Results 1 to 15 of 15

Thread: First Time Build

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Perth, Western Australia, Australia
    Posts
    5

    Default First Time Build

    Hello, I'm new around here and have joined to lend some experience if that is o.k? I'm contemplating what to build and can't quite decide which boat to build. Any suggestions would be great also as I keep discovering new models (that throw spanners in the works).

    The boat that I build will hardly ever see flat water. It will mostly encounter 5-15 knot winds and .5 to 1.5m swell. It is the short chop that the boat will have to deal with I will need to take most into consideration. I am looking for a length of 4.5m to 5m and a beam of 1.7m to 2m, optimally it would be around 1.8, but overall design is more important. I am after a boat that will do what a 4.8m aluminium dinghy will do, but with a higher degree of comfort. I would like to be able to power the boat with 30-50hp, cc or tiller, depending on design. Above all, this is my first build, so it would need to be a relatively simple stitch and glue with not huge costs of ply involved. I will however most likely add quite a bit of glass to the design to cope with conditions, probably a minimum of 2 x 300gsm and 1 x 450gsm layers.

    Originally, I was contemplating building MB Marsh's Almaguin 500, but the 7.5 degree dead rise is not really enough. I also looked at building a lengthened Selway-Fisher Power 14, but lack of chine put me off.

    I have look at the Bateau range and a couple really catch my eye such as the Outboard 17, but it is just a bit too big for what I want and I think that I would have to double or triple the fibreglass and epoxy amounts to get the hull that I want and then the power would need to be above what I'm looking at.

    I quite like the Spira Newporter 16, but have some reservations about internal gunnel height in relation to my two small children, but this design looks good.
    I also quite like the panga from Spira, but the lack of vee and lack of a planing plank puts me off the design for what I want.
    I like the Marissa design, but the material total and complexity worries me. I have been in touch with them and asked if I can some how obtain a kit drawing for extra and am waiting on an answer.
    The Australian designs from Bowdidge are probably one level up from what I want in my first build. The look very good though, and would look at building one in the future.

    Any suggestions or ideas would be appreciated.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Lake Norman,North Carolina and Cedarville, Michigan
    Posts
    220

    Default Re: First Time Build

    You are going to hear this from others I'm sure, but consider dipping your toe in with a smaller build to test out even the stitch and glue process. Lots start with a canoe or similar to get a hang of it before going into the size and complexity you are considering.

    That being said, I'm familiar with a couple of the designs you mention and feel confident in saying that if you follow the build and fiberglass lamination schedules of the designer without trying to "beef up" the glass, your product will be plenty strong and not over weight.

    The cost of the plywood is really minor in the grand scheme of things even if you discount your labor time to zero. I wouldn't let that be the limiting factor. If it is, then you might find you start a build without really being aware of the cost and complexity and taking on a project that doesn't get completed for want of funds.

    I know there is a certain pride in being able to say you built one of these boats from a set of plans and stack of plywood, but if you can swing anyone of the available CNC kits offered by several of the mentioned designers I don't think you would regret it in the long run. It doesn't take too many mis-cuts to quickly add up to the cost of a "kit".

    I have to admit an ignorance of the waters that you will be using your boat, so I'll leave the plan suggestions to others more knowledgeable. Sounds like you have done your research and both good plans and designers have made you short list so I think you will be happy.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Perth, Western Australia, Australia
    Posts
    5

    Default Re: First Time Build

    Thanks JT for the advice. Yes, I agree. Cutting is the one area that I'm not going to tackle. I have a friend with a CNC manufacturing company that will cut for me from PDF format (manual?). I understand that I will have to do minimal cutting after this as the bulk will be done.

    Whatever I build will unavoidably have the bejesus beaten out of it occasionally, especially at this time of year when you have to put your boat in before work to pull cray pots around the 3 mile reef. This is where I will need a nice vee with lots of glass. Otherwise, I'm a fair weather fisherman mostly.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    Nelson, New Zealand
    Posts
    46

    Default Re: First Time Build

    Try looking at Sam Devlins designs. His Duckboat type Cackler 14 or the Snow Goose may be ideal for what you are intending to do with the boat and his FDishing boat designs (candlefish 16) might be a suitable candidate. They don't need a lot of power (which makes for a cheaper engine and smaller fuel bills) which might sway your decision. Plenty of illustrations of the boats being built to give you an idea of the construction too.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    16

    Default Re: First Time Build

    Hello Pilchard: I built a Bateau C17 as a center console...great boat for the conditions and use that you described.....with high freeboard / cockpit depth. Very dry ride.
    Five years old and no problems whatsoever. V-bottom....11 degree at transom.
    Resized_20171022_133619 (2).jpg
    Last edited by Rmarsh; 11-24-2017 at 07:41 AM. Reason: details

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Lake Norman,North Carolina and Cedarville, Michigan
    Posts
    220

    Default Re: First Time Build

    Pilchard,
    I'm curious about your plan to have the panels cut locally by CNC using PDF plans. I've not heard of this being done, so I'm curious to hear how. Will he recreate all the parts in a CAD program to cut them? Seems like a lot of work, but hopefully a good friend that owes you one.

    I don't think I've heard of any designers sharing their cut files for obvious reasons, but I guess that might be the wave of the future. Already, they have to take a leap of faith and send plans out electronically. I wonder if any sell the files at this point?

    The C17 above is available as a kit from Bateau and my experience with their kits has been great. Their material is top notch and shipping in the US is reasonable.

    Since home for you is half way around the world from their Florida shop, that is a good reason in my mind to propose the purchase of cut files if they would sell them. I know there are a lot of those Bateau boats built Down Under so maybe Bateau has a relationship with someone there already that could cut direct for you under license from them?

    Good luck with your build.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Location
    SW Washington/ At Sea
    Posts
    157

    Default Re: First Time Build

    Would the Bartender 19 be too big?

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Hobart, Tasmania, Australia
    Posts
    18

    Default Re: First Time Build

    Mark Bowdidge covers off most sizes in his design portfolio - good looking, modern boats.

    http://www.bowdidgemarinedesigns.com

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Location
    Barrie, Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    4,852

    Default Re: First Time Build

    Ditto on the plywood -- in 5 years all that you will remember is your labour. The cost of the plywood won't even enter into it.

    Also, you'll be wishing you used better stuff as the cheap wood starts to rot. I'm dealing with that now with a 10 ft dinghy, a boat I designed and built and which is perfect for what I want, but which is made from cheap ply. (I wish I'd bought the good stuff.)

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Northern Europe
    Posts
    9,444

    Default Re: First Time Build

    DeeMac beat me to it. Marks stuff is designed for your waters.....and they work as designed.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Perth, Western Australia, Australia
    Posts
    5

    Default Re: First Time Build

    Quote Originally Posted by DeeMac View Post
    Mark Bowdidge covers off most sizes in his design portfolio - good looking, modern boats.

    http://www.bowdidgemarinedesigns.com
    Thanks gents. It so happens that a good friend of mine who I fish with is upgrading his outboard to a 4 stroke so I am the proud new owner of a 1997 90hp Mariner with 405 hours on it. Has recently been rewired and had new seals in the leg. After agreeing to buy this engine, I started to look for bigger hulls, and as such, I was settled on the OB17, but then viewed the Bowdidge page and asked around. The Seastrike 16 fit the bill perfectly, as the only issue that I had with the OB17 was the 12 degree dead rise, which really isn't enough in my part of the world to cope with the sharp chop.

    I spoke with Mark today and am now quite excited to get the project under way. As a bonus, my wife restores art deco era furniture and is very good on a sander.

    I will be building with AB marine ply (AS2296), constructed from cedar veneer and eucalypt core.

    In terms of PDF and full digital files (I think they are called DXF and DXW files), there are surprisingly a few designers that will send this out. Bowdidge is not one and I will respect his wishes, marking and cutting it myself. Funnily enough, my CNC router mate won't hand over his machine to other people's files and cuts these with full manual control. He says that it tears thin ply.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Rockland Maine USA and Woodbridge, Suffolk, England
    Posts
    338

    Default Re: First Time Build

    Quote Originally Posted by jtdums View Post
    Pilchard,

    I don't think I've heard of any designers sharing their cut files for obvious reasons, but I guess that might be the wave of the future. Already, they have to take a leap of faith and send plans out electronically. I wonder if any sell the files at this point?
    Not that it is relevant to this build (I only design sailboats basically) - but I supply DXF files for CNC cutting with most of my designs – and all the newer ones. I have boats building all over the world from 8' to over 60', from CNC cut parts. CNC facilities are available surprisingly easily nowadays and most of my builders can just deliver their material to a local CNC shop to get parts cut when they want – it's no big deal any more!

    Cheers -- George
    To be truly free to live, one must be free to think and speak.

    A C Grayling

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Lake Norman,North Carolina and Cedarville, Michigan
    Posts
    220

    Default Re: First Time Build

    Quote Originally Posted by debenriver View Post
    Not that it is relevant to this build (I only design sailboats basically) - but I supply DXF files for CNC cutting with most of my designs – and all the newer ones. I have boats building all over the world from 8' to over 60', from CNC cut parts. CNC facilities are available surprisingly easily nowadays and most of my builders can just deliver their material to a local CNC shop to get parts cut when they want – it's no big deal any more!

    Cheers -- George
    I admire that you are already embracing techniques that will undoubtedly dominate in the future.

    Is there an effective way to protect your intellectual property? Do you worry about your designs popping up in other parts of the world with minor modifications under another name?

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Rockland Maine USA and Woodbridge, Suffolk, England
    Posts
    338

    Default Re: First Time Build

    Quote Originally Posted by jtdums View Post
    I admire that you are already embracing techniques that will undoubtedly dominate in the future.

    Is there an effective way to protect your intellectual property? Do you worry about your designs popping up in other parts of the world with minor modifications under another name?
    Thank you - that's nice of you to say so

    I don't think there is and therefore I don't worry about it particularly. In any case, all the designs have been downloadable electronically since the the late 1990's, and I encourage my builders to save them to their own computer, burn them on to a DVD etc etc. for their own security.

    I guess if someone feels they must sell them on, or pass them on to another builder, list them on another site and so on, I would just feel really very sad for them it's such a mean-spirited, intellectually impoverished thing to do. I've not discovered it happening but then again I haven't really searched around!

    Cheers -- George
    To be truly free to live, one must be free to think and speak.

    A C Grayling

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Perth, Western Australia, Australia
    Posts
    5

    Default Re: First Time Build

    Looks very nice Rmarsh.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •