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Thread: Building a Hvalsoe-13

  1. #1
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    Default Building a Hvalsoe-13

    This is Chapter 1 in what will hopefully be a finite narrative about my build of a Hvalsoe 13. The boat and her designer, Eric Hvalsoe, are fairly well known here on the Woodenboat forum. It's lapstrake built, 13'-4" LOA with a 4'-6.5" beam. She's the predecessor to his better known 16 and now, the Hv18.


    Eric designed the boat for traditional construction and I thought long and hard about building in that manner. A big part of me fully appreciates the materials and skills involved in building a leak free boat that does not rely on epoxy. This same self, sometimes wishes he found the processes necessary to work that way enjoyable. But that guy doesn't really exist. I have the skills, I just find working in that manner somewhat tedious. So, I have chosen, with Eric's permission, to build in glued lapstrake using 6mm plywood for planking.


    I have a lot of experience in building objects of many types, but I've just one boat build under my belt. That was my Somes Sound 12 1/2, Emily Ruth. My forum thread on that build is here: http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...es-Sound-Build


    My lack of boat building experience is bolstered by my reading of this forum. I've learned a great deal from reading the experiences of others along with the comment from other readers. In particular, Rich Jones' forum thread on building his Hv13 (http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...the-Hvalsoe-13 ) has been and will continue to be a tremendous resource. I look forward to comments, pro and con, over the course of this build. I hope that both Rich and Eric will continue to provide input and help.


    There are a few reasons I chose this boat: I like the way it looks. It rows very nicely and is pleasantly stable which is something I appreciate. It’s designer is a local guy. He’s also a nice guy, another thing I appreciate. And it’s the size of boat I want to use… I’ll be rowing in Puget Sound near my home and will launch off a neighbor’s beach. I’ll be able to easily tow this smallish boat to and from my yard without much difficulty. I want to get my exercise rowing, not tugging a big heavy boat around.


    This is the goal:

    CWB's Hv13.jpg



    The boat pictured is the 13 at Seattle’s Center for Wooden Boats. It was built by Eric and is of all the traditional stuff. Last January on a pleasant Saturday I went over to the center to row it. A last checkout before contacting Eric and arranging to purchase the plans. Of course it met all my expectations. I only rowed and did not sail it as I have no plans to do so in my boat. In fact, she won’t be getting the centerboard, mast step, or rig. Strictly a rowing vessel.


    I’m excited. Next I’ll bring you all up to date with where I’m at now.


    Jeff


  2. #2
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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Great little boat. I look forward to your narrative.

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    After contacting Eric about the boat, we had a good back and forth exchange via email. He said that all he had then were the original lines drawing done back in the early 80's. But, he'd been wanting to redo them for some time. I guess I gave him a good opportunity and he set to work. Soon a tube appeared in my mailbox containing the lines dwg, offsets, a table of dimensions, and a few details, though it is all for cedar on bent frames. He also included a sail plan with the caveat that it too needs some updating. As a bonus, he traced the transom outline from the template in his shop. The plans are minimal but all the relevant information is there. Eric cautioned me that the offsets fair to the rabbet line and I should be mindful of that point during the lofting.

    So off into uncharted territory I went. My Somes Sound plans, by John Brooks, included all the information a new boat builder needs. Those plans required no lofting. There were full size drawings of all station molds complete with lined-off plank marks. For that build I tacked battens up onto the molds to visually check all the marks and made some very minor adjustments. At the time I thought this exercise was giving me some lofting experience. Ha! Was I ever naive.

    My lofting table arrangement:

    Loftng table.jpg

    I am fortunate in having a sizable shop and the means to set the lofting ply up onto tables. The idea of crawling around on the floor is not my cup of tea.

    Working on a section... Lacking any drafting/lofting ducks I started out tacking the battens directly onto the ply. But I soon realized that I'd be punching many many holes both into the battens and the ply itself. So I soon decided to use those small wooden toggles. They are tacked using my pneumatic pin nailer which leaves very small holes. I could drive one pin, then using that as a point of rotation, the toggle could be adjusted slightly. The adjustment was just enough to easily tweak the batten into fair. When I was done with a line I pried the toggles up and pulled the pins. I think it was a rather slick way to do the work.
    Lofting.jpg


    The loft of the forefoot and stem:
    Lofting, forefoot.jpg

    The sharp angle at the stem is a distinctive feature of the Hv-13 and 16 although Eric has been messing with it on recent builds.

    Having never done it before, the lofting took me a few weeks to finish. Way more time than I had anticipated. This fact hasn't bothered me at all. It's all an enjoyable learning experience. I worked very carefully and cleanly. When finished on the ply I then transferred the station molds, developed transom, and stem profile to mylar sheets. I don't anticipate using these in the future, but took this extra step simply to aid mold in cutting out the molds, etc. Besides, mylar is really cool material .

    Here's the stem dwg along with stem stock marked out:

    Stem, loft & marking out.jpg

    More later, the line-off is coming.....

    Jeff

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Glad to see you building this boat! Lofting is a pure delight that many boatbuilders miss nowadays with pre-cut patterns coming with many plans. You did a masterful job on the Somes, so once you figure out changing from regular lap to glued lap, the building experience will be a pleasure.
    The only thing I tweaked was the intersection of the stem and keel. I rounded that out a bit just because I thought it looked nice. I also went with a 1/2" thick keel and keelson instead of 3/4".
    I'll be following closely!
    I was born on a wooden boat that I built myself.

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    This will be fun to watch. I wouldn't mind seeing another view of your shop; there is a lot to be learned from looking at another man's shop

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Yay! You've chosen a beautiful boat, and I'm looking forward to watching.

    +1 on the shop photos, and more of the lofting process.

    Mike
    "near it, a small whale-boat, painted red and blue, the delight of the king's old age."

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Nice choice for a beautiful boat. I look forward to the narrative.
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    http://www.harborwoodworking.com/boat.html

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    I'm not familiar with the 13, but that's a lovely design.

    I absolutely stink with jealousy about your shop, BTW... I do all my work in my driveway.

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Thanks for all the encouragement. I'm actually pretty far along in the preliminaries that must be done prior to cutting a plank. The lofting was finished last spring as were the molds. I also took time then to prepare the transom blank. I've elected to go with a plywood core and 1/16" douglas fir veneer. I laminated that up in my vacuum press: three lams of 6mm ocume and the two veneer layers for a total of 7/8" thick. Oh yeah... I added a solid doug fir inner chunk at the transom top. That way, when I shape the perfect curve, we'll see solid wood, not ply.

    A couple more thoughts on the lofting process.... As I said before, this was my first time but I'm not a stranger to geometry and drafting. I am, if anything, a bit too exact in my approach to measurements and calculations. This is a result of my engineering training and my genes. I can fuss endlessly sometimes. So tackling the lofting process wasn't a really big deal to me. If anything, it is the inherent inexact aspects of boat building that are a frustration, not the plotting of given points. And I am working on a well thought out design.

    Perhaps the area that I had the most trouble with was developing the transom. I had to re-do this a couple of times because I either didn't understand all the steps involved or I simply didn't measure correctly. I got frustrated erasing lines and there are many in a relatively small area at the transom. So for what became my final attempt, I taped some paper to the lofting ply and drew on that. This surface turned out to be much nicer to work on. It hadn't helped that I'd used a poor paint to cover the ply. A paint that sort of remained sticky for a very long time and didn't want to either take lead lines or give them up again. Fortunately I'd at least chosen good MDO plywood. Here's the transom loft:

    Lofting, Developed transom.jpg

    Finally after drafting the transom and all the station sections, I was ready to subtract the ply thickness and find bevel angles. Now, many builders using such thin planking will simply subtract the ply thickness and be done with it. And I can appreciate the logic in that approach. But I wanted to do it "by the book" so to speak. Being the first time I'd done this, I felt it was important to fully understand the process. So I dived in.

    It's a confusing process. At least it was confusing for me to read the instructions presented by several authors. I'm not sure I've got really good reading comprehension, and I'm equally not sure that boat builders make the best teachers. But what did help, a great deal, was reading Yeadon't thread about building his Hv18 where he talked about deriving the bevel angles. He recommended reading the Gougeon Brothers book on boat construction. They have a wonderful tutorial that describes how to make a master bevel board, a degree stick for any station spacing, and how to use them. Highly recommended.

    Eric too did his best to keep me on track. We had numerous email exchanges where he both calmed me down and gave me tips on how to proceed. (I wonder if he wishes he'd charged me more....?)

    Anyway, I persevered and got the lofting done. And, importantly, I believe I did OK. My developed transom is really really close to the tracing that came with my plans, and most important, all the lines look fair and balanced. However before putting the loft to actual use I asked fellow island boat builder Steve (stromborg hereabouts) to come pass judgement. It's always good to get a second opinion!

    Lofting done, I made the molds:

    Molds.jpg

    Then I put it away for the summer. I needed to get some outdoor projects done: deck, sailing, patio, sailing, new front door, sailing.....

    More later.

    Jeff

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Lines and lofting is are not easy to read and write about.

    But we learned some great tricks at boatbuilding school in Tacoma, for me that was 1980-81. I just missed Joe Trumbly who had instructed the program for the previous 25 years or so. The tale was told - that Joe taught the Gougeon Brothers about the master bevel board on a visit back east. I can't personally swear to it. However - the bevel board was part of lofting at Bates, had been for some time - and the only depiction in print I've seen of a master bevel board and it's usage as we learned it - is in the Gougeon Brothers classic boatbuilding manual. Go figure.

    Great technique by the way. Makes child's play of accurate deductions. I still teach these techniques in lofting classes at The Center For Wooden Boats in Seattle.

    The lines drawing of the 13 is drawn to the outside of the plank. Transom bevels roll from about 28 to 45 degrees. At those bevels, even with a thin skin an accurate deduction can make a difference. For a boat this size I draw a parallel raking station a few inches ahead of the transom, that is where the master bevel board comes into play.

    Carry on!

    Eric

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Jeff,
    You are so much more exacting then I am! I'm embarrassed to say how I hacked my way through the transom lofting and final development of the rolling bevels. The transom has got to be the hardest and most frustrating part of lofting for those with a Neanderthal brain like mine.

    If I were to build another HV13, I'd also change the rabbeted stem to an inner stem/outer stem like done in other glued lap designs. The transition from the stem to the keel when planking was a real head-scratcher. Again, some fudging was involved, but it came out to be a pretty little boat. When changing a design from one building method to another, always expect a lot of nights laying awake trying to sort things out.
    I was born on a wooden boat that I built myself.

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Thanks both Eric and Rich. You guys have already been a great help with this build. I don't know if you remember, Eric, but you described the use of that parallel raking station to me in an email. Indeed it made taking off the bevels possible. During the line-off I was very pleased to discover that I'd actually done something right. Both the transom and stem bevels were either spot on or required only minor tweaking. The areas off the most were within a few inches of the keelson. Areas in transition to say the least. Here's a better view of the transom lofting. You can see the use of the raking station:

    Lofting, Transom.jpg

    Rich, I am building my boat in the usual manner of glued lap: garboard plank overlying the keelson, then beveled to accept a keel... and, inner stem, planks, outer stem. This is the way espoused by John Brooks and how I build Emily Ruth. It's what I know, so I'll use it.

    Jeff

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    I'll agree - the trickiest part of this backbone is gauging the roll for the landing of the garboard through the toe of the stem. Big transition over a short distance. Use a hood end ply pattern to see the shape. Changes over a rounded forefoot are more gradual.

    Rabbeted vs non rabbetted construction is a significant divide. Rabbeting may not be as terrifying as some people imagine, but precise lofting work particularly pays off. Probably fair to say a higher level of skill is involved. With my traditional hulls, the keel rabbet is formed by the junction of the apron (sometimes called the keelson) and the keel. Beginning with a drawing to the outside of the plank, a builder can flesh out the details on the loft along either path - garboard to rabbet, or to centerline.

    We used glued ply non rabbeted construction on both 18's so far. With my background and in terms of time, possibly a wash vs rabbeted construction. The HV's use a plank keel shape. The part that most sucked about the non rabbeted garboard to centerline construct, was planing the garboards flat after installation to receive the exterior plank keel. There was also more work beveling the apron to centerline. Mercifully for that task, the 13 keel is not quite as wide as the 18.

    RE: apron thickness. 3/4" is a little fat - part of that is the need to hold nails for a traditional rabbeted garboard. Even then it is slightly heftier than necessary. On a glued ply construction, you are not worried about holding fastenings, so apron thickness could certainly be reduced (and would be easier to bend up to the transom). But not too much. It is still contributing to the stiffness of the backbone, still needs to be beveled off for the garboard.
    Eric

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Yes, bevelling the keelson is now the next step for me and there is a lot of material to remove though not as much as the 18 would need. I will use my power plane as much as possible just because it's faster and doesn't affect the tendonitis in my elbow as much.

    My keelson/apron is 3/4" doug fir. It is/was actually too thick to make the bend at the transom. I kerfed it there on the bandsaw with two cuts. That made it limber enough to make the bend but I didn't carry the cuts far enough forward to get a smooth transition. I didn't notice it at first but Steve saw it right away. He was then in the unfortunate position of boatbuilder-friend-supporter-colleague having to tell me I screwed up. I was devastated of course but thanked him anyway. I've taken care of the resultant hump now. Live and learn......

    Jeff

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    ^ That's why I originally went with the 1/2" thickness. That 3/4" keel simply did not want to bend at the stern. I didn't feel like going to the bother of steaming and figured that the total keel/keelson thickness of 1" was plenty since everything is epoxied, making a very strong chunk of wood.
    I have to say that the boat came out very, very stiff. No flex anywhere that I can see. Stiff enough that, except for the mast partner, I left out all the knees on the thwarts.
    I was born on a wooden boat that I built myself.

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Finally some time to get back at this. I did the lofting and then the molds back in the spring, finishing up in April. After summer projects, I dug it all out, assembled a building jig, and got to it:

    Backbone.jpg

    The backbone went together fairly easily except for the foul-up I mentioned before. I use a laser level to get things all aligned properly.

    Then came the line-off. I started with the suggestions given by John Brooks. He recommends beginning at the transom. I don't particularly like the joggled plank look, so I endeavored to lay them out assuming dory gains throughout. I carefully drew various planking arrangements on the backside of my mylar transom drawing... stretching out the spacing where I thought I could and tightening things up in the tightest part of the curves. I worked back and forth between the drawing and the actual transom using short 6mm thick sticks as plank stand-ins. Finally I got something that I think will work OK. We'll see when I actually get to it.

    After getting a transom one likes, Brooks then suggests to extrapolate those spacings onto the station molds. He uses a proportional method and gives a good description in his book. Well, it didn't work for me. Oh, I got the layout done allright, but the spacings were way off.... not even close in too many instances. So then I simply divided up the middle mold into equal widths... tacked a batten there and at the transom, then onto the stem... also at equal spacings. This actually worked to a degree. At least it looked like a lapstrake boat. But the spacings didn't make sense with equal widths at both flat areas and around the curve at the bilge. It wasn't right.

    Many more trials and errors ensued. I was getting frazzled. So I contacted Eric.

    At his suggestion, I began at the midship mold, garboard. That plank can be fairly wide, then I stepped them down gradually with the narrowest planks at the turn of the bilge. The shear became wider as did plank #9 below it. I then took those spacings and modified my transom to be similar. Some edges didn't move much from where I had them. Then I ran a garboard batten laying it to the stem in what seemed a natural manner. (It's all sort of like voodoo.) The shear was given by the lofting and I didn't make any adjustments to it.... a batten showed it to be fair and pleasing. A center batten followed then all the others.

    I sat in my shop chair a lot... just looking at the boat. Or, rather, looking at this weird 3D drawing of a boat. After looking, I'd get up and move a batten at a mold... maybe move it a whole 3/32". Then sit a look some more. This went on for a week or so. Finally, I didn't see where I could move anything to improve it. So I asked Steve to come over again. He didn't laugh, or shake his head in disgust. He suggested I might... maybe, adjust those two a tiny bit because they seemed too cramped. Or was it too open? No matter, after he left, I tried that suggestion. I think I found truth somewhere in between. That seemed about right.

    I decided the line-off was done:

    Line off, Stern.jpg

    Line off, Bow.jpg

    Line off, Beam.jpg

    After the line-off I marked all the molds, took off the battens, and got out my planes. Time to bevel that keelson and get to making it a boat.

    And that's where I am now. Lots of planing to do and my elbow is not real happy about it. So I must go slowly with plenty of rest periods. I'll post more photos later.

    Jeff

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Say, nice boat.
    Quote Originally Posted by James McMullen View Post
    Yeadon is right, of course.

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    I well remember those days of lining off. Hours of staring and adjusting. I had the added problem of a small shop where I couldn't get a good view from all angles. But, it all came out good in the end.
    Glad to see that you added the width of the outwale to the sheerstrake so it doesn't look skinny when done.
    I was born on a wooden boat that I built myself.

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Quote Originally Posted by Yeadon View Post
    Say, nice boat.
    Maybe YOU should get yourself something similar eh?

    jpatrick - keep them fotos coming... most enjoyable. Looks like you're doing fine work!
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    http://www.harborwoodworking.com/boat.html

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    Maybe YOU should get yourself something similar eh?

    jpatrick - keep them fotos coming... most enjoyable. Looks like you're doing fine work!

    Thank you David. And thank you, Tim. Your thread on building the Hv18 is one of my guides.

    Jeff

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Quote Originally Posted by Rich Jones View Post
    I well remember those days of lining off. Hours of staring and adjusting. I had the added problem of a small shop where I couldn't get a good view from all angles. But, it all came out good in the end.
    Glad to see that you added the width of the outwale to the sheerstrake so it doesn't look skinny when done.
    Thanks, Rich. The batten at the shear went on right away and I immediately realized if I simply added another like it, I'd be seeing the outwale width. Together they add up to 1 1/8", just as Eric has designed. Saving battens from older builds pays off sometimes.

    I'm fortunate in that my shop is large enough to get a pretty good view of one side. But you wouldn't believe how messy I can be in there. Sometimes it takes a while to clear a path.

    Jeff

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Ah, what a lovely sight. I'm glad you're doing it. Thanks for the pics.

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Congratulations, great headway - looks terrific.
    "People should be able to access these benefits [Social Welfare] as a matter of right, with no more loss of their own standards of self-respect than would be involved in collecting from an insurance company the proceeds of an endowment policy on which they have been paying premiums for years."
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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    I haven't given up yet. I might have come close.

    I had a devilish time figuring out how to bevel the keelson/inner stem transition to allow for a smooth, but not too rounded, bend in the garboard. The sharp intersection between the two components in the 13 were enough to confound my 3-D visualizing abilities and almost beat me into submission. It took many hours of looking, contemplating, and trial and error before I achieved happiness. It also took a couple of email chats with Eric to keep me on the straight and narrow. What allowed me to turn the corner was his suggestion to make a trail plank that went back a couple of molds. So I did this and the effort was well worth the time and materials. With the trail plank I was able to actually see where the hard spot was at the juncture. The procedure was: bend the plank into the stem, listen for any cracking of plywood, stop and note where the apex of the bend is, take it all off and shave a little more keelson/stem. Repeat....

    Little by little, this nervous and inexperienced boat builder got the temporary to lay nicely and look proper. It all sounds so easy.....

    My trial plank:

    Garboard test plank 1.jpg

    and...

    Garboard test plank 2.jpg

    During the process of doing this, I over cut the bevel on the keelson port side not once but two times. Each time I had to stop and scarf in some new material, let it cure, and re-bevel. Time marches on and on.

    With the test plank telling me its OK to proceed, I installed the garboards. Whew. Beveling them was pretty straight forward as was spiling for the next. These tasks were quite similar to what I did when building my Somes Sound. Surely the garboard must be the most difficult on a lot of boats.

    Here is #2, both port and stb. are installed. This happened late yesterday afternoon/evening:

    #2 installed.jpg

    Now my question to those who know more than I, and there are many..... There is quite a bit of curvature in plank #2 and #3. I'm assuming this will continue to be true as I proceed up/down the hull. Scarfing as I cut out the planks will safe me a lot of plywood because I can minimize waste. How do people handle this task? On the SS I scarfed all the stock prior to spiling any plank as per Brooks' suggestion. But he had gone before me and provided a cut sheet. I'm on my own here.

    Any suggestions?

    So that brings us up to date. I'm still having fun. I'm off to Port Townsend today for some supplies and a nice lunch with my wife. It will be a nice change of pace.

    Jeff

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    I will enjoy following your build also.
    Thanks for taking the time to post.

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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Tell you how I handled the HV 18 with 9 ml.

    I spiled the plank as I am used to (not the truss business).
    I got the plywood up on the bench, admittedly this was awkward starting out with full size sheets. Some additional support required.

    I adjusted the sheets and/or spiling batten to layout the plank with the least possible waste of plywood, this also involved extending fair batten curves and taking into account the scarf.

    The individual plank segments were ripped using a 'panel saw' (small skill saw, with fine kerf blade), my preferred method.

    The plank segment butt ends were carefully cut on the lines, as these cuts aligned the scarfs.

    The great revelation of this planking job was cutting the scarfs on the table saw with a mortising jig. I have a high ceiling. I can set an 8' plank segment upright in the mortising jig and cut a scarf in 2 seconds. I can cut all the scarfs for a plank in a few seconds, clean as a whistle. Note also that these are narrow planks. Fabulous.

    I realigned and reassembled the plank sections for port and starboard strake back on the bench, taking care to set plastic or wax paper under the scarf joints. Accurate realigment was accomplished by referring back to the spiling batten. All the planks on the 18 were three segments, so again, considerable care and concentration and faith in the spiling to reassemble the plank.

    The plank segment were then glued up on the bench. Weights, pads, whatever to press the scarfs flat. With very little clean up, and after cutting the gains, the planks were installed on the boat.

    Bench assembly became easier and less cumbersome as the size of the plywood sheets diminished. Flat, fair scarfs and plank lines, phenomenally little plywood waste.
    Eric
    Last edited by Eric Hvalsoe; 12-13-2017 at 10:54 PM.

  27. #27
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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Thanks for sharing your process, Eric. I've come to the conclusion that one can either save material or save time, but not necessarily both, when forging new paths. I think I'll be happier taking the slow route. This means hanging a plank every other day instead of one per. That's ok. I've other tasks to keep me occupied and out of trouble.

    Our trip to Port Townsend yesterday was a good one. We bought coffee at Sunrise Coffee Co., visited the Northwest Maritime thrift shop, and I bought boat building supplies at Admiral Ship Supply. While I shopped for boat stuff, Chris found a few tools and odd parts (odd to her) that she can use to form patterns in her ceramic endeavors. Win win for us. Then we had a nice lunch in downtown.

    When I got back home to the shop I found that the newly installed plank hadn't fallen off. Thank goodness that epoxy actually gets hard! I'll be scarfing up the next plank today.

    Jeff

  28. #28
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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Hi Jeff,
    I enjoyed your Somes Sound thread. Good job! I will be following this one.
    I took Eric's HV15 out for a row from the CWB, Seattle, a couple of years ago. It was very nice. I have his HV16 plans.
    I can't improve on Eric's planking system, but you can see mine on my thread, "Kotik, Kotik, Kotik!" I thought there was a photo of my scarf-cutting method, but I don't see it. I'll post one here tonight. Sorry, got to go now.
    Cheers, Ian
    Old Joke: ‘A bench fitter works to the nearest thousandth of an inch. A loco fitter (steam) works to the nearest inch. A shipwright works to the nearest ship’.”
    Alan Byde, Canoe Design and Construction, Pelham Books, 1978

    “...old maxim, 'A fair line supersedes any given measurement'.”
    Allan H. Vaitses, Lofting, International Marine, 1980

  29. #29
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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Hello Jeff,
    Here are some scarfing photos. There is nothing original about the method, but they just show the way I do it. The edgeways curve of the planks goes one way for the bottom planks, then straightens out around the bilges, then goes the other way for the topsides. I put scraps of plywood under the hanging ends at the back end of the stack, as needed, to keep them level. You have to be careful to stack them so that you are cutting the scarf on the correct side of each piece. I arrange them so that the water flows "over" them, not "into" them, which doesn't really matter since they are epoxied, but I like to keep to the old principles where I can. Some people prefer to use hand planes for the whole job.











    I usually do a dry assembly of the part-planks on the boat with screws and clamps in all the right places, then take them off and glue them on, one piece at a time, working from stern to bow, gluing the scarfs as I go, but on my Kotik I did some by doing the dry assembly and then marking it with a long straightedge straddling the joint and marking a line for about 2ft each side of the joint, and sighting along those lines to line up the part-planks on the bench and glue the scarfs there. This means you have to let that glue set before you can glue the whole plank onto the boat, but that's just a matter of how you organise it. The scarfs came out smoother that way, so they took less sanding and filling. The trick is to keep the three pieces correctly lined up when you glue them together. (Two pieces for the HV13.)
    Anyway, I'm glad to know you're getting on with it. Keep up the good work!
    Also glad to know you had a good day in Port Townsend. We enjoy that place too. Been to the WB Festival four times now and will probably go again in 2018. We feel that we have a few friends there now, including Eric, and Steve "Stromborg".
    Cheers,
    Ian
    Old Joke: ‘A bench fitter works to the nearest thousandth of an inch. A loco fitter (steam) works to the nearest inch. A shipwright works to the nearest ship’.”
    Alan Byde, Canoe Design and Construction, Pelham Books, 1978

    “...old maxim, 'A fair line supersedes any given measurement'.”
    Allan H. Vaitses, Lofting, International Marine, 1980

  30. #30
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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Ian, thank you for sharing the photos and process. The way I've been cutting scarfs is quite similar. I guess my question was more along the lines of: When do people cut scarfs? On the SS I scarfed half sheets of ply end to end so that I then had 2' x 16' stock. This was at the direction/suggestion of the designer who had already built the boat. This resulted in minimal waste and it was time efficient because all the scarf cutting and gluing could be done at one time. On the Hv13 I don't have preconceived patterns so I don't know how the plywood sheets might best be used. Your's and Eric's responses lead me to believe that this condition is more the norm. And, given this situation, it is probably most efficient to do as you guys are doing. I will proceed accordingly.

    But yesterday and today are given over to being Santa's helper. I'm working on a totally unrelated project as a gift for a dear friend. Still, the boat is close at hand and I can glance at her every now and then.

    Best to all.

    Jeff

  31. #31
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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Thanks, Jeff. That's good, and Merry Christmas!
    Ian
    Old Joke: ‘A bench fitter works to the nearest thousandth of an inch. A loco fitter (steam) works to the nearest inch. A shipwright works to the nearest ship’.”
    Alan Byde, Canoe Design and Construction, Pelham Books, 1978

    “...old maxim, 'A fair line supersedes any given measurement'.”
    Allan H. Vaitses, Lofting, International Marine, 1980

  32. #32
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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Jeff,

    Due to shop space constraints, I have no long bench to scarf the planks together off the boat. Each plank on the boats I have built needed three sections.

    I buy cheap doorskin ply and make patterns for the plank pieces, including the length needed for the scarfs, by rough-cutting the doorskin with extra width and clamping it onto the battens so that I can trace directly from the previous plank and the lining-off batten for the next. This trimmed pattern then gets transferred to the expensive ply for cutting out. This allows optimal use of the expensive ply.

    I have router scarfing jig I built a long time ago but you can use any method as others have pointed out and you have discovered.

    The doorskins, being so thin, don't have the same bend characteristics as 3/8" ply but this is generally only a problem with planks with a lot of twist, like the garboard, but you're past that.

    Once each plank section is fine-tune fitted, I glue it onto the boat. It does take me 3 glue sessions for each plank, but you get into a rhythm after a while.
    Alex

    "A man who is not afraid of the sea will soon be drowned, for he will be going out on a day he shouldn't. We do be afraid of the sea, and we only be drowned now and again" Aran Islands Fisherman

  33. #33
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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Alex, thanks for that info. I actually use a variation of your doorskin method but with 1/4" fir ply. My fir "test plank" is scribed to the prior planks bevel, sawn/planed to the line, then adjusted to fit "just so." It works pretty well for me.

    It sounds like you glue your scarfs together as you hang the planks. True? And if so, how do you clamp them?

    Fortunately, I've got the space and length in my shop to glue the scarfs on a bench. It's a temporary bench, but it works just fine.

    Jeff

  34. #34
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    Jan 2008
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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Spectacular. Can’t wait to see it completed at PT this year.

    or next.

    Whenever.
    There's the plan, then there's what actually happens.

    Ben Sebens, RN

  35. #35
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    Default Re: Building a Hvalsoe-13

    Quote Originally Posted by jpatrick View Post
    It sounds like you glue your scarfs together as you hang the planks. True? And if so, how do you clamp them?
    Jeff
    Jeff,

    True, scarfs are glued together on the boat.

    I have a bunch of F-clamps that I use, together with pairs of rectangular-section sticks a little longer than the planks are wide. I use these, one above and one below the plank to get the clamping force over to the lap. Doesn't need a lot of force over most of the plank length, only when there is a lot of twist.
    Alex

    "A man who is not afraid of the sea will soon be drowned, for he will be going out on a day he shouldn't. We do be afraid of the sea, and we only be drowned now and again" Aran Islands Fisherman

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