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Thread: Boat Auction, attention Brits

  1. #1
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    Yes, it is the Exeter Maritime Museum collection.
    I would love to be able to take the coble Leslie on, but have too many boats as it is.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    I didn't see them, but Cremyl or however it's spelled is selling their charter fleet of square metre boats in that auction. I have been Facebook buddies with those folks for quite some time.

    As I understand it neither of the six metres recently up for auction came close to their reserves and they will try again later. Two moderns, 'Thisbe' and one of the St. Francis' (I forget which one). Are times harder in the UK than they have been? Is this an affect of 'Brexit' or just something it was time to have happen? I know the UK six metre fleet has been in a state of flux for some time, with several of their boats moving to Canada, Spain and the US, and several more for sale.

    Mickey Lake
    'A disciple of the Norse god of aesthetically pleasing boats, Johan Anker'

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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    https://www.sweeney-kincaid.com/Sale...px?SaleId=3112

    https://www.sweeney-kincaid.com/Sale...px?SaleId=3112



    Lot 139 is the world's first ever bilge keeler... the very first of the Hon Arthur Balfour (later Lord Riversdale)'s "Bluebirds of Thorne" - mis-catalogued.

    Uffa Fox enthusiasts note Lot 503 - DARING and Lot 505 - VIGILANT, no less...

    The star of the show for me would be 433 - ELIZABETH, which I think may be the very first ASC - a type that has just been retired by the Sea Cadets... it is clear that whoever put the caralogue together did not recognise the boat and it looks as if the compilers of the National Small Boat Register did not, either...
    Last edited by Andrew Craig-Bennett; 07-11-2017 at 02:40 PM.
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    this may well be the last opportunity anywhere ever to pick over a group of Uffa Fox 14's
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    They have two Ducklings, no 18 complete , lot 329, and another, lot 307, and a Fairey Falcon, (a 16ft hot moulded dayboat, very rare and much desired, in rather tatty shape, lot 310, and a Jollyboat (biggest and fasted Uffa Fox dinghy, much favoured by Prince Philip when younger) lot 314, as well as the very interesting Admiralty dinghy ELIZABETH, lot 433, but they are all in Eyemouth...lot 139 is the very first BLUEBIRD OF THORNE and the mother of every single bilge keeler, which gets the following ignorant dismissal in the National Small Boat Register:

    Bilge-keel yacht Little Bluebird. 26?x7?9?. Built 1924, to an amateur design, the best comment on the result would be ?interesting?. Not required for the collection consider disposal GH May 2014 Construction is double diagonal, and the entire hull has been sheathed (with Cascover, or similar), at some time. The sheathing has now failed at various points, and the condition of the timberwork is suspect. Rig is gunter, fitted for outboard engine. Most fittings are modern, and the sails are by a Dutch maker. Acquired about 2006. A cynic might conclude, at the point when the leaks began to win. Lay outside until 2/11, which hasn?t improved her condition. Previous owner claimed that she was the first bilge-keeled yacht in the world. While this needs more research, I have seen references to such craft around 1880. This particular example has the keels so heavily splayed, that the greatest beam is across the keels. It must have been inconvenient, to say the least. Ostrich shed, north bay, second row from south, fourth from east end. Mast (B334) in Potato shed M6. Boom and gaff (B335/6) in Potato shed F4. Sails (C205) in Meak?s Yard, 14. E5. Cockpit cover (C206) in Meak?s Yard, 14. E5. Boathook in Potato shed R3.

    written by an "expert" who clearly had never even heard of Lord Riverdale of Sheffield, her designer. (where do they find these people?)

    Heaven knows why they have two perfectly ordinary Fireflies... and other rather unremarkable boats...

    Last edited by Andrew Craig-Bennett; 07-11-2017 at 05:07 PM.
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    Some amazing boats. 50 - 100 pound minimum bids. There seems to be little or no interest. Without being able to see them up close, they may not be much of a bargain (see the Free Boat thread), but even so, what a lot of dreams that auction fuels....

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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Craig-Bennett View Post
    They have two Ducklings, no 18 complete , lot 329, and another, lot 307, and a Fairey Falcon, (a 16ft hot moulded dayboat, very rare and much desired, in rather tatty shape, lot 310, and a Jollyboat (biggest and fasted Uffa Fox dinghy, much favoured by Prince Philip when younger) lot 314, as well as the very interesting Admiralty dinghy ELIZABETH, lot 433, but they are all in Eyemouth...lot 139 is the very first BLUEBIRD OF THORNE and the mother of every single bilge keeler, which gets the following ignorant dismissal in the National Small Boat Register:

    Bilge-keel yacht Little Bluebird. 26?x7?9?. Built 1924, to an amateur design, the best comment on the result would be ?interesting?. Not required for the collection consider disposal GH May 2014 Construction is double diagonal, and the entire hull has been sheathed (with Cascover, or similar), at some time. The sheathing has now failed at various points, and the condition of the timberwork is suspect. Rig is gunter, fitted for outboard engine. Most fittings are modern, and the sails are by a Dutch maker. Acquired about 2006. A cynic might conclude, at the point when the leaks began to win. Lay outside until 2/11, which hasn?t improved her condition. Previous owner claimed that she was the first bilge-keeled yacht in the world. While this needs more research, I have seen references to such craft around 1880. This particular example has the keels so heavily splayed, that the greatest beam is across the keels. It must have been inconvenient, to say the least. Ostrich shed, north bay, second row from south, fourth from east end. Mast (B334) in Potato shed M6. Boom and gaff (B335/6) in Potato shed F4. Sails (C205) in Meak?s Yard, 14. E5. Cockpit cover (C206) in Meak?s Yard, 14. E5. Boathook in Potato shed R3.

    written by an "expert" who clearly had never even heard of Lord Riverdale of Sheffield, her designer. (where do they find these people?)

    Heaven knows why they have two perfectly ordinary Fireflies... and other rather unremarkable boats...

    Little Bluebird is interesting, to me at least, as an owner of a sistership to the final Bluebird of Thorne. Crazy angle on those bilge keels. But a consistent theme of significant tumble home.

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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Y View Post
    Little Bluebird is interesting, to me at least, as an owner of a sistership to the final Bluebird of Thorne. Crazy angle on those bilge keels. But a consistent theme of significant tumble home.
    You have a very fine boat!

    I actually went to a couple of talks at the Little Ship Club by Lord Riverdale in the 1970's. A delightful man.

    I found the idiot, by the way:


    Captain George Hogg
    George served in the Royal Navy, undertaking amongst many roles that of Naval Attaché to states in South America. A keen maritime historian, he was a founding Trustee and driving force of the National Maritime Museum Cornwall. George has a particular interest in vessels at the lower end of the size spectrum, initiating and developing the National Small Boat Register which is run from the museum in Falmouth. George has worked very closely with National Historic Ships over the years, serving on the Registration committee 2006-20011, and is now a welcome member of the new working group.

    RN, say no more...
    http://www.nationalhistoricships.org...re-page-2.html


    Heaven knows why they have two perfectly ordinary Fireflies... and other rather unremarkable boats...
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    Thanks Andrew, sounds like a bit of a Dads Army outfit, gone off the rails somewhat.

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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    Well, my wife has given me permission to buy the wonderful Uffa Fox 14 Daring. Just one catch...... if I do, I have to sail it home. To Oz. It's a great catch, that one.

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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Craig-Bennett View Post
    , and a Fairey Falcon, (a 16ft hot moulded dayboat, very rare and much desired, in rather tatty shape, lot 310
    And the basis for Charles Stock's "Shoal Waters".

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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    Quote Originally Posted by Hwyl View Post
    And the basis for Charles Stock's "Shoal Waters".
    Indeed so. This seems to have been Fairey's only venture into dayboats. They preferred the higher performance boats, probably because Charles Currey was the leading light at Fairey Marine.

    I'd certainly like that one but my hands are full...
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    Wail………. Bawl………. Sob………..

    and all of 12,000 mile away……….
    Last edited by skuthorp; 07-12-2017 at 08:03 AM.

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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    I've registered to bid... and I think I will go and look at the Lowestoft boats once viewing arrangements are in place.
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    This is really cool. Keep us informed, please, Mr. Craig-Bennett.

    Mickey Lake
    'A disciple of the Norse god of aesthetically pleasing boats, Johan Anker'

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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    Now you see it, now you don't Uffa Fox's 22 sq metre VIGILANT was in the sale as Lot 505; now she isn't!

    Believe the 22 squares have all been withdrawn which with luck means their futures are assured.
    Last edited by Andrew Craig-Bennett; 07-14-2017 at 08:21 AM.
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    Awesome! With the metre and square metre boat revival going on you'd hope they'd all find safe homes.

    Mickey Lake
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    A word on two of the types of boat in the auction:

    1. Fairey Marine hot moulded boats (Duckling, Firefly, Fairey Fourteen, Gannet, Fairey Finn, Albacore, Swordfish, Jolly Boat, Falcon) Despite having been produced by an industrial process,involving being baked in an autoclave, these are dead easy to repair - all you need are a sharp chisel, some Agba veneers, which you can get, a staple gun, and some epoxy.

    In the case of (at least) the Firefly and the Jolly Boat, moulds exist and new boats are occasionally built by cold moulding.

    The Fourteen and the Finn are standard interpretations by Fairey (probably actually by Charles Currey!) of the well known restricted classes. The Gannet in the auction may well be the only one surviving - she was an interpretation by Fairey of a "less hairy" Fourteen with decks.

    On the other hand...

    2. Uffa Fox and Morgan Giles International 14's, International Canoes, etc. Despite having been hand built (by some of the finest small boat builders ever to walk the earth) these are almost impossible to repair. They were built over male moulds with the CRE ribs laid in place first, then the diagonal inner skin, 1/16" thick, then calico, then the fore and aft outer skin, 3/16" thick, all held together with the smallest size turned copper nails.
    Last edited by Andrew Craig-Bennett; 07-13-2017 at 02:27 PM.
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    I have left bids on the RN 16ft dinghy and on one of the Ducklings, both "below reserve", and will go to Lowestoft when they permit viewings. Worth noting that there is a nice clinker Whitehall (Lot 305).
    Last edited by Andrew Craig-Bennett; 07-12-2017 at 12:30 PM.
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    What an amazing collection! Some real gems there!

    Rick

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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    Excellent (really excellent!) article in Yachts and Yachting, here:

    http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/new...story-for-sale
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Craig-Bennett View Post
    Excellent (really excellent!) article in Yachts and Yachting, here:

    http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/new...story-for-sale
    Thanks for the redirect, Andrew. I haven't been here very frequently of late (it's Summer, after all!).
    I hope you get the boats and I hope you're successful in saving them.
    Pity that Berlin's so far away but I think SWMBO would not appreciate any more distractions.

    Cheers;

    Gernot

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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    A great article - thanks Andrew! And, for me, worth reading if only to discover Holt's Gently - a really lovely boat I've never heard of! So many wonderful boats - I do hope the collection can be retained in some form, somehow.

    Rick

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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    The only organisation in Britain with the resources and - just as important - the storage space - for this lot are the National Maritime Museum, who have a huge warehouse available in Chatham Historic Dockyard Ropeworks, where they have stuffed their incredible collection of Admiralty ship models.

    The best outcome would be for them to bid on and take over the lot and then discard the unimportant stuff.

    Whether they will do so, or whether the notorious internal politics of that organisation will operate to stop them taking action, is yet to be seen, but anyone who knows the NMM will not be optimistic.
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    For us none Brits, this looks like a combination of the collections of what was the maritime museum at Exeter together with what must have been another at Beale Park. I believe that NMM had a go at the Exeter collection at one time, possibly at Beale Park as well. Lot 325 a canoe by Everson is the only boat that off hand is of historic US importance. He was the New York whitehall builder that the New York Canoe Club persuaded to build the new fangled sailing canoes. There are only 3 of them in US museums that I know of: Adirondack Museum with a whitehall, and a sailing canoe (in tough condition) at Mystic and a better one at Mariners.

    What I fear is no bids at all on the 'ethnic' boats where they may well have disappeared. In the US only Mariners Museum has collected such craft with small examples being found in ethnological collections. A few of these countries might have museums that are interested but not the money to repatriate them. I sense a very large bonfire unless an organization like the International Congress of Maritime Museums organizes something.
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Fuller View Post
    For us none Brits, this looks like a combination of the collections of what was the maritime museum at Exeter together with what must have been another at Beale Park. I believe that NMM had a go at the Exeter collection at one time, possibly at Beale Park as well. Lot 325 a canoe by Everson is the only boat that off hand is of historic US importance. He was the New York whitehall builder that the New York Canoe Club persuaded to build the new fangled sailing canoes. There are only 3 of them in US museums that I know of: Adirondack Museum with a whitehall, and a sailing canoe (in tough condition) at Mystic and a better one at Mariners.

    What I fear is no bids at all on the 'ethnic' boats where they may well have disappeared. In the US only Mariners Museum has collected such craft with small examples being found in ethnological collections. A few of these countries might have museums that are interested but not the money to repatriate them. I sense a very large bonfire unless an organization like the International Congress of Maritime Museums organizes something.
    I concur.

    I also foresee a big bonfire - of all the ethnic exhibits and of the less perfect examples of domestic craft.

    I think that the better examples of the classic racing dinghies will either be retrieved by the families of their donors or bought by private individuals - there is a classic dinghy racing "scene" here:

    http://www.cvrda.org/community/

    and more precisely

    http://www.cvrda.org/community/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=6698

    but there is going to be an awful lot of stuff left over.
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    The sad thing is that the ethnic exhibits were collected with much volunteer enthusiasm and some expense. But nobody will want them.
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    The Irrawaddy ferryboat, is worth a premium just for the name.

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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    Word reaches me that some people, of whom I am not one, but who may be associated with the CVRDA,are planning a move to secure the important racing dinghies, that is to say the International Fourteens, the Merlin Rockets and the National Twelves, and separately there may be something planned by some Canoe folks for the Uffa Fox 1947 IC "Merdeka" and the ultra-rare Linton Hope 1911 (RCC B class - the European ancestor, when crossed with the US canoes, by Uffa Fox, of the IC) - "Aquamarine".
    Last edited by Andrew Craig-Bennett; 07-13-2017 at 04:28 PM.
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    There are some lovely boats there, the Hastings punt Argonaut is one i like plus many others. Trouble is many are in need of restoration & with 15% buyers premium & vat on top nothing will be cheap. Add in costs of transport & In fact most will end up far over current market value.

  33. #33
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    In a spirit of enquiry, I put a bid of £550 (before Buyer's Premium and VAT!) on the rather lovely Whitehall, just to see if the reserve was indeed set at £500. It was still "below reserve".

    There are many boats there which are of considerable interest as museum exhibits, but which are so damaged that they can never go afloat again. I fear that the handful of seaworthy boats will be "cherry picked" and the others will be firewood.

    There is also some rather nice woodworking kit... and at least one of the models, Lot 11, the Irish trading schooner RESULT (actual vessel in the Ulster Folk Museum I think) is something rather special.
    Last edited by Andrew Craig-Bennett; 07-16-2017 at 02:47 PM.
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    Note: I deleted those posts because I had linked to pictures in the online catalogue. The online catalogue seems to change and when I just looked it contained a ban on reproducing any part of it, so, not wishing to get WB into trouble, I deleted the links. In the case of the two above posts they made no sense without the pictures.
    Last edited by Andrew Craig-Bennett; 07-16-2017 at 04:18 PM.
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    Default Re: Boat Auction, attention Brits

    I'm interested in the Scaffie 'Anne', lot #150. Although she is a replica I think she would look very much at home here on the Moray Firth. Also, I refuse to rename boats that I have bought, and my wife's name is Anne. However, I agree with Keith66 that with all the overheads I'm unlikely to get it cheap. I suspect, like other auctions, that bids will accelerate in the closing hours, and people will get silly in their determination to win.
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