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Thread: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

  1. #1
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    Default Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    Anyone noticed that the "big" threads have dried up over the years, I may be wrong but most of the forum seems to be about ply and epoxy trailerables or small repairs. Are people not coming here or have the restorations dried up? Perhaps its a certain kind of low budget person that hangs around on internet forums but Ive noticed that the boats are getting smaller and there is a lack of traditional work being showcased.

    Interested to hear your comments.
    whatever rocks your boat

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    You are correct. I suspect there are a lot of reasons behind that. Mostly, this kind of forum appeals to the backyard DIY'er, and that demographic lends itself to plywood and epoxy. I suspect the old traditional restorations are out there, but are less common, and less visible in this space.
    There's the plan, then there's what actually happens.

    Ben Sebens, RN

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul G. View Post
    Anyone noticed that the "big" threads have dried up over the years, I may be wrong but most of the forum seems to be about ply and epoxy trailerables or small repairs. Are people not coming here or have the restorations dried up? Perhaps its a certain kind of low budget person that hangs around on internet forums but Ive noticed that the boats are getting smaller and there is a lack of traditional work being showcased.

    Interested to hear your comments.
    I haven't been here that long so I can't comment on how it used to be, but look at Jim (Amazon), Jase (My Girl), NedL (Jersey Sea Skiff), artif (Incentive)... And I won't put Petrel into the same category as those projects but I do think she qualifies as a restoration rather than just small repairs. These may be "low budget" compared to building a 70' schooner in Vietnam or some of the other past threads I've read, but I see plenty of craftsmanship and traditional work happening.

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    Been here for quite a while, when I joined there was a lot of lively debate over methods and some very substantial well photographed threads (lets not forget that schooner thread either!) I agree that most here are backyard diy'ers but its still a shame not to see fine wooden boatbuilding work either in design, construction or repair not being at the forefront. I wont even mention the bilge inhabitants who for the most part haven't left their trailers in years .
    whatever rocks your boat

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    I agree that it would be nice to see more traditional work - new, large boat builds in particular - since that's what I enjoy as well. But that there are some really great small boat threads (the Una Project and about a million John Welsford build threads for example) happening right now. And the invention of S&G plywood/epoxy construction has opened up wooden boat building to many who might never have the time or skill to build a traditional boat.

    But I do regret that there are not more people willing and able to take on the restoration of a large plank-on-frame boat. There are so many of them being cut up right now. Thad's thread about the Tally Ho for example. And Tad Roberts recently posted on Facebook about several other boats in the same circumstance. Then just today this showed up on craigslist :



    Atkin design built in 1936. Handsome boat with a pedigree. Sunk and raised then the owner passed away. Needs someone to restore her.

    https://seattle.craigslist.org/oly/boa/6043826534.html

    She might be a pile of dry rot held together by rust or she may be worth saving - but how many people would take on the project?

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    There is also those committed builders who just want to get on with it quietly, and feel their time is much better spent in the build shed than bashing a keyboard. Big timber boats are pretty easy to pick up for little money.....but the time and costs to renovate or rebuild have gone up significantly in the last decade. Your spare time might be free, but many might be holding down 2 jobs just to make ends meet.....maybe thats where a reasonably quick and cheap ply and epoxy boat comes in?

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    Quote Originally Posted by cstevens View Post
    I haven't been here that long so I can't comment on how it used to be, but look at Jim (Amazon), Jase (My Girl), NedL (Jersey Sea Skiff), artif (Incentive)... And I won't put Petrel into the same category as those projects but I do think she qualifies as a restoration rather than just small repairs. These may be "low budget" compared to building a 70' schooner in Vietnam or some of the other past threads I've read, but I see plenty of craftsmanship and traditional work happening.
    There are indeed these & I would include yours in the group. There are also various other threads on smaller repairs being done.

    However - who has the cash nowadays to rebuild a big old boat? I used to, but then I used it to rebuild a big old boat & could not begin to consider doing it again. For example - the new screws for replacing the bottom on Neoga cost over $3,000US! No, that's not a typo & no it does not include anything but boxes (& boxes) of screws.
    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    However - who has the cash nowadays to rebuild a big old boat? I used to, but then I used it to rebuild a big old boat & could not begin to consider doing it again.
    Oh, yeah - I can relate to that for sure!

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    I have a theory. People who do glass, ply and epoxy are also reasonably adept at hosting pics on a third site, and soon enough come up with a method of getting pictures to stick here that works for them. People who use hand tools, tallow and red lead, with exceptions like Jay and a few others, are less so, and just give up.

    I have another theory, which is that it has always been thus. The good old days really weren't. Sure we had Bernadette and her beautiful schooner. And a few notable others along the way. But mostly the activity here reflects activity in the real world. Minus plastic boats.

    I have another theory. Ever since Trump came along and discussion of him has dominated the Bilge, pretty much everyone with an interest in boats of any sort has gone away.

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    I see a lot of building and repair activity on the Wooden Boat Facebook page that isn't posted here on the Forum. Some people don't want to commit to a long building thread and find Facebook a good alternative.
    I was born on a wooden boat that I built myself.

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    Discussion of Trump... you mean mass Hysterics over Trump

    I have a theory, in y2K the majority of big wooden boats were 55 years old or older, on their last legs and prime canidates/long over due for major restoration... the big old boats that got restored were restored over the past 15 years... now the average age of a big old wooden boat is 70+... the boats that were not restored are now gone, cleaned up due to rising water front property values or beyond repair at this point...

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    Ever since they eliminated metal and wood shop in many of our Hi Schools, there are fewer and fewer young people that have any interest or ability to work in the trades. My grandson has his nose buried in his electronic games and could care less about boats or boat building.
    Jay

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    I recon folks who know how to actually build a proper carvel boat do not need our help.
    Well, by "our",I do not mean me. I think carvel boats are silly.
    The few who share their build s of carvel boats are giving us a gift.
    I like to help folks,virtual help here or actual help in the world.
    I need the karma credit

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    I think it's a question of cost as well as the declining number of big boats out there. A big project is out of reach financially for most people. The very rich who want a big boat are probably more like to build new, than to restore an old boat.

    The newest production or semi-production carvel boats are close at least 45 years old. My Roughwater 35, for example, is carvel and came out of the boatyard in 1972. The following year the hulls were fiberglass
    The cure for everything is salt water - sweat, tears, or the sea
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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    All wood is good. I don't know if the desire for large wooden boats has declined or the resources for such. Even with the money and time for a big boat I wouldn't want the hassle. In everything I do I weigh the joy vs. the hassle factor. For me building and using little boats brings me joy without much hassle. I don't worry about what I'm missing out on with a big boat. I have other hobbies with high hassle factors that also bring more joy so worth it to me. Certainly I appreciate the beauty of the big well built and cared for stuff, but I'll never play with them. Don't sweat what the super ship to Bolger box thread ratio is, read a few lines to figure out what threads interest you, ignore the rest.

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    On my part I realised that time is the most important commodity, and I don't have an unlimited supply. That's why I have chosen a glass boat with a wooden interior or one of the reasons. I don't want to spend my time doing repair work but rather the far more enjoyable pastime of upgrading!
    whatever rocks your boat

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    All valid points. And it gets worse. Around 1980 I bought a 32' powerboat. Let's compare then to now. Back then, most of the marinas around here still welcomed wooden boats, and many allowed owners to work on them at the marina. That is no longer the case. At that time, even though most of the boats were glass, there were still enough wooden ones around to support the satellite businesses that make it convenient to maintain a wooden boat. We had a local shop, just a few miles from my marina, where I could go during normal business hours and buy most any kind of common boat lumber over the counter, and in sizes appropriate for boat maintenance and repair. Nowadays, I don't even know where to look for plank-length lumber of any species. Back then, silicon bronze hardware could be bought locally, and it cost less than stainless. In fact, even as late as 1999, the hardware store near my house sold bronze Reed and Prince (Frearson) flat head wood screws. They sold them by the each (from a bin) or by the box. In stock. And that wasn't even a boat place; just a well stocked old-fashioned hardware store. Nowadays, I have to order them online and wait for them to be shipped here. Back then, alkyd paints were sold everywhere including, not surprisingly, that same old-fashioned hardware store. Now I drive 25 miles each way to buy alkyd paint for my duck boats. I think I read here on the forum that Petit doesn't even make underwater seam compound anymore. It just goes on and on. Far fewer boats from which to choose a restoration candidate. Far more expense and more limited availability of materials and supplies. Far fewer places where wooden boat maintenance is allowed. All during a period of reduced disposable income. It's no surprise that fewer projects are under way.

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    It's certainly true that there are posts on the WB facebook page showing work I'd really prefer to see here with some detailed notes about what's being done. But even so, I'll bet overall there's less new construction of big traditional boats going on. Between the expense, the difficulty of finding good materials -- especially the wood -- and loss of skills how else can it be?

    But I suspect that the restoration of big old boats hasn't seen such a decline. Looking back over the years, a lot of projects were reported here -- but how many at one time?
    -Dave

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    There is a ton of marketing around selling epoxy and plywood boat plans and kits. As a result of that and the perceived skill level of traditional building being a barrier to entry, it's not a surprise that we see more ply/epoxy boat than anything else.
    -Jim

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    Quote Originally Posted by Gordon Bartlett View Post
    All valid points. And it gets worse. Around 1980 I bought a 32' powerboat. Let's compare then to now. Back then, most of the marinas around here still welcomed wooden boats, and many allowed owners to work on them at the marina. That is no longer the case. At that time, even though most of the boats were glass, there were still enough wooden ones around to support the satellite businesses that make it convenient to maintain a wooden boat. We had a local shop, just a few miles from my marina, where I could go during normal business hours and buy most any kind of common boat lumber over the counter, and in sizes appropriate for boat maintenance and repair. Nowadays, I don't even know where to look for plank-length lumber of any species. Back then, silicon bronze hardware could be bought locally, and it cost less than stainless. In fact, even as late as 1999, the hardware store near my house sold bronze Reed and Prince (Frearson) flat head wood screws. They sold them by the each (from a bin) or by the box. In stock. And that wasn't even a boat place; just a well stocked old-fashioned hardware store. Nowadays, I have to order them online and wait for them to be shipped here. Back then, alkyd paints were sold everywhere including, not surprisingly, that same old-fashioned hardware store. Now I drive 25 miles each way to buy alkyd paint for my duck boats. I think I read here on the forum that Petit doesn't even make underwater seam compound anymore. It just goes on and on. Far fewer boats from which to choose a restoration candidate. Far more expense and more limited availability of materials and supplies. Far fewer places where wooden boat maintenance is allowed. All during a period of reduced disposable income. It's no surprise that fewer projects are under way.
    True it's not as easy to walk to the corner hardware store and find materials suitable for restoring a classic wooden boat. Even here in Seattle, a mecca for these things, we have few options and have to travel or order supplies. But then you can't get parts for old cars at NAPA any more either, and that hasn't stopped the classic car hobby from flourishing.

    There is a cottage industry in bronze casting and pattern making that is well documented here on the WBF. Fasteners are still being produced, even if they have to be ordered and shipped. Wood is harder to find - true - but we have options for laminating to replace the large timbers that were available decades ago. And I don't know that there are fewer candidates. On the contrary, I think there are far more boats needing restoration than there are people willing to take them on. I see great boats show up in the ads every day just in the Seattle area, for free or very little money. It seems like every marina has a few old boats slowly going down hill and every yard has a selection of abandoned projects sitting on the hard, destined for the crusher.

    My take is that the problem is not lack of interest, or time, or money, or wood, or supplies. It's lack of space. Building or restoring a large boat takes a lot of room - room that is available to fewer and fewer people who live near the water. When I started working on Perihelion it wasn't that hard to find a place to put her that was in the city, affordable and open to DIY work. But during the time I was working on her I had to move the boat twice as the yards she was in closed down, finally ending up 30-45 minutes away from where I was living, which makes it difficult to get much done.

    Right now that yard where I had Perihelion is the only place in Seattle where I could haul Petrel out for an extended time without paying upwards of $30.00 a day, and I don't know how long that will last. Most of the people on the forum restoring larger boats have plenty of land to put up a shed and work on the boat near their house. Jim and Ned both do for example. Others, like chris-on-the-boat, artif and me, are trying to get it done in the water, but that limits what we can do and also comes with other requirements, like insurance. And the ability for the boat to float.

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul G. View Post
    Anyone noticed that the "big" threads have dried up over the years, I may be wrong but most of the forum seems to be about ply and epoxy trailerables or small repairs. Are people not coming here or have the restorations dried up? Perhaps its a certain kind of low budget person that hangs around on internet forums but Ive noticed that the boats are getting smaller and there is a lack of traditional work being showcased.

    Interested to hear your comments.

    Didya miss my thread? One fool, alone in his back yard, building a big plank-on-frame catboat out of fockin' thin air?
    Last edited by Jim Ledger; 03-15-2017 at 07:08 AM.

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    The members here who build with traditional materials and use traditional techniques are as much artists as builders. It takes literally years of study, apprenticeship, and practical experience to take on a large traditionally built boat. I greatly admire these people and aspire to be like them in the future.

    However, if a person is interested in building a boat and has never done so before, plywood and epoxy are the only reasonable way that they can build a boat that they can use in a relatively short amount of time. You can not argue the beauty of a traditionally build boat with it's flowing curves and mind bending engineering. However its an extremely intimidating project for a novice. I don't want to say impossible, but something that might take a decade or more to complete.

    I hope traditional builders do not resent the novices building with modern materials and techniques. The fundamentals of building and the principles of strength are the same for any style of build and we bring our questions to this forum for that reason.

    I would hope that the traditional members see that if the novice catches the boat building "bug" using the more manageable modern materials they will be more likely to attempt a traditional build in the future when they have better confidence in their skills. I can't help but believe that the more people involved in the boat building hobby, whether traditional or modern, helps us all collectively. More people in the hobby drives innovation and product availability while lowering prices.

    It's unfortunate when a novice poses a question on this forum and they are called ignorant. Some respond by belittling the question or casting doubt on the design and designer. Throwing the novice builder into doubt as to whether they can build their dream. This is not how it should be. I realize that the veteran member may be tired of hearing "what engine should I buy" over and over and that may lead to lashing out in frustration.

    I really hope that we as a community of boat builders would support one another. That doesn't mean sugar coating things, but certainly there is a way to get your point across without driving away the new guys. Like I said, we want to encourage people to get into the hobby, not to think that our community is a bunch of arrogant yacht snobs.

    Pardon the pun but, A rising tide raises all boats. There's room for us all and traditional builders should lead by example with their skill and their patience.
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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    When I started my rebuild in 2009 there were many "proper" building threads, which was really a very good resource. In recent months I visit the boat part of the forum with decreasing frequency due to the repetition of build threads for a design that has been discussed in detail time and time again. The cynic in me says it's part of the "look at me" culture; never felt the need spout a blow by blow account of my 7-year project - but then we're not all the same...

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    The cynic in me says it's part of the "look at me" culture; never felt the need spout a blow by blow account of my 7-year project - but then we're not all the same...
    Cynical indeed. Not to say ungenerous. There are many reasons for wanting to share one's own work even if it does not add to the body of knowledge on the forum. I, for example, do not in any way imagine that my efforts with Petrel are going to set an example for anyone else. I am learning as I go and am relying on the forum for advice and guidance, thus my participation here. And hopefully those who read my thread find some entertainment value as well. Then there is the value in receiving encouragement and support from people with a shared interest. Even a simple "nice job!" response, or commiseration on some challenge, can help keep the motivation up.

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    "Proper" boats need a place to tie up and that's getting absurdly expensive, and quite out of reach for all but the 1%, or fraction of 1%.
    A plank on frame hull won't do well living most of its existence on a trailer. That being said, I'd call clinker built a proper high skill build which can survive on a trailer.
    The rest is "the old ways are always the best." Best for then probably. Best for the resources available then, certainly (IMHO.) Anyone who saves a grand old boat/yacht,work boat deserves a few brownie points for doing good while doing well. God bless'em.
    There does seem to be quite a number of boat building schools doing rather well, and the success of WB magazine must be worth something pointing to at least a renewed appreciation of, and a longing for, skilled craft.

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    Well put scot2640.
    I had not even weighed the difficulty of getting a boatyard to deal with ones woody. That is truly a slap in the face from the establishment.

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    Since WBF started in the 90s, blogging sites have become vastly easier to use, customize and update on a schedule that suits the blogger. Unless a build mentioned here gets 'stickied' it tends to fall out of view. For example: https://maloneboatbuilding.com/present_work.html
    Last edited by rbgarr; 03-15-2017 at 05:14 PM.
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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    Jim's catboat is at this time, front and center I suspect. Though it was an epoxy build, Tenner's Turtle Bay was a stellar thread. Not traditional but still a very engaging thread. Luc's schooner in Vietnam (I hear they're about to start work on her again) was another one, not Traditional but still, a sizeable enough project that I think it fits under the OP's intent.
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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    OK, so I'll weigh in:

    Ignoring for a moment that my life changes course at a moment's notice, and carries me off into uncharted waters. This has made it very difficult to sail let alone build, but I know that soon, I can finish the Luders and start on a bigger project (to be seen here, in the future). So this leaves the question: What type of build?

    I would love to tackle, learning along the way, the construction of a large-ish carvelle boat. I have several designs in mind, but all are much larger than the Luders. What will I need?

    I can source the supplies. Timber? This site has given me more links than I can count. Bronze, lead, hardware, all do-able.

    But I will need space. Not cheap. And it will have to be space I own, because as has been pointed out, the number of yards who let you do your own work has fallen, and when places close, you have to move your half finished project.

    Which leads me to move and launch. There are logistics issues there that are not trivial. The last economic downturn forced a lot of people to park their trucks. If you can find a Brownell truck that can fit you into their schedule, great. That or a flat bed, and a crane to load ($$$). And if that space you found is not close to water (which is now very expensive), you will pay for that as well. Of course, that's for a new build. Restoration? Now you have to do it twice. And if that boat is more than 12.5 feet wide, you're really paying. Actually, you're really paying if it's more than 8.5 feet wide, but it quickly goes from Expensive to Ludicrous to Insane. Unless you were fortunate enough to find that boatshop on the water that lets you work on your own boat.

    Having solved those two non-trivial problems, now you need to find a home for it in the water. If you own your own dock, no problem. If you can reasonably access a mooring, you're in luck. But when you find a marina...

    First they will ask about "what type of boat". Hint: "wood" as an answer will quickly be shut down. If you went with cold molding, then "composite" might get you there. But the number of marinas that accept wood are becoming far and few between. I was once told at a transient marina, where I was only staying a few days, that if they'd known my boat was wood when I asked for a slip, they would have told me to keep going.

    But supposing you can get past this, their next question will relate to insurance. Yes, you can find insurance. But it will not be as easy is if you tell them something like "a Bayliner 40" or even a J42.

    Can you get through the roadblocks? Yes. It can be done. But done frequently? I don't think you're going to see that. I've been playing with wooden boats since the Reagan Administration, and even I'm ready to consider something else. Not because I don't love old wooden boats. But because I'd rather sail or even work on a boat than try to solve maritime logistics problems. As I get older, I become very jealous of other demands on my time.
    Heute ist so ein schöne Tag...

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    I've built four boats over the past nine years. Pretty sure all are on the forum, somewhere.

    They are:

    • Cedar on oak lapstrake rowboat / John Gardner design
    • Stitch and glue kayak / Pygmy Coho design
    • Skin-on-frame rowboat / Dave Gentry Whitehall design
    • Glued lap sail & oar boat / Eric Hvalsoe design


    This is 64 linear feet of boat. Is this not good enough? Were you not entertained?
    Quote Originally Posted by James McMullen View Post
    Yeadon is right, of course.

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    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    There are a lot of good points made here & I'm not talking about those bemoaning the good old days. Times do change & as said, it is getting more & more difficult to find places for wood boats. My brother was asked to leave a marina because his boat was wood - though there'd never been a problem other than the travelift operator ignoring where he told him to put the strap. A week or 2 after he got the notice, a 'glass boat moored next to him sank at the mooring due to neglect. He wasn't asked to leave.

    To own a big wood boat one has to be either wealthy or a good scrounger. I'm the latter - but that takes time. Even so, moving my boat (3 axle trailer required) 3 miles costs $850 each way + launching, stepping the mast & mooring. Even though I do everything other than drive the truck, operate the travelift or operate the mast crane. It costs me roughly $5,000 per year - not counting any maintenance or repairs. This means that I don't do vacations - the boat is my "vacation". It also means I drive used cars, use used equipment for mowing, snow removal, etc. - but I can do that because I can work on them.

    Not everyone is willing to make these sacrifices - not should they be required to.

    Even though I have one of those boats that the OP & others deem "acceptable", I enjoy most all the build/rebuild/repair threads - as all are wood & all are about craftsmanship & people getting out on the water in something they built/rebuilt themselves. For example, Jim Ledger's thread on making/casting his steering gear is about as old school as anyone's gonna find.

    Finally - accusing those who document a build/rebuild here of saying "Hey look at me!" is just plain wrong. Many are in places where they don't have fellow boat owners/builders dropping by every day & posting it here provides a level of engagement with others they otherwise would not have. Most all also get comments & suggestions from those of us who aren't too busy looking down our noses - which helps them make a better boat. An example of this is Rich Jones' 14th Star thread. It's traditional building based on 100YO plans (which should be enough to make even you "purists" happy - even if he's put an electric motor in) & there is plenty of encouragement & advice offered plus even parts for it offered by others.
    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

  32. #32
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    NZ
    Posts
    1,985

    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    Sure there are builds of various sizes but the substantial boats like Chucks Concordia and up are thin on the ground. It could be due to a combination of the factors mentioned, alternative blogs, an aging fleet and the costs being the main ones. Not many threads like this anymore

    Just seems that the "wooden" part of the wbf is getting fuzzy, and now we have the banner adds and I think the bilge is the most active forum? It's a shift that I've noticed over time, I came here when I had a carvel boat and knew nothing (still dont!) and there seemed to be quite a few ongoing build/repair threads. Personally I don't mind how it goes, but I am finding less reasons to tune in and if I want coarse little ply boats built with home renovation materials and painted in latex I'll go to duckworks

    Even though I have one of those boats that the OP & others deem "acceptable",
    Thats a bit unfair, its not about acceptable but noticing the decline of the "wooden" aspect.
    whatever rocks your boat

  33. #33
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    South Puget Sound/summer Eastern carib./winter
    Posts
    12,424

    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    Hey boatbuilding uses lots of grown up words that we are not allowed to employ here!

  34. #34
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    East Quogue,NY
    Posts
    11,984

    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    Were you not entertained?
    Gladiator Yeadon!



    Kevin
    There are two kinds of boaters: those who have run aground, and those who lie about it.

  35. #35
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Fort Worth, Texas, USA
    Posts
    1,793

    Default Re: Decline of Real Wood Building and Restoration Threads

    I appreciate those who would like to see more build and renovation threads.
    If this is turning into plywood box boats, are there other places where people are doing older style boats?

    I one time asked if anyone knew where I could find threads on trimarans. Obviously this was the wrong place, I got no suggestions.

    Times do change. Perhaps we should also - as in finding a forum which has attracted people with our interests.

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