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Thread: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

  1. #36
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Jay --

    I prefer large photos -- you can see more of the details. But a large, dense (complete data set) photo does take time to load, often TOO long to load. I use Irfanview, a free download, to save my pics-to-be-uploaded jpeg files at about 35% of data. The loss of data density does not seem to impair the visual quality of the photos, and they load very quickly.
    "The future is already here — it's just not very evenly distributed." William Gibson

  2. #37
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Ok, as long as it does not seem to be a problem I will keep it as it is.
    Thanks

  3. #38
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Back to the mast splice. I built a short spar bench on the club dock and proceeded to cut a set of staggered scarf tapers on the existing spar that I saved.
    These were simple on the side staves as there was no wood under them but the fore and aft staves were rabbeted and ended in a blind end that had to be carefully cut with chisels and a chisel plane. The long end of the mast was supported by steel angle brackets from the Big Red Box Store. They had a bit of wood on them to allow the mast not to be metal scared. The short spar bench was made up of two by fours sitting on a pair of 2X8s on edge. The were spaced four inches apard and had threaded rod set in them to allow for making a top clamping system. Still a lot of clamps were used to hold the side staves into the rabbets.

  4. #39
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Greer View Post
    Back to the mast splice. I built a short spar bench on the club dock and proceeded to cut a set of staggered scarf tapers on the existing spar that I saved.
    These were simple on the side staves as there was no wood under them but the fore and aft staves were rabbeted and ended in a blind end that had to be carefully cut with chisels and a chisel plane. The long end of the mast was supported by steel angle brackets from the Big Red Box Store. They had a bit of wood on them to allow the mast not to be metal scared. The short spar bench was made up of two by fours sitting on a pair of 2X8s on edge. The were spaced four inches apard and had threaded rod set in them to allow for making a top clamping system. Still a lot of clamps were used to hold the side staves into the rabbets.



    Picture worth a thousand words, so there's 3 thousand. Now I can visualize what AFH meant when he was describing rabbets for the hollow mast in Sensible Cruising Designs.

    Thanks Jay

    Kent

  5. #40
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Greer View Post
    Here is the after work.
    I'm guessing that cotter pin was bent back like that by the prior owner, too!

    At least according to my old rigging mentor, "split pin" cotters should never be bent at hard angles, but rather only spread enough to keep the pin from easily wiggling out. This permits the pin to be easily pulled with a pair of pliers or the point of a marlingspike and then the same pin replaced when reassembling. "Bent round" split pins often cannot be removed without cutting them with a pair of diagonals and, if the pin is properly sized (its diameter matching the hole,) sometimes even requiring filing to the hole and driving the remains out with a punch.



    Where a spit pin cotter's legs are liable to snag line, sails, or human flesh, a "ring cotter" is the preferred tool for the job.



    Not a major criticism, but I expect the Skipper would have something snarky to say about such an abomination on his elegant block!

  6. #41
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    There is nothing more maddening than to be crewing on a boat that has those cotter rings aloft and to hear one tinkle down the rig with a ting as it lands on deck at night! I deliberately turn my cotters, as seen above, so as not to snag flesh, line or sailcloth. They are easy to turn flat again for removal due to the easy turn of the cotter ends. And that's the truth! Never have I had a problem with a cotter turned in this fashion. The ends are turned using a round needle nose plier. Note also that the ends of that cotter key are polished as well.
    Jay

  7. #42
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    I'm with you on this one Jay.
    Those rings can cause a lot of damage to spinnakers too.
    That block will have come from the factory looking like that with the cotter pin.
    I always use rubber self amalgamating tape on the cotter pins as well.
    Bob's concerns with removal come into play if the split pins are tight in the hole though, which I try to avoid for that reason if I am sizing them.
    Lovely boat by the way. H28's get a pretty bad rap in NZ due to the production fibreglass ones that were made here.
    Sloop only, big doghouse and higher topsides maybe too.
    Sailing wise they get compared to modern hull forms that outperform them rather than the classic fleet due to how they look above the waterline.

  8. #43
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Thanks for the comment Slako! I agree that the H28 looks better to me in the original form!
    I stay away from fiberglass hulls ever since I got a bad itch on a new boat delivery that still had loose glass fibers in the bunk area.
    Jay

  9. #44
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    You won’t find those blocks coming out of a factory Slacko, they’re straight out of the Greer workshop
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
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  10. #45
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    I was thinking that could be the case Larks, but they look remarkably like a Ronstan wire block that I have on my Vang.
    Ronstan probably copied Jay though.

  11. #46
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    I agree about the cotter pins. When turned all the way they do not catch anything, a bit more work to remove, and maybe difficult to reuse. Cheap to replace. I have some rings and never had one come out on its own. Perhaps I need to consider changing them over.
    I considered changing my halyards over to the open Snatch blocks shown in the spec's for the Meadowlark, but in stead went for a single halyard, which gives me a purchase for tightening the luff. I am very please with the results. One halyard on the short gaff in stead of two. I still have some tension adjustment for different wind conditions.

  12. #47
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    The secret of removing a cotter key that is open as shown above is in using an expanding needle nose circlip plier for the job. Diagonal cutters are also your friend when in a hurry. After a few years in the weather most bronze cotters corrode and brittalize making them non-reusable. I keep an ample supply of spares in my rigging bag. That block is a copy of an early Merriman Bros. block. More to come.
    Jay
    Last edited by Jay Greer; 08-09-2017 at 01:01 PM.

  13. #48
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Here is another reason to varnish your spars. Varnishing allows you to see what is happening with the wood, as mentioned before. I saw a tiny hole in the under side of this spreader. Although it looks good, here is what I found.
    Califronia has alot of termites!

  14. #49
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    This is the bane of wooden boats in California! We fumigated the entire hull and spars to insure that them termites is all daid!
    Jay
    more on the way, fun stuff next!
    Last edited by Jay Greer; 08-12-2017 at 03:40 PM.

  15. #50
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Here is the rigging being installed after the mast splice job. I mounted a block for a chute at the mast head so the block would hang free vertically. for this, I drilled the angled hole in a jig in order to make sure it come out on the center line. I used SS U shackles because I had not found a source for bronze ones. The back stays and span stay will be replaced with Spectra next time when we step the new stick that is to be built next Spring. Spectra is light, strong and very weather resistant. That big nut was lock punched to keep it from backing off. I had to machine a bronze tapered support for the eye bolt on the fwd end. The shackles were later safety wired. I also machined up a set of tiny clinch rings for the topping lift bail rivets. The old mast head cap tang was made off SS and was pretty raunchy so we made up a new one out of phosphor bronze plate. We heat treated it so it would bend as it is no longer supplied with a hardness option.
    Jay
    Last edited by Jay Greer; 08-12-2017 at 03:36 PM.

  16. #51
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Quote Originally Posted by gilberj View Post
    I agree about the cotter pins. When turned all the way they do not catch anything, a bit more work to remove, and maybe difficult to reuse. Cheap to replace. I have some rings and never had one come out on its own. Perhaps I need to consider changing them over.
    I considered changing my halyards over to the open Snatch blocks shown in the spec's for the Meadowlark, but in stead went for a single halyard, which gives me a purchase for tightening the luff. I am very please with the results. One halyard on the short gaff in stead of two. I still have some tension adjustment for different wind conditions.
    Meadow Lark is one Herreshoff boat I have always wanted bo build! I like sailing in skinny waters! I too, appreciate L.F. H's concept of designing the sail hoisting set up to be efficient enough, allow one crew member to hoist a single sail without strain. Our own H28 is very simple to set sail on, and only one person needs be fwd. to handle that. I also like the "Marco Polo" he designed. Many people have opted to modify the rig to two masts and a bow sprit but, I do think the "Marco Polo" is better off with the original three masted rig and no nose pole! It keeps everything inboard!
    Jay
    Last edited by Jay Greer; 08-13-2017 at 02:49 PM.

  17. #52
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    From Sensible Cruising Design:

    [IMG]new doc 2017-08-18 13.13.33_1 - Version 2 by Greg Larkin, on Flickr[/IMG]
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

    LPBC Beneficiary

    "Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you, too, can become great!"

  18. #53
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Wow, Thanks Larks! I didn't know that photo would blow up with so much clarity! The only difference I can see is she now has a windlass on the bow, there is a bow roller for the anchor rode, teak decks and the transom is now varnished.
    Jay

  19. #54
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    Jay, this whole thread is sheer awesomeness!!!! What a beauty.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

  20. #55
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Greer View Post
    Wow, Thanks Larks! I didn't know that photo would blow up with so much clarity! The only difference I can see is she now has a windlass on the bow, there is a bow roller for the anchor rode, teak decks and the transom is now varnished.
    Jay
    My pleasure Jay, I meant to do it when you first opened the thread. I actually used a document scanner application on my mobile phone - “Cam Scanner” to copy the photo, a surprisingly good little function.
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

    LPBC Beneficiary

    "Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you, too, can become great!"

  21. #56
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Right bloody fair dinkum mate!
    Jay

  22. #57
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Several of you have requested information as to how I handled leakage around the cockpit bench seats on "Bright Star". The seats were already built into the boat when we bought her but they leaked miserably! This meant salt and wash down water getting below through the storage areas under the seats. Not a happy situation. My old friend Rolly Kaylijian once told me that it is better to direct water that leaks through a hatch than to attempt to seal the hatch against
    water intrusion. So, I ended up building a set of gutter frames under each seat. These drain directly into the cockpit and thence out through the cockpit drains.
    I used a Japanese draw pin miter joint to build the gutters so that the corner miters would not leak. What looks like a simple miter, is a bit involved in its structure but it is done in such a manner that it does not leak. Here is the end result of the mahogany gutter and the mitered corners. I have also posted an example of how the joint is made. The inside of the joint has a double mortice and tendon joint that is formed with a tapered slot in either piece which allows for a tapered white cedar draw pin to be driven. The cedar has swollen and is water tight and the joint is as well. It took a bit of time to make this as it is a very small piece of joinery but it came out just fine.
    Jay
    Cockpit seats

  23. #58
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    The miter jointed gutter drain.

  24. #59
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    This is how it was done. A Japanese Azebiki Saw was used to cut the mortices and the miter was cut with a Dozuki saw. The draw pin slot was cut with a tiny key hole saw that cuts on the pull. Once the joint is assembled, a flat taper pin of cedar is driven in to draw the joint together. No glue was used. It does not leak. Not shown here is the half round gutter drain that is cut into the seat frames.
    Jay

  25. #60
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Here is the spreader mounted flag halyard lizzard I made up out of a scrap of lignum vitae. The lizard was first cut with a hole saw in on the flat but not cut through the plank. The center was cut using a round over router bit in the drill press as well. Then the piece was freed using the hole saw in the press again. The slot for the strap was done on the lathe using an expanding bit to hold it from within while cutting the groove. A paper pattern was then made for the strap. The wooden lizard is flat where it contacts the spreader.
    Jay

  26. #61
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    This shot shows the simple system LFH used for hinging the spreaders. Even though there are a few cracks in the plate fastening, the main load is on the center
    pivot pin. This system avoids having tang fastenings pulled out by gyrating spreader load. The direction of loading is always self aligned. The spreader tips are held at the correc height by the siezings that are built of of marlin. Artists water based acrylic paint is used to seal the siezings against weather rot. It does not mark the sails. Incidently, I am building a new mast is this winter. We will use Spectra in place of wire shrouds.
    Jay

  27. #62
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Greer View Post
    This is how it was done. A Japanese Azebiki Saw was used to cut the mortices and the miter was cut with a Dozuki saw. The draw pin slot was cut with a tiny key hole saw that cuts on the pull. Once the joint is assembled, a flat taper pin of cedar is driven in to draw the joint together. No glue was used. It does not leak. Not shown here is the half round gutter drain that is cut into the seat frames.
    Jay
    Dude, this joint and the application is just awesome. What a cool idea. I definitely need a boat with opening cockpit seat lockers, now.

    Peace,
    Robert

  28. #63
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Ok Robert, Thanks for the positive input!
    I am going to post another picture of the joint that may be a bit clearer as to how it was done. So watch for another posting from me.
    Jay

  29. #64
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Here it the little tool I made up for seizing and serving in tight spots. The jaw is lignum vitae.
    Jay

  30. #65
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Here are a few more photos of the locking pin miter joint that was used for the cockpit drain frames. Of course more meat had to be put in the upper surface to allow for the drain cove cut.
    Jay

  31. #66
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"


  32. #67
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    The added benefit of the key/draw spline is that it also acts as a stopwater.
    Jay

  33. #68
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    The next photos will show how we solved the problem of mounting the compass on the mizzen mast so that it could be revoved easily when not needed.
    Stay tuned for much more info.
    Jay

  34. #69
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Greer View Post
    The added benefit of the key/draw spline is that it also acts as a stopwater.
    Jay
    I’m going to have to try this - but how does the “locking pin” actually work Jay? Is it simply that it wedges that join so firmly that it won’t move or reopen? Or do you end up gluing the or pinning the through the leaves of the join as well anyway?
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

    LPBC Beneficiary

    "Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you, too, can become great!"

  35. #70
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    Default Re: Jay & Anne Greer's H28 Ketch "Bright Star"

    Larks, the cedar spline is tapered as is the double mortis. While it will hold with no glue, I did glue mine just to insure a good seal.
    Jay

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