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Thread: Another bite out of the First Amendment

  1. #1
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    Default Another bite out of the First Amendment

    Don't bother with this link, too many people are having trouble with it -- Ian has posted the meaty bit in his post #5.

    8th Circuit - Citizens do not have a right to film public officials in public. (LINK)
    Last edited by sharpiefan; 08-10-2017 at 08:16 AM.

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  2. #2
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    Not linking here, but I get the picture. It's the 'justice' system colluding to prevent corrupt officials from being exposed by their own actions.
    I think collusion is the right word too. If the'official' is still convicted despite any flimed evidence not being admitted is it not colluding with a criminal to avoid that conviction?

    Certainly this will not stop filmed evidence, that gate is well and truly off it's technical hinges.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    A lot of cities have already passed this law where police are concerned.

    It's a vile law and needs to be struck down!

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    yes they do!
    The doctrine of nonresistance against arbitrary power, and oppression, is absurd, slavish, and destructive of the good and happiness of mankind.
    Personal failures are too important to be trusted to others.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    [IMc - Took several tries to get the text to appear, so I C&P it here. This aberrant and abhorrent opinion ensures that this will go to the Supreme Court.]


    JEFFERSON CITY — In a free speech ruling that contradicts six other federal circuit courts, the Eighth Circuit Court of Appeals has upheld a district court ruling that says Americans do not have a first amendment right to videotape the police, or any public official, in public.

    The court of appeals filed the opinion July 25.

    The case stemmed from a lawsuit brought by Matthew Akins of Columbia, who has had numerous run-ins with police as he attempted to videotape them pulling cars over and making arrests. Akins was typically standing on public property such as a street or sidewalk while videotaping the encounters. Akins was videotaping the encounters on behalf of a group called Citizens for Justice, which he founded in 2010.

    According to his lawyer, Stephen Wyse of Columbia, Akins was threatened numerous times for his actions, his employer was hassled, and he was ordered to stop videotaping by police on several occasions. He had charges filed against him, many of which were later dropped, according to the Eighth Circuit ruling.
    Akins sued Boone County Prosecutor Dan Knight and several Columbia police officers, citing violations of his First, Second, Fourth, and Fourteenth Amendment rights.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    So what other rule of evidence would they like struck off? Embezzlement whist holding public office. That catches a few.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    Thanks, Ian, I thought it was just my dumbphone being crappy again.

    And Happy Birthday!

    Hope the voyage is a long one.
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    We are doomed.
    May be some rough water ahead. We're getting new captain.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    It appears the court is wrong. But without a court being wrong an issue will never get to the Supreme Court.

    But we only get a one side of the issue. It is easy to interfere with anyone doing their job. That may be a greater part of the issue. He might even be stalking police officers.
    Life is complex.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    I have hope that the Supreme Court will see this correctly and strike down the law.

    What worries me more is that we live in such a regressive time that there are local governments, and I assume local voters, who favor this sort of thing. It is a blatantly obvious case of "It will never happen to me!" and eventually it always does.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    Quote Originally Posted by Too Little Time View Post
    It appears the court is wrong. But without a court being wrong an issue will never get to the Supreme Court.

    But we only get a one side of the issue. It is easy to interfere with anyone doing their job. That may be a greater part of the issue. He might even be stalking police officers.
    So how does standing on a public street with a video camera interfere with any one. Was he using it as a club to hit them?
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  12. #12
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
    I see no mention of video cameras.......

    Someone want to make the link?
    Someday, I'm going to settle down and be a grumpy old man.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    Pretty sure the supreme court already kinda weighed in on this one. They haven't heard it directly, but they did refuse to hear cases that overturned anti-recording laws. Yeah, kind of hard to unpack that, but in short there's so many federal courts that have already weighed in, and the gist of previous supreme court decisions, should make this a very quick decision in favor of recording police.

    Then again, we're going to have a conservative packed court soon. So I wouldn't make any bets.

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

    Quote Originally Posted by P.I. Stazzer-Newt View Post
    I see no mention of video cameras.......

    Someone want to make the link?
    There ya go, highlighted it for ya.

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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    Quote Originally Posted by P.I. Stazzer-Newt View Post
    I see no mention of video cameras.......

    Someone want to make the link?
    The expression "Use a picture. It's worth a thousand words." appears in a 1911 newspaper article quoting newspaper editor Tess Flanders discussing journalism and publicity.

    Photographers' Rights (LINK)

    Photography and the First Amendment (LINK)

    Hope the voyage is a long one.
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    you come into harbors seen for the first time...

    Ithaka, by Cavafy
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  16. #16
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    This sounds like the work of one o' them, what's the phrase? Oh yeah, "activist judges".

    What are you doing about it?




  17. #17
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    Quote Originally Posted by Corvida View Post
    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.



    There ya go, highlighted it for ya.
    I think there is a good case for invoking the right of the people peaceably to assemble as well.

    Hope the voyage is a long one.
    May there be many a summer morning when,
    with what pleasure, what joy,
    you come into harbors seen for the first time...

    Ithaka, by Cavafy
    (Keeley - Sherrard translation)

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    Quote Originally Posted by Peerie Maa View Post
    So how does standing on a public street with a video camera interfere with any one. Was he using it as a club to hit them?
    As I said there are issues we do not know about. But he may be carrying a club along with the camera.
    Life is complex.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    You are being silly again.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  20. #20
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    Quote Originally Posted by P.I. Stazzer-Newt View Post
    I see no mention of video cameras.......

    Someone want to make the link?
    Isn't there a clause somewhere that says if it is not mentioned it is not forbidden?
    Yep, here it is
    Amendment IX (1791)
    The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  21. #21
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    Quote Originally Posted by Too Little Time View Post
    As I said there are issues we do not know about. But he may be carrying a club along with the camera.
    Or he might be carrying a gun, but we're constantly being told that concealed carry makes us safer so there's no need for anyone including the cops to be concerned about that, right?

    What's so funny about peace love & understanding?

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    Quote Originally Posted by Too Little Time
    As I said there are issues we do not know about. But he may be carrying a club along with the camera.
    Are you being serious?

    May I still take still photographs of public officials in public?

    How about taking a series of still photographs with a motor drive? May I then construct a crude moving film with these stills?

    This is a moronic ruling that will undoubtedly be challenged. My guess is the challenge will be successful.

    Deja Moo: The feeling that you have heard this bull before.


  23. #23
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Montgomery View Post
    Are you being serious?
    perhaps sarcastic?
    The doctrine of nonresistance against arbitrary power, and oppression, is absurd, slavish, and destructive of the good and happiness of mankind.
    Personal failures are too important to be trusted to others.

  24. #24
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    Default Re: Another bite out of the First Amendment

    Quote Originally Posted by Phillip Allen View Post
    perhaps sarcastic?
    You got it.

    No rights are absolute. I suspect this fellow with the camera thinks his right is absolute and the appeals court said it is not. But we don't know the whole story.
    Life is complex.

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