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Thread: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

  1. #1
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    Default Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Hello All, My name is Dave and I am building Theresa II, A 1913 design by Albert Strange. There may have been one of this design built in that time but if it was it has long ago disappeared into the well of history. She is a sweet set of lines and is aching to be seen again. Though I am modifying the plans somewhat She will be as true to designed size, shape and appearance as possible. She is a 25.6' (LOA) by 7.6', gaff rigged yawl. I am using lead as opposed to cast iron so had to redesign the ballast and centerline a bit. She is getting double planked with red cedar and doug fir set in epoxy. Not quite cold molding, but a close cousin. I'd like to build her traditionally but for reasons I could explain later this just won't work for me. Frames will be steam bent white oak. The stem, keel and stern parts will all be laminated doug fir. Ok... So here's my predicament. I am working alone. The stem by itself measures 4.5" thick at the stem head, 7" thick at station 3 and 12" wide at station 4 where it overlaps the keel. It measures almost 12' around the profile. The keel at least is straight for the next 16' but is almost 20" wide. These are huge, wide, long laminations. The chance for voids is guaranteed. Working alone it's impossible. Solid timbers, I think, are not an option inside a ridgid monocoque hull. The backbone needs to be as stable as the hull. So here is my solution if it makes any sense. Laminate the stem in or 3 or 4 easy overlapping pieces more or less as originally designed and fit them together, as if they were timbers. So would these pieces be doweled together with thickened epoxy or bolted together and bedded with 5200. I can't see that they would ever be taken out. Laminations would be thin, 1/4" max. I have just finished the lofting (well 95%) so actually making a boat part is looming large. Please let me know if I am on the right track with this stem or way off in the weeds.
    Thanks, Dave
    Last edited by dragonslayer; 11-11-2020 at 01:31 AM.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Welcome Dave, I can’t wait to get into this thread.

    On your stem, personally I’d be making it up in one 12’ length. Immensely stronger and no mucking around with bolts and/or fitting all those components together. Should be pretty stable too. Even if you build out of seperate stem/knee/forefoot you’d have to trim widths down to a fair shape. With a bit of ingenuity you’ll handle it ok as a single lamination.

    To increase width at lower end of stem glue alternating veneers side by side in a different place so that glue lines block each other. In other words you have a central 5” wide board that runs full length then glue pieces either side at lower end to build up width then resaw into veneers. Next, alternating layers could be made up with a central glue-line etc etc.

    Same thing for keel. Probably about t he same amount of work either way. But you will need a decent sized bandsaw.

    You need to have a look at Jim Ledgers thread entitled “lofting the Brewer catboat” , he made a monster laminated stem from Angelique IIRC. he’s working alone on a 25’ catboat.

    A lot of Paul Gartsides boats have single length laminated stems.

    I found it for you . http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...Brewer-catboat
    Last edited by Andrew Donald; 11-02-2020 at 10:01 AM.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    On Wenda, an Albert Strange canoeyawl, the stem was laminated up and bolted, much as you suggest. 1/4" laminates were too thick and led to glue starvation on a test piece, in the end we ended up with about 1/8" laminates and had to steam those and clamp them on the fixture first...

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Quote Originally Posted by Canoeyawl View Post
    On Wenda, an Albert Strange canoeyawl, the stem was laminated up and bolted, much as you suggest. 1/4" laminates were too thick and led to glue starvation on a test piece, in the end we ended up with about 1/8" laminates and had to steam those and clamp them on the fixture first...
    CY what timber did you use , flat or quartervsawn?

    I went and had a look at some pics of Therese 2 , it doesn’t look too serious a bend , but I may be corrected. Maybe the stern post is sharper.

    these frames were all 3mm DF dry and the stern post is done with about 4 mm strakes. Sure it’s not 12’ but that’s only longer. Do-able. BTW this is a 22’ Grey Seal. Forward stem was same about 4” sided and 3” moulded.

    2248159D-6F6E-4923-8775-7D8173A8A729.jpg
    Last edited by Andrew Donald; 11-02-2020 at 06:06 PM.

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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Thanks Andrew, I had thought of edge gluing the slices (to get enough width ) and then staggering the glue joints in the laminations. That may be the way to go. I think I'll need 5 arms with a 14' wingspan or at least another person. Paul Gartside is the designer who modified my plans to accomodate an engine and lead ballast. In the process the stem was a bit enhanced. Same shape, just a bit beefier. And the stern is not quite as sharp a bend as the stem. If I can figure out how to post a picture I'll attach a picture of my lofting and maybe a shot of that section on the plans.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    CY, Do you have any pictures of that stem. Does that stem belong to "Sally"? If so we traded emails a few years ago when I was interested in a Wenda.
    Dave Ahrens

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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew Donald View Post
    CY what timber did you use , flat or quartervsawn?
    VG, Utile (African Mahogany) which is heavy and stiff. I think it just barely floats!
    (Some Albert Strange boats have a pronounced "knuckle" in the stems, I think there are drawings in Theresa in the first book, I will take a look)
    edit: Yes, Sally.
    Probably no pics other than of the boat

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Yes CY. the drawings are in John Leather's book on Albert Strange, pg 141.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    More drawings and photographs are in the first section of the later Albert Strange book, by Miller and Clay

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    I have made a bit more progress but thought first I'd put up a picture of the sail plan as Albert Strange drew it.
    Just to better provide a "face" to my project.

    Theresa sail plan.jpg
    And the construction plan...

    Theresa Constr plans.jpg
    I'd be interested to know if there is a better way to put up these pictures.
    Please let me know if I need to do something different.
    Dave Ahrens

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    No advice on the stem from me, but that's a seriously nice boat. I'll be following.
    -Dave

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Thank,you Woxbox , I'll be interested in your input.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Dave only advice I can give re pics is that you need to take them in landscape so they don’t rotate when published. You could host your pics on a third party host site and link to your thread through the same button used. Just select the other tab on window that comes up. You have to pay though and as many have found you are open to whether or not that host ups their fees or goes belly up with your pics.
    looking forward to this build.

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Thanks Andrew. Think I'll post them as above. These were shot with a goPro and didn't rotate. Only thing is they take up a lot of the page and that may annoy some.

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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Here are all the profile templates needed to make the backbone assembly. My lofting floor is 12' x 28' and is made from 3/4 particle board. I rolled out 30# felt under it.
    Then I cut slots all around the edges of each piece with my router and glued and splined them together. I then sank 3" concrete screws along edges and corners. Screw heads were counterbored and puttied over flush. When I take it up I can locate the screws with a metal detector, chip out putty and back out the screws. Then fill the holes. I might add, I hate the particle board. It chips out when pulling nails, leaving little divits I have to re-putty. But it was $20 less than the cheapest 3/4 ply. Luckily my floor is flat and solid. When I built my shop I poured 5" thick 6 sack concrete over 10" of crushed rock and it is 50' by 70'.
    Theresa backbone templates.jpg
    Dave Ahrens
    Last edited by dragonslayer; 11-13-2020 at 11:00 AM.

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    I bet you’re excited to be “on the road” with the build , actually making bits, if indirectly. That lens sure makes for a funny shaped boat. Ply is hellishly exxy here too. Do they still sell MDF in England?
    goodonya

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Good luck with your build. I'll be following along green with envy.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    I'm in Northern California. About parallel to Ft Bragg. Next time I'll use plywood. At least I could use it later for something else. This Particle board won't even burn properly.
    Dave

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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    When it came time to loft the body plan I decided not to do it on the floor, on top of the profile and half breath lines, Crawling around on these lines just doesn't suit my knees or my neck. So I built a table on saw horses with plywood next to the lofting floor. Normally body plan lines (station lines) would be laid out along a vertical base line with the forward stations on the right side and aft stations on the left side of the baseline. But that would take 2 sheets of plywood since Theresa is just under 8' wide. So I divided the body plan into 2 baselines. A screwed down batten on the right side and another one on the left side, representing both sides of the same line.
    Theresa Body plan 2.jpg
    Theresa body plan 4.jpg
    Theresa body plan 3.jpg
    Water lines were laid down same as on the floor. Buttock (vertical) lines from each baseline at each side. Diagonals from each side. I'm sure lots of people have done it this way before but I've never seen it or read about it anywhere. Anyway it worked great and I can walk all around the table. And also, call me a heretic but I don't like the white paint. Ink doesn't erase and bleeds through if you try to paint over it. Scrubbing with acetone is the only way I have found to redraw a line. I like the bare plywood much better. You need to erase something just erase it or sand it off. This method probably wouldn't work as well on a bigger boat with more stations. Possibly this is commonly done and I just have never seen it. I'll be interested to see your comments on it.
    Dave
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Great project. We are following.

    unnamed.jpg
    "Yeah, well, that's just, like your opinion man"
    -The Dude-

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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Albert Strange at the helm of CHERUB III, his last yacht.

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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    You chose a beautiful design Dragonslayer and found a clever way of lofting too, prevents a lot of muscle and joint pain.
    Enjoy building her.
    I'll be following your progress.

  23. #23
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Nice work, Dave, and nice shop.

    You must have a lot of confidence to loft in ink!
    "George Washington as a boy
    was ignorant of the commonest
    accomplishments of youth.
    He could not even lie."

    -- Mark Twain

  24. #24
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Actually, not so much confidence. Every line erased at least twice before the ink. Getting confused I have to keep reminding myself I'm not just drawing lines, I'm drawing the boat. Lofting is a fascinating process. I've been seeing rotating hulls in my sleep for a month now. And on the table for the body plan. It may seem clever but there are definite disadvantages. It will not be as easy to lay out a full mold and construct it on my 4x8 table as if I had done the drawing on the floor. Didn't think of that. There is probably a good reason the old masters are still called Masters.
    Dave Ahrens

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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Dave I saw in a back issue of WB a method where the builder did their body plan on heavy clear plastic film mounted on a frame. Maybe you could do that and flip it to get the other side then spike it through onto another sheet of ply ?
    Last edited by Andrew Donald; 11-20-2020 at 06:49 PM.

  26. #26
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Yes. That is how I plan on picking up the lines. A few years ago I found a giant roll of clear window film that had been discarded. It is 4ft wide and probably 50'long. I plan on laying it on the plan and pricking through it along the lines then transferring this onto my form material. What issue was that if you remember?
    Dave

  27. #27
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Issue 35, p95

  28. #28
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Thanks. That was quick! You must have an index. Do they have such a thing?... Don't have that issue$#%^U!

  29. #29
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    Default Re: Building Theresa II. An Albert Strange Canoe Yawl.

    Yeh I’ve got the electronic library which comes with an index. I’d go as far as saying for any build it’s as good as it gets.tons of info and a great cross referenced index

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