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Thread: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

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    Default How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?



    Harvey Weinstein’s Biggest Enabler?


    A culture that assumes sexual harassment is simply how the world works.

    http://www.slate.com/articles/double...arassment.html
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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    I have a bad feeling about Louis CK.

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Power (too much of it anyway).
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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Influence.

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Ask the president.
    Fight Entropy, build a wooden boat!

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    It's possible to cross the line of what's appropriate or legal without consequences simply because you're never caught. Also these people are valued for their work. I knew two high school teachers who were having sex w their students when I left high school but they managed to stay on for a decade.

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Prudery, and its opposite companion, license. We haven't come to terms with these two nodes of psychic energy, and it has untoward consequences in the larger culture. Power is definitely in there, too.
    So many questions, so little time.

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by Duncan Gibbs View Post
    Power (too much of it anyway).
    And shame. Victims of this type of crime often feel shame and a misplaced sense of responsibility.

    I have never really understood why women turn assault inward and attack themselves in such a self-destructive manner when they should be enraged(!) and madder than hell.

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    And conversely to this question - why do many women want to be with men who are active aggressive and powerful womanizers?

    when men are young, aggressively wild and sexually predatory - they are called "bad boys". Later in mid life and established in society, are labeled sexual predators. Weinstein, Trump, Cosby or even Ben Affleck fall in this category.

    I personally know that many of the most successful men in business and industry can be considered sexual preditors. If they knew they could expand their reach due to power and position for sexual favors they would. You know them too.
    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 10-12-2017 at 10:20 AM.
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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Perhaps it's trading one guilt for another. Or escaping one guilt only to discover that a different guilt exists at that end of the escape attempt.

    To wit, many women have been culturally-indoctrinated to believe that enjoying sex at some level brands them a slut. So, if they are with a bad boy, the sex is presumed, "OK," because it was, " done to them," rather than a result of pro-action on their part.

    Of course, being abused is now part of the equation and must be dealt with.

    Kevin
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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    David G
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    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    There's a hardwired biological part to this. The fundamental difference between men and women is that women get pregnant; men don't. Women can only have a relatively small number of children, and have a large investment in each one. Men can have a lot more with not much effort. This has had a large evolutionary effect, all morality aside. Powerful men for all of human history have sometimes used their power to have sex with as many women as they can manage.

    The record for the largest number of documented children is 867, held by a sultan of Morocco in the 1600s known as 'Ismail the Bloodthirsty'. Really.

    Note that I am NOT arguing that the way we are hardwired by evolution to want to behave is how we should behave, not at all. But it explains pretty well how men sometimes do behave - and why women generally don't.
    Last edited by Keith Wilson; 10-13-2017 at 09:43 AM.
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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Sometimes it's because they are powerful.

    Bill Clinton.

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave Hadfield View Post
    Sometimes it's because they are powerful.
    Let's make it in terms we at WBF can understand. How about half of these boat owners can be labeled as one in their lives.

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    or this one. (multiple time winner)

    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 10-13-2017 at 10:23 AM.
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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Or the this one. (Another chicken dinner!)

    Be wary of your critics, at peace with your decisions, and work hard to be a better man.

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    [Big ol' righteous rant]

    The 'power' doesn't necessarily mean political power, or head of the clan, head of the corporation, type of power. It also means the 'I'm two hundred pounds and she is one-ten, I'm getting me some,' type of power. It is probably most commonly power of the sort of 'Hi, honey, you worthless c-word, I'm home drunk and I want it now, and if you tell anyone I've been [insert the usual horrible crap men are typically guilty of, I'll kill you and come back for the kids,' type. There is also the bizarrely currupted psuedo-religious 'let's slice off the sensitive parts, in order to keep her from defiling the sacred act of procreating by having pleasure,' type.

    Makes me ashamed to be a man, almost. We, men, have earned the reputation. We need to own it, and we need to figure out how to get all the rest of us on board about not looking the other way or somehow justifying, rationalizing it. You let someone get abused, you knew about it, you didn't say anything, it was only a little titty feel, just a little harmless groping, you are guilty of it, too. It is sexual assualt, every bit as much as full on rape. Not saying something about a 'just a little feel,' especially after being told about it in a complaint, is tantamount to committing rape. You are guilty by being complicit.

    The eleven frat boys that watched a passed out female party guest get raped by one of them, are all guilty of it, just as if it had been a murder in a roomful of mafia hitmen and the murder was by only a single bullet fired. Boys will be boys is barely a good enough excuse for setting a bale of hay on fire while learning to smoke behind the shed at eleven years old. trmp's 'locker room talk' is the same as if a bank robber explains to the cops, when the dye pack explodes, that he was just making a withdrawal. Hey, customers will be customers, it was just a little cash, you know, small bills and all, what's the fuss, what, like locker room talk, gimme a break. It's why trmp doesn't deserve a capital letter T nor even a vowel.

    The further you go back for a look, from just down from the trees, out on the savanah and no civilization at all, all the way to our modern era of industrial techno miracle and still barely civilized, we share common culture and a heritage of men violently owning and dominating women and children. The women, for as much as that happened, are, in whole, and in the long run, nearly as horrible to each other, and to men, of course, don't we deserve it. Did I make that point?

    The long term trend is for less of that. The fact that we share all that biology and heritage and unevolved bullshirt does not mean that we can't eventually get past it. If we ever do, what a payoff for slogging through such tedium. I mean really, modern humans are only this good after two hundred thousand years or so?

    I think one of the main things we can all do, alone and together is figure out how to be better. We have the ability. We have the big brain and the opposable thumbs. We now have a tiny sliver of human time with an investment in science and technology. And humanity is naught if not introspective at least somewhat. We will, if we survive, evolve past being the horrible species we have been so far. If the life of our planet survives us.

    [/Big ol' righteous rant]


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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Mahan View Post
    [Big ol' righteous rant]

    The 'power' doesn't necessarily mean political power, or head of the clan, head of the corporation, type of power.

    [/Big ol' righteous rant]
    Agreed.

    The flip side of this is that most women enjoy being in the presence of a powerful man. The energy of that is biological. It is the razor we walk on. It is a known fact a weak man who wants a woman as a mate rarely possesses her for long. Beta men lose out due to their exhibited characteristics. A man who is dominate and promotes position does have a favorable advantage. Not every male can be as successful in wealth, power and leadership as another. The unravelling of what it is to be heterosexual male in modern western society is really in conflict. Sex politics is only one aspect. Our once basic male institutions such as Boy Scouts, the Military, sports and other have become more inclusive to females in an age of great social change. Many of the children in our society are being raised by women without a good male role model. The norms of good men are being lost in this translation. The line in the sand is wiped away with changes. Unwanted sexual attention and physical advances/attacks should never be tolerated. Neither should we be living in this hypersexualized culture filled with corporate marketing of sexual innocence, unprecedented amounts of pornography in every media where ever we look and overstimulated societies that struggle with this phycological exploitation. We can not even gage what is normal, right or moral when these things weigh so much in our biological programing and the effects on our subconscious.
    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 10-13-2017 at 11:54 AM.
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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    The Pornography Generation is coming.

    It used to be hard to find actual pornography. It had to be chased in back-alley newstands and scummy cinemas. Hotel room porn was censored. You had to steal a Playboy from your older brother.

    Now young boys have it -- unlimited access. To unlimited stuff. At much too early an age.

    The result will be bad. The expectation of what is normal sex is changing, and it's not good for women.

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post
    The record for the largest number of documented children is 867, held by a sultan of Morocco in the 1600s known as 'Ismail the Bloodthirsty'.
    Betcha Genghis Khan has more descendants, though.

    What are you doing about it?




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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by Flying Orca View Post
    Betcha Genghis Khan has more descendants, though.
    Likely true, but no records, just genetics. Fortunately, that kind of thing doesn't happen all that often. The idea that a spectacularly brutal and ruthless conqueror would leave vast numbers of descendants is not pleasant to contemplate.
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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post
    Likely true, but no records, just genetics. Fortunately, that kind of thing doesn't happen all that often. The idea that a spectacularly brutal and ruthless conqueror would leave vast numbers of descendants is not pleasant to contemplate.
    Indeed. There's a lot to be said for cushy modern western civilization. Let's hope it survives. (But that's a matter for the other thread...)

    What are you doing about it?




  23. #23

    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    53% of white women voted for Trump even after the PU++y grabber video, I don't understand that but it's part of the problem.

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post
    Likely true, but no records, just genetics. Fortunately, that kind of thing doesn't happen all that often. The idea that a spectacularly brutal and ruthless conqueror would leave vast numbers of descendants is not pleasant to contemplate.
    Does it help your feelings that he did it all in the name of religion?

    No?

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Smith porter maine View Post
    53% of white women voted for Trump even after the PU++y grabber video, I don't understand that but it's part of the problem.
    Totally incomprehensible from an Australian perspective .

    and well said Jim.
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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Smith porter maine View Post
    53% of white women voted for Trump even after the PU++y grabber video, I don't understand that but it's part of the problem.
    They are like right-wing males. They think it won't happen to them while they want more jobs and less taxes. They won't get either, but that is the logic. Women who voted for Trump weren't looking out for other women.

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by Duncan Gibbs
    Power (too much of it anyway).
    Quote Originally Posted by varadero
    Influence.
    Correct.

    Power = influence.
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  28. #28

    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by CWSmith View Post
    They are like right-wing males. They think it won't happen to them while they want more jobs and less taxes. They won't get either, but that is the logic. Women who voted for Trump weren't looking out for other women.
    White women are males your losing me CW

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Hoppe View Post
    Agreed.

    The flip side of this is that most women enjoy being in the presence of a powerful man. The energy of that is biological. It is the razor we walk on. It is a known fact a weak man who wants a woman as a mate rarely possesses her for long. Beta men lose out due to their exhibited characteristics. A man who is dominate and promotes position does have a favorable advantage. Not every male can be as successful in wealth, power and leadership as another. The unravelling of what it is to be heterosexual male in modern western society is really in conflict. Sex politics is only one aspect. Our once basic male institutions such as Boy Scouts, the Military, sports and other have become more inclusive to females in an age of great social change. Many of the children in our society are being raised by women without a good male role model. The norms of good men are being lost in this translation. The line in the sand is wiped away with changes. Unwanted sexual attention and physical advances/attacks should never be tolerated. Neither should we be living in this hypersexualized culture filled with corporate marketing of sexual innocence, unprecedented amounts of pornography in every media where ever we look and overstimulated societies that struggle with this phycological exploitation. We can not even gage what is normal, right or moral when these things weigh so much in our biological programing and the effects on our subconscious.
    Ted, I think you exaggerate the condition to the point of spreading a stereotype. Mothers say to their daughters, "Look! He's a doctor!", but they don't want them marrying the guy if he's a jerk. It's no different than my friend's father who used to say, "Boys, it's just as easy to fall in love with a rich girl!" He was wrong. Both are really saying, "Successful people can be good, too!" Most married women I know fell in love with a loving partner who would spend his paycheck on the family and be good with the kids. That was their priority. That "power is an aphrodisiac" claim is for shallow women the way big boobs work for shallow men.

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Smith porter maine View Post
    White women are males your losing me CW
    The women who voted for Trump are the same as the men who voted for Trump. I said "They are like..."

    Women who voted for Trump did not care about Trump's behavior, but you can bet if he treated their daughter that way they would care plenty. They just didn't care about the others.

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Smith porter maine View Post
    53% of white women voted for Trump even after the PU++y grabber video, I don't understand that but it's part of the problem.
    Perceived economic interests have higher priority than morality. Look at the Evangelical support for Trump.

  32. #32

    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by CWSmith View Post
    The women who voted for Trump are the same as the men who voted for Trump. I said "They are like..."

    Women who voted for Trump did not care about Trump's behavior, but you can bet if he treated their daughter that way they would care plenty. They just didn't care about the others.
    I don't think so they would be outraged, but it not them and theirs.

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by CWSmith View Post
    Ted, I think you exaggerate the condition to the point of spreading a stereotype. Mothers say to their daughters, "Look! He's a doctor!", but they don't want them marrying the guy if he's a jerk. It's no different than my friend's father who used to say, "Boys, it's just as easy to fall in love with a rich girl!" He was wrong. Both are really saying, "Successful people can be good, too!" Most married women I know fell in love with a loving partner who would spend his paycheck on the family and be good with the kids. That was their priority. That "power is an aphrodisiac" claim is for shallow women the way big boobs work for shallow men.
    Stereotypes are indeed strange things. Most women are flattered to be pursued by men of means. Before many women get married they are often willing to give sexual favors for education, careers, gifts and vacations by men whom they know are Incompatable long term. And that is by fact and personal experience. Way too often, more young women do this but hide or discount it.

    and more poiantly, I have no doubt that nearly every wife or female partner from this forum would have a hard time not acting or just would serious consider a fling with Ben Afleck or Matt Damon sexual advance - whom have be recognized in the Weinstein associations.
    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 10-13-2017 at 07:47 PM.
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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Hoppe View Post
    and more poiantly, I have no doubt that nearly every wife or female partner from this forum would have a hard time not acting or just would serious consider a fling with Ben Afleck or Matt Damon sexual advance - whom have be recognized in the Weinstein associations.
    You really do have a dark view of women, my friend.

    If the converse is true, then I must be falling far behind. The thought of cheating on my wife is so repugnant to me as to challenge my very self-image, my core identity. I think most married women would respond in a similar manner.

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    Default Re: How do sexual predators get away with it for so long?

    Quote Originally Posted by CWSmith View Post
    The women who voted for Trump are the same as the men who voted for Trump. I said "They are like..."

    Women who voted for Trump did not care about Trump's behavior, but you can bet if he treated their daughter that way they would care plenty. They just didn't care about the others.
    They couldn't vote for Hillary. Even after all this, they wouldn't vote for Hillary. They think Trump's crude, crass, a simply awful man, but can't imagine life under another Clinton. Very common in this neck of the woods, especially among fundies. Fox and Rove did one hell of a job selling that one.

    And you are dead right. Nothing happens for them until it happens to them (or their kids).
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