Rural conservative America and the educated elites. an article.

[PeterSibley]

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/11/the-...om-the-inside/

A pretty good understanding of Christian fundamentalism too. I know fundamentalists, good people and good friends but there is a gulf between us on things that can be considered and accepted, no matter how good the evidence.

[Paul Pless]

perhaps you might have included the word 'white' in your thread title
or, would that have been redundant?

[PeterSibley]

I probably should have .... or is it a given?

[skuthorp]

"Tribe" seems to be the most important word in that article.
But rather as the maligned Canute legend says, in the bitter end you cannot hold back the tide. You can ignore it for a time but not hold it back.

[PeterSibley]

Belief is all.

[Too Little Time]

I guess that is a story that educated liberals want to believe.

[elf]

It's sure a theory for which there is an awful lot of evidence.

[Gerarddm]

The sickening thing, of course, is that EVERYBODY should be a part of the 'educated elite', whether they be in Palo Alto Ca or Puhdunk, AL.

American education has clearly failed in the past 50 years.

[Ian McColgin]

The same essay written about Islamic fundamentalists would be readily accepted by our righties.

I was not raised among people like this but I've plenty of relatives in Oklahoma and Kansas who are right there. And I went to a protestant theology school where "liberal" evangelism always takes fundamentalism seriously. From what I know, this essay correctly identifies the futile approaches. And, in referring back to FDR, it hints at the practical means to engage people in a better future.

[Peerie Maa]

The sickening thing, of course, is that EVERYBODY should be a part of the 'educated elite', whether they be in Palo Alto Ca or Puhdunk, AL.

American education has clearly failed in the past 50 years.

Did you get that line that said college students from fundi families learned the stuff that disagreed with their world view in order to pass the exam, and then put it out of their mind when they graduated. I have read the same thing from another source.
It is not your education system, it is your lying politicians and preachers propagating a world view to hold on to power.

[PeterSibley]

Who is the author please?

Please follow the link shown.

[PeterSibley]

I have been told by my local equivalent of the US rural conservatives referenced above that all the evidence found so far, artifacts, carbon dating of aborigine habitation of the Australian land mass for 65000 years is rubbish...... the world having been created 7000 years ago.

Evidence versus faith in the literal Bible. No contest.

[Peerie Maa]

I have been told by my local equivalent of the US rural conservatives referenced above that all the evidence found so far, artifacts, carbon dating of aborigine habitation of the Australian land mass for 65000 years is rubbish...... the world having been created 7000 years ago.

Evidence versus faith in the literal Bible. No contest.

Which is not actually written down. Some old bishop added up all of the begats and came up with a date and actual time of day.

[Too Little Time]

Who is the author please?

http://www.rawstory.com/author/justice/

It is difficult to determine the author. Might be this person. Or it might be a stock photo.

[Peerie Maa]

Sorry, I see no person related to the piece. Perhaps it's a problem with my tablet?

I'll switch over to my windows 10 machine and see if I get a more informative view.

It would be a lot simpler though, if Peter would just tell me who the author is of this piece that he posted. Sorry to be a bother.

It is a writer who posts as Forsetti.

[Peerie Maa]

Oh, so the author is anonymous? The picture of the praying woman is not the author, because the the "writer" intimates that he is male? Was there just one author, or more than one?

Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed the piece. It took me back to a creative writing class. When I read the line " I dated their calico skirted daughters" I was hooked, and I read the piece carefully. Most enjoyable. The only disappointment I have is that the author fails to explain how he (she) broke free from this unbreakable prison. I would love to know, but since I don't know who the author(s) is (are) I guess I'll never find out.

Without emailing the question direct, knowing the authors name, address, age, place of birth etc would not yield that data anyhow.

[Peerie Maa]

Everyone has different standards. It's been a very long since I've read anything at all that didn't have the author's name and bio, or a readily available track to a more detailed bio. Even when I read fiction for pleasure, I check out the author's bio. I would think in this new age of click bait my approach would be more common, but I guess not.

Great stuff though: ". I worked off and on, on their rural farms. I dated their calico skirted daughters. I camped, hunted, and fished with their sons...."

Yep, read my tagline.

This guy has quality, but like me before I retired, might have good reasons for writing behind a pen-name.

[PeterSibley]

Yep, read my tagline.

This guy has quality, but like me before I retired, might have good reasons for writing behind a pen-name.

What Nick said, I looked and couldn't find a name either so there's likely a reason. The writing is good and most authors like their name known.

[paulf]

Forsetti

These guys: http://www.alternet.org/staff

Grain of salt required.

[PeterSibley]

The essay rang true to my local experience of Christian fundamentalism.

[Peerie Maa]

So you couldn't find the name of the author either? Yet, rather than saying so initially, you redirected me to the link????

Would it matter to you if the writer's account of his (her) background was totally made up and that the article was carefully orchestrated to make a particular point based on someone's imagined local experience? I'm not saying that this is the case, but it could be cleared up very simply. Interestingly, the Raw Story submittal guidlines say that no opinion pieces will be accepted for publication. I believe that this is an opinion piece.

Why do so many Americans suspect that so many Americans are liars? It would be simple for the editorial authority to have the "no opinion pieces" requirement proven. It only takes a conversation to establish the veracity of the piece prior to acceptance for publication.

[PeterSibley]

So you couldn't find the name of the author either? Yet, rather than saying so initially, you redirected me to the link????

Would it matter to you if the writer's account of his (her) background was totally made up and that the article was carefully orchestrated to make a particular point based on someone's imagined local experience? I'm not saying that this is the case, but it could be cleared up very simply. Interestingly, the Raw Story submittal guidlines say that no opinion pieces will be accepted for publication. I believe that this is an opinion piece.

From my experience it is very likely a true story from the writer's experience, I could have written a somewhat similar essay.

[paulf]

Go to their web site , it explains things fairly well.

http://forsetti.tumblr.com/

[PeterSibley]

It does, thanks.

[PeterSibley]

I was remarking on the similarities between my local experience and the author's views.

[PhaseLockedLoop]

http://www.rawstory.com/2016/11/the-...om-the-inside/

A pretty good understanding of Christian fundamentalism too. I know fundamentalists, good people and good friends but there is a gulf between us on things that can be considered and accepted, no matter how good the evidence.

Christian fundamentalists have, over the years, been generally opposed to progress. Backward, you know. And yet it's progress that's put everyone--everyone, scientists and non-scientists alike--at risk of catastrophic climate change, not fundamentalism. So it behooves those of us who are scientifically inclined to recognize that our highly educated world view is not something to be proud of, historically.

[Peerie Maa]

So it behooves those of us who are scientifically inclined to recognize that our highly educated world view is not something to be proud of, historically.

Money, and the shares owned by shareholders are not highly educated. Money and shares do not think nor understand, they just act over the short term to grow. That is your problem. Shareholders should sell their shares in big oil and big coal and invest in renewables. That is the only strong message that will be listened to.

Unfortunately it is easier, the lazy way, for big oil and big coal to employ denialist shills rather than re-jig their businesses to develop benign uses for their product or move into renewables instead.

[Keith Wilson]

So it behooves those of us who are scientifically inclined to recognize that our highly educated world view is not something to be proud of, historically.

Right. For the first time in all of human history, (at least in the richer countries) most of us consistently have enough to eat, water we can drink without getting sick, and most of our children live to grow up. We almost certainly won't die of plague, or smallpox, or typhoid, or cholera, or TB. The vast majority of our children will learn how to read, and will have knowledge of the wider world unimaginable to somebody 500 years ago.

Don't give us this nonsense about how the scientific worldview is not something to be proud of. When you are dealing with the physical wold (and we all have to) nothing else works. Ignorance does not have a good record. Yes, we certainly have plenty of problems, but they're mostly caused by ignorance and lies, deliberate or accidental , very rarely too much knowledge. (And FWIW, fundamentalism as such is a relatively recent phenomenon.)

[TomF]

It would be worthwhile noting, as neither the OP's article nor the University of New Hampshire's pieces do, that conservative Christianity isn't the only kind.

That in fact, Christianity isn't a homogenous blob of reactionary slop when it comes to any number of issues. Pretty much every "progressive" social issue of the past 250 years or so, including Ecological issues, will find Christians both at the movement's origins, and key supporters throughout the movement's arc.

Forty years ago, Herself worked as a summer student illustrating an "EarthCare Toolkit" for a collection of Canadian mainline churches, in response to a groundswell then among members to understand environmental care within a Christian theology of being called to be Stewards of Creation, not dominators of it. That thinking had already been around within some sectors of the Church for decades, but was widespread enough 40 years ago to be prompting development of a (in Church terms) "mass market" guide.

Please don't make the mistake of imagining that the "Christianity" defined by, for instance, the views of Mike Pence, is the only extant example or the one which must be considered the most "faithful" to Christ's teachings. I consider it a heresy.

[elf]

(And FWIW, fundamentalism as such is a relatively recent phenomenon.)

Not at all, Keith. Fundamentalism is Judaism, Paulism, Catholicism, Lutheranism, Methodism, all the religions of the Muslim world. They are all fundamentalist. Even some of the more benign sounding religons of the far east fall into fundamentalist postures. Fundamentalism has to be understood as any spiritual or political structure which has rules which proscribe the freedom of the human mind to live a creative life respectful of others freedoms.

That is where, if there was a Christ, Jesus ran afoul of the officialdom when he espoused the broadest possible tolerance for all people.

[Boater14]

The search for the author ends with me. I confess. You are all commenting on an article written by a retiree, sitting in his big chair with a cup of coffee taking a break from putting up decorations. I have a degree in elementary education, managed buildings and renovation projects up to 50 million dollars. I pulled that article out of my bu** and given your biases you wholeheartedly agree or not. Here's a hint. You see an article, Google the author, delete it or read on based on the writers credability.

[PeterSibley]

Unless your own experience supports the story as written.

[paulf]

The search for the author ends with me. I confess. You are all commenting on an article written by a retiree, sitting in his big chair with a cup of coffee taking a break from putting up decorations. I have a degree in elementary education, managed buildings and renovation projects up to 50 million dollars. I pulled that article out of my bu** and given your biases you wholeheartedly agree or not. Here's a hint. You see an article, Google the author, delete it or read on based on the writers credability.

We did, and you ain't the author.
Again, grain of salt required.

[Breakaway]

Unless your own experience supports the story as written.

But you'd agree that a work of fiction could support the actual experience of a real human being, yes? And that being the case, one should take care when proffering the material to others as a first-person account or observation. Yes?

Kevin

[Ian McColgin]

The blog is the blog and the author explains why he or she chooses to remain anonomous, just as many here publish under a code name. It's not reporting that stands or falls on small discrete facts. Rather it's a judgement about how certain people behave, in this case, fundamentalists. The central description holds whether it's Christian fundamentalists as in this essay, or Jewish fundamentalists or the Islamic fundamentalists like the Taliban. The heart of the psychology is the same. People who are in denial about this won't see it. And perhaps there are some who really have not met fundamentalists, have not seen people who profoundly reject helping the oppressed or seeing the knowledge we gain through science as one of God's gifts, not Satan's lure.

One of my theology profs used to gaze at the class and say: "Our Blessed Savior commands us to love God with all our hearts, all our bodies, all our souls, and all our minds. Why be so fearful of that last."