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Thread: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

  1. #1
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    Question Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    Hope y’all are enjoying that moon shine in the company of fun and virtuous friends.

    While i I am looking for a sail oar wherry, dory, or skiff (that can later be retrofitted to mount an electric outboard) for two adults and a dog that’s light enough to transport on a roof rack on pickup truck camper shell, I am inclined to build a sliding seat* to row in our 17’ canoe*. Have you any suggestions or observations from your own canoe rowing experiences, please?

    *
    canoe: https://www.wenonah.com/Canoes.aspx?id=12
    sliding seat and rigger plans: https://angusrowboats.com/pages/sliding-seat
    Last edited by Chris94703; 12-04-2017 at 01:14 PM.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    And there's me thinking that you wanted one of these.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  3. #3
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    They will really move under oar power. I do kind of wonder though, whether it might actually be faster rowing from a fixed seat and staying trimmed more level than it would be with your weight constantly moving fore and aft and hobby-horsing the trim. You can take out the yoke on that We-No-Nah, but if sliding required taking out those aluminum quarter thwarts that would not be a great idea.

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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Peerie Maa View Post
    And there's me thinking that you wanted one of these.
    That looks fun, but how does a land lubber row in that? I’m itchin’ to row on water every time my arse gets on our Warerrower ergo at home. Binge watching the Vikings TV shows exacerbates such sweeping desires.
    Last edited by Chris94703; 12-04-2017 at 02:00 PM.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Todd Bradshaw View Post
    They will really move under oar power. I do kind of wonder though, whether it might actually be faster rowing from a fixed seat and staying trimmed more level than it would be with your weight constantly moving fore and aft and hobby-horsing the trim. You can take out the yoke on that We-No-Nah, but if sliding required taking out those aluminum quarter thwarts that would not be a great idea.
    Hmmm. Maybe fixed seat rowing or tandem sweeping might be more stable and prudent in our beloved canoe.

    While canoe padding’s fun, in comparison rowing seems to be a more complete fitness exercise and faster. I’m addicted to human powered velocity: My last mountain bike crash in August will not be my last. I pray.

    I keep reading that sliding seat rowing is faster than a fixed seat and can sustain power for longer.

    To get started on fixed seat rowing, what length of wooden spoon oars, two pairs, should we buy or build?
    How should I mount the two pairs (four) of oar locks on the gunnels? Couple of twarts would need to be moved around and the two seats installed at the proper, low, height.
    Last edited by Chris94703; 12-04-2017 at 01:44 PM.

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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris94703 View Post
    Hmmm. Maybe fixed seat rowing or tandem sweeping might be more stable and prudent in our beloved canoe.

    While canoe padding’s fun, in comparison rowing seems to be a more complete fitness exercise and faster. I’m addicted to human powered velocity: My last mountain bike crash in August will not be my last. I pray.

    I keep reading that sliding seat rowing is faster than a fixed seat and can sustain power for longer.

    To get started on fixed seat rowing, what length of wooden spoon oars, two pairs, should we buy or build?
    How should I mount the two pairs (four) of oar locks on the gunnels? Couple of twarts would need to be moved around and the two seats installed at the proper, low, height.
    With something that narrow you will probably need some outriggers



    You will still use your thighs and core when rowing fixed seat if you use oars long enough to put some welly into.

    Think skinny guideboat or Rangely
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  7. #7
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    I tend to think fixed seat is the way to go (just how much speed do you need). The length of your canoe will also come into play.

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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    I had a drop in sliding seat rig for my 16 foot canoe. It had outriggers and racing oars. The boat was too short and hobby horsed too much with the sliding seat. I am back to fixed oars.
    Elect a clown expect a circus

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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    With all this discussion of pitching due to a sliding seat, how about trying a sliding rigger?

    Your weight doesn't move, your legs get involved, and the actual rowing mechanics are the same.
    Virtually no pitching at all.
    Of course your legs do move in and out so there is some pitch. But I bet it is not noticeable.

    http://theoarcruising.blogspot.com/2...atriggers.html

    BTW, I built one on a 11' catamaran rowing boat and it didn't pitch at all.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    I think that if you have a good foot brace you will be able to exert plenty of power.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    With a sliding seat or sliding rigger you get a longer stroke thru the water.
    And it feels really good to get the leg power in there.

    Whether you need more stroke or power depends upon the actual boat you use (hull speed), and your desired speed.
    To each his own.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    Quote Originally Posted by upchurchmr View Post
    With a sliding seat or sliding rigger you get a longer stroke thru the water.
    And it feels really good to get the leg power in there.

    Whether you need more stroke or power depends upon the actual boat you use (hull speed), and your desired speed.
    To each his own.
    And whether you are on a flat river or a lumpy lake or sea.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  13. #13
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    Check this fixed rigger gizmo out. It's simple, reasonably priced (and wouldn't be that difficult to cobble together on your own).
    https://www.essexindustries.org/adjustable-rowing-rig/

    On their drop-in, winged fixed rowing seats (fiberglass and around $300 in the 1970s) Old Town Canoe used to suggest 7' spoon-bladed oars, though they did not row cross-handed (guide boat style) which would tolerate longer oars.

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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    "Yeah, well, that's just, like your opinion man"
    -The Dude-

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    I assumed a canoe would row better with the body in the center?
    Of course I didn't think about the typical thwart position.
    That certainly would be just about the cheapest option.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    If the top priority is exercise, then the legs gotta move. It doesn't help to exercise the legs at a later time; you need those big leg muscles to be competing with back and arms in stressing your heart, etc:



    Last edited by rudderless; 12-04-2017 at 07:47 PM.

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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan


  18. #18
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    The Rantilla rower is very complex.
    I've never seen one in waves. The lack of ability to lower the handles/ raise the blade might cause you to catch a wave on the recovery.
    It would be nice to see where you are going.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    I had a drop in rig on an 18.5 ' Jenson. Hobbyhorsed wicked, but those canoes are quite skinny in the ends. I'd go fixed with modest outriggers, maybe out to 3.5' or so, for some 7.5 oars. If you want to slide, a short slide like the one I just wrote up in SBM piece is much less pitchy than a long slide as you really are moving only about 18".
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  20. #20
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    Quote Originally Posted by cut3times View Post
    I tend to think fixed seat is the way to go (just how much speed do you need). The length of your canoe will also come into play.
    Speed enough to make progress against strong tides combined with gusts of wind in the SF Bay.
    Last edited by Chris94703; 12-05-2017 at 03:20 AM.

  21. #21
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    Quote Originally Posted by rudderless View Post
    If the top priority is exercise, then the legs gotta move. It doesn't help to exercise the legs at a later time; you need those big leg muscles to be competing with back and arms in stressing your heart, etc:



    Yeah, a way for me to exercise while have fun exploring along with my wife. Thanks for the photos.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    Quote Originally Posted by upchurchmr View Post
    With all this discussion of pitching due to a sliding seat, how about trying a sliding rigger?

    Your weight doesn't move, your legs get involved, and the actual rowing mechanics are the same.
    Virtually no pitching at all.
    Of course your legs do move in and out so there is some pitch. But I bet it is not noticeable.

    http://theoarcruising.blogspot.com/2...atriggers.html

    BTW, I built one on a 11' catamaran rowing boat and it didn't pitch at all.
    Thanks for this information: This is the first time I've become aware of "sliding rigger" as something different from sliding seat|sculling.

  23. #23
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    Quote Originally Posted by Todd Bradshaw View Post
    Check this fixed rigger gizmo out. It's simple, reasonably priced (and wouldn't be that difficult to cobble together on your own).
    https://www.essexindustries.org/adjustable-rowing-rig/

    On their drop-in, winged fixed rowing seats (fiberglass and around $300 in the 1970s) Old Town Canoe used to suggest 7' spoon-bladed oars, though they did not row cross-handed (guide boat style) which would tolerate longer oars.
    In theory, I want to build, but in practice, I prefer to buy frugally in order to save time and money. Thanks!
    Last edited by Chris94703; 12-05-2017 at 11:02 AM.

  24. #24
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    Thank you for the two links.


    BTW, forum.woodenboat.com is awesome.
    Last edited by Chris94703; 12-05-2017 at 11:02 AM.

  25. #25
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    Default Re: Canoe 17 sliding seat plan

    Sliding riggers are not very common, but they work well, and Rudderless's post #16 is a perfect illustration of how it works.

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