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Thread: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

  1. #1
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    Default VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    2020 model. 200 - 300 mile range. 300+ hp. Small, but useful --

    https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/l...tag=CADf328eec

    David G
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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Wow! That's a hot-looking rig.
    We're merely mammals. Let's misbehave! —Cole Porter

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Can we trust that VW is telling the truth about mileage?
    “What, Me Worry?". -. A. E. Newman

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    I need it 6/9/18 which is when our current Jeep lease it up. I would jump on it in a heartbeat.
    This post is temporary and my disappear at the discretion of the managment

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    I was very excited about the new VW van until seeing the floor height mandated by this electrical platform design. One of the best features of my old Vanagon was the low floor which allowed easy access. This car (and most future VW's) use this same platform to provide space for the batteries and looks to be very uncomfortable as it appears the seat height is barely above floor level. Would make for some very wet and dirty pant legs here in a northern Michigan winter. Seems that common sense has now been lost in the automotive industry.
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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Nice looking. With full torque available at 0 rpm it'd tow a small boat fine. Unfortunately even 300 miles is insufficient range for my needs.
    Waiting for another battery breakthrough to make an EV truly practical. I'd love to own one.
    Fight Entropy, build a wooden boat!

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by michigangeorge View Post
    I was very excited about the new VW van until seeing the floor height mandated by this electrical platform design. One of the best features of my old Vanagon was the low floor which allowed easy access. This car (and most future VW's) use this same platform to provide space for the batteries and looks to be very uncomfortable as it appears the seat height is barely above floor level. Would make for some very wet and dirty pant legs here in a northern Michigan winter. Seems that common sense has now been lost in the automotive industry.
    Not to worry. With the salt y'all throw on the roads up there the floor will rust through in no time!
    Fight Entropy, build a wooden boat!

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by Reynard38 View Post
    Not to worry. With the salt y'all throw on the roads up there the floor will rust through in no time!
    Why not a plugin hybrid?
    Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Pless View Post
    Why not a plugin hybrid?
    That'll work. Looks like the VW is purely a EV though.
    Fight Entropy, build a wooden boat!

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Eff VW.

    Kevin
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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by Reynard38 View Post
    Nice looking. With full torque available at 0 rpm it'd tow a small boat fine. Unfortunately even 300 miles is insufficient range for my needs.
    Waiting for another battery breakthrough to make an EV truly practical. I'd love to own one.
    Like this?
    [rant](Personally, I'm getting tired of all these "new battery breakthroughs" that never seem to result in a viable commercial product. If they're not ready to put it in a phone or car, they should keep quiet.)[/rant]

    This New Battery Material Uses Graphene to Charge 5 Times Faster (ARTICLE LINK)

    Excerpt
    The Samsung Advanced Institute of Technology (SAIT) has developed new battery material, made from a "graphene ball," which could potentially deliver charging speeds five times faster than today's lithium-ion batteries. Samsung announced the new material in a press release this past Wednesday, November 28.

    But just how fast is this new material? Well, in theory, this graphene ball material only needs about 12 minutes to achieve a hundred percent charge.
    #include [std-disclaimer]

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    It's coming. Watched a episode of NOVA that was all about batteries. I'd expect 600+ mile range in maybe 5 years along with very fast charging.
    Of course the oil industry and their legions of lobbyists (Scott Pruitt leading the hordes) will do everything they can to delay the inevitable switch to electrons from hydrocarbons.
    Fight Entropy, build a wooden boat!

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    One of my favorite things in Ray Bradbury's Dandelion Wine is The Green Machine, an electric car two little old ladies cruise around in, in Green Town, Illinois, in the summer of 1928. I've been waiting for my Green Machine since the first time I read the book, more than fifty years ago.

    Hope the voyage is a long one.
    May there be many a summer morning when,
    with what pleasure, what joy,
    you come into harbors seen for the first time...

    Ithaka, by Cavafy
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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by Reynard38 View Post
    It's coming. Watched a episode of NOVA that was all about batteries. I'd expect 600+ mile range in maybe 5 years along with very fast charging.
    Of course the oil industry and their legions of lobbyists (Scott Pruitt leading the hordes) will do everything they can to delay the inevitable switch to electrons from hydrocarbons.
    The battery is only part of the issue with fast charging. To recharge the car you want in 10 minutes or so would take an electric power source the equivalent of about 3,000 hp. Picture plugging it in with one foot in a water puddle. (40,000 volts or so at 100 amps)
    FWIW, the VW Golf EV is a very pleasant car to drive, costs about $30,000, has a 125 mile range, and easily recharges at home. They are selling at a rate of about 300 a month, a rate about the same as most small cars sell in a half a day. Aside from the range, at current gas prices, it often costs more to drive an electric car than a gas-powered equivalent these days, depressing the interest in driving one.
    Last edited by Dan McCosh; 11-30-2017 at 10:56 AM.

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    My 1999 Subaru has a limited number of years. With front + rear wheel drive and that range, I'd be very interested.

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by michigangeorge View Post
    I was very excited about the new VW van until seeing the floor height mandated by this electrical platform design. One of the best features of my old Vanagon was the low floor which allowed easy access. This car (and most future VW's) use this same platform to provide space for the batteries and looks to be very uncomfortable as it appears the seat height is barely above floor level. Would make for some very wet and dirty pant legs here in a northern Michigan winter. Seems that common sense has now been lost in the automotive industry.
    When my mom became wheelchair bound, I did research into vans and wheelchair access. Found a place near home who specialized in converting vans for that purpose. The standard van, then, would accept a wheelchair if top of head to ground was not more than 48". If the person in the chair need more height, they had to modify the van. I asked if they had ever considered modifying the wheelchair. They had not.

    Shortly after, I found myself in a phone conversation with a guy from Chrysler, and suggested they offer a model with a ramp and a "squattable" chair. Nothing ever came from it, and mom never quite reached the point where she couldn't get from her chair to the front seat.
    May be some rough water ahead. We're getting new captain.

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    It IS a cool looking little beastie. But, as with all such rigs, esp. sub-compact sized ones, I'd rather it be a typical hatchback configuration... a fuller more squared-off tail... for practical purposes.
    David G
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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Another useless hipster 'crossover' that is not a crossover at all as it has next to no utility value. You couldn't pay me to drive this thing. And as someone else already asked, where's the plug in verision? Plug-ins are the real 21 Century 'crossovers', since they transition from ICEs to electric power.
    There is no rational, logical, or physical description of how free will could exist. It therefore makes no sense to praise or condemn anyone on the grounds they are a free willed self that made one choice but could have chosen something else. There is no evidence that such a situation is possible in our Universe. Demonstrate otherwise and I will be thrilled.

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by JimD View Post
    Another useless hipster 'crossover' that is not a crossover at all as it has next to no utility value. You couldn't pay me to drive this thing. And as someone else already asked, where's the plug in verision? Plug-ins are the real 21 Century 'crossovers', since they transition from ICEs to electric power.
    Sure... and the sports cars I drove in my callow youth were the very apex of practicality <G>

    And VW, to their credit, is pursuing EV's hard, with 30 models slated by 2025.

    "“VW’s targets for EV penetration are much more aggressive at this stage than most industry estimates,” Hendrikse (ed. - Morgan Stanley analyst) said."

    At your next doctor's visit, Jim, I think you should ask if you are infected with G.O.F. <G>
    David G
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    Sure... and the sports cars I drove in my callow youth were the very apex of practicality <G>

    And VW, to their credit, is pursuing EV's hard, with 30 models slated by 2025.

    "“VW’s targets for EV penetration are much more aggressive at this stage than most industry estimates,” Hendrikse (ed. - Morgan Stanley analyst) said."

    At your next doctor's visit, Jim, I think you should ask if you are infected with G.O.F. <G>
    It's not a crossover. It's just a chunky looking car. Want to drive a chunky look car then knock yourself out. I want a CUV with some 'U' to it. What's GOF?
    There is no rational, logical, or physical description of how free will could exist. It therefore makes no sense to praise or condemn anyone on the grounds they are a free willed self that made one choice but could have chosen something else. There is no evidence that such a situation is possible in our Universe. Demonstrate otherwise and I will be thrilled.

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by JimD View Post
    It's not a crossover. It's just a chunky looking car. Want to drive a chunky look car then knock yourself out. I want a CUV with some 'U' to it. What's GOF?
    Ask your doctor, do. I become ever more suspicious that you might be suffering from it.
    David G
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    Ask your doctor, do. I become ever more suspicious that you might be suffering from it.
    Just guessing, is it something like grumpy old phart's disease? I'm not grumpy, I just lament the passing of a class of vehicles that were both small and capable of doing some light work. First 'they' stopped making small pickup trucks and then they stopped making genuine crossovers. Now all we see are these scrunched up things, at least in the North American market.
    There is no rational, logical, or physical description of how free will could exist. It therefore makes no sense to praise or condemn anyone on the grounds they are a free willed self that made one choice but could have chosen something else. There is no evidence that such a situation is possible in our Universe. Demonstrate otherwise and I will be thrilled.

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by JimD View Post
    Just guessing, is it something like grumpy old phart's disease? I'm not grumpy, I just lament the passing of a class of vehicles that were both small and capable of doing some light work. First 'they' stopped making small pickup trucks and then they stopped making genuine crossovers. Now all we see are these scrunched up things, at least in the North American market.
    I share your lamentation. I once owned a Toyota pickup so small that there wasn't really room for more than two on the bench seat. Ran like a top... forever... and inexpensively. My lamentation includes - on a more reasonable note - the dearth of small diesels in the current crop of medium size trucks, suv's, and station wagons. I know Chevy now has the Colorado diesel... but do I really feel comfortable with the 'reliability' of both a GM, and a 'new' engine? I'd rather see a proven rig from Toyota, Nissan, Mitsubishi, etc.
    David G
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    We drive a 2000 Honda Insight hybrid that has 150,000 or so miles. We replaced the main battery last summer, around $3k, but are still way ahead in terms of overall cost, gas savings, etc. It is a 'rollerskate' with two seats and a mid-level cargo deck in the rear, with the battery underneath. The design uses a small 3-cylinder gas engine as the main power with a flywheel ring electric motor to provide a boost for acceleration and passing– a good setup for our conditions. It doesn't plug in, but has an inertial charging system that uses the kinetic energy of the car to charge the battery, with an extra charge from rollers on the brakes.

    We very seldom run out of juice. The car has been used mostly for a job commute about 30 mi. across a flat valley, with a slight downhill slope on the way in, which charges the battery for the return trip, often against the wind. We garage it in winter, when the low clearance (which cuts wind resistance) makes it difficult on snow days. We love it.

    These have become a cult car, and we could sell it for quite a bit more than we paid.



    The new VW, with its ingenious all-wheel drive system and greater clearance, might work very well for us in all seasons. I don't see why they can't combine a plug-in charger with an inertial charging setup, which would certainly increase the practical range.

    In any event, I can't wait for EVs to be widely available at a decent price. Our solar PV house system was designed to provide enough surplus power to charge an EV.
    We're merely mammals. Let's misbehave! —Cole Porter

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    I had no idea this car even existed. Cool. Although it wouldn't do for me.

    There is no rational, logical, or physical description of how free will could exist. It therefore makes no sense to praise or condemn anyone on the grounds they are a free willed self that made one choice but could have chosen something else. There is no evidence that such a situation is possible in our Universe. Demonstrate otherwise and I will be thrilled.

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by JimD View Post
    I had no idea this car even existed. Cool. Although it wouldn't do for me.

    Honda's first attempt at a hybrid. Cool in lots of ways, and have their quirks. Well-built, like most Hondas. But a good fit for only a narrow segment of users.
    David G
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan McCosh View Post
    The battery is only part of the issue with fast charging. To recharge the car you want in 10 minutes or so would take an electric power source the equivalent of about 3,000 hp. Picture plugging it in with one foot in a water puddle. (40,000 volts or so at 100 amps)
    FWIW, the VW Golf EV is a very pleasant car to drive, costs about $30,000, has a 125 mile range, and easily recharges at home. They are selling at a rate of about 300 a month, a rate about the same as most small cars sell in a half a day. Aside from the range, at current gas prices, it often costs more to drive an electric car than a gas-powered equivalent these days, depressing the interest in driving one.
    Our ground crews plug the external power cord into the jet in all weather conditions. These cords are capable of supplying ALL the electical needs of a widebody aircraft while it's at the gate. In the 28 years I've been flying commercially I've never seen anybody get injured. Seen a few gas pump fires though.
    You say the electric car costs more to operate? Could you share the math on this?
    I did a little digging and came up with this. The numbers are from a Michigan University.

    https://pluginamerica.org/how-much-d...-electric-car/
    Fight Entropy, build a wooden boat!

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by Reynard38 View Post
    Our ground crews plug the external power cord into the jet in all weather conditions. These cords are capable of supplying ALL the electical needs of a widebody aircraft while it's at the gate. In the 28 years I've been flying commercially I've never seen anybody get injured. Seen a few gas pump fires though.
    You say the electric car costs more to operate? Could you share the math on this?
    I did a little digging and came up with this. The numbers are from a Michigan University.

    https://pluginamerica.org/how-much-d...-electric-car/
    The new tax bill passed yesterday kills subsidies for electric vehicles and opens the gate to taxing electricity that goes through vehicle chargers in order to recover lost fuel taxes which fund highway maintenance. Meanwhile, the one hundred year old petrochemical industry maintains its subsidies and tax breaks 'necessary for its growth'. . ,
    Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by Reynard38 View Post
    Our ground crews plug the external power cord into the jet in all weather conditions. These cords are capable of supplying ALL the electical needs of a widebody aircraft while it's at the gate. In the 28 years I've been flying commercially I've never seen anybody get injured. Seen a few gas pump fires though.
    You say the electric car costs more to operate? Could you share the math on this?
    I did a little digging and came up with this. The numbers are from a Michigan University.

    https://pluginamerica.org/how-much-d...-electric-car/
    Don't really know what power is needed to sustain a jet on the runway, but to charge a 500 kWh battery in 10 minutes would take a charger output of 3 million watts. That means 12,500 amps at 240 volts, or whatever you want to compute the voltage and amperage. It's about 100x the maximum power available at a typical household power supply. It's getting into the range of a bolt of lightning. As for the price of gas vs. electricity, The study you cite notes about 30 kWh per 100 miles. That's $4.50 worth of electricity at the domestic rate around here. (my household billing). That means that a 50 mpg gas--powered car breaks even at $2.25 a gallon, which has been the local price off and on around here. The study uses a 25 mpg figure, which is a hypothetical average for all cars, not comparing two cars with similar performance, etc. FWIW, we get about 45 mpg most of the time with a gas-powered, five-passenger station wagon. Two tanks ago, I filled up for $2 a gallon. Many states heavily discount electricity for electric cars, and have higher gas prices. Regardless, heavy taxes on pump gasoline are mainly non-existent for electricity. You can run the numbers up and down, but the actual cost of electric power and gasoline power is remarkably close these days in the U.S.

    Might add that if you attempted to build a piston-engine generator to charge the car in 10 minutes, it would be larger than the P&W Wasp, the largest piston-engine radial ever built

    (FWIW, It looks like a typical ground supply for a jet is about 7 kw, compared to 3,000 kw for the car charger.)
    Last edited by Dan McCosh; 12-03-2017 at 03:28 PM.

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    Default VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan McCosh View Post
    Don't really know what power is needed to sustain a jet on the runway, but to charge a 500 kWh battery in 10 minutes would take a charger output of 3 million watts. That means 12,500 amps at 240 volts, or whatever you want to compute the voltage and amperage. It's about 100x the maximum power available at a typical household power supply. It's getting into the range of a bolt of lightning. As for the price of gas vs. electricity, The study you cite notes about 30 kWh per 100 miles. That's $4.50 worth of electricity at the domestic rate around here. (my household billing). That means that a 50 mpg gas--powered car breaks even at $2.25 a gallon, which has been the local price off and on around here. The study uses a 25 mpg figure, which is a hypothetical average for all cars, not comparing two cars with similar performance, etc. FWIW, we get about 45 mpg most of the time with a gas-powered, five-passenger station wagon. Two tanks ago, I filled up for $2 a gallon. Many states heavily discount electricity for electric cars, and have higher gas prices. Regardless, heavy taxes on pump gasoline are mainly non-existent for electricity. You can run the numbers up and down, but the actual cost of electric power and gasoline power is remarkably close these days in the U.S.

    Might add that if you attempted to build a piston-engine generator to charge the car in 10 minutes, it would be larger than the P&W Wasp, the largest piston-engine radial ever built

    (FWIW, It looks like a typical ground supply for a jet is about 7 kw, compared to 3,000 kw for the car charger.)


    The cost of electricity and gas here makes the electric car in that example more expensive to operate, at current rates and prices.

    That&rsquo;s before some other tax goes up to recapture the revenue lost to declining revenue from taxed motor fuel.

    Kevin


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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    About the 2000 Honda Insight Hybrid, I forgot to mention that the mileage varies between about 58 and 62 mpg. The electric power is generated by the car = free.

    On to plug-in EVs— The BMW ActiveE (170 horsepower) has an energy consumption rate of 33 kWh per 100 miles. The Nissan Leaf (107 hp) does 29 kWh/100m. So 30 kWh per 100 mi. is a realistic value.

    As far as cost goes, though, most published estimates are based on power purchased from local utilities. We installed a grid-tied solar PV system in 2011, partly paid for with a $10,000 DOE grant. Based on our out-of-pocket cost, I calculated the payback at about 8 years: by 2019.

    The system generates 3000 kWh more than we use each year. Based on the 30 kWh per 100 mi value, that comes out to 10,000 miles, low-cost now, and as of 2019, no cost for power.

    (Too many so-called engineers are crippled by their bias against EVs.)
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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    I keep reading that we'll be switched over to self-driving cars in the next 10-20 years, which would make tooling around in neato-looking muscle cars obsolete. Wouldn't it?
    Well, Mr. Botard, do you still deny all rhinocerotic evidence?

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by PhaseLockedLoop View Post
    I keep reading that we'll be switched over to self-driving cars in the next 10-20 years, which would make tooling around in neato-looking muscle cars obsolete. Wouldn't it?
    Jesus, Mary, and Joseph! Don't mention this to Pless.
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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    Quote Originally Posted by Chip-skiff View Post
    Jesus, Mary, and Joseph! Don't mention this to Pless.
    Indeed. He doesn't even trust his pups to drive... you think he'll let some machine do it?
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

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    Default Re: VW rollerskate EV crossover coming

    au contraire, i so want a self driving car
    i can set back and read
    get dropped off at the door of where ever it is i'm going
    let the car go park itself (or better yet go make some money ubering)
    have a few drinks with dinner
    let the car pick me up after i've had a few drinks and deliver me to my home
    Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

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