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Thread: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

  1. #456
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Thanks Neil. It is amazing, though I knew there was spots under the clamps that I was having trouble getting to and would need to deal with now. Your solution with a sanding disc sounds workable. I had also thought of using a Dremel, same idea to protect the hull.

    Ken
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  2. #457
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Hi Ken, I just wrote this in Davids Ilur build thread and it's something for you to consider too so I'll put it here as well:-

    Just a thought re interior fit out. I didn't make a cradle for the hull, I just screwed a few battens across the building stand making sure one was in way of the bilge runners and I kept the boat upright with tie down straps or a thin batten screwed to the stand aft so I could clamp it to the sheer strake.

    The reason for this approach was to allow me to tip the boat onto the bilge runner on either side to get better access to the lower parts of the hull interior. It's a long way to reach and do work

  3. #458
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Ahhh, Steve I like the way you think. It had occurred to me that the stretch was going to be a little painful. Literally, in view of my back issues. I will keep it in mind. I had considered "walking" her a little to one side and then tilting to reach. But it's always good to hear other ideas and keep those options in mind. Thanks!
    50780645828_e3f82ecef4_c.jpg
    Ken
    Last edited by KenStocker; 12-30-2020 at 10:00 PM.
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  4. #459
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    I had taped off the transom so that I didn't get paint on the epoxy. I thought I would be able to just scrub it off, but not so. If I use mineral spirits, will that dull or harm the epoxy? That's 3 coats of epoxy, ready to start with varnish. Or should I just go ahead and sand it off as I prep for varnish?
    50822579323_7cccd04e3e_w.jpgGot a little of the epoxy drips cleaned us today, but not much. Mostly just getting a feel for how the heat gun/scaper combination works. Though not #1 on my list of fun things to do, don't think it will be too bad over all. Tedious seems the most apt description.
    Also mapped out the next few steps. I haven't had a chance to pick up plywood for the centerboard case yet, I have some paneling to use for a mock-up. My main reason for wanting to get that started is so that I can have an exact height to install those two thwarts. Doing that will allow me to pull the rest of the forms, as well as the bar clamp, without worrying about the shape of the sheer. 50823631237_8b998030df_c.jpg
    When the desire to learn is greater than the desire to win, the journey becomes the prize.

  5. #460
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    I would suggest that at this point you can risk solvents on the transom but I wouldn't leave it there to long and wash it off a.s.a.p.
    If you try and sand it off you may just spread the adhesive.

    Once you get those thwarts in she'll be a boat and getting rid of all that extra stuff in the way makes life much easier but you might need to get some of the floors in first, It's hard to work under the thwarts. I did the C/B case, then the floors then the thwart cleats and thwarts.

    I've mentioned before that epoxy acts as grease before it sets so the thwart cleats can move when clamped. I overcame this by:-
    - Drilling a 1mm hole at each end of the cleat where they are fairly thin.
    -Once properly clamped I then tapped very small brass nails I have into the hull planks through the holes.
    -Cut the head off the nail/pin.
    -Remove the cleat.
    -Cut the pin short enough that it won't protrude through the cleat.
    -Epoxy the cleat on, locating it over the pins.
    -Clamp them on safe in the knowledge that they won't move while setting.

    If you're lucky the pin will push a little epoxy through the hole which will fill it.

    You probably don't have such pins but you'll be able to come up with something similar. If you know someone who makes wooden ship models they may have the pins or if you're really desperate you can PM me your address and I'll post you a few.

  6. #461
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    50868954071_183b505453_c.jpg50868953616_8b90f530cf_c.jpgGot a fair amount done this weekend. Dry fit the centerboard case, as well as laying out the two center thwarts. I cut the thwarts plenty long, mostly just wanted to see how they were going to look. These two boards were the "worst" of them, and by that I mean they had the least stunning birds eye figuring. The four that I consider to be the most spectacular will be reserved for the four side seats. But that will have to wait for the installation of the center thwarts, so that the last form can be removed and accurate patterns made. As for the CB case, is a coat of epoxy enough to seal the interior?

    50872626527_3c53c16da0_c.jpg
    It becomes fairly obvious in these pics that I am dodging doing the interior scraping all at one time...just shall we say...chipping away at it.
    Ken
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  7. #462
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Ken, the thwart timbers are beautiful. Wish I'd had access to such timber.

    The CB case is, in my case, fibreglassed inside but I'm not sure how important it would be to go that far. I would however recommend three coats of epoxy to guarantee a waterproof lining.

  8. #463
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Looking really good, Ken! And I agree that several coats of epoxy inside the CB case is good. A lot of guys seem to use a carbon (?) powder additive to add abrasion resistance since the sides of the case, especially at the leverage points, will be wear spots. Are those thwarts solid or ply? Spectacular stuff there!

  9. #464
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Quote Originally Posted by Hugh MacD View Post
    Looking really good, Ken! And I agree that several coats of epoxy inside the CB case is good. A lot of guys seem to use a carbon (?) powder additive to add abrasion resistance since the sides of the case, especially at the leverage points, will be wear spots. Are those thwarts solid or ply? Spectacular stuff there!
    .

    Graphite powder,to reduce the friction.Cleaning up glue seepage isn't much fun and has to be done carefully.It does result in a much neater looking interior-----------------------eventually.

  10. #465
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Those thwarts look lovely Ken. Have you seen the video on Off Center Harbor about trimming/shaping the edges of thwarts in Caledonia Yawl - it makes interesting viewing...................... and I now follow the ideas (roninging the upper edge and bevelling the under edge) for almost all of my thwarts & sidebenches. Makes the boat look 'lighter' imo but I'm sure there are lots of approaches. When you put multiple layers of epoxy on the inside of the centreboard case remember to remove the amine blush between the layers if you can.
    Regards Neil

  11. #466
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Hugh, the thwarts are solid. I've had that wood for 15+ years, waiting for just the "right" application. I think this qualifies! Edging them with mahogany allows me to stretch limited material, as well as looking good. I have saved the "best" 4 pieces for the side seats, and will hopefully still have enough for all of the sternsheets.

    John, do you know of a brand name/source for that graphite?

    Neil, I haven't seen the video, will try to catch it. The plan is to bevel the thwarts like that, and thanks for the reminder about amine blush. Easy for a rookie like me to forget details like that!

    Knowing that I have this beautiful wood has been a blessing and a curse. Nice to look forward to, but brutal to have to wait! Can't lay out the side seats till I have the CB case in, and the middle thwarts attached so that the boat holds it's shape. Then I can remove the mold at station 7, and make patterns for the side seats. Patience is not my strong suit!

    Ken
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  12. #467
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Looking terrific Ken. What actually is that timber that you’ve saved for the thwarts? Looks lovely.
    cheers
    Greg
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  13. #468
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Quote Originally Posted by Larks View Post
    Looking terrific Ken. What actually is that timber that you’ve saved for the thwarts? Looks lovely.
    cheers
    Greg
    It's birdseye maple, some of the most beautiful wood I've ever had the pleasure of working with. I've always been a sucker for figured wood, though I suspect most of us are. (I've always loved quarter-sawn oak.)Some have discouraged me from using maple, as it is not very rot-resistant. But the thwarts are screwed, not glued, and thus can be replaced should that become an issue. I suspect that will not be true in my lifetime, especially with the boat stored inside.

    Ken
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  14. #469
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Not a lot that's picture worthy today. Epoxy day mostly. Attached the mahogany to the sides of the thwarts. Also finished gluing up the center section of my second oar, started...about a decade ago I think! All that's left on that is to source the remaining pieces for the blades.

    I should also admit that I hate doing tool maintenance. Whether it's sharpening, tuning up, whatever. I tend to have so little time for actual shop time that it pains me to have to "waste" it, much to my own hurt. But I finally had no choice but to change my thickness planer blades. And since I had never done that, (don't tend to use it that much), I could not find the gauge for setting the blade depth. A buddy who manages a local tool shop found what he thought was a universal gauge. Long story short, not that universal. The blades were not set deep enough into the cylinder, and so cut a very deep wavy cut. After spending half an hour digging in the shop, finally found the original. Loosened the blades, reset, and the result was a very nice cut. Glad to have that out of the way, since I am taking Friday off just for boat time.

    I also found at my local marine supply store, West Systems #403 Graphite additive, which specifically says it is for centerboards and rudders. (Though I'm not sure I see the use for rudders, unless it's for pivoting rudders). I will use it on the CB case interior, so thanks for the information above!

    Ken
    When the desire to learn is greater than the desire to win, the journey becomes the prize.

  15. #470
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    So I took Friday off, originally to see my daughter and family. Unfortunately, they all have Covid, so Friday became boat day. It was a strange kind of weekend. Felt like I never got anything "done", but also felt like I accomplished a lot. Here's the list...

    Put two coats of the System 3 graphite on the interior of the CB case. Got the CB rails and logs cut. Cut the blanks for the thwart cleats. Cut the pieces for the blades on the remaining oar. (The other one has been glued up for who knows how long...)Scraped the inside of the hull, about 5' of one side, a good start. Cut the 4 pieces for the second, lower "rub rail", you know, the one I have failed to really be able to label thus far, and got one of those cut to match the bevel where it meets the outer stem. Also played with the pattern of the first of the floors.So no, didn't "finish" anything, but got a good start on several fronts.50921086787_c966fe71e1_w.jpg 50920959061_663f03a202_w.jpg 50920957331_bd3071afb3_w.jpg50920264768_ca189136c2_w.jpg

    All in all a good weekend.

    Ken
    When the desire to learn is greater than the desire to win, the journey becomes the prize.

  16. #471
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Nice bit of progress Ken, feels good doesn't it

  17. #472
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Coming along nicely, Ken, that's going to be a beautiful boat when finished. Iain Oughtred's designs have their own signature style and that is already coming through in your boat. Press on!
    *******
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  18. #473
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Quote Originally Posted by cluttonfred View Post
    Coming along nicely, Ken, that's going to be a beautiful boat when finished. Iain Oughtred's designs have their own signature style and that is already coming through in your boat. Press on!
    Thanks Matthew, his boats are lovely, aren't they? It does, as Steve said, feel good to make progress. Thanks for the encouragement!

    Ken
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  19. #474
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Hi Ken, Its good make progress. What's the temps like there? You've got a very nice boat and it looks like you know what you're doing!

  20. #475
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Quote Originally Posted by davidladd View Post
    Hi Ken, Its good make progress. What's the temps like there? You've got a very nice boat and it looks like you know what you're doing!
    Nothing thrills me more than knowing that looks are deceiving! But thanks for the compliment! Woodworking, yes I've done it basically all of my life, and found great enjoyment in doing so. Boatbuilding? Zero, Zip, Nadda! So lots of new things, but as always deeply satisfying to work with wood. That part doesn't change.
    So temps? Pretty typical of the coast. 36 degrees this morning at 4:30 am, and 50 degrees tonight at 5pm. This winter has been pretty mild, with no extremely hard freezes to speak of. Although the forecasted weather for the Columbia Gorge is for blizzard conditions tomorrow, we will likely see little to nothing of that on the south coast.
    For me, the weather is a little less of a problem, in that I have two work areas. The garage, (circa 1908, though added later) is not heated. The "shop", is heated. So I have to choose when to use epoxy in the garage, but can tackle things like the center board in the shop at will. When planking, there was a night where Steve Price had to talk me off of the ledge when I glued up a plank at the exact time that the temp dropped like an anvil. Ultimately no harm done, except to my arteries!
    Temps for you sound like much more of an impediment. But in spite of that, your boat is looking terrific, keep up the good work!

    Ken
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  21. #476
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    So I was reminded today why I gave away my jointer. Rough-sawn mahogany, add a hand plane, 5 minutes later,(max)and the edge is straight as can be. Plus the added enjoyment of those curly shavings. Very satisfying! Add in a text from my son, telling me how he had his oldest (14 yr. old)help him with a hand plane and how amazed she was at how effective it was. He then thanked me for passing down my woodworking skills to him. Doesn't get much better than that! 50944488627_b8413a719e_w.jpg 50944487472_e2882c9622_w.jpg 50944385851_b5f36e721a_w.jpg 50943686388_292b4fbfd5_w.jpg Then I did a mock-up of the 2nd oar, followed by cutting and laying out the remaining centerboard pieces. The only two things I need to nail down is the position of the upright brace, which the plans are not real specific on, and the position of the plugs for the centerboard pin. The brass rod for the centerboard left Hillsboro at 2:41 am on Sat. morning. So the snow and ice up north have obviously been a problem. I don't want to finalise the position of the plugs till I am a little more certain of where I want that pin.
    Attached Images Attached Images
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  22. #477
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    You've lost me with this "upright brace" thing, I don't recall that.

    Also, with the pivot pin blocks I rounded mine over so there were no hard edges to catch toes on, important in a rocking moving boat

  23. #478
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    A brief note Ken - I overdrilled a hole in my centreboard, filled it with epoxy, then drilled a smaller hole for the centreboard support bolt - so the centreboard pivots on an epoxy based pivot point rather than pivoting on timber or epoxied timber. Nice to hear the stories about planes and their use. If we can get some sunny days i plan to raise the mainsail on Plockton and hopefully finish the rigging. I'll post some photos. The points in the previous posts about primarily having the boats weight on central rollers/pads are correct - the side bunkers are just to stop her rocking on the trailer I think................
    Good luck and keep on posting the photos.
    Regards Neil

  24. #479
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve TN 15 View Post
    You've lost me with this "upright brace" thing, I don't recall that.

    Also, with the pivot pin blocks I rounded mine over so there were no hard edges to catch toes on, important in a rocking moving boat
    I have seen it done both without(your build and others)and with this upright,(Al's boat, and others). I took another look at the plans, and found that the CB rails and logs, as well as this upright, are all shown with dotted lines. It is placed at station 4, about here. 50948155231_42a6b5c93a_w.jpg I tend to prefer the look of yours, and am not sure it is at all necessary. I like the "uncluttered" look. Haven't decided yet. Apparently not putting it in has not sunk Miss Caroline!

    Ken
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  25. #480
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Quote Originally Posted by neil.henderson View Post
    A brief note Ken - I overdrilled a hole in my centreboard, filled it with epoxy, then drilled a smaller hole for the centreboard support bolt - so the centreboard pivots on an epoxy based pivot point rather than pivoting on timber or epoxied timber. Nice to hear the stories about planes and their use. If we can get some sunny days i plan to raise the mainsail on Plockton and hopefully finish the rigging. I'll post some photos. The points in the previous posts about primarily having the boats weight on central rollers/pads are correct - the side bunkers are just to stop her rocking on the trailer I think................
    Good luck and keep on posting the photos.
    Regards Neil
    I have the same plan in mind Neil. The 3/8" brass rod arrived today, apparently escaping the glaciers up north, and will allow me to place the plugs, and thus the rod itself, in the centerboard case. Also need to start planning that centerboard so that I can meld the two together. That will not happen this coming weekend, as we are taking a trip to my Covid-recovered daughter's home to spend time with those grandkids. (And their parents, I guess!) Very relieved they have recovered, and are attempting to navigate these strange and challenging times with family. My wife and I, as a medical assistant and grocery store manager, are thankful to have escaped exposure thus far. Isn't it a bit bizarre the considerations we have to take into account? Thanks for your input as always, and stay safe.

    Ken
    When the desire to learn is greater than the desire to win, the journey becomes the prize.

  26. #481
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Yeah Ken I can't understand the need for the vertical, when the centre board is in use all the stresses are in the keel, pivot point and top rails of the case and that is quite aft near the thwart which has huge lateral load bearing capabilities. As you say, Miss Caroline hasn't sunk yet ( disclaimer for reference by mother nature, the merest thought of suggesting she is unsinkable never even begun to speculate about the slightest possibility of crossing my mind. I know better than to temp you )

    Ken take care visiting the family, you and I are older and more susceptible to complications and ongoing damage from this bug

  27. #482
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Thanks Steve, we will be very careful. My daughter home-schools the kids, so exposure is minimal. I believe in trying to balance reasonable precautions without stopping living. Sometimes a tough balance, but I appreciate your concern. Who'da thunk we would ever face these kinds of decisions, huh? Stay safe yourself.

    Ken
    When the desire to learn is greater than the desire to win, the journey becomes the prize.

  28. #483
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    O.K., soliciting opinions. I am looking forward to the spacers between the gunnels. I have a couple, or even 3, choices. One is some walnut I have. One is some Douglas Fir I have. Another would be Port Orford (white)cedar. I have plenty of the first two, ample availability of the cedar. Float me some opinions. The contrast between the mahogany and either fir or white cedar is nice. The more subtle difference between the mahogany and the black walnut would probably be more noticeable when sanded and varnished. What thinkest thou?
    50997626348_9381eed76b_w.jpg50998330376_2ef895a744_w.jpg
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  29. #484
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    What's your color scheme going to be? That might affect your choice. I like 'em both. I did a mahogany/walnut/mahogany tiller for my Santana and it looks OK. This is the only photo I have of it:
    IMG_3537.jpg

  30. #485
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Mate I've got hoop pine all round and the Deks Olje #1 gives it a nice honey colour but I like the contrast effect of the second pic

  31. #486
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Steve, I like that contrast better, to some extent. But as Hugh said, the interior will match the exterior, mostly white. I did that to intentionally make the darker mahogany pop. I've already compromised a bit by lightening it with the maple seats, but tried to mitigate that with the mahogany trim on them. I will also use mahogany for the floorboards, knees, and walnut for cleats, oarlock pads, etc. Just trying to balance light and dark without losing that "pop" in the contrast.

    Ken
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  32. #487
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Contrasts are great when they show off a profile or the lines of a build.. The trick is not to make the overall look to "busy" thereby complicating the effect on the eye.
    Sometimes less is more.

  33. #488
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1902 View Post
    Contrasts are great when they show off a profile or the lines of a build.. The trick is not to make the overall look to "busy" thereby complicating the effect on the eye.
    Sometimes less is more.
    Yeah that rings true

  34. #489
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1902 View Post
    Contrasts are great when they show off a profile or the lines of a build.. The trick is not to make the overall look to "busy" thereby complicating the effect on the eye.
    Sometimes less is more.
    Yeah, Mike that's the way I'm leaning too. Someone was once asked if they liked the opera. They said "Yes, but too many notes." It's been our family's running joke, and I'm trying not to get "too many notes" as far as wood types go. I was leaning towards the darker look as well. May even just match it up with mahogany and call it good.

    Ken
    When the desire to learn is greater than the desire to win, the journey becomes the prize.

  35. #490
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    Default Re: Tammie Norrie comes to Coos Bay

    Hi Ken,
    I'm jealous that you get to make the choice of rail spacer material. I have always liked the look of the open gunnel. But, the Ilur design doesn't have that so I'm out of luck there. If it was me, I would go for using the same material as the rails. It will look great without looking to boldly.

    David

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