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Thread: Ducker Resto

  1. #36
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Denise,
    What you are looking at there is the top of the daggerboard in the daggerboard trunk. If I was doing this, i'd look at plans like Greenbriar/ York to determine where the dagger board slot goes and the Greenbriar plan to show how to build it. The plan would also show where the mast step/ partner needed to be in relation to the daggerboard. You still have the vestiges of that forward thwart to which the daggerboard headledge would tie in. Then you have a 'partner board' which runs from the stem back to that forward thwart. You can figure out where the partner and step need to be by measuring forward from the trunk and backwards from the stem.

    Greenbriar is the boat Joe Liener built copying a boat he measured about 1948. Boat is in the Chesapeake Bay Maritime Museum collection.
    Ben Fuller
    Ran Tan, Liten Kuhling, Vernon Langille, Josef W., Merry Mouth, Imp, Macavity and a quiver of unamed 'yaks.
    "Bound fast is boatless man."

  2. #37
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Thanks Ben!
    I guess these boats go back even farther then 1948, year I was born. I've not been able to find any leads to any wood boat builders from back in the day and I'm usually able to find stuff like that. Researching a boat is something I really enjoy.


    Getting a slight break in the heat here in SE PE, going to try and stabilize the dimensions of the boat so I can get started on planking and stem repairs.
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  3. #38
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Quote Originally Posted by DeniseO30 View Post
    Took a drive today, all the way to egg harbor nj. Got me some white cedar!
    Sounds like you visited Schairer Brothers. Great place with real nice people.

  4. #39
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Sure did Ned! I almost wished I had a house to cover with all that siding they have LOL
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  5. #40
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Finally! Got the "deck" off. Seems to be clear WC .50" thick. The "carlins" are only resting on the inner rail and have a screw through the plank into the end grain
    Took the boards to the basement, started scraping. 100 years of mud it seems. Also seems power washing is the ticket to this mess.

    My thoughts are now going down the "remove plank, restore, patch, fix the put it back and do another" approach. Fixing them on the boat may be more tedious and less practical since the rivets make it easy work, IF you can call any of this easy LOL

    Ben! it's looking to me that it was an OPEN Ducker and the deck was added.

    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  6. #41
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Sounds like the standard way of adding the deck. Instead of notching for deck beams, they would keystone or bevel ends to rest on the inner rail so that it could be light and not weakend by notches. That platform was standard in the open duckers as the pusher needed a place to stand that got him above the reeds. If you took the inner rail off you'd find the frame ends beveled and a minimalist beveled notch in the rail to take it. I guess it is the reason that Pa is the keystone state.
    Ben Fuller
    Ran Tan, Liten Kuhling, Vernon Langille, Josef W., Merry Mouth, Imp, Macavity and a quiver of unamed 'yaks.
    "Bound fast is boatless man."

  7. #42
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    I can't imagine standing on that even when it was new Ben! Mud for sure.. pea green paint under it.... Yeah.. this is gonna take awhile LOL


    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  8. #43
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Denise,
    All that is looking pretty sturdy, as there is a second rail under your deck beams to take the weight of the pusher. Standing is not a problem. Balance could be. Bear in mind that there would be another person in the boat, the gunner when you are pushing and you have the pole both for balance and support.
    Ben Fuller
    Ran Tan, Liten Kuhling, Vernon Langille, Josef W., Merry Mouth, Imp, Macavity and a quiver of unamed 'yaks.
    "Bound fast is boatless man."

  9. #44
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    First bath in a 100 years! (giveERtake LOL)


    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  10. #45
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    the experts on the facebook site arrrg.
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  11. #46
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Seems there was blue paint under the green! The boat is almost dry from the pressure washing really made a big, huge difference!

    What's everybody's input on a detail sanders? I had one of those little triangle ones years ago and it was worthless I threw it away. My RO DeWalt would be too aggressive.

    found more info on the racing class 15 ft boats of the 1800's

    Last edited by DeniseO30; 08-06-2017 at 06:41 PM.
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  12. #47
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    This is very cool. I am very excited for you and I'm looking forward to seeing how this turns out. I sailed Ben's ducker (Greenbriar) and a York this summer. They are fun, surprisingly fast boats under sail and oar. Good luck, I will be watching.

  13. #48
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    thanks! I noticed the planks are rather tight after all that water. Going to build a form for the rails this week or next.
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  14. #49
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Encouraging. I wonder how many leaky spots can get fixed by tightening up the rivets? Which rails do you need the form for? Joe told me and others that built these boats from scratch that they just used the boat as the form for rails, bent on the outside with, for the inside, marking the little triangular notches for the frames on them, then trimming these off the boat.

    With the evidence of the forward thwart, this looks like a candidate for an Eakins style rig if you decide you need a sail.
    Ben Fuller
    Ran Tan, Liten Kuhling, Vernon Langille, Josef W., Merry Mouth, Imp, Macavity and a quiver of unamed 'yaks.
    "Bound fast is boatless man."

  15. #50
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    It's looking great Denise!
    - Chris

    https://fvpetrel.wordpress.com

    Life is short. Go boating now!

  16. #51
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Ben, the inner rails are in too many pieces to even worry about salvaging. I may use the boat to bend then them in place but I still have to do lots of blocks and spreaders. The outer rails on this boat were more like rub rails in half round WO it's about the same amount of work on or off the boat.
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  17. #52
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Quote Originally Posted by cstevens View Post
    It's looking great Denise!
    Thanks Chris!
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  18. #53
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Quote Originally Posted by DeniseO30 View Post
    First bath in a 100 years! (giveERtake LOL)

    Wow, some of it is watertight.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  19. #54
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Quote Originally Posted by Peerie Maa View Post
    Wow, some of it is watertight.
    It was a pleasant surprise Nick. Had to keep bailing that side.. other side has the split planks.
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  20. #55
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Quote Originally Posted by DeniseO30 View Post
    Ben, the inner rails are in too many pieces to even worry about salvaging. I may use the boat to bend then them in place but I still have to do lots of blocks and spreaders. The outer rails on this boat were more like rub rails in half round WO it's about the same amount of work on or off the boat.
    Denise, I wasn't thinking about salvaging the inner rail, mostly about bending it and marking it for the frame ends which you'll note have a beveled or angled top, snaped off is what they used to say. The outer rail may complicate bending the inner rail on the outside to fit it, bending is usually against the sheer strake.
    Ben Fuller
    Ran Tan, Liten Kuhling, Vernon Langille, Josef W., Merry Mouth, Imp, Macavity and a quiver of unamed 'yaks.
    "Bound fast is boatless man."

  21. #56
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    That was an excellent job of power washing. In the hands of an amateur, a power washer could easily do far more harm then good.
    I was born on a wooden boat that I built myself.

  22. #57
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Thanks Rich!! I found with wood, it's best to wash it with a fan pattern first and the more intense spraying a second and third time, a lot of the paint and varnish will come away if the wood is given time to get wet.

    Ben the top 2" +- of the sheer strakes are are gone also, but I'll figure it out. I did notice last night as I was putting the tarp over it. What's left of the in rails was tapered for the stem and deck, like a canoe .
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  23. #58
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Denise, I would like to let you know that I find it wonderful what you are doing, it's so inspiring! If I wasn't that deep into my project ... there is this beautiful old lifeboat from Nazare just 200 m away from me, uncovered and no-one seems to care that it is suffering. Can't tell you how often I've been there to look at it, wondering if it could be rescued. Seeing you, I'm sure it can! Awesome and thank you!!!

  24. #59
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Dawn dishwashing liquid plus a little scrub brush to get rid of the flakeys is what our local marine archaeologists recommended. Part of Barbashela was watertight as well, the starboard garboard amidships, a strip of canvas saturated in paint and caulked. You can see the soapy water pooling at the bas of the frames.



    We used a Dewalt RO with 80 and 120, very light pressure, with good results. For the thicker stuff we put a nylon brush on a drill and the cypress held up great.



    We deployed a whole arsenal of weapons, scrub brush, putty knife, wire brush, bronze brush, RO sander, belt sander, awl, razor scraper, nylon brush as needed depending on the thickness of the crud that we were removing. Be curious to hear what tricks you have up your sleeve?



    For other sander options you might check out the DeWalt oscillating multi tool, it comes with a triangular sander as well as a bunch of cool blades. We used it to scarf and clean out seams...a little and sometimes a lot...


  25. #60
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Dody, thank you! I'm of the mindset that all wooden boats are restorable but there are diminishing returns. This boat,even though it is probably a historical artifact it quite probably has low or very little value to anyone except another person that loves Delaware duckers.

    Charlie, is your boat back together now? Major operations you had going on there!! When I restore a boat I try to remove old paint and varnish with remover and power-washing to minimize the sanding and scraping.
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  26. #61
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Quote Originally Posted by DeniseO30 View Post

    Charlie, is your boat back together now? Major operations you had going on there!! When I restore a boat I try to remove old paint and varnish with remover and power-washing to minimize the sanding and scraping.
    Yes she splashed November of 2016 and is now back at her Museum home in Biloxi. You can see the restoration thread here



    Our paint removal was aggressive, but there wasn't much of it to take off and we were working with 7/8 inch cypress. We did use stripper as well on the thick stuff....I say we, the Skipper tackled that while I played with blue tape.


  27. #62
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    She's A Beauty Charlie!

    Gotta small conundrum here.. I mean when I get started.
    Remove what's left of the sheer strakes, repair & put them back on the boat before or after making the new in-rails?

    It got cool here in the east! Must get something done on the boat before summer comes back again

    LOL I'm going to go for the plastic bag in place steam bending, WHEN, I get set up and have the rails ready.
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  28. #63
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Oh well got sidetracked for a bit. Helped a friend take his boat down to Chesapeake Bay in the sweltering heat of August. Big mistake that was but the deed is done.

    I downloaded Tapatalk it seems to work with photographs.

    The stems are in bad condition, I can save them but I'm saying this before I try and take one out.
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  29. #64
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    Default

    One thing for sure the stems were beefy


    Sent from my LG-M430 using Tapatalk
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  30. #65
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Looking closer, I think the stems were sawn and not steam bent going by the grain, clearly there's a piece missing the top, I think it's in the back of my truck.
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  31. #66
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Stems were all sawn; you noticed that they tapered them so they have plenty of meat for the fastenings, but were slim ahead of the rabbets. Not parallel sided.
    Ben Fuller
    Ran Tan, Liten Kuhling, Vernon Langille, Josef W., Merry Mouth, Imp, Macavity and a quiver of unamed 'yaks.
    "Bound fast is boatless man."

  32. #67
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Fuller View Post
    Stems were all sawn; you noticed that they tapered them so they have plenty of meat for the fastenings, but were slim ahead of the rabbets. Not parallel sided.
    You knew I'd find out that Ben!

    I've a couple of ideas to stabilize the stems.. saw a slot in the leading edge,(would be tricky) a spline in. other.. dowels 1/4" drilled and inserted across the grain. I like the spine best.. near invisible and very strong.
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  33. #68
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Oh my.....
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  34. #69
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    Quote Originally Posted by DeniseO30 View Post
    Oh my.....
    Wassup?
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  35. #70
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    Default Re: Ducker Resto

    I got one of the stems out of the boat took pictures apparently I can't upload with Tapatalk just now, so I have to get back with the pictures in a little while
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

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