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Thread: The Uranium One scandal?

  1. #1
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    Default The Uranium One scandal?

    Stand by for some more fake news. The Republicans are doing wind sprints, trying to get this supposed scandal front and center in the media... presumably, to distract from the Mueller investigation.

    From all I have read, it's a nothingburger, with a bunch of false accusations. For a good review, try the Snopes article:

    https://www.snopes.com/hillary-clint...m-russia-deal/
    "Fact is that which enough people believe. Truth is determined by how fervently they believe it."
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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Fox has been pushing it. Trump can't continue to base his presidency on the supposed sins of Hillary Clinton. And when those sins don't exist, it just gets thinner and thinner...

    So long as they free all those child sex slaves in that pizza parlor basement!

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Jeff Sessions was even asked about it today under oath.

    Douchebaggeriness.
    Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Yeah, go on, do it. Investigate.
    Hillary will put on a good show of resistance but really just be happy to be in the limelight.

    Any serious up-and-coming democrats will need to distance themselves from Hillary, but they'll need to get out of Hilly/Bernie/Biden's shadow anyway if they're legit.

    It'll be a huge waste of time and energy and government resources, sure, but that doesn't mean it's a bad thing.
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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    TRump and Clinton ARE America. They do whatever is neccessary to get to where they need to go to get the rewards they want, and screw anyone who gets in the way. Anyone who thinks they are any different from each other (bar the obvious) needs their heads examined. Its the American way, lie, cheat, break deals and shaft everyone till you reach the top! Go USA!

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    The same 'principles' apply in US foreign affairs too, figures.

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Quote Originally Posted by skaraborgcraft View Post
    TRump and Clinton ARE America. They do whatever is neccessary to get to where they need to go to get the rewards they want, and screw anyone who gets in the way. Anyone who thinks they are any different from each other (bar the obvious) needs their heads examined. Its the American way, lie, cheat, break deals and shaft everyone till you reach the top! Go USA!
    Let us make a brief comparison with Russia, shall we? A country ruled by a ruthless although fairly competent kleptocrat, where the rule of law is tenuous at best, and nonexistent if one opposes the government with any effectiveness, an economy with a declining GDP dependent on resource extraction almost as much as Saudi Arabia, which generates no significant new technology outside a few very restricted fields, and whose manufactured goods (other than things you burn up or blow up) are a joke . . .

    Shall I continue? God knows the US plenty of problems, but this is starting to get more than irritating. Ms. Clinton has her share of faults, but if you honestly can't tell the difference between her and Trump, you'd best refrain from commenting on US politics unless you have a much higher tolerance for embarrassment than most folks.
    Last edited by Keith Wilson; 11-14-2017 at 07:35 PM.
    "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations,
    for nature cannot be fooled."

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Tiring of the agitprop? Ignore him.

    Deja Moo: The feeling that you have heard this bull before.


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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Montgomery View Post
    Tiring of the agitprop? Ignore him.
    I think you're right. I wonder if he's getting paid, or if he's doing out of conviction?
    "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations,
    for nature cannot be fooled."

    Richard Feynman

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post
    I think you're right. I wonder if he's getting paid, or if he's doing out of conviction?
    conviction of course, he has a long history of quality topsides postings
    Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post

    Shall I continue? God knows the US plenty of problems, but this is starting to get more than irritating. Ms. Clinton has he share of faults, but if you honestly can't tell the difference between her and Trump, you's best refrain from commenting on US politics unless you have a much higher tolerance for embarrassment than most folks.
    You are gonna be in so much trouble when the progressive posse gets back together. Baseless claims that she has faults, referring to Candidate Clinton as a he, indicating that Candidate Clinton is not married without a cite from huffington post. Good knowing you man, I'm gonna miss you.
    Disbelief in magic can force a poor soul into believing in government and business.
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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Quote Originally Posted by switters View Post
    You are gonna be in so much trouble when the progressive posse gets back together.
    Feh. There is no one here on the left, whether they supported her for president or not, who wouldn't readily acknowledge Ms. Clinton's faults. Blind hero-worship is definitely not a common problem among Democrats.

    I'm glad to hear skaraborgcraft is sincere, not an official troll. These days, one can get a bit paranoid. But really, for a defender of Russia to accuse US leaders of ruthlessness and amorality, and claim that these qualities characterize the country? Hooo boy. Just how ignorant of history does he think we are?
    "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations,
    for nature cannot be fooled."

    Richard Feynman

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    where's lw?
    Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Reporters from Fox News themselves even debunk this story.
    https://www.mediamatters.org/video/2...network/218557
    Tom

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Where is Louie Gohmert's chart?
    Steve Martinsen

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?



    In the words of the inestimable Dave Barry, "I am not making this up."
    Steve Martinsen

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    They left out George Soros and the Protocols of the Elders of Zion.
    "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations,
    for nature cannot be fooled."

    Richard Feynman

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    **** me, that chart is legit?

    Wow!
    Nosce te ipsum

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post
    Hooo boy. Just how ignorant of history does he think we are?
    Not everyone Kieth. It is easy to be "ignorant" of history, when often the facts or the story you get fed is not quite the same as reality. Its more a case of believing the wrong information being spoon fed to you, than of ignorance, and actually having that belief that your own government is always going to be honest with the people. Im not defending the system in Russia, what i find amusing is that the vast majority of Russian know exactly what kind of government they have running things, but its taking a while for Americans to actually see whats going on, and why, i mean, how many times does someone have to throw down the "blame Russia" card, before you actually realise it cant all be Russias fault? You seem to take some kind of joy in laying out facts about how crap Russia is, but then, it would appear, you fail to explain how this backward country has managed to infiltrate your country where it is responsible for everything that has gone on lately, and yet it is the US who has the most invasive of systems to "protect the American people", and yet that seems to have failed in these situations. I find that hard to believe. Nothing wrong with being loyal. But i have witnessed what blind loyalty gets you. If you think being paid $500,000 from a Russian investment firm, Renaissaance Capital, for a speech in St Petesburg (thats in Russia), thats fine, but i would question why millions of $ was forhtcoming into the Clinton foundation from investors involved in the Uranium One deal.Exactly what is it that she hands out at these speeches that encourages such generosity to their foundation? Now if you are so positive that these things happen all the time in Russia, why assume it does not happen in the US? Dont people want power and money too, or all you all law abiding citizens?

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    So many questions, so little time.

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Quote Originally Posted by skaraborgcraft View Post
    If you think being paid $500,000 from a Russian investment firm, Renaissaance Capital, for a speech in St Petesburg (thats in Russia), thats fine, but i would question why millions of $ was forhtcoming into the Clinton foundation from investors involved in the Uranium One deal.
    THIS is a perfect example of why Keith is right. Take a little bit of information: the fact that HRC received a fat honorarium for a speech (something virtually all famous celebs do, whether they're corrupt or not), then 'mention' something about a uranium deal, without looking at the facts behind it....

    ...and, lo and behold, you've got a conspiracy... corruption... EVIL!

    Sorry, but the Uranium One 'nontroversy' is exactly like the ridiculous Benghazi allegations. You can always attribute, to evil, that which you don't bother to understand. It's even EASIER, in fact, if you don't cloud your mind with contrary facts.
    "Fact is that which enough people believe. Truth is determined by how fervently they believe it."
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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Norm, you seem to be a follower of finance. Is it just a coincidence that rules governing banks have been changed to suit their own investment style beyond what was considered lawfull, or might Wall St contributions have something to do with it?
    Surely you do not deny lobbyists are paid huge incentives to pass law in their sponsers favour?

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Quote Originally Posted by skaraborgcraft View Post
    Norm, you seem to be a follower of finance. Is it just a coincidence that rules governing banks have been changed to suit their own investment style beyond what was considered lawfull, or might Wall St contributions have something to do with it?
    Surely you do not deny lobbyists are paid huge incentives to pass law in their sponsers favour?
    You are absolutely right about all of that. We are increasingly descending into a kleptocracy, in this country... where the big money interests, via lobbyists and corrupt politicians, certainly influence both law and executive action to perpetuate and enhance the interests of the wealthy and powerful....

    ....but I intensely dislike false accusations, and the Uranium One thing has all the earmarks of an utterly false set of accusations, that are dependent on people not knowing obtainable facts about the controversy. How many people, for example, believed that Hillary Clinton was involved with a secret pedophile sex ring operating out of the basement of a NY pizza parlor? Why did so many people believe, for eight long years, that Obama was a Kenyan-born anti-colonial Muslim?

    I voted for Hillary Clinton. I thought that she was supremely qualified, by virtue of long experience, to be President. I wasn't a 'personal' fan of her... like many politicians, she has been certainly capable of lapses in judgment, from time to time... but I will NOT participate in fake news and false political smears, against ANY politician.
    "Fact is that which enough people believe. Truth is determined by how fervently they believe it."
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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Just to illustrate the point, consider that even Shep Smith, FOX News reporter/commentator, pushed back of this false scandal:

    Fox News anchor Shep Smith broke from his network’s hyperventilating coverage of the “Uranium One” pseudoscandal to debunk allegations of wrongdoings by Hillary Clinton.Smith, never one to blindly toe the party line, took to task President Donald Trump ― and, implicitly, his cable news network of choice ― over the “inaccurate” portrayal of the sale of a Canadian mining company with major U.S. holdings to a Russian company.

    “Here’s the accusation,” Smith explained Tuesday. “Nine people involved in the deal made donations to the Clinton Foundation totaling more than $140 million. In exchange, Secretary of State Clinton approved the sale to the Russians — a quid pro quo.”

    It’s a claim that has dominated Fox News in recent weeks after The Hill published a deeply flawed report about a “Russian bribery plot” involving the sale. Following pressure from the president and several Republican members of Congress, Attorney General Jeff Sessions announced earlier this week that the Justice Department would consider appointing a special counsel to review the deal as well as other matters involving Clinton and other Democrats.

    There’s never been any evidence that Clinton acted inappropriately and, as Smith notes, “the Clinton State Department had no power to approve or veto that transaction. It could do neither.” Indeed, the State Department was just one of nine agencies that signed off on the deal and Clinton herself wasn’t even on the committee.

    “The accusation is predicated on the charge that Secretary Clinton approved the sale,” Smith said. “She did not. A committee of nine evaluated the sale, the president approved the sale, the Nuclear Regulatory Commission and others had to offer permits, and none of the uranium was exported for use by the U.S. to Russia. That is Uranium One.”

    Since Smith’s segment, Uranium One has been mentioned over 40 times on various Fox News shows.
    "Fact is that which enough people believe. Truth is determined by how fervently they believe it."
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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Some real!ing head on FOX (sorry, I'm too lazy to go lollipops name) debunked the whole Uranium thing. He started getting death threats.

    Here it is:
    http://www.newsweek.com/fox-news-hos...ium-one-711762
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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    The difference, my good sir, is that while the US certainly has its share of corruption, it is generally the exception, not the normal procedure. There have been some times it was worse than others - the late 19th century, the 1920s - (and the current administration seems so far to be quite exceptionally bad in that respect) but generally, the above-ground official public channels are how things get done. That doesn't prevent bad decisions, even sometimes monumentally horrible ones, but the things that Norm mentions are all out there in public, done in plain sight.

    I have lived and traveled places where that was not the case, and the real story is usually hidden - but that is not generally how it is here. Sometimes, no doubt, but not that often. And in the US, we are utterly incapable of keeping secrets for long, and there is no reliable mechanism for suppressing information; someone will always find it out and publish an article or a book. Paranoia is rational in some part of the world - Argentina, Peru, most of Central America (Costa Rica expected), sometimes Mexico, just to speak of places I know something about - and Russia, certainly. but paranoia applied to the US will generally lead you astray.
    "For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations,
    for nature cannot be fooled."

    Richard Feynman

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    I suppose Donna Brazille(sp?) being afraid to stand in front of a window without the shades drawn was just paranoia on her part.

    Until people get over this ridiculous knee-jerk partisanship and DEMAND real accountability across the board, and genuine journalism, this country is going to be stuck with the politicians it deserves. I'm not holding my breath for change any time soon.

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    I guess some see Clinton and others as part of that kleptocracy, and others do not. Much would depend on what you read, and whether you want to believe it.......sometimes the truth is uncomfortable.....

    Have you divested yet Norm? Tops about to blow!

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post
    The difference, my good sir, is that while the US certainly has its share of corruption, it is generally the exception, not the normal procedure. There have been some times it was worse than others - the late 19th century, the 1920s - (and the current administration seems so far to be quite exceptionally bad in that respect) but generally, the above-ground official public channels are how things get done.
    I would only partially agree, Keith. Comparisons to other countries don't strike me as particularly valid: we should be holding ourselves to our OWN standards, not the standards of other nations. While I believe most politicians WANT to be honest, and TRY to be, our political system, especially gerrymandering and the way we finance political campaigns, makes it nearly impossible for the most honest of politicians to not pay attention to those things that will help get them re-elected.

    Politicians run for three possible reasons: 1) they want the ability to influence governance for altruistic reasons, 2) they want power, and 3) they need a job.

    Congressmen are paid $174K/yr... not an especially big salary, if you have to maintain a residence in DC as well as at home. However, a few terms in Congress opens doors to private employment, so for the politician who is NOT obsessed about power, or who isn't particularly altrusitic, serving in Congress is the key to career advancement.

    Others are independently wealthy, which undoubtedly helped their election prospects, and gives them the levers of power. HOW they exercise that power can vary.

    A few are altruistic... but even THEY recognize the compromises in principle that is required to be elected... and if one is not elected, one can't influence the course of government. You might want to read Al Franken's book, where he is especially honest about how much time he had to spend on the phone, cajoling big donors for the contributions necessary to win his election... it is frankly depressing to have to accept that idea.
    "Fact is that which enough people believe. Truth is determined by how fervently they believe it."
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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Quote Originally Posted by skaraborgcraft View Post
    I guess some see Clinton and others as part of that kleptocracy, and others do not. Much would depend on what you read, and whether you want to believe it.......sometimes the truth is uncomfortable.....
    It often is. However, mixed in with a smattering of truth, there's a heaping helpful of lies. It's sometimes hard to distinguish among them.

    Quote Originally Posted by skaraborgcraft View Post
    Have you divested yet Norm? Tops about to blow!
    I admit to being concerned... and I fully expect a market correction soon... who knows how much... 5%? 10%? Probably not much more than that. I've recently gone heavier into cash, than my normal investment pattern, in anticipation.
    "Fact is that which enough people believe. Truth is determined by how fervently they believe it."
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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post
    And in the US, we are utterly incapable of keeping secrets for long, and there is no reliable mechanism for suppressing information.
    Thats a good one Keith. Why are the FBI still dragging out the release of the JFK files after all this time? Never ceases to amaze me that a government will coerce its citizens to giving up certain rights with the usual " if you have done nothing wrong, you have nothing to hide".......and yet the same government will redact pages and pages of stuff. And if you believe all the redacted stuff is to do with matters of national security............history has already shown that not to be.

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Quote Originally Posted by skaraborgcraft View Post
    Thats a good one Keith. Why are the FBI still dragging out the release of the JFK files after all this time? Never ceases to amaze me that a government will coerce its citizens to giving up certain rights with the usual " if you have done nothing wrong, you have nothing to hide".......and yet the same government will redact pages and pages of stuff. And if you believe all the redacted stuff is to do with matters of national security............history has already shown that not to be.
    I'm sure that SOME redacted stuff doesn't deserve to be withheld... but presuming that ALL redactions, based on national security issues, are evidence of some sort of cover-up is the stuff that false conspiracy theories are made of.

    Undoubtedly, there are redactions which are necessary, to protect tradecraft, sources, and methods. When it comes to national security, there's a certain amount of trust we MUST invest, in the directors of those agencies... I see no other alternative. Fortunately, I believe that most heads of intelligence agencies, presuming they are professionals with long association with the agencies they head, are honorable people.
    "Fact is that which enough people believe. Truth is determined by how fervently they believe it."
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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Trust in our national security apparatus? What rock have you been living under, Norm? Have a good hard look at Operation Paper Clip and MK Ultra, and get back to me.

    I've come to believe that the biggest mistake the U.S. made post WWII was inviting thousands of Nazis into the inner sanctums of our scientific and intelligence communities. Don't believe it happened? Conspiracy theories? Have a closer look.

    "Lie down with dogs, get up with fleas." Or rather, sarcoptic mange. Much more difficult to cure.
    So many questions, so little time.

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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    Quote Originally Posted by ishmael View Post
    Trust in our national security apparatus? What rock have you been living under, Norm? Have a good hard look at Operation Paper Clip and MK Ultra, and get back to me.
    What, exactly, would you like to do about it? Prevent our intelligence apparatus from keeping ANY secrets? You think that would be a sensible alternative?
    "Fact is that which enough people believe. Truth is determined by how fervently they believe it."
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    Default Re: The Uranium One scandal?

    We invited thousands of nazis into the inner sanctums of what, now?

    If thousands were invited, how "inner" could those sanctums have been, really?
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