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Thread: FORD - starting issues

  1. #1
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    Question FORD - starting issues

    FORD - Fix Or Repair Daily

    The Ford has had the transmission replaced, finally.

    It had been given a test drive by the Garage. I drove it home from the garage.

    It then sat for a week, I cleaned it inside due to the musky smell of being parked up for 8 months.

    On completion, tried to start it.

    It turns over, seems to be firing but stops on release of ignition key.

    Battery now getting low.

    Could it be that the gasoline is 'stale' and has lost 'octane', by being 'parked-up' for 8 months, and if so would it be resurrected by the addition of an 'octane booster' ?

    EG




    Alternatively should the fuel tank be drained and fresh gasoline be put in?

    Other suggestions?
    Enjoy a good rum on the rocks at sunset.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Remember timing lights?

    They remain a good way to determine if a spark plug is getting juice.
    Rattling the teacups.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Fill the tank with fresh gas. How old is the car. ODBII socket?
    “What, Me Worry?". -. A. E. Newman

  4. #4
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Bow View Post
    Fill the tank with fresh gas. How old is the car. ODBII socket?
    Will follow your suggestion and fill the tank with fresh gas.

    Will have to check if it has a ODBII socket.
    However even if it did, I don't have, or know anyone/garage that has one for a FORD.
    Enjoy a good rum on the rocks at sunset.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    You can get OBDII readers that interface with a laptop or smart phone for about $10 on fleabay.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rum_Pirate View Post
    Will follow your suggestion and fill the tank with fresh gas.

    Will have to check if it has a ODBII socket.
    However even if it did, I don't have, or know anyone/garage that has one for a FORD.
    The best helping hand you will ever receive is the one at the end of your own arm.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Isn't your Ford the re-badged Mazda? I am interested, as I was considering buying one used.

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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan McCosh View Post
    Isn't your Ford the re-badged Mazda? I am interested, as I was considering buying one used.

    My initial advice is DON'T buy a Ford Escape.

    The one I have is about 10 tears old and of Japanese origin and I think it is similar to the Mazda Tribute.

    There are several sites that do consumer reports on all vehicles.
    The site I visited (after I bought it) indicates that it has higher than average transmission/gearbox issues.

    However, it would probably depend on the year and spec you intend to buy.

    Plus you are in the USA so parts would be relatively easily obtainable.

    IF mine ran without problems, it would be a nice vehicle.

    Maybe I bought a Monday/Friday* car or a 'lemon'.

    * See Arthur Hailey 'Wheels'.
    Last edited by Rum_Pirate; 01-30-2017 at 09:59 AM.
    Enjoy a good rum on the rocks at sunset.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    I think you need a competent repair shop.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Canoeyawl View Post
    I think you need a competent repair shop.

    Well spotted that man.


    Now “there's the rub” !
    Enjoy a good rum on the rocks at sunset.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Rum_Pirate View Post
    Will follow your suggestion and fill the tank with fresh gas.

    Will have to check if it has a ODBII socket.
    However even if it did, I don't have, or know anyone/garage that has one for a FORD.
    Ford, Honda, Pontiac, it doesn't matter. The OBD II socket is the product of global industry standardization.
    Rattling the teacups.

  11. #11
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Quote Originally Posted by oznabrag View Post
    Ford, Honda, Pontiac, it doesn't matter. The OBD II socket is the product of global industry standardization.

    Thanks, I did not realise that.

    I will make the first step and try Jim Bow's suggestion : Fill the tank with fresh gas.
    Enjoy a good rum on the rocks at sunset.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    It's not the gasoline...
    Unless there is no gasoline

  13. #13
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Canoeyawl View Post
    It's not the gasoline...
    Unless there is no gasoline
    Plenty gasoline, 3/4 tank.

    Mind you the tank (and vehicle ) has been sitting in a HOT climate for 8 months awaiting the transmission.

    It managed to drive from the garage to home, +/-2 miles, without cutting out or dying.

    Given that it turns over, seems to be firing, but stops/dies on release of ignition key.


    What do you suggest that it might be?
    Enjoy a good rum on the rocks at sunset.

  14. #14
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Fuel pump not pressurizing fuel properly.
    Keep calm, persistence beats resistance.

  15. #15
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Does your gas down there have ethanol?

    If so, drain the tank, and flush the lines.
    Quote Originally Posted by George Jung View Post
    Don't under-estimate Jack. He's purty damned talented

  16. #16
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Quote Originally Posted by jack grebe View Post
    Does your gas down there have ethanol?

    If so, drain the tank, and flush the lines.
    I do not know if it has ethanol in it.

    What does the ethanol do to the lines?
    Enjoy a good rum on the rocks at sunset.

  17. #17
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    I found this on a discussion on ethanol

    Adding ethanol does boost octane. It lowers mileage significantly. The excuses for subsidizing ethanol were that an oxygenated fuel would burn cleaner, which means virtually nothing when a catalyst is used, and would "reduce our dependance on foreign oil".

    It turned out it's more energy intensive and expensive to grow the corn and turn it into ethanol than to use just crude oil. The reason we all are running ethanol fortified fuels has much more to do with the corn lobby than any imagined benefit.

    For us, the first issue is how our cars run with ethanol vs. without it. At the same octane rating, I doubt most of us would notice a difference in performance, but we can easily measure the difference in fuel consumption.

    The second issue is how the parts of the fuel system are affected by the presence of ethanol. I would further divide this into the rubber and metal parts. Many rubbers break down in the presence of alcohol.
    electric fuel pump I used to transfer fuel between vehicles was made in britain and used a bellows. It eventually failed because the ethanol swelled the rubber bellows and caused it to break.

    A replacement bellows would also fail since they haven't changed the material. I doubt we have vulnerable rubbers in our fuel systems, but could be mistaken. This leaves the effect on metal parts.

    While pure ethanol, like distilled water, is an electrical insulator, it like water, is hungry for ions, and in the presence of metals, will pull ions into solution and corrode the metal just like water.

    There are more than enough dissimilar metals in our fuel systems to create batteries in the presence of a weak electrolyte.

    This is why we hear stories of fuel system corrosion when using alcohol fuels. When we got our lawn mower back with a $500 bill after the carburetor failed, the mechanic told us not to use ethanol fuels if we had a choice and under no circumstances store it for the winter with an ethanol fuel.

    My interpretation of this is we should not store our cars with ethanol fuel for long periods.

    We should also be prepared to see more internal corrosion in our fuel systems. Since the introduction of ethanol fuels, I have tended to replace standard steel tubing with stainless when I can and be on the lookout for hidden corrosion whenever I work on fuel systems.
    Is this commentary accurate?
    Enjoy a good rum on the rocks at sunset.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    If it started and drove home it's not the quality of the fuel.
    "Simple minds discuss people, Average minds discuss things, and Great minds discuss ideas".

  19. #19
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Comparing to much older vehicles is pretty far fetched, I know, but perhaps this will trigger (spark) something for the folks that understand the new space shuttles.

    At one time, many years ago, when starting the ignition switch would bypass the ballast resistor and allow a full 12 volts to supply the coil. When the key was released the supply to the coils passed thru the resistor only and was reduced to about 9 volts for normal running.

    Perhaps there's still something like that going on and it's malfunctioning. It does sound spark related to me.
    Last edited by Gib Etheridge; 01-30-2017 at 03:21 PM.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Ignition switch,
    Bad battery,
    bad alternator,
    water in fuel,
    timing,

    ...impossible to diagnose over the internet with the limited data you have provided. Send roundtrip airfare for 6, I will pick 5 really good mechanics and we will be there shortly. Oh please purchase large quantities of beer and rum.

    Or try these suggestions, all of them are reasonable. http://www.fordforum.com/forum/gener...t-start-20441/

    Jack
    Last edited by JTA; 01-30-2017 at 03:12 PM.
    Jack
    Nicotine free since 1 October 2009

  21. #21
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Could be the battery.

    They don't last too long out here regardless of the advertising or guarantee (which stops at the US border).
    Enjoy a good rum on the rocks at sunset.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    There is a lot more chance of fuel going funky when in an open tank than when under pressure in a fuel injection system, especially in the heat over 8 months. All the most volatile components will evaporate. They are what helps the car start when cold (and why they bump up these components to make "winter gas", not that you have to worry about that). So the car starts OK on what is locked into the fuel injection piping, and will continue to run once it has warmed up a bit, but may not like starting on old fuel that has been in the tank for months. Fresh fuel is a cheap thing to try, it can't hurt.

    The battery sounds OK, if it has enough juice to try starting it multiple times.

    Maybe a shot of fresh gas right down the throttle body? Check spark first? Although that can get tough now, with one coil per plug, etc.

  23. #23
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Yes... I'd heard lots of stories about trouble getting Ford started.

    Wait... I haven't read this whole thread... we ARE talking about Pat Ford, right?
    David G
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  24. #24
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Try dropping a match into the fuel tank.
    That will tell you if the gas is good or not. If not, you can replace it.
    If it was good you can now replace the car...

  25. #25
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Possible faulty sensor in air intake.


    Runs when disconnected.




    Stops running when reconnected.

    Enjoy a good rum on the rocks at sunset.

  26. #26
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    What is this sensors for?

  27. #27
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Syed View Post
    What is this sensors for?
    Looks like the MAF/Mass Air Flow sensor.

    It measures the volume and density of the incoming combustion air, so that the Engine Control Module can tell the injectors how much gas to spray in.

    If it goes bad, it sends a wonky signal. If you unplug it, the injectors typically go to 'default', so the engine will run, but not very well.
    Rattling the teacups.

  28. #28
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Thank you ozna for the reply.

    Dust may be the culprit.

  29. #29
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    If it is one of the flap type airflow sensors, it may just be stuck/sticky after sitting so long. Pull it off, clean it up and see what happens. Without it, the vehicle is either in serious limp home mode, or just running at idle or cold start mode.

    Pete
    Don't underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers!

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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Quote Originally Posted by epoxyboy View Post
    If it is one of the flap type airflow sensors, it may just be stuck/sticky after sitting so long. Pull it off, clean it up and see what happens. Without it, the vehicle is either in serious limp home mode, or just running at idle or cold start mode.

    Pete
    Will try that this afternoon.

    It would be an easy, not to mention inexpensive, solution.




    PS Thanks Onzabrag for explaining what it does.
    Enjoy a good rum on the rocks at sunset.

  31. #31
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Not sure I'm right, but I think you'll find that the sensor itself is a fine wire across the throat, mine is anyway on a 96 F150.

    It is best cleaned with spray electrode cleaner.

  32. #32
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Gib Etheridge View Post
    Not sure I'm right, but I think you'll find that the sensor itself is a fine wire across the throat, mine is anyway on a 96 F150.

    It is best cleaned with spray electrode cleaner.

    From pic (haven't opened it yet) it may be like this





    I will report back when I undo it this afternoon.
    Enjoy a good rum on the rocks at sunset.

  33. #33
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Rum_Pirate View Post
    From pic (haven't opened it yet) it may be like this





    I will report back when I undo it this afternoon.
    Be careful you do not touch the wire.

    !!!


    I went through this on two vehicles awhile back, and I seem to recall that you could only use the spray function of a can of cleaner. No physical contact.
    Rattling the teacups.

  34. #34
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    Is it OK to use 'canned'' air for computers?
    Enjoy a good rum on the rocks at sunset.

  35. #35
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    Default Re: FORD - starting issues

    A solvent type of spray cleaner is usually used. Do not use WD40, as it leaves residuals that will take weeks to evaporate (DAMHIK). They sell MAF cleaner in spray cans. Electric contact cleaner will work too.

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