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Thread: Bottom Paint

  1. #1
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    Default Bottom Paint

    Well I am ordering the paint and decided on Interlux Brightside as its readily available in Canada. When I called the vendor a very reputable and large chain Marine store I received some unexpected advice. Due to the climate I reside in the boat will be in the water from mid May till mid Sept, it's used on a fresh water lake. When I asked about the bottom paint the advice I was given was not to use bottom paint at all and just use the Brightside for the bottom. The rationale was the amount of time the boat is in the water, the fact that its a nice clean fresh water lake where the max water temp never exceeds 72 degrees that there would be little to no need for an anti fouling paint to combat a little common algae build up. So here is my question, is this sound advice and will the Brightside perform well as a bottom paint.

    As usual thanks for all the comments and advice from the members.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    Why don't you ask some of the people who keep their boats in your lake what they think. Some people who work for "very reputable and large chain marine stores" often don't know their butt from a hole in the ground. Others may know a lot, but, like Russian intelligence operatives, "they don't wear badges" that would let you know one way or the other.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    As per my post on other thread - true, anti fouling is not really what you need. Also true what bob says. Your lake may be cool enough and depending on prep the Brightsides might survive. Or it will bubble. I'd be interested to know the result. Pettit 1959 is always my bet in this application. Woody runabouters usually know about it.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Cleek View Post
    Why don't you ask some of the people who keep their boats in your lake what they think. Some people who work for "very reputable and large chain marine stores" often don't know their butt from a hole in the ground. Others may know a lot, but, like Russian intelligence operatives, "they don't wear badges" that would let you know one way or the other.
    Well to start with this is the only wood boat on this lake, every other boat is either aluminum or fibre glass/gelcoat and none of them have any sort of bottom paint or anti fouling paint, in fact 0% of the boat owners have likely never heard of Interlux paints, or peitit paints or any other hull paints for that matter....that is why I chose to ask the question here but apparently based on this response that may of been a mistake in itself. Not really looking to hear from any Russian Intelligence operatives, just people that can help with advice that is not seasoned with sarcasm and completely pointless advice that do not ANSWER or even address the actual subject matter the question. What is the point of having this Forum if asking legitimate questions are responded to with clearly ridiculous babble.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Hvalsoe View Post
    As per my post on other thread - true, anti fouling is not really what you need. Also true what bob says. Your lake may be cool enough and depending on prep the Brightsides might survive. Or it will bubble. I'd be interested to know the result. Pettit 1959 is always my bet in this application. Woody runabouters usually know about it.
    Thanks, at least you offered some real advice.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    If the boat is intended to stay in the water more than a couple days, or something like a weekend, then Brightside is rather risky. It doesn't always bubble and flake when left submerged too long, but it certainly can and sometimes does. That's why the directions on the can say it is for topside use (or dry-sailed boats, which are only in the water while being used).
    As for fouling, don't ever let anyone try to tell you that it doesn't happen in fresh water. They are very badly misinformed. We can get 1/2" long, green fur growing on boat bottoms around here, and if you pull the boat out and don't remove it quickly, it hardens like concrete. If you are far enough north, it might be too cold for it (Lake Superior, for example - where you are more likely to get nasty rust stains in your paint that won't come out) but you might want to check around and see what other boaters are doing.

    Also remember, as Bob mentioned, that the percentage of marine retail store sales personnel who have actually ever painted a boat is probably extremely low.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    Quote Originally Posted by GordC View Post
    Well to start with this is the only wood boat on this lake, every other boat is either aluminum or fibre glass/gelcoat and none of them have any sort of bottom paint or anti fouling paint, in fact 0% of the boat owners have likely never heard of Interlux paints, or peitit paints or any other hull paints for that matter....that is why I chose to ask the question here but apparently based on this response that may of been a mistake in itself. Not really looking to hear from any Russian Intelligence operatives, just people that can help with advice that is not seasoned with sarcasm and completely pointless advice that do not ANSWER or even address the actual subject matter the question. What is the point of having this Forum if asking legitimate questions are responded to with clearly ridiculous babble.
    Really? You ask for advice. You get what is actually very good advice (whether you recognize it or not). And you get up in arms because you don't like his tone of voice? Seriously? I'd call that: self-defeating. And nervy.
    Last edited by David G; 02-17-2017 at 05:50 PM.
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    http://www.harborwoodworking.com/boat.html

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    The lake you describe sounds a lot like Lake Michigan, tho maybe cleaner. Fiberglass boats here will start to show growth in a couple of days. Likewise lines left dragging in the water, posts (wood), or just about anything else left in for a couple of days. I will admit I do not have experience with a painted wood boat. VC-17 by Interlux is the gold standard for bottom paint here. If I had a wooden boat that I planned to keep in all summer, iin a freshwater lake like you describe, VC-17 is what I would use to paint the bottom with, and then know I didn't have to worry. I roll it on very very thin (c. 2quarts on my 36 footer), so if you're talking about a smaller wooden boat, a quart would be plenty. Just roll, don't tip.

  9. #9
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    Default Bottom Paint

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul356 View Post
    The lake you describe sounds a lot like Lake Michigan, tho maybe cleaner. Fiberglass boats here will start to show growth in a couple of days. Likewise lines left dragging in the water, posts (wood), or just about anything else left in for a couple of days. I will admit I do not have experience with a painted wood boat. VC-17 by Interlux is the gold standard for bottom paint here. If I had a wooden boat that I planned to keep in all summer, iin a freshwater lake like you describe, VC-17 is what I would use to paint the bottom with, and then know I didn't have to worry. I roll it on very very thin (c. 2quarts on my 36 footer), so if you're talking about a smaller wooden boat, a quart would be plenty. Just roll, don't tip.


    The specifics of fouling and effective fouling protection are highly localized. The best advice is to find another experienced boater on your body of water.

    Now, there's not much difference in fouling protection for wood or glass or aluminum. ( certainly worms don't eat metal or fg,but they are not a problem in a lake)

    So find out specifically what paint other boaters are using. The brand is not enough... find out exactly which paint.

    Also, ask what their use is. A fast boat used the same amount of time as a slow boat will have less fouling. A slow boat used more than a fast boat may have less fouling. A boat that sits at the dock a lot will foul most.


    Kevin


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    Last edited by Breakaway; 02-17-2017 at 06:19 PM.
    There are two kinds of boaters: those who have run aground, and those who lie about it.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    Fresh water in general and cold fresh in particular do not require as much active anti-foul as salt water or temperate rivers and the Great Lakes. You'll see nice applications of paints with for example half the copper content as their salt water equivalents. But they still need something.

    Additionally, bottom paints are paints that are designed to be wet continuously. Topside paints are not. That's why topside paints used as long term bottom paints are prone to failure.

    There is no comparison between either bare wood or just enamal finished wood to unpainted glass or aluminum.

    But whatever you do, please provide photos now and come back in October with a full report and more photos.

    Since nothing works all the time and anything works a little, maybe you'll get lucky. Myself, I'd protect the wood but it is your boat.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    Really? You ask for advice. You get what is actually very good advice (whether you recognize it or not). And you get up in arms because you don't like his tone of voice? Seriously? I'd call that: self-defeating. And nervy.
    Yes Really, and yes I asked for advice not some stupid comment that did not even answer
    The question, maybe read the other comments
    that actually offer constructive advice not some
    rant about Russian spys.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    Okey dokey, then.
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    http://www.harborwoodworking.com/boat.html

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    Actually, the points that Cleek made were right on the money and you would do well to listen to them, and be a fool not to. Point #1 - the first people you should be asking are those who have had boats on your particular lake. They will know a lot more than we do here about the local conditions and the need, or not, for antifouling paint on that lake. Point #2 - The knowledge level of marine store sales people varies greatly, and many of them are by no means experts, or anything even approaching experts. Whether or not you appreciate Bob's humor doesn't really matter. He made a couple of good points and you don't have the knowledge to be an ass about it. You should be thanking him.

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    If you are truly worried about it, go ahead and put the anti-fouling paint on. You may not need it but it won't likely do any harm.
    We boat on Lake of the Woods in NW Ontario. Cold, clean, fresh water for the most part so maybe like where you are.
    I don't have much experience with wooden boats sitting in the lake all summer but I know from past experience that basic oil based paint will stay on an aluminum boat that sits in the lake all summer where we are.

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    Quote Originally Posted by Todd Bradshaw View Post
    Actually, the points that Cleek made were right on the money and you would do well to listen to them, and be a fool not to. Point #1 - the first people you should be asking are those who have had boats on your particular lake. They will know a lot more than we do here about the local conditions and the need, or not, for antifouling paint on that lake. Point #2 - The knowledge level of marine store sales people varies greatly, and many of them are by no means experts, or anything even approaching experts. Whether or not you appreciate Bob's humor doesn't really matter. He made a couple of good points and you don't have the knowledge to be an ass about it. You should be thanking him.
    OK and I repeat, THERE ARE NO OTHER BOATS ON THIS LAKE WITH BOTTOM PAINT there is no one to ask....if you think his advice was sound then fine, you are entitled to your opinion and i respect that. Did you actually read my initial post???? i think not....the question was can you use Brightside as a bottom paint as suggested by the paint vendor. A good question, i was given information that i suspected was incorrect and made my post to confirm.
    It had nothing to do with Russian operatives or what other people are doing, if there was other wood boats on this lake using bottom paint then fine of course I would consult them....but there isn't .Sheesh. Mr Cleek did not offer any advice, he did not answer the question, in fact his tone was pure sarcasm and condescending. Are we done with this now...

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    One of the charms of this place is when people come in, ask a question, and then insult the people (very experienced people) that gave him an answer. This is one of the grave mysteries of life.

    (No you can't put enamel on the bottom of a boat that will stay in the water any length of time. I hope that satisfies you and you will take your rudeness elsewhere.)

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    GordC,

    I asked a similar question a few years back and got the same answer, "Go ask your slip neighbors." At first I was like "What the hell, its a forum, why would I ask my neighbors! I came to the forum to ask you guys".

    But then I did more searching on the forum and the saw the same advice given to others.

    Then I called the paint manufactures and with very few exception the applications engineers told me the same thing. Weird as it sounds performance is very localized and as the paint engineer told me "We could spend millions characterizing our products for every conceivable water condition, or you could look over side of a few boats on your dock and 100% absolutely know what works in your water in less than a 30 seconds."

    Now I understand no one uses bottom paint on your lake, but Bob's answer was what lots of others, including me, asking the same question get told.

    As for the Russian pun, I rather like the humor here on the board. And it's old school, because these guys are old school.

    Bob has given me some great advice, as has PC and Nick, and Ian, and Scott, Larks and well too may to list really. They have all, at different times, saved me a S$%&# ton of money. And trust me, they grit their teeth when answering many of them because I ask a lot of unconventional and often stupid questions. But the advice has all been solid - any many here have been working on boats for 60+ years.

    I don't bother asking my local shipwright questions because part of his "product" is his experience, and he expects me to pay for it - and rightly so. So this is really the only place I get help, but I always do and its always good.

    I just thought I would throw this information out there because I noticed you are new on the forum and I remember also being new and how the advice could be intimidating and aggravating at times.

    Cheers

    Leo

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    not to mention, you have 2 threads asking the same question started 20 minutes apart
    so who is wasting time ?

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    Several boats that I know,that are berthed in Tobermory,only get new anti-fouling every few years.
    Sometimes it's 10 years.Mostly for aesthetics.

    The ones that are down the shore a bit,in smaller, warmer harbours and river mouths like Southampton and Port Elgin, have disgusting algae and (s)lime buildup.

    You can buy paint for below the waterline that has no anti fouling properties.
    R
    Sleep with one eye open.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    leop - a most gracious and patient response. Kudos. And he's far more likely to hear you, than one of us testy ones. It does get wearisome at times, dealing with the same questions repeatedly. Questions that often could be answered with a bit of research from the enquirer. And toss in some attitude on top? It grits my teeth, it does. But you have reminded me that there is a better way, and I thank you.
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    http://www.harborwoodworking.com/boat.html

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  21. #21
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    Did you actually read my initial post???? i think not....the question was can you use Brightside as a bottom paint as suggested by the paint vendor.
    It seems that you are the one who can't, or doesn't read, not me. I read your initial post and answered your questions in post #6, but they seem to have gone over your head. You have gotten plenty of good advice in your two threads on the same topic, and just about all the replies from folks who have actually done this stuff and who know a hell of a lot more about the topic than you do are giving you the same answers. There is no excuse for your a-hole attitude. The good news for the rest of us is that people who come here with that attitude seldom last very long.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Bottom Paint

    Look boys if I hurt bobs feelings I apologize and
    if that means I am subjected to the rath of insults
    from his friends I accept that. Frankly a member
    should be able to ask a question and expect
    an answer not tainted with sarcasm especiall
    from a senior member. Bobs comment was not
    appropriate in my opinion. I posted the same question
    In another forum and received good respectful
    answers without sarcasm or condemnation. May I
    respectively suggest if senior members feel
    the question is not worthy of a response
    they just not make comment. I come on here
    seeking advice I ask my questions in a very
    respectful manner and expect respectful answers
    if that is not the way this forum works then
    i am mistaken.

    Once again if if you feel I have Rocked the boat
    a little then I apologize.

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