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Thread: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

  1. #1
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    Default 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    Have a 12 volt-10 amp battery charger. Was told that 4 amp is ideal, also been told that the more amps the better.
    What say you?

    Planes, easy to remove wood parts. Also have an axe and a shovel to derust. will the "stuff" turn the wood to mush or will it be safe?
    basil

  2. #2
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    That's a good question. I am inclined to think that for the amount of time involved, the wood will be fine. You could always run a simple test with some scrap wood.
    There is nothing quite as permanent as a good temporary repair.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    My preference is a bucket of 1 part molasses, 2 parts water, with the metal parts suspended by a string. I leave things in for 2 weeks, wash clean and oil.I just derusted my Stanley sliding square that had been left where rain blew in. It's perfectly clean now.
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
    Grateful Dead

  4. #4
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    I've never heard of this before. Exactly how does it work? Do you attach one pole of the battery charger to the rusty item, then attach the other pole to the liguid, and suspend the rusty item in the liquid? If so, do you attach positive or negative to the rusty item or does it matter?

  5. #5
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    It matters.
    If you get + & - leads crossed you'll get a very rusty tool and a very clean piece of rebar.

    Google: Rust removal with electrolysis.
    Lots of stuff will come up.
    basil

  6. #6
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    What is molasse? Thé french traduction is "mélasse" which is a sort of sugar sirup.
    For electrolysis i'd rather use a salt mixture. And wich pole on the metal to derust? + or - ?
    And which metal on the other pole?
    I have quite a bunch of tools to derust and I am very interrested in this method.
    Gerard.
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  7. #7
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rapelapente View Post
    What is molasse? Thé french traduction is "mélasse" which is a sort of sugar sirup.
    For electrolysis i'd rather use a salt mixture. And wich pole on the metal to derust? + or - ?
    And which metal on the other pole?
    I have quite a bunch of tools to derust and I am very interrested in this method.
    I use washing soda (detergent)
    Positive is connected to your sacrificial anode - rebar, any cheap steal - remember it works best line of sight, so can be useful to bend the anode in a circle
    Negative is connected to the cathode you want to remove the rust from.
    the process produces hydrogen gas, be careful

  8. #8
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    Molasses is an unrefined heavy sugar syrup, part of the sugar making process. I live in sugar cane growing country so the stuff is cheap and available from animal feed suppliers. In other places it's likely available from health food shops . Probably expensive but remarkably useful for getting rid of rust.

    A pint of molasses would make up 3 pints of solution, sufficient to cover most hand tools. It's reusable for a long time too and not toxic to dispose of.
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  9. #9
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    i have been using el-cheapo vinegar to soak the rust off tools

    the vinegar can be reused for a while

    the results are quite good

    this fencing tool had a lot of rust on it



    the vinegar even cleaned up the detail



    and got it out of the teeth



    on another forum there has been some talk about using electrolysis and the folks are claiming good results w/ this system





    and here is another look at the same system



    i haven't tried 'em butt the reports are positive

    GOOD LUCK

    sw
    "we are the people, our parents warned us about" (jb)

    steve

  10. #10
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    The interesting thing is that the battery charger method will not attack paint.
    The paint stays and the rust goes.

    How fast does it start rusting again? I was told quite quickly, if you don't coat with oil or something.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    Got it !
    I'm gonna give it a try soon! ��
    Gerard.
    SCHOONER FOR EVER, GOELETTE A PERPETE

    http://www.schooner-anthea.com

  12. #12
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    I cleaned 6 stanley planes and several chisels using the battery charger electrolysis method and it worked very well. I used a cheap stainless steel tray as the anode. I understand that surface pitting can happen if the process is allowed to go too long. Just monitor the progress daily and stop when the tool is clean. And yes, cleaned surfaces will re-rust right before your eyes, but the rust is easily removed with fine sandpaper.

    What's so funny about peace love & understanding?

  13. #13
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    I had a situation where I wanted to remove the rust, then go "directly" to a bluing operation for long term rust resistance.
    Haven't found a bluing method for home use.

    Anyone know how to do it?

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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    Not sure if this will help, Brownell's (gun smithing supplies) has chemicals and instructions available:

    Supplies: http://www.brownells.com/search/inde...cals&ksubmit=y

    How to: http://www.brownells.com/GunTech/index.htm?k=bluing

    You may have to purchase instructions, otherwise, your library is a good source.

  15. #15
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    The Brownell's stuff that Wlitcsh mentions in the above post was mentioned in a blueing post by Bob Smalser way back when. I've expect it's still here.
    Last edited by goodbasil; 04-20-2017 at 05:57 PM.
    basil

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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    Guess I'd have to buy the booklet.
    Brownell's First step bluing kit was ~$1000.

    Perhaps that's why I didn't pursue it.

    I had a bookmark for Smalser, I'll see what I can find.

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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    I know that to set up for hot bluing is expensive, and not cost effective for a one off. Did you see the "Oxpho-Blue", it appears to be a cold bluing solution that is available in small quantities, doesn't require a stainless tank, burner etc? I think there's also at least one other "cold blue" that may be worth a look.

    Good Luck

    Bill

  18. #18
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    Thanks for the info.
    I think I'll try on something not so precious.

    My brother in law tried with something on the end of the barrel of a .22.
    Didn't work at all.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    Here's a small boat engine crankshaft that I did in molasses. i coated the bearing surfaces with grease. The rust was removed nicely



    The other parts were all well rusted too, before a dunk in the molasses.

    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

    I'd rather look back at my life and say "I can't believe I did that" instead of being there saying "I wish I'd done that"

  20. #20
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    Quote Originally Posted by swoody126 View Post

    i haven't tried 'em butt the reports are positive

    GOOD LUCK

    sw
    I use similar to #1 but with scrap steel rod, not bought rebar, and an old laptop powersupply .

  21. #21
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    Quote Originally Posted by upchurchmr View Post
    I had a situation where I wanted to remove the rust, then go "directly" to a bluing operation for long term rust resistance.
    Haven't found a bluing method for home use.

    Anyone know how to do it?
    Classic old timer hot bluing

    3 parts Nitric Acid
    2 parts Hydrochloric acid

    In this you dissolve iron nails (horseshoe nails) until the solution is saturated.

    Mix with destilled water in a 1:5 ratio

    Degrease object thoroughly and coat lightly with the bluing solution, place the object somewhere warm and moist for 24h.

    Boil it to fixate the rust and polish off the black oxide with fine steel wool, repeat until desired colour, then boil it again in a soda solution to neutralize the acids.
    A final polish and then a final boil in clean water, let dry and oil it regulary for a few days. Don't spare the oil

    The bluing solution will last for a looong time, probably for generations to come
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  22. #22
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Bigfella View Post
    Here's a small boat engine crankshaft that I did in molasses. i coated the bearing surfaces with grease. The rust was removed nicely



    The other parts were all well rusted too, before a dunk in the molasses.


    ok,..... I have te ask,... what is the engine????? Looks like fun.

  23. #23
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    Quote Originally Posted by nedL View Post
    ok,..... I have te ask,... what is the engine????? Looks like fun.
    It's a 3.5hp Blaxland or Chapman Pup that I bought as a fixer-up.

    It's the same as this one that I also have, except this one is an extremely rare bronze cast version (they made 20 of these in the 1930's - I'm not aware of where any of the others are).



    This is the one that I dropped into the molasses to remove the rust from

    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

    I'd rather look back at my life and say "I can't believe I did that" instead of being there saying "I wish I'd done that"

  24. #24
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    Ryden,

    Do you know if there is anything special about horseshoe nails?
    Will any steel nails or other do?

  25. #25
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    Quote Originally Posted by upchurchmr View Post
    Guess I'd have to buy the booklet.
    Brownell's First step bluing kit was ~$1000.

    Perhaps that's why I didn't pursue it.

    I had a bookmark for Smalser, I'll see what I can find.
    $1000? That seems to be about $930 more than the kit here:
    http://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-to...cals/index.htm

    10 amps for larger parts. http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/s...d.php?t=154196
    The 1942 Metals Handbook has a process; heat to dull red and treat with superheated steam at 60-100 psi. The process was called barffing. The meaning of the word seems to have changed over the years. As long as I am hijacking I might as well ask; when they make molasses, what do they do with the rest of the mole?
    Last edited by MN Dave; 04-22-2017 at 02:22 AM.
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  26. #26
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Bigfella View Post
    It's a 3.5hp Blaxland or Chapman Pup that I bought as a fixer-up.

    It's the same as this one that I also have, except this one is an extremely rare bronze cast version (they made 20 of these in the 1930's - I'm not aware of where any of the others are).



    This is the one that I dropped into the molasses to remove the rust from

    hey Bigfella,

    whata surprise to check into this forum and see your post

    i have been in Franklin, La @ the BAYOU TECHE WOODEN BOAT FESTIVAL this week and there about a 1/2 doz PUTT-PUTT BOATS on display that sport similar engines, most in running order



    the PUTT-PUTTS were used in the logging industry in south Lousiana many years ago to pull cypress logs out of the swamps and pull rafts of cypress logs to the mills along the bayous

    there were several designs used

    the bateau(flat nosed)



    and the skiff(pointy nose)



    all using the old cast iron engines simiar to the one you pictured they run on a TOTAL LOSS SYSTEM and the speed and direction are controlled w/ the lever on the brass spark shaft(sorry i don't know the correct term)

    some singles



    some twins



    the original boats were made of cypress though some of the really old ones have marine plywood bottoms replacing the old plank ones

    enjoy your engines

    sw
    "we are the people, our parents warned us about" (jb)

    steve

  27. #27
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    Default Re: 2 ?'S. Rust removal by electrolysis.

    Quote Originally Posted by upchurchmr View Post
    Ryden,

    Do you know if there is anything special about horseshoe nails?
    Will any steel nails or other do?
    I believe that horseshoe nails are soft iron, or more accurately, were soft iron. Dunno about today.

    I think that the purpose of specifically calling for these nails was that you didn't want an alloyed steel but as pure iron as you could get.
    Just speculating, but i think that any trace metals might change the colour of the bluing.

    Mild steel (only low carbon alloy) should probably work
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