, China asserting itself in Asia and the Pacific (including Aus.), Russia still playing in US internal politics, the Atlantic Alliance a bit under pressure as the Brits dig their hole even bigger. Sounds like there's a need for some seriously competent diplomacy from the State Department…………………….. Oh…………..
    A perfect time to toss more gas on the Israel/Arab fire……………..

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Sitka, AK
    Posts
    25,184

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Quote Originally Posted by Reynard38 View Post
    So we'd be the only nation, other than Israel of course, to recognize Jerusalem as the Capitol. Gotcha.
    Well, you seemed to find it appalling that the US be so vain as to feel we had the right to declare their capital. Now you seem to feel it's important that the rest of the world has done exactly that, and we should fall in line.


    Quote Originally Posted by Reynard38 View Post
    Thanks for clearing that up.
    No problem man. Just looking at things a bit different from here.
    "Simple minds discuss people, Average minds discuss things, and Great minds discuss ideas".

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Tacoma, WA
    Posts
    8,133

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    There's some belief among the Pence brand of christian fundy that the Israel/Jerusalem connection will make JC return quicker. It is prophesized!
    “What, Me Worry?". -. A. E. Newman

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Aug 1999
    Location
    Woodbridge, Suffolk, UK
    Posts
    22,482

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Everyone - the State Department, the Arab League, the King of Saudi Arabia, the King of Jordan, the Chairman of the Palestinian Authority, the President of Turkey - has told him NOT TO DO THIS.

    And I don’t seem to be aware of massive pressure on him from his “base” to do it.

    People are going to die because of this.
    IMAGINES VEL NON FUERINT

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Walney, near Cumbria UK
    Posts
    35,729

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Quote Originally Posted by PhaseLockedLoop View Post
    Yeah, boy. Them pros with experience, knowledge and training have managed to make the ME the peaceful area we see since 2000. Bombs, more bombs, sanctions, assasinations, puppet "governments" and more bombs.

    It's certainly possible now to make things even worse, but don't let's pin any medals on the professionals.
    The problem with that argument is that the Palestinians to Israel is like guns to the US. Neither country cares how many of their citizens dies. There will be no peace in the old Palestine until Israel completely changes.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

    The power of the web: Anyone can post anything on the web
    The weakness of the web: Anyone can post anything on the web.

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Scotland
    Posts
    5,701

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    The UN Partition Plan for Palestine made clear that Jerusalem was a special case and would be an international city. I will be interested to hear the UN's response to Trump's decision.

    The United Nations General Assembly decided in 1947 on the partition of Palestine into Jewish and Arab states, with Jerusalem to be an internationalised city.
    The territory of Palestine should be divided as follows:

    A Jewish State covering 56.47% of Mandatory Palestine (excluding Jerusalem) with a population of 498,000 Jews and 325,000 Arabs;
    An Arab State covering 43.53% of Mandatory Palestine (excluding Jerusalem), with 807,000 Arab inhabitants and 10,000 Jewish inhabitants;
    An international trusteeship regime in Jerusalem, where the population was 100,000 Jews and 105,000 Arabs.

    The partition plan also laid down:
    A guarantee of the rights of minorities and religious rights, including free access to and the preservation of Holy Places;

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/in_depth/...ts/1681322.stm

    The City of Jerusalem shall be established as a corpus separatum under a special international regime and shall be administered by the United Nations. The Trusteeship Council shall be designated to discharge the responsibilities of the Administering Authority on behalf of the United Nations.


    https://unispal.un.org/DPA/DPR/unisp...256C330061D253

    Over the years international consensus seems to have switched to "Let the Israelis and the Palestinians sort it out for themselves".

    This is an interesting overview..

    A Guide to the Dispute Over Jerusalem and Israel’s Capital..
    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...-quicktake-q-a
    Somewhere between Murder and Suicide, there is a place called Merseyside.

  26. #26
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Deepest Darkest Wales
    Posts
    18,524

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Craig-Bennett View Post
    Everyone - the State Department, the Arab League, the King of Saudi Arabia, the King of Jordan, the Chairman of the Palestinian Authority, the President of Turkey - has told him NOT TO DO THIS.

    And I don’t seem to be aware of massive pressure on him from his “base” to do it.

    People are going to die because of this.
    Which is what makes it a first rate distraction.
    Someday, I'm going to settle down and be a grumpy old man.

  27. #27
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Marietta, GA
    Posts
    8,654

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Quote Originally Posted by BrianW View Post
    Well, you seemed to find it appalling that the US be so vain as to feel we had the right to declare their capital. Now you seem to feel it's important that the rest of the world has done exactly that, and we should fall in line.


    No problem man. Just looking at things a bit different from here.

    Yes, you truly are.
    Fight Entropy, build a wooden boat!

  28. #28
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Fredericton, New Brunswick
    Posts
    32,502

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    The key motivating principle behind every single "policy initiative" out of the Trump Cadre seems to be heedless disruption. "Blow it up - what could go wrong?"

    As ACB said, people will die because of this - and for what? A kid with a tank. A toddler with a hammer.
    If I use the word "God," I sure don't mean an old man in the sky who just loves the occasional goat sacrifice. - Anne Lamott

  29. #29
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    MD
    Posts
    42,075

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    I don’t see the upside to this.

    https://www.brookings.edu/blog/marka...of-israel/amp/

    So, again: Why in the world is Trump doing this?

    From the outset, most experts understood that the “deal of the century” was most likely beyond reach and that its collapse may lead to President Trump lashing out with such moves as moving the U.S. embassy to Jerusalem and giving the green light to expand Israeli settlement in the West Bank. The fact that the White House may take a controversial step on Jerusalem now, before he even has a chance to unveil his plan, means one of two things.

    The first is that his advisers live in their own bubble, reinforced by unprecedented inexperience. In fact, this is already a public fear. Despite deep partisanship on almost every issue, Americans come together on this issue: 81 percent of all Americans, including 71 percent of Republicans, prefer Trump relying on experts in his Middle East diplomacy, not on inexperienced family members and personal lawyers.

    But there is a second possibility: That the Trump administration has already given up on its “deal of the century” and is looking for ways to pin the blame on someone else.

  30. #30
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Portland, Maine
    Posts
    12,222

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    What's to be surprised about? Ambassador Friedman marched in with all this on his agenda, including the recognition of outlaw settlements and the break away from the two state concept.
    SCROTUS just rolls with this. He don't give a ****.
    Study Peace

  31. #31
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Fredericton, New Brunswick
    Posts
    32,502

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    I think it's the "Health Ledger 'joker' Presidency.". Some people just want to watch the world burn.

    Caught a clip of about 3 minutes of Steve Bannon's harangue at the Roy Moore rally, and this is that. The Middle East "strategy" is exactly the same empowerment of bile and generalized dyspeptic rage. Bannon used the phrase "blue collar billionaire" in his comments to describe Trump. That's an insult to blue collar workers. More like "crypto-fascist militiaman billionaire."
    If I use the word "God," I sure don't mean an old man in the sky who just loves the occasional goat sacrifice. - Anne Lamott

  32. #32
    Join Date
    Jan 2000
    Location
    Portland, Maine
    Posts
    14,890

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    Pure distraction. For every article about this there’s one less article about that Russian business. Everyone talking about this isn’t talking about his administration’s connections with Russia. That there will be people dying because of this? Even more of a distraction.

  33. #33
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Fredericton, New Brunswick
    Posts
    32,502

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East

    A Jerusalem in flames will be quite a distraction. Bigly even.
    If I use the word "God," I sure don't mean an old man in the sky who just loves the occasional goat sacrifice. - Anne Lamott

  34. #34
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    MD
    Posts
    42,075

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East


  35. #35
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    Northern California Mountains
    Posts
    10,191

    Default Re: Now, Trump (and his son-in-law) just might explode the Middle East


Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •