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Thread: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

  1. #1
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    Default Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    Looking for advice on best additive to make non sag epoxy glue.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    I can add enough of pretty much any powder to thick it up.

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    Default Re: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    If making a glue, stay away from the fairing mixes (microballons).
    I like to add wood flour and silica for glue ups. If I think that something really critical then I might choose a purpose made additive like West system 404.

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    Default Re: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    Quote Originally Posted by wizbang 13 View Post
    I can add enough of pretty much any powder to thick it up.
    I thought the same thing.

    Well, my answer was more along the lines of, “Lots.”

    Really, though, be careful, and keep track of your mixes. Make little recipes for easily repeatable batches. The line between too soft and too stiff a mix can be very fine, though, so take care.

    Peace,
    Robert

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    Default Re: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    I like colloidal silica for non-sagging mixtures. Duckworks has it fairly cheap:

    http://m.duckworksbbs.com/supplies/a...lica/index.htm

    Tom
    You don't have to be prepared as long as you're willing to suffer the consequences.

    www.tompamperin.com

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    As usual... the answer to 'best' is: It Depends. What task will you be using it for?

    Have I mentioned lately how much I hate these bald questions with no background and no details? I haven't? Well I do. I find it aggravating. It usually provokes lots of responses which 'might' be correct... or not. It's not until we chivvy the requisite facts out of the OP that it becomes apparent that most of us were on the wrong track all along.

    I'd really prefer that queries err on the side of Too Much info, rather than Too Little. Really, really!!! Not trying to pick you YOU Oldad... just an ongoing pet peeve.
    Last edited by David G; 10-10-2017 at 11:22 AM.
    David G
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    http://www.harborwoodworking.com/boat.html

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    Or... you could keep the details to yourself, and just read up on your own, until you are satisfied about the answer --

    West System -- http://www.westsystem.com/the-gougeo...-construction/

    System 3 -- https://www.systemthree.com/pages/literature

    Russell Brown -- http://newcollege.net/wp-content/upl...ics_e-book.pdf
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    http://www.harborwoodworking.com/boat.html

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

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    Default Re: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    "Non sag epoxy glue" implies structural gluing, does it not? It didn't seem like that vague of a question to me.

    Tom
    You don't have to be prepared as long as you're willing to suffer the consequences.

    www.tompamperin.com

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    Default Re: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    We want non sag for fairing as well.
    Non sag can be anything from 404 to 410. Big difference.

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    Default Re: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    Quote Originally Posted by WI-Tom View Post
    "Non sag epoxy glue" implies structural gluing, does it not? It didn't seem like that vague of a question to me.

    Tom
    'Non-sagging' is pretty clear, with little room for ambiguity. But not NO room.

    'glue' is a term thrown around, often incorrectly, for a variety of actual resin uses.

    Without some background to buttress or disprove our suppositions... yes, it's a vague question, subject to a range of interpretations. And all unnecessary if the folks asking the questions would take the time to offer up some details of what they were about.

    I've been using epoxy since the Gougeon brothers first popularized it for marine applications back in the 70's. And I'm more than happy to offer advice. I'd just find it more thoughtful and incisive if the OP's would invest the time to make the questions as answerable as possible. Without having to go back and forth with a bunch of interrogation on their intent.

    Of course... I recognize that some of that is unavoidable. Often - if a person knew enough to realize what the germane factors were - he's know enough to not need to ask the question. But - esp. in this sort of venue (as opposed to a face-to-face, or phone conversation) I find it inefficient to ferret out the information. I'd appreciate it if they at least made an effort to save us from the necessity, and to garner themselves the most precise and cogent advice.
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    http://www.harborwoodworking.com/boat.html

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    Great answers, thanks.Yes, no sag glue is what I am after. Gluing side panels to bottom and want the glue to stay in place and not sag or run. I have colloidal silica so that is what I will use unless someone comes up with something better. As for the rest, I think the response in #8 sums it up pretty well. Thanks Wi-Tom

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    Quote Originally Posted by Oldad View Post
    Great answers, thanks.Yes, no sag glue is what I am after. Gluing side panels to bottom and want the glue to stay in place and not sag or run. I have colloidal silica so that is what I will use unless someone comes up with something better. As for the rest, I think the response in #8 sums it up pretty well. Thanks Wi-Tom
    Fumed silica is fine for your application. Wood flour, also. And others.

    And fotos? Did I mention fotos? Fotos are usually QUITE illuminating.
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    http://www.harborwoodworking.com/boat.html

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    I like pic too, bu in this case I am not there yet, asking the question before the need arises rather than waiting til the last minute. Big change for me.

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    Default Re: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    For structural gluing, I'll often also toss in some fibers (milled cotton, linen or tiny chunks of cut glassfiber) to act as little re-rods and strengthen the epoxy. It can sometimes make the stuff a bit more difficult to spread evenly and it's a bear to sand if you have to, but it does reinforce the resin. I bought a bag of milled fibers from Gougeon about 25 years ago when laminating a new bottom for a Simmons skiff and still have some, so it goes a long way. Makes your resin look kind of like runny oatmeal.

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    Default Re: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    Fumed silica is fine for your application. Wood flour, also. And others.

    And fotos? Did I mention fotos? Fotos are usually QUITE illuminating.
    Thread drift: Dave, I just saw your SOF designs are featured in the current issue of Watercraft. Congratulations!

    Tom
    You don't have to be prepared as long as you're willing to suffer the consequences.

    www.tompamperin.com

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    Quote Originally Posted by WI-Tom View Post
    Thread drift: Dave, I just saw your SOF designs are featured in the current issue of Watercraft. Congratulations!

    Tom
    Oooohhh... not me. You're mixing me up with the brilliant, handsome, and talented Dave Gentry. Haven't received a nicer compliment in weeks!! And, please, don't put my hobby-horse spurring down to his ledger sheet. He's far more soft-spoken, patient, and gentlemanly with his quirks.
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    http://www.harborwoodworking.com/boat.html

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Best additive for non sag epoxy glue??

    Quote Originally Posted by Oldad View Post
    Great answers, thanks.Yes, no sag glue is what I am after. Gluing side panels to bottom and want the glue to stay in place and not sag or run. I have colloidal silica so that is what I will use unless someone comes up with something better. As for the rest, I think the response in #8 sums it up pretty well. Thanks Wi-Tom
    I almost always use colloidal (aka fumed silica, cabosil, aerosil).
    There is no rational, logical, or physical description of how free will could exist. It therefore makes no sense to praise or condemn anyone on the grounds they are a free willed self that made one choice but could have chosen something else. There is no evidence that such a situation is possible in our Universe. Demonstrate otherwise and I will be thrilled.

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