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Thread: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

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    Default 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    Wen, Rikon, Baldor ($) Anyone have any recent experience or recommendations?

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    Wen & Rikon... thru the years, as brands not so good. No experience with their grinders specifically. Fine Woodworking and such magazines do periodic comparison tests that I always look up when I don't have a specific tool/model in mind. The pick a Best Overall, and Best Value as well.
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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    For sharpening tools?

    I have two, waste of time in my opinion. I've a standard bench grinder, 1250 rpm, with an 8 inch Kinik 140 grit soft white alox wheel. It cuts quickly without heating the workpiece much, leaves a nice fine finish that only needs a couple of wipes on the waterstone and a swipe on the green paste strop to get a shaving edge.

    John Welsford
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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    Abbott and Ashby, not sure if they do one at a speed that suits your requirements....
    Larks

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    Quote Originally Posted by john welsford View Post
    For sharpening tools?

    I have two, waste of time in my opinion. I've a standard bench grinder, 1250 rpm, with an 8 inch Kinik 140 grit soft white alox wheel. It cuts quickly without heating the workpiece much, leaves a nice fine finish that only needs a couple of wipes on the waterstone and a swipe on the green paste strop to get a shaving edge.

    John Welsford
    Agree John. 1250 RPM is a puzzle though.
    Tom L

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    Conventional wisdom seems to be that the tool rest is the determining factor. Most are crappy and you end up having to mount after-market rests on them. Beyond that, it's pretty much six of one and half dozen of the other. The rest of the machine is just a motor with wheels on the arbors.

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    I got the 10" Grizzly "Tormek clone"- I think they also have an 8" model; slow speed, water bath. It works ok, but I only use grinders to shape blades that are excessively worn, or damaged etc. Actual sharpening I do on water stones. I'm talking about plane irons, chisels, etc.
    regards
    pvg

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    1250 RPM is a puzzle though.
    Maybe a 50 Hz thing? Although that is slow for a 4 pole motor, and too fast for a 6 pole. I would expect more like 1450 rpm, unless the motor is extremely inefficient, or there are belts or gears involved.

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    I have a Tormek low speed wet grinder I use for times when a tool is damaged to the point of needed more than a hone on a stone.
    Great machine and will handle darn near anything that needs an edge ground, accurately. The only draw back is the price. I did bite the bullet and do not regret it. The machine I have saves a lot of time and does justify its price. Maybe the Grizzly is a better price choice if it works as well as the Tormex.
    Jay
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    http://www.gosale.com/5831994/grizzl...FZFafgodqCsAFA

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    I have a Wen 8" low speed bench grinder. It came with 2 wheels that were so badly warped they are unusable. I replaced them with an 80 grit white wheel and a 100 grit cbn wheel. It keeps my turning tools sharp and is fairly forgiving for a novice sharpener like me.

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Greer View Post
    I have a Tormek low speed wet grinder I use for times when a tool is damaged to the point of needed more than a hone on a stone.
    Great machine and will handle darn near anything that needs an edge ground, accurately. The only draw back is the price. I did bite the bullet and do not regret it. The machine I have saves a lot of time and does justify its price. Maybe the Grizzly is a better price choice if it works as well as the Tormex.
    Jay
    https://www.sharpeningsupplies.com/T...FZCcfgodpigBRg
    http://www.gosale.com/5831994/grizzl...FZFafgodqCsAFA
    Wow - the Grizzly isn't much more than a Home Depot regular old grinder.
    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    2X....Good for rough work, but never for final sharpening/honing.

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    Quote Originally Posted by john welsford View Post
    I've a standard bench grinder, 1250 rpm, with an 8 inch Kinik 140 grit soft white alox wheel. It cuts quickly without heating the workpiece much
    that's what I'm looking to buy for shaping blades/cutters. The "slow speed" Rikon/JET is 1750-1800 rpm vs. 3450-3600 rpm or so for most of the "standard" metal working bench grinders/cheap ones from home depot.

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    Maybe some basic information about motor speed is in order. Some often wonder why a slow speed motor costs more than a high speed one. AC induction motors in the USA operate on 60HZ but often 50HZ in several other countries. The most simple motor is a 2 pole one that makes the current rotate around the coils at 3600 RPM. Theoretical speed is always a multiple of the AC current in HZ, so motors run slower at 50 HZ. If there were no losses due to friction or output load, the speed of a 2 pole motor operating on 60HZ would be 3600 RPM. Nothing is so perfect, so the actual no load speed will be less or in the neighborhood of 3450 RPM. Doubling the number of poles to 4, results in a rotating current speed of about 3450/2 or 1725 RPM. Adding two more poles makes the speed 3450/3 or about 1120 RPM. More poles added follow the same reasoning and some overhead fans may have lots of poles.

    Loading the motor shaft will slow the motor down (called slip) and one result will be increased current proportional to the slip to handle the increased load until the motor stops and the very high current burns the thing up. This also explains why starting current is much higher than running current. There is more to that than I stated but it gets complicated. Some low life manufacturers use the starting (peak) current to make their motors sound more powerful but it is a lie and a major distraction to the uninformed.

    Anyway John's 1250RPM may be a typo or my ignorance of how electrons behave down under.
    Last edited by Tom Lathrop; 04-07-2017 at 09:58 PM.
    Tom L

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Lathrop View Post
    Agree John. 1250 RPM is a puzzle though.
    Thats what it says on the motor label, its a cheapie double ended grinder I picked up somewhere, it has a brass wire buff on the other end.
    I've no idea whats inside the motor casing but dont think that the rpm is very important. I do think that my home made tool rest is though, its 150mm long, made of 20 x 6mm bar with the "rest" edge milled dead straight and polished.

    John Welsford
    An expert is but a beginner with experience.

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    Quote Originally Posted by john welsford View Post
    Thats what it says on the motor label, its a cheapie double ended grinder I picked up somewhere, it has a brass wire buff on the other end.
    I've no idea whats inside the motor casing but dont think that the rpm is very important. I do think that my home made tool rest is though, its 150mm long, made of 20 x 6mm bar with the "rest" edge milled dead straight and polished.

    John Welsford
    Like many things in tool world, the user is a big part of the equation. Some years ago a couple of Graham Byrnes's students asked me what he might like for a present. I suggested an 8" slow speed grinder since I knew he didn't have one. He didn't like it and prefers the high speed burners. Maybe just another difference between Aus and NZ? Mine is a relatively cheap 8" 1740 RPM unit with one coarse carbo wheel and one al-oxide medium grit. Not very powerful but maybe that is a good thing. I made a jig for grinding planer and jointer blades that works so well, my friends now have good edges on theirs. I do some things that should not be done with a grinder but get away with it, mostly.

    I have no idea how the 1250 RPM is arrived at on a simple induction motor.
    Tom L

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    Just a note on the rotational speed of the Tormex grinder. It runs in a water bath at 90 RPM. The Grizzly is a water bath as well but turns a bit faster at 110RPM.
    Jay

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    I have the 10" Grizzly unit. I don't like the guide, but I can live with it for the price.
    I follow it with a stone and the buffing wheel.
    Last edited by JimConlin; 04-13-2017 at 02:03 PM.

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    I now use a variable speed grinder; Delta. I bought it at one of the big boxes. I used to use a high speed grinder that was less than smooth. This one is nicer. The tool rest is shop made specifically for lathe tools. It also works for other things: chisels, plane irons, etc. The wheel is quite course. Something on the order of 60 grit. The idea is to cut fast and allow the wheel to wear away easily to constantly expose fresh abrasive. I'm cautious with this, of course, but I've never ruined a tool by overheating. I've maintained my tools for over thirty years this way.

    The other wheel is felt, charged with a grey compound. It was mounted to quickly hone lathe tools. I don't use it on chisels or plane irons as a rule.

    Jeff


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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    I wouldn't get hung on the accuracy of a specs on a label on a cheap motor. Not sure about NZ, but in Australia, most single phase motors seem to be fast or slow, approx 2800 or 1400, plus or minus 50. I seem to end up using the grey wheels on a high speed grinder, cause I'm in a hurry for no good reason. I tend to use the side of the wheel near the hub, short time on wheel plus prolonged water dip between each grind, soon as there is a feather edge, then a quick hone with 240 or 320 white frecut paper on a flat surface, little on the back, most on the bevel. Strop on the palm of hand Carefully! Plus a strop on some clean softwood, good for general woodwork, woodcarving chisels more involved process. Point of what I'm trying to say is, not so much what is done but how it is done. I think there is a lot overthinking sometimes in the pursuit for perfection, learn to recognise good enough.
    the invisible man........

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    The Tormek is certainly a better machine than the Grizzly, but costs 3 or 4 times as much. The Grizzly is adequate for my needs and (social security) budget. I find I can get pretty good performance from "fair-to-middlin" machine tools by spending some time tweaking them, and spend my limited $$ on high quality hand tools
    regards
    pvg

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Lathrop View Post
    Like many things in tool world, the user is a big part of the equation. Some years ago a couple of Graham Byrnes's students asked me what he might like for a present. I suggested an 8" slow speed grinder since I knew he didn't have one. He didn't like it and prefers the high speed burners. Maybe just another difference between Aus and NZ? Mine is a relatively cheap 8" 1740 RPM unit with one coarse carbo wheel and one al-oxide medium grit. Not very powerful but maybe that is a good thing. I made a jig for grinding planer and jointer blades that works so well, my friends now have good edges on theirs. I do some things that should not be done with a grinder but get away with it, mostly.

    I have no idea how the 1250 RPM is arrived at on a simple induction motor.
    I do tend to think that a lot of people read too many magazines, ( apart from WoodenBoat of course, ) which promulgate the idea that the only way to do something is the way they say.
    That happens in the cruising boat mags which say you have to have a half million dollar boat infested with all the latest electronics and sail it in company with others on an "organised" cruise, or in the case of some woodworking magazines they'll tell one that only certain methods of grinding a chisel will work, and that at certain rpms on a grinder that runs water blessed by the local bishop over the edge while grinding.
    I find that I can do a decent job with a high speed grinder using one of those horrible grey wheels that come with them, it takes care and practice but it can be done. I much prefer though a finer grit and a soft wheel. My straight knife grinder has a 120 grit red alox wheel on it, that works really well, the one I use on tools is slightly finer and is on a slower speed grinder, that is really good to use.
    My horizontal wheel low speed wet grinder would drive me to distraction if I used it much, working on plywood boats I find that I'm sharpening chisels and planes several times a day, and my motto is "shaving sharp in 3 minutes". I'm out in the shop to build a boat not mess around for hours sharpening things.

    That said, a couple of years ago I counted up and found that between chisels, shaves, planes and drawknives I had 42 steel bodied edge tools, and every now and again I'll set up a production line, grinder, coarse waterstone, fine waterstone, slip stones for the gouges and scorps, strop with green paste, and reassembly area, and spend half a day going through the lot.
    I've a lot more tools now, dont dare count them.


    John Welsford
    An expert is but a beginner with experience.

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    I have found that Im putting off sharpening edge tool ( Im afraid to count them...) lately because the arthritis makes my fingers cramp up running the blades over the oilstones.
    I went out and spent 200 bucks on the Workshop 3000. Let me say right off the bat I am not a gadget guy and if youve read any of my posts you know Im a cranky old school hand tool proponent. BUT.....I gottta say this thing is worth every penny.
    Takes about ten minutes to set up and get to work. I grabbed six of the beater chisels off the peg board over the bench; my cabinet chisels are in boxes in drawers, and set to sharpening them. Two of them were in pretty sad shape, the others just needed a tune up.
    Thirty minutes later all six were hair shaving sharp.
    No oil, no water, no mess, just quick and simple and with enviable results.
    My tired old digits were more than pleased as well...
    After I run all the block plane irons through it and the hand plane irons that will fit I will decide whether to spring for the wide blade attachment.
    I can definitely see keeping this thing on the bench mid project while dovetailing drawer sides for just a quick lick.

    My two cents worth...

  24. #24
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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    15 years ago I bought a Toromek.
    The early model had plain steel arbor - it rusted and expanded so much that it would stop the wheel.
    Toromek provided a newer stainless arbor and I have not had an issue since.
    I also bought most of the "adapters" for different sharpening tasks.
    Most have inadequate fine adjustment capability, so I set it up, grind to see the position on the edge, adjust, look at the grind, etc, until I get what I want.
    The planer knife tool is almost useless.

    Still for chisels/ knives/ hand plane blades I really like it.

    But once I get an edge, I use a diamond strop tool to touch up the edge, probably 3-4 times before going back to the Toromek.

    I sure did spend a lot on the separate tools which I only use 2 or 3 of.

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    I did a long term review of the tormek T7 spanning some years. It's posted here;

    http://www.woodworkforums.com/f171/t...essions-116841

  26. #26
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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    Quote Originally Posted by willin woodworks View Post
    I have found that Im putting off sharpening edge tool ( Im afraid to count them...) lately because the arthritis makes my fingers cramp up running the blades over the oilstones.
    I went out and spent 200 bucks on the Workshop 3000. Let me say right off the bat I am not a gadget guy and if youve read any of my posts you know Im a cranky old school hand tool proponent. BUT.....I gottta say this thing is worth every penny.
    Takes about ten minutes to set up and get to work. I grabbed six of the beater chisels off the peg board over the bench; my cabinet chisels are in boxes in drawers, and set to sharpening them. Two of them were in pretty sad shape, the others just needed a tune up.
    Thirty minutes later all six were hair shaving sharp.
    No oil, no water, no mess, just quick and simple and with enviable results.
    My tired old digits were more than pleased as well...
    After I run all the block plane irons through it and the hand plane irons that will fit I will decide whether to spring for the wide blade attachment.
    I can definitely see keeping this thing on the bench mid project while dovetailing drawer sides for just a quick lick.

    My two cents worth...
    You mean Work Sharp?


  27. #27
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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    Search yard sales and second hand shops for a belt driven grinder. You can slow them way down with pulley diameter changes.
    The best helping hand you will ever receive is the one at the end of your own arm.

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    Default Re: 8" Low-speed Benchtop Grinder reccomendations

    Quote Originally Posted by oznabrag View Post
    You mean Work Sharp?

    yyp
    Yup. Ididnt get the knife sharpening rig, just the tool sharpener.
    Have sharpened damn near every blade in the shop and am quite pleased with the results.

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