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Thread: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

  1. #1
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    Default Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    This thread is a follow on from a thread I raised in Designs/Plans last year...see extract below...
    "I have just come across photographs/information on this boat (miscellaneous threads) in my search for anything on the 'Lorelei' catboat (c.1915) because it has enthralled my mind as did 'Melonseed' a few years ago. Readers might remember that I did a build thread on the 16' Melonseed (Mallard) with lots of photographs (around 2007). Anyway, I was wondering if anyone can supply additional detailed information, dimensions, etc. I have the table of offsets but they are difficult to read due to pixilation. I really do fancy building one of these beautiful boats but it may end up more as a tribute to Gil Smith rather than a dedicated replica. For instance, I only have an 18' shed to build in so straight away I would reduce this catboat length to 2/3 (16'6") of the original (c. 25').

    Now that I have cleared my 'boat shed' (by selling my MGRV8 sports car), I have been able to make a start on a replica of the Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei" at a scale of 2/3 the size of the original (now housed in the Long Island Maritime Museum, West Sayville, New York State). I was very fortunate to be noticed by a gentleman (Tom) who is a voluntary worker in that very museum. He has been instrumental in my being able to get this far because he has supplied many photographs/measurements and information about the original (1915) craft. If you wish to catch up on the detail then go to the thread mentioned above.

    Anyone who considers themselves knowledgeable/expert should look away now and find some better reading because I do not profess to be anywhere near the mark when it comes to knowledge in the art of boat building and rely heavily on my gift of being able to 'eyeball' problems. Those with similar gifts will know what I am talking about. Others may become appalled at some of my methods which border on the art of the 'bodger' because I tend to stray from the plan from time to time and occasionally ignore the existence of measuring instruments. However, the fact is that for this build I have no actual plan or useful drawings other than the line drawings/table of offsets I found on the internet. I failed miserably in trying to properly loft this boat, for a number of reasons, and have ended up with the idea of lofting in a three dimensional way as I progress with the build which in turn has lead to some trauma. Let's just say that no one should try this method at home!

    Having said all that, you will see that I have made a start and when I am finished I hope to have a craft that will at least look like the Gil Smith catboat named ''Lorelei". For those of you who might be tempted to repeat the exercise, I'm afraid that I will not be able to supply plans to help you because there are none and this is going to be very much a one off exercise. If you're all happy with that then please be my guest...and don't be too shocked at any of my way out methods or lack of boating vocabulary. I may often refer to the odd 'thingy' or 'what's it' in my ramblings but don't hesitate to put me on an even keel when this happens. All I can say is...Jim Ledger...eat your heart out. Seriously though, that man enthrals me and I have to say that he is surely our 21st century Gil Smith, and then some. If you don't believe me, go wallow in the thread entitled 'Lofting the Brewer Catboat'. Don't let it put you off having a go at boatbuilding though, he is a master craftsman and only a fewpeople could follow in his footsteps. Now then Jim, after that tirade on your awesome craft skills, you'll be wondering just what to buy me for my next birthday present!!!


    Let's get back to the plot : The 'boat shed' you see in the pictures below is the one I used to build Mark Barto's gaff rigged 16' Melonseed
    Skiff way back in 2007 and you can still see the marks on the floor where her hardback stood. The working area is very tight (18'x10' overall) but I will manage. Lastly, for anyone who gets hung up on this build...you will have to bear with me as I pursue various other activities. So, there might be some fair gaps between posts but I will try and cover most of the activity with photographs as we progress. Once again I have to say that this is not master class boatbuilding but proof, maybe, that anyone can have a go and perhaps end up with a boat that sails well and safely. What more could you ask than to sail in a wooden boat that you have built from scratch?


    I took the bull by the horns recently and drove down to a small lumberyard in Essex where I bought 113 metres of Western Red Cedar. I was allowed to choose my own pieces from a large number of planks and got some very nice pieces at a good price. The planks range from 9 to 12 feet in length and are 70mm wide x 20mm thick, so I can convert each one to 9 quarter inch strips. I have ordered a couple of sets of 1/4 inch cove and bead router cutters...from your side of the pond as they are less than half the price for them over here. Yes, I hear you say that I am cutting things a bit thin with regard to hull thickness but I am determined to give it a go. The idea is to use modern methods and materials to build a fairly light but strong boat. The main thing is for the finished boat to look, unmistakeably, like the
    Gil Smith catboat 'Lorelei'... and I will be well enough pleased with that.

    Last edited by Don Scott; 07-20-2017 at 04:19 AM.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Earlier post deleted following photobucket fiasco. Will try to feed in earlier photographs from time to time using postimage.


    Last edited by Don Scott; 07-10-2017 at 03:40 PM.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    This should be a very interesting build. I was just at the Long Island Maritime museum a couple of weeks ago. My son's marriage ceremony was held on the grounds and I was able to sneak into the Small Craft building to ogle the Gil Smith catboats.
    I was born on a wooden boat that I built myself.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Hello Rich,

    The museum is too far away to visit but I have been right up the gates on Google Earth and studied the aerial views. Better still, as mentioned above, I have been in contact with Tom during the building of the 4' model when he supplied me with dimensions and various photographs. I am hoping that he spots this thread and gives permission to use some of his photographs of the original to show alongside the build. In the meantime, here is one photo of the model to give some idea of the shape of 'Lorelei'. There are many more on the Design/Plans section under the same heading i.e. The Gil Smith catboat 'Lorelei'. (update : no longer available due to PB fiasco).



    Last edited by Don Scott; 07-10-2017 at 03:52 PM.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"


    This is the line drawing I came across on the internet that sparked my interest in the first place. Very sleek and simple lines...'TO DIE FOR' as we say over here... but not yet!
    Apologies for not acknowledging the source... can't remember where it came from but someone will hopefully fill that gap.
    Looking forward to 'Tom' spotting this thread and allowing use of his photographs or placing them on the thread himself to illustrate the build as it progresses.
    Just as important, I hope that this thread gives useful publicity to The Long Island Maritime Museum, West Sayville, New York State, where the original 'LORELEI' is on display with a number of
    other GIL SMITH catboats.
    Last edited by Don Scott; 06-19-2017 at 03:43 PM.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    That's a sweet model, Don! This is the first time I've seen the lines and offsets for a Gil Smith boat, that's classified information over at the Museum. There must be a leak, someone in the Penny Baotshop, maybe.

    I think this might be Lorelei, but I'm not sure. I'll have a look around and see what else I've got.


    Watching with interest!


    Jim


    Last edited by Jim Ledger; 06-19-2017 at 06:55 AM.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    How did Tom notice you if you haven't been to the museum?

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Steven,

    I originally started the thread with the intension of building a reduced size replica. The original
    is 25 feet long and I only have an 18 feet shed! Tom posted to my thread in the Design/Plans section
    and said he might be able to help. He followed up with a few photographs/dimensions without which
    I could never have got started.



    Jim,

    This is an honour indeed. If you cast your mind back, it was you who suggested that I should have a crack
    at building a model in the absence of any available plans for this catboat. It worked out reasonably well and I
    have now got to the stage of having a crack at the 2/3 scale replica. I use the term 'replica' very loosely but
    hope to produce something near the mark. The build is using ordinary builders ply stock in some cases and
    will certainly not follow in Gil Smith's footsteps as far as build method/materials are concerned. I intend to
    bury the boat in epoxy resin to protect the inferior wood types. No one else would approve of this but I am happy
    in my work. I am putting this build up on the Forum so as to fulfil a promise I made to Tom some time back.

    There will be an added bonus if this boat ever hits the water.

    Lorelei is to the left of the boat in your photo... it has a 'shark fin' top to the centreboard.
    Last edited by Don Scott; 06-19-2017 at 12:06 PM.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Jim,

    I have just found the official? site where the lines/offsets can be found. They were placed on my 2016 thread
    by Peerie Marr

    http://www.loc.gov/resource/hhh.ny2039.sheet

    I also noticed that you had difficulty in downloading a 'thesis' on Gil Smith during the run of that same thread.
    I will place the web address in the post below. I hope you manage to raise it.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Jim,,, you will see that it is a PDF file, address below...

    http://nautarch.tamu.edu/pdf-files/Merwin-MA2000.pdf

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Having constructed the jig for that beautiful bow shape, the piece was constructed using 1/8" slivers of Oak epoxied, bent and clamped over it.

    Last edited by Don Scott; 07-20-2017 at 05:06 AM.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    As I stated before, I was at the museum a few weeks ago for my son's wedding and snuck into the small craft building in between courses at the reception. I snapped off a rapid bunch of shots before being dragged out by my wife. I was interested in a power launch and there was a big Gil Smith catboat on either side. Here they are, but not sure if either is your boat.



    I was born on a wooden boat that I built myself.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    I am really looking forward to seeing this come together.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Rich,

    The top photograph, taken from above, is definitely 'Lorelei'. I have a photograph taken from almost the same position and the colouration of decking strips match up perfectly. It is enough of a coincidence that you should spot this thread only a couple of weeks after your son's wedding, but to have slipped away from the party and taken a photograph of that very craft is stretching coincidence a bit far. I am very pleased that it happened though.



    Stem fitted
    Last edited by Don Scott; 07-20-2017 at 04:46 AM.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    I was standing on a raised platform photographing the launch (the bow is seen just to the right). I spotted the catboat and just snapped off the shot. My Palmer launch build is based on little more then you have going into your build. I've nothing but a set of lines plans and offsets. No construction plans, scantlings or detail plans. Old photos are providing me with the only hints of the little details. You're in much better shape, having a real boat to research. Little things like the vertical support posts under the foredeck and the shape and number of floorboards; things you can't get off the lines plans. Perhaps you can enlist Jim Ledger into take a lot of detail photos.
    I was born on a wooden boat that I built myself.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Rich, I already have a good collection of detail photographs, some of which were posted by Jim on my model building thread over on the Design/Plans section. However, most of them were provided by a gentleman called Tom (still don't know his surname) but a volunteer in the LIMM. I hope he will give permission for their use as the build progresses. They will help to compare my build with the original and show what my efforts SHOULD have looked like.

    I have just spent the last couple of hours ploughing through your 'fan tail' build. All I can say is that I am very impressed with your craftsmanship! I am also intrigued by the power plant you use because I had not heard of it before but, I am well acquainted with the type of R/C prop you are using. I build and fly electric powered model aircraft. I have been pondering the use of an old Yamaha 3.5HP outboard motor which has just come into my possession but not much use in either your boat or mine.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Quote Originally Posted by Don Scott View Post
    Rich, I already have a good collection of detail photographs, some of which were posted by Jim on my model building thread over on the Design/Plans section. However, most of them were provided by a gentleman called Tom (still don't know his surname) but a volunteer in the LIMM. I hope he will give permission for their use as the build progresses. They will help to compare my build with the original and show what my efforts SHOULD have looked like.

    I have just spent the last couple of hours ploughing through your 'fan tail' build. All I can say is that I am very impressed with your craftsmanship! I am also intrigued by the power plant you use because I had not heard of it before but, I am well acquainted with the type of R/C prop you are using. I build and fly electric powered model aircraft. I have been pondering the use of an old Yamaha 3.5HP outboard motor which has just come into my possession but not much use in either your boat or mine.
    Thanks for the compliment. The R/C airplane prop gives good results but I'll have to carry a few spares. One whack into a bunch of weeds will probably snap the thing off. Experience will tell me whether to stick with them or find something different. An electric R/C model airplane is on my bucket list of things to do.
    I was born on a wooden boat that I built myself.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Rich,

    I would be interested in knowing details of the glass fibre and resin you used on the Fantail. I think I have made a big mistake in buying a big roll of 1m wide chopped strand mat. Not only that but I read that glass fibre comes in two types of binder...one for polyester based resin and the other for epoxy. Anyway, I ordered the stuff that is 'powder' bound which can be broken down by the epoxy resin (I use West System) but could not get the glass to lie down. Consequently, I have made a bit of a mess of the centreboard box interior. I ordered the 'powder bound' glass but I feel that I have received the other stuff which has a binder that can only be broken down by polyester resin...something to do with styrene I believe. I would be glad to hear any advice on this subject.

    I have done my 3D lofting (not recommended) i.e. lofting in the round by using batons to prove the lines of temporary MDF frames. Next step is to cut out the ribs that would correspond with the hackmatack odd numbered ones in the full size boat (that's about half of the 27 frames). These are made by using the MDF frames as patterns from two thicknesses of 6mm builders ply bonded together with epoxy and screwed to the MDF. The MDF frames are then cut down by a half inch all round so that they don't get accidentally bonded to the ply ribs or the western red cedar strips when being glued in place. When the boat is turned right way up, an additional set of lighter ribs (Ash) will be laid between the ply ones. I will endeavour to post photographs that will better explain my methods (well, I did say that my methods might not be to everyone's taste). This build is more of a one off exercise rather than trying to instil my unconventional ideas.


    For those of you who like numbers I have been working out the cost of producing 3/4" x 1/4" coved & beaded strip (Western Red Cedar). I have already explained that I bought 42 planks (lengths of 9, 10 and 11 feet) which were 70mm x 20mm.
    Each plank makes 9 strips. I am beading and coving them myself (tedious!) and the game works out at 10p per foot...that's about 8 cents a foot in US dollars. I don't know how good or bad that is compared with ready made stuff.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    These are the batons I mentioned above being used to get the lines 'eye sweet' as you say over there on the other side of the pond (I call it 3D lofting!). You can also see the ply ribs affixed to the MDF building frames.
    It would have been far easier if I had had a set of plans but, as far as I know, there are none.

    Last edited by Don Scott; 07-20-2017 at 04:45 AM.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    I don't use CSM at all so have no experience to draw on, but I saw a test piece in a chandlery that had peel ply put on over the CSM.
    It had laid now nice and smooth and looked to need minimal sanding before the next step.
    That test piece would have been produced by an expert, but I was impressed with the results nonetheless.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Quote Originally Posted by Don Scott View Post
    Rich,

    I would be interested in knowing details of the glass fibre and resin you used on the Fantail. I think I have made a big mistake in buying a big roll of 1m wide chopped strand mat. Not only that but I read that glass fibre comes in two types of binder...one for polyester based resin and the other for epoxy. Anyway, I ordered the stuff that is 'powder' bound which can be broken down by the epoxy resin (I use West System) but could not get the glass to lie down. Consequently, I have made a bit of a mess of the centreboard box interior. I ordered the 'powder bound' glass but I feel that I have received the other stuff which has a binder that can only be broken down by polyester resin...something to do with styrene I believe. I would be glad to hear any advice on this subject.

    I have done my 3D lofting (not recommended) i.e. lofting in the round by using batons to prove the lines of temporary MDF frames. Next step is to cut out the ribs that would correspond with the hackmatack odd numbered ones in the full size boat (that's about half of the 27 frames). These are made by using the MDF frames as patterns from two thicknesses of 6mm builders ply bonded together with epoxy and screwed to the MDF. The MDF frames are then cut down by a half inch all round so that they don't get accidentally bonded to the ply ribs or the western red cedar strips when being glued in place. When the boat is turned right way up, an additional set of lighter ribs (Ash) will be laid between the ply ones. I will endeavour to post photographs that will better explain my methods (well, I did say that my methods might not be to everyone's taste). This build is more of a one off exercise rather than trying to instil my unconventional ideas.


    For those of you who like numbers I have been working out the cost of producing 3/4" x 1/4" coved & beaded strip (Western Red Cedar). I have already explained that I bought 42 planks (lengths of 9, 10 and 11 feet) which were 70mm x 20mm.
    Each plank makes 9 strips. I am beading and coving them myself (tedious!) and the game works out at 10p per foot...that's about 8 cents a foot in US dollars. I don't know how good or bad that is compared with ready made stuff.
    I, and most others who build strip planked hulls, use 6 oz. fiberglass cloth and epoxy resin (I also use WEST resin). That chopped mat is for really big projects or for building a boat totally of fiberglass.
    I thought of the bead and cove, but many here on the Forum prefer square stock. The little gaps are easily filled in before glassing. Doing bead and cove certainly gives you an easier hull to fair.
    A couple of hints. First, use woodglue (Titebond II) to glue the strips together. Gorilla glue stinks for this application. Epoxy is overkill and is hard to clean up/sand. The glue is only there to hold the boat together until you glass the boat. All your strength comes form the glass and epoxy. Remember to cover all the edges of your molds with packing tape so you don't glue the boat to the mold!
    I was born on a wooden boat that I built myself.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Don, great to see you back at it. Your melonseed building thread was a big help while I was building mine. I'll be checking in to see how Lorelei is coming along.
    Steve B
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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    This looks like a wonderful catboat, and you'll have a distinctive boat to sail when it's done. I look forward to your progress.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Rich, John, Steve, Slacko...thanks for posting to this thread and showing the interest. Steve, I had a good look at your build and was enthralled by it all. I didn't know that I had been included in the 'halls of fame' in that list of past Melonseed builders.

    Rich, I am pleased that you mentioned the fact that you strip build with wood glue (Titebond II). I had already found in my readings on the subject that it wasn't a good idea to use epoxy because of the difficulties of clean up. I have already started the preliminary strip lay up using an Evostik variant and it does the job well with a very short grab time. I take your advice on the idea of using chopped strand mat which will have to be put to some other use. Of course, the 6oz woven glass will not need to have been impregnated with a binder to keep it together...the weave does that for you. Anyway, it looks like I will have to get my wallet out on this one.


    My method of build has loaned itself to a very tidy way of keeping the strip in place whilst it sets. First of all, my build is done with coving uppermost which creates the perfect channel to run a bead of wood glue the length of the strip without it dripping all over the place. I have read in a few cases where it is suggested that the strip should be applied with bead uppermost, for whatever reason...perhaps to limit damage on the otherwise exposed coving edges. Anyway, to tighten the joints between strips as they are applied I have made a series of 2" offcuts from scrap strip. These are lightly hammered down at the frames and then pinned to the frames. I don't suppose for a minute that I have come up with something new here but, the bonus is that you don't have to get a single pin hole in that beautiful Western Red Cedar. I made a bit of a mess of things in this respect when applying the decking to the Melonseed...pin holes everywhere. Also the slim finished ply ribs allow for a small clamp to be applied so as to keep the strips firmly against the ribs.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    After fairing all the frames I have started to puzzle out how to construct the centre board housing and the skeg...all held together with screws at the moment until I figure things out how to bind them together permanently. Judging only by the photographs I have been privileged to see (I have nothing else to help), there doesn't seem to be any really solid connection between the stem and the stern. Looks like my 'keel' is going to end up in five sections. The trouble is that I have had to build chunky at the front end because there is no connection between the front centre board top housing and nearest cross beam which might have helped to stop the mast from screwing the bows off the boat in a keen breeze...if you see what I mean?

    Last edited by Don Scott; 07-20-2017 at 04:44 AM.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Quote Originally Posted by Don Scott View Post
    After fairing all the frames I have started the puzzle out how to construct the centre board housing and the skeg...all held together with screws at the moment until I figure things out how to bind them together permanently. Judging only by the photographs I have been privileged to see (I have nothing else to help), there doesn't seem to be any really solid connection between the stem and the stern.
    The boat that you are copying


    has a solid keel carved to form a hollow garboard, onto which the skeg is bolted. You can see the form of it in the body plan.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Hello again, Nick. I think we have jumped through this hoop once before when I was building the model to sort a few problems out. Strength and structure didn't matter too much on the model but I need to get it right on the big one if for nothing else but safeties sake. You will see from the photograph below that I have made the keel bomb proof at the front end between the stem and the leading edge of the centre board trunk. That was easy enough as the photographs of the original made pretty clear how things go together in that area. I understand what you say about the clues in the line drawing but I will not be carving a garboard out of solid material...it's a bit late for that anyway. To tie in the sections I propose to build up the area in question with a series of sandwiched ply lengths stretching right from the transom to just forward of the centre board trunk which will then be contoured to fair with the bottom of the boat. You'll just have to wait and see how things develop because apart from the forgoing I am making up a lot of my method on the hoof , so to speak...trust me! I know that I am doing a few things that Gil smith wouldn't approve of but, we'll still get there in the end and I feel sure he will be proud of me. Don't forget that this is just an experimental journey for me where the satisfaction of creating such a beautiful craft, far outweighs the cost of building it.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    A bit of overkill here at the sharp end but it follows what can be seen in the photographs I have seen. I am still waiting for a gentleman called Tom to come to my rescue with his series of photographs taken at LIMM, West Sayville, New York.

    Last edited by Don Scott; 07-20-2017 at 04:50 AM.

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    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    I was discussing a thick keel, creating the form of a hollow garboard, not a thick garboard as was often used on big sailing vessels.
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Scott View Post
    To tie in the sections I propose to build up the area in question with a series of sandwiched ply lengths stretching right from the transom to just forward of the centre board trunk which will then be contoured to fair with the bottom of the boat.
    I was thinking along those lines myself, a big wood reinforced epoxy fillet tying the skeg into the strip planked bottom. Need to be careful of the final shaping, but will do the job. Rather than using ply, why not use your planking stock, shaped on the bench before gluing into place?
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  30. #30
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Red Hook, NY
    Posts
    86

    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Those are some sweet lines Mr. Scott. I look forward to watching your progress.

  31. #31
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    21,981

    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    The difficulty with centerboarders is making sure they don't develop a hinge at the ends of the CB. The centerboard box itself is a stiff box structure.

  32. #32
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    West Sayville, New York
    Posts
    71

    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Don I'm finally here, let me know how I may be of assistance.

  33. #33
    Join Date
    Jan 2000
    Location
    Cushing, Maine
    Posts
    3,085

    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Have you checked in with the Wooden Boatworks http://woodenboatworks.com/index.php/boats/custom run by Don Costanzo. He was one o the principals in the 1997 build of MADIGAN and has built a number of Gil Smith replicas. I think plans for MADIGAN were drawn by Dave Dillon and are now in the ships plans collection of Mystic Seaport.

    We built a replica of one of the other Gil Smith cats based on one we had in the collection when I was at Mystic, I'll be down there this coming weekend and will see if I can get a photo of the keel structure.

    The interesting part of the Gil Smith boat is that the centerboard drops through the massive keel/ skeg structure which is the boat's real backbone. I would expect to see all of that as a long beam with a slot in it.

    The support or lack of support of centerboards has come up on the UNA thread. We see a number of unsupported trunks on these old boats. I've been thinking about this and wonder whether some of it has to do with the fact that these old boards were mostly designed so that the aft corner of the board stayed in the trunk. And lots of these boats had heathy ledges for the trunk which may have been taking the load. Certainly we see this in some of the pie shaped trunks and boards.
    Last edited by Ben Fuller; 06-25-2017 at 06:36 AM.
    Ben Fuller
    Ran Tan, Liten Kuhling, Vernon Langille, Josef W., Merry Mouth, Imp, Macavity and a quiver of unamed 'yaks.
    "Bound fast is boatless man."

  34. #34
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Firbeck, Notts/South Yorks border, England
    Posts
    276

    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Ah! at last you're here Tom. You placed a good number of photographs of the original 'Lorelei' on the thread that I ran in the Design/Plans section last year. They were very useful in making the comparison between the real thing and the model hull of this catboat that I made. I was hoping that you might give me permission to use them (I have them on my computer file) from time to time for the same purpose as I develop the larger version on this thread. I never approached the officials/trustees of LIMM when I built the model because I was lead to believe that there were no existing plans for that specific boat in existence. I didn't and don't really feel justified in asking for any approval to build, simply because my current build is not a very serious or professional attempt at building the replica. However, you came on the scene with photographs and measurements of the full size boat that made it just possible for me to have a go.

    So, even though I am not officially in contact with the museum authority, I do hope that this thread will lend itself to some positive publicity in terms of awareness/visitor numbers, etc. for the Long Island Maritime Museum, West Sayville, New York and I do not mean that in any smug sort of way.

    Coming back to the point, Tom, if you give me permission for use (with acknowledgement of course) those photographs where they lend themselves to comparison then I will be very pleased. Otherwise, you could just feed them into your posts at any point you feel is appropriate. Either way would be fine.

  35. #35
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Firbeck, Notts/South Yorks border, England
    Posts
    276

    Default Re: Gil Smith catboat "Lorelei"

    Sorry I missed you there, Ben, we must have been beavering away at the keyboard at the same time and you have come up with some interesting suggestions which I will take on board. I have to reiterate my words in the above post about the quality of my build and just quote an appropriate saying, the source of which I have long forgotten... "Badly built boats are not entirely useless, even the worst of them can serve as horrible examples."

    You will have to take my boat build with a pinch of salt...or maybe a tot of whiskey!

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