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Thread: "True" vs. "False" in law

  1. #1
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    Default "True" vs. "False" in law

    1. I shoot a guy. I claim he was going to kill me, though I had no reason to think that. Later it is found that he was. Is my claim valid?

    2. I apply for a loan. On the application, I list as an asset an inheritance I haven't received. Later I receive it. Have I defrauded the lender?

    3. I am a witness under oath. I say I saw the car go through the intersection, though I couldn't have. Other witnesses say the car went through the intersection. Have I committed perjury?

    Am I bailed out of any false statement you can describe by what I learn after I make it?
    He's a Mexican. -- Donald Trump.
    America cannot survive another four years of Barack Obama. -- Governor Chris Christie (R) New Jersey
    It wasn't racism, it was an attack on Christianity. -- Fox News
    The Lord was not pleased with what was happening to the Hammonds. -- Ammon Bundy

  2. #2
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    Default Re: "True" vs. "False" in law

    These scenarios all presuppose that facts have anything to do with a good case.

    Kevin
    There are two kinds of boaters: those who have run aground, and those who lie about it.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: "True" vs. "False" in law

    A lie is a lie regardless of what happens later.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: "True" vs. "False" in law

    It's a trick!

    The first three questions aren't true or false answers!

  5. #5
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    Default Re: "True" vs. "False" in law

    1. You got lucky.

    2. You're probably lucky.

    3. You're lucky there were other witnesses and that thus your perjury is unlikely to be exposed.

    None of these seems likely to lead to a charge of perjury even though your relationship to truth appears accidental at best.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: "True" vs. "False" in law

    What Ian said.

    I especially like "though your relationship to truth appears accidental at best"
    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

  7. #7
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    Default Re: "True" vs. "False" in law

    The answer to your final question is No

  8. #8
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    Default Re: "True" vs. "False" in law

    Quote Originally Posted by CWSmith View Post
    A lie is a lie regardless of what happens later.
    It's a matter of what you knew when you spoke, right?

    Otherwise you could shoot people, defraud and lie, hoping that something would turn up.

    So the idea that someone is going to find something to bail you out isn't something to be investigated, it's something to be dismissed out of hand, right?
    He's a Mexican. -- Donald Trump.
    America cannot survive another four years of Barack Obama. -- Governor Chris Christie (R) New Jersey
    It wasn't racism, it was an attack on Christianity. -- Fox News
    The Lord was not pleased with what was happening to the Hammonds. -- Ammon Bundy

  9. #9
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    Default Re: "True" vs. "False" in law

    Quote Originally Posted by Osborne Russell View Post
    It's a matter of what you knew when you spoke, right?

    Otherwise you could shoot people, defraud and lie, hoping that something would turn up.

    So the idea that someone is going to find something to bail you out isn't something to be investigated, it's something to be dismissed out of hand, right?
    Intent matters. Truth matters. The phrase "I saw..." isn't made right by someone else later.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: "True" vs. "False" in law

    Quote Originally Posted by CWSmith View Post
    Intent matters. Truth matters.
    What is your intent when you say something is true that you don't know to be true, in order to gain by it?

    Quote Originally Posted by CWSmith View Post
    The phrase "I saw..." isn't made right by someone else later.
    How about the phrase "Obama wiretapped . . ."?
    He's a Mexican. -- Donald Trump.
    America cannot survive another four years of Barack Obama. -- Governor Chris Christie (R) New Jersey
    It wasn't racism, it was an attack on Christianity. -- Fox News
    The Lord was not pleased with what was happening to the Hammonds. -- Ammon Bundy

  11. #11
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    Default Re: "True" vs. "False" in law

    Quote Originally Posted by Osborne Russell View Post
    What is your intent when you say something is true that you don't know to be true, in order to gain by it?
    I think you answered your own question.

    Someday I want to hear a parent tell their child, "You can lie if it gets you what you want." At least then they will be teaching their true values.

    How about the phrase "Obama wiretapped . . ."?
    Distraction? Dilution? Isn't that the biggest problem in our society today? Honesty is the first casualty when the ends justify the means.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: "True" vs. "False" in law

    March 16, 2017

    QUESTION: So, Sean, the day before yesterday, you said you were extremely confident that the House and Senate Intelligence Committees would ultimately vindicate the president's allegation that Trump Tower was wiretapped.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.89259cdb3388
    Ultimate vindication is irrelevant. There is nothing for anyone to investigate. The people of America know everything they need to know about whether Donald Trump is a liar as President.

    Remember when they used to speak of Ms. Clinton "misleading the American people"?
    He's a Mexican. -- Donald Trump.
    America cannot survive another four years of Barack Obama. -- Governor Chris Christie (R) New Jersey
    It wasn't racism, it was an attack on Christianity. -- Fox News
    The Lord was not pleased with what was happening to the Hammonds. -- Ammon Bundy

  13. #13
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    Default Re: "True" vs. "False" in law

    Just go into politics, the law and stockbroking, you have all the principles necessary.

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