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Thread: Pettit Sea Gold

  1. #1
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    Default Pettit Sea Gold

    Anyone tried the new Pettit Sea Gold yet? Any observations, opinions etc?
    http://www.pettitpaint.com/fileshare...h-brochure.pdf
    pvg

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    Bump, anybody?

    I love Sikkens (door and window, not the orange stuff) but this claims to be superior (not surprising for an ad) but also cleans up with soap and water, about $30/quart.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    Well, it sounds good but, time will tell us the truth. I have seen many many new coatings come and go over the years I have worked with wooden boats. Pettit is an old line company and deserves a bit of trust. But, I for one, will let some of you try it first.
    Jay

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    I come down with Jay on this one. When I was younger, more optimistic (gullible?), and had less regard for tradition... I was always keen to try the Next Miracle Finish. There have been very few that have stood the test of time. And none of them, so far, water-based. Now... it's true that Pettit is a solid supplier. But even the best suppliers can get overly invested in something promising. I, too, will wait for some other sucke..... errrrr, I mean 'enthusiastic young innovator' to do the beta testing. If it proves out over long-term... I'll probably be retired anyway.

    So experiment away. Just don't get your hope up too high.
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    http://www.harborwoodworking.com/boat.html

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    But, but, it's already won innovation awards .....!

  6. #6
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    This discussion (which I began) reminds me of the Gershwin tune "They all Laughed." :-)
    Lyrics go something like:
    They all laughed at Christopher Columbus
    When he said the world was round
    They all laughed when
    Edison recorded sound
    and so on...
    I doubt the Vikings (or Christopher Columbus) ever used epoxy, or alkyd based paints, or polyurethanes etc... or silicon bronze or stainless steel or nylon or...
    I share the scepticism about "latest and greatest" stuff and of water based finishes in general, but you never know...
    They told Marconi
    Wireless was a phony
    If I get a chance to try it and test it I'll report it here; hope some of y'all might do the same.
    Regards
    pvg

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    pvg - please do report back if you try it; but really we shouldn't have to, Pettit should publish some test results so we don't have to experiment with our trusted boats and belongings. West Marine has a nice video touting the product - based on what?

    I'm happy with Sikkens except the fumes just bug me more and more as I age. About 5 years ago I had our wood floors refinished and the guy insisted on using a water-based product (Bonna?) because he just couldn't take the fumes anymore after30 years in the biz. I know floors are not boats, but so far so good holding up to foot and paw traffic.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    Just ordered a couple of quarts . . . I will be one of the guinea pigs . . . I have been planning on a satin interior finish for my Lightning, and had been dreading many coats of Epiphanes with sanding in between . . . At the pace I work, I am guessing Sea Gold could save me more than a week, which may be the time I need to have the boat ready to go at the beginning of the season. My Lightning will be dry sailed and covered when on the trailer, so it will be pretty light duty for the varnish.

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    MS - you brave pioneer, you. Do let us know how it goes... both initially and in a year or so.
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    http://www.harborwoodworking.com/boat.html

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    Who, who, who's got the last laugh now?
    Jay

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Greer View Post
    Who, who, who's got the last laugh now?
    Jay
    I guess we'll know in a year or two...
    Glad you like Gershwin
    pvg

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    I do like Gershwin and others as well. I am a big band singer and later on to opera in order to support my love of wooden boats.

    As for varnish substitutes, the first one I know of was "Zap On". It was fast drying and was fast in emptying your wallet. "Zap On" had no longevity. I still have a can that came from my father's shop. One of the worst insults to any sane boat owners credulity was "Sudbury 365" The mfg. touted it to last as long as a year and that it could be layed on over old varnish and hot coated with no sanding needed. Sudbury was water clear and had no UV filtering qualities what so ever. After several months in the sun it would crack and peel off in sheets! Bad product! Sudbury had a terrible odor that I am reminded of when using "Bristol Finish" which, makes me only trust to use it out of doors. I find that it does last for a very long time so I use it for my flag staff trucks which are at the mast heads of our H28.
    Jay

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    I tried the Sea Gold on an old aluminum boat with new White Oak woodwork for seats, gunwales, splash rails, motor mount, and deck (Okoume plywood with White Oak dashboard). I thought this would be a good application to try the Sea Gold as the finish doesn’t have to be perfect.


    What I liked about it…
    - Goes on easy
    - Drys fast
    - You can apply three coats a day ( I applied 6 coats total followed by a top coat of traditional Captains Varnish)
    - No sanding required between coats… however there were very slight brush marks ( I applied it with a brush)
    - It cleans up fast with soap and water


    What I didn’t like about it…
    - In my opinion the finish isn’t “satin”, its closer to a "matte" or "flat" finish... I couldn't decide if I liked it or not. I ended up putting on a top coat of Captains varnish to get some “pop” (as suggested on the label)
    - The dried Sea Gold had more of a plastic look to it… sort of like the cheap laminated wood flooring
    - The finish isn’t clear but “semi-transparent” leaving a bit of a muddy look to the grain.
    - The wood grain lifted as if it had gotten wet. My nice, smoothly sanded wood surface, after applying the first coat of varnish, became bumpy in some areas from the grain lifting…. especially in areas with end grain on curved edges. I didn't wipe the wood down with Pettit 120 Brushing Liquid before applying Sea Gold... perhaps the lifted wood grain is the result.. my impression was that the 120 isn't really required, but used to wipe off dust and residue, I used a tack cloth instead to remove the dust.
    - I was very frustrated in trying to remove the painters masking tape I put down to protect the aluminum hull from being varnished where it mated with the wood. In pulling the tape off, the Sea Gold didn’t tear at the seam (between the masking tape and the finished wood surface) as it does with traditional varnish and instead pulled and tore away from the finished wood. After tearing the vanish off the wood along the first 6 inches of masking line, I used a utility knife to score the seam before pulling the rest of the tape off. Even with using a utility knife, still there were a couple of spots where it still pulled away. Removing the tape turned into a time consuming job. And then I needed to sand and reapply varnish to the areas that got torn away adding 3 more days to bring the project to completion.

    As far as duablity goes… time will tell.


    Final verdict… I might has well just used traditional varnish because I didn't get it completed any faster using Sea Gold because I had to revarnish areas that got torn away when removing the masking tape. I would only use this stuff again for a quick and easy project… its no substitute for traditional varnish.

    Last edited by Pags; 06-07-2017 at 02:49 PM.

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    We'll be having a review of it by Matt Murphy in issue 260.

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    I put 4 coats of Sea Gold on the inside of my new Lightning.

    As to application:

    I was a little taken aback when I realized that Sea Gold had a bit of a milky tan look to it, even after lots of stirring. But it brushed on nicely, dried quickly, and didn't need sanding in between coats. It was also virtually odor free.

    However, I was surprised at the look of the finish after four coats. I expected a "satin" finish to have at least some sheen, but my finish had absolutely none. In fact, my interior looked virtually the same as it did before I put the Sea Gold on. It looked nice, but it didn't look "finished" to me.

    So I made a decision to apply at least a coat or two of Epifanes Clear Varnish before putting the deck on.

    The first coat of Epifanes went on fine and looked great, except for some annoying brush marks and a few holidays. After sanding according to the instructions, and wiping it off with Pettit Brushing Thinner, I applied the second coat. And the second coat turned out pretty rough, both the surface texture and the look of it. It looked like it had thousands of tiny air bubble holes in it, and felt like a non-skid surface.

    After doing some research, my guess was that I had fish eyes in the second coat, and the advice from Epifanes was that it had to be sanded off.

    So I have now sanded off the second coat and then some, and am now waiting for a low humidity day to try another coat. I also bought the pricey Epifanes thinner and gave the surface a good wipe-down in hopes of removing any oil/grease/other contaminants from the surface.

    I don't know if Sea Gold caused the fish eyes. I just hope the next coat of Epifanes turns out better.

    P.S. Whilst procrastinating the job of sanding the 2nd coat off, I decided to get a smaller electric sander that would be better for sanding in between my frames and in between varnish coats. The one recommended by our fancy tool store was a Festool sander with variable speeds. It is shaped like a small clothes iron, which really helps get close to the edges and into the corners of the hull. It also doesn't vibrate nearly as much as my other sanders. I am not going to say it has made the sanding fun, but it has made if much more tolerable. And I feel it has given me a much better chance of sanding in between coats without sanding too much . . .

    More at eleven . . .

  16. #16
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    I put five coats on the rub rails of my skiff last summer. It went on easily- no sanding between coats. It has held up very well, except for one small area with a screw and mahogany plug that seemed to introduce water under the finish and turned the wood under the finish black. Should be easy to repair next spring. It is true that the finish is essentially flat. I have considered varnishing over the Sea Gold to improve the sheen, but I don't really care about sheen on this fishing skiff. I am planning to use the same finish on a mahogany plant bench, made with leftover porch flooring, just finished. That will be interior only, so endurance will not be factor. Overall, I like it.
    Last edited by Irv Mac Dowell; 11-01-2017 at 08:27 AM.

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by Scott de M View Post
    But, but, it's already won innovation awards .....!
    I'll wait for it to win some durability awards But I suspect we'll be seeing a lot more water based finishes on the market as the VOCs get legislated out of existence.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    I bought 3 qts from Defender, had the best price.
    It must be well stirred, forms a sticky paste in can bottom when it sits. Even has to be stirred while your using it. And that sticky mud can take a while to stir back into the liquid.

    It does form a plastic like feeling surface, so do lots of other finishes. It sort of goes on like a liquid glue, like your painting a very thin coat of glue.
    It dries quick, but some areas take longer so they stay milky looking longer. Takes a while to harden fully the finish. Takes 3 coats to get a sheen.

    The whole point is can it last longer exposed to the sun, which is why I am trying this. Supposedly can be re-coated with minimal fuss when it wears. Easier to use is one of their talking points.
    Last edited by sdowney717; 11-22-2017 at 12:58 AM.

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    Pags- What kind of painters' masking tape do you use? Blue, green, the plastic pale green/tan 'fine line' type?? Curious here.

    I wonder what purpose the pigmented 'muddiness' (?)of the appearance serves compared to a clear, water-based, exterior varnish like this? https://www.homedepot.com/p/Varathan...6320/203369806

    Will wait for the WB # 260 review. Thanks for the heads up, Anne.
    Last edited by rbgarr; 11-22-2017 at 07:12 AM.
    "... and the great shroud of the sea rolled on as it rolled five thousand years ago."

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by Pags View Post
    I tried the Sea Gold on an old aluminum boat with new White Oak woodwork for seats, gunwales, splash rails, motor mount, and deck (Okoume plywood with White Oak dashboard). I thought this would be a good application to try the Sea Gold as the finish doesn’t have to be perfect.


    What I liked about it…
    - Goes on easy
    - Drys fast
    - You can apply three coats a day ( I applied 6 coats total followed by a top coat of traditional Captains Varnish)
    - No sanding required between coats… however there were very slight brush marks ( I applied it with a brush)
    - It cleans up fast with soap and water


    What I didn’t like about it…
    - In my opinion the finish isn’t “satin”, its closer to a "matte" or "flat" finish... I couldn't decide if I liked it or not. I ended up putting on a top coat of Captains varnish to get some “pop” (as suggested on the label)
    - The dried Sea Gold had more of a plastic look to it… sort of like the cheap laminated wood flooring
    - The finish isn’t clear but “semi-transparent” leaving a bit of a muddy look to the grain.
    - The wood grain lifted as if it had gotten wet. My nice, smoothly sanded wood surface, after applying the first coat of varnish, became bumpy in some areas from the grain lifting…. especially in areas with end grain on curved edges. I didn't wipe the wood down with Pettit 120 Brushing Liquid before applying Sea Gold... perhaps the lifted wood grain is the result.. my impression was that the 120 isn't really required, but used to wipe off dust and residue, I used a tack cloth instead to remove the dust.
    - I was very frustrated in trying to remove the painters masking tape I put down to protect the aluminum hull from being varnished where it mated with the wood. In pulling the tape off, the Sea Gold didn’t tear at the seam (between the masking tape and the finished wood surface) as it does with traditional varnish and instead pulled and tore away from the finished wood. After tearing the vanish off the wood along the first 6 inches of masking line, I used a utility knife to score the seam before pulling the rest of the tape off. Even with using a utility knife, still there were a couple of spots where it still pulled away. Removing the tape turned into a time consuming job. And then I needed to sand and reapply varnish to the areas that got torn away adding 3 more days to bring the project to completion.

    As far as duablity goes… time will tell.


    Final verdict… I might has well just used traditional varnish because I didn't get it completed any faster using Sea Gold because I had to revarnish areas that got torn away when removing the masking tape. I would only use this stuff again for a quick and easy project… its no substitute for traditional varnish.

    Yes... all water-based finishes lift the grain more than most oil-based. It's something that should be mentioned in the Application Procedures. And that's not a big problem, if you use it as an opportunity to whisker up any loose fibers, knock them down by sanding hard, than carry on over that smooth substrate. Shellac (alcohol-based) does the same thing, and I welcome it. You just have to be sure to flatten the surface after that first (and sometimes second) coat.

    Yes... most water-based film finishes tend to look plasticy, and like they're just sitting on the surface. That's because they are. The chemistry involved for curing most of these products is called 'copolymerization'. That means it's achieved by having one large molecule (already larger than corresponding molecules in oil-based products) meld with another large molecule... creating an even larger molecule. Which is then too large to penetrate into the pores of the wood.


    I solve that lack of penetration and lack of ambering by using de-waxed shellac (which penetrates and warms quite well) as my sanding sealer. Because the shellac does the whiskering, it helps eliminate some of that effect as well. You achieve the same effect with some water-based finishes by using an oil/varnish blend as your sanding sealer. Or Daly's 'Benite' sealer. But it takes some experimentation to see which finishes will work with which sanding-sealer formulations. Sheallac will work with every water-based finish I've run into.
    Last edited by David G; 11-22-2017 at 01:12 PM.
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    http://www.harborwoodworking.com/boat.html

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  21. #21
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    That was weird...
    I coated 2 large bare wood pieces, one ash, one white oak.
    The white oak looks ok, seagold went on smoothly, even color.

    On the ash, weird. The ash as I was painting it reacted chemically with the seagold. It began to crystallize on the wood and in the brush. It was forming little dry crumbs. I rinsed brush with water and finished painting the ash.
    Looking at the seagold finish, it seems to have separated and parts of it congealed into a loose sludge. I wont know more till it cures as if it will need to be stripped. The finish also looks splotchy. To me this is a fail.

    One thing different, I had used some oxalic acid on the ash, so maybe it was not well rinsed.

    I earlier had painted minwax coated mahogany and it did fine. I let the minwax cure a week before putting on the seagold.

    Link to picture, after it dried it peeled off the ash wood by itself.
    I scraped it off with a razor blade, washed it and will recoat just on the backside first and see what happens.
    https://photos.app.goo.gl/5u0OHshH21YWgtzk1
    Last edited by sdowney717; 11-24-2017 at 02:44 PM.

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    I'd have to assume the oxalic acid contaminated the surface in some way that the water-base product did not cotton to. As skeptical as I've gotten about water-base... I don't think we can blame the finish for the failure. Though it may turn out to be a quirk... that it won't go on well over an oxalic acid bleached finish no matter how well rinsed. That's conceivable, I suppose. Or it might just need a more thorough rinsing that an oil-base would require...

    Another argument against water-base finishes. A new set of quirks to learn and get bitten by in the meantime. With oil-base, there is a known and shared body of knowledge already available.
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    http://www.harborwoodworking.com/boat.html

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  23. #23
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    Default Re: Pettit Sea Gold

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    I'd have to assume the oxalic acid contaminated the surface in some way that the water-base product did not cotton to. As skeptical as I've gotten about water-base... I don't think we can blame the finish for the failure. Though it may turn out to be a quirk... that it won't go on well over an oxalic acid bleached finish no matter how well rinsed. That's conceivable, I suppose. Or it might just need a more thorough rinsing that an oil-base would require...

    Another argument against water-base finishes. A new set of quirks to learn and get bitten by in the meantime. With oil-base, there is a known and shared body of knowledge already available.
    Yes, was surface contamination from the acid. I scraped it off with a razor blade, came off easily.
    Washed it, dried it, recoating worked fine.
    After one coat, plan to lightly sand to knock down raised grain, then put on 2 more coats. The oak it did raise the grain a little bit, the ash it did not.

    here they are before any finish.

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