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Thread: Restoration of the BC Salmon Troller "Petrel"

  1. #2591
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    Default Re: Restoration of the BC Salmon Troller "Petrel"

    Quote Originally Posted by DeniseO30 View Post
    My brother-in-law came over yesterday with some vanity doors , we're removing the beadboard panels and replacing them with pebbled glass. so I was on my feet for 4 - 5 hours now I'm paying the price oding on Advil LOL

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    Quote Originally Posted by Garret View Post
    While I was never a gymnast (or even close), I can relate.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oldad View Post
    In a few weeks, good lord willin', I will be 84 years old. You young pups have no idea what's in store for ya....
    PS Sorry for the thread drift...
    Fair point. At not-quite-fifty (that's coming up in June) I'm not so young as I was, but not so old as I hope to be some day either. Grant, 84 is an accomplishment! I sure hope to make it that far myself. And if I do I expect I too will look back on my fifty-year-old-self with amusement at such trivialities as occasional lower back pain.

  2. #2592
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    Default Re: Restoration of the BC Salmon Troller "Petrel"

    Yeah, but Grant (Oldad) looks in better shape than a lot of 50 year olds.
    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

  3. #2593
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    Default Re: Restoration of the BC Salmon Troller "Petrel"

    Grim day in Seattle today, at least at first. Rainy, windy and cold - the sort of damp chill that crawls under your skin and won't go away for anything short of a hot shower. Not a morning that made me want to spend a long day outside making frames. So instead I decided to shirk my responsibilities to Petrel and work on another neglected project instead - my basement shelving.

    For those who may have joined since my last post on this topic, last Fall I embarked on a mission to build shelves for my workshop. But, being far too clever for my own good sometimes, I couldn't take the easy road of nailing together some 2x4s and particle board. Instead I decided I would get some practice in woodworking by milling the lumber to size on my newly-purchased (at the time) table saw, and fastening the whole thing together using mortise and tenon joints.

    That plan has worked well in some ways and not so much in others. I have certainly learned a lot about various woodworking tools. And I now have developed a little bit of skill that I did not have before. That's all to the good, but what I do NOT have yet is any place to put things in my shop! As it so often does, my ambition has outstripped both my abilities and my available time so this project has been dormant. And in the meantime I have to hunt in various piles when I need to find anything.

    So, time to move things forward a bit. When I left off the last time I did anything on the shelves I was cutting the mortises. After some experimentation and advice I had settled on using a bit and brace to remove most of the waste and then finish off with a chisel. That worked well but it was a bit slow and after about the first fifty or sixty holes I gave up on the brace and switched to a spade bit in a power drill. Not so aesthetically pleasing as the hand tool but much faster. So things went rather more quickly after that.

    With all the holes drilled at last, I settled in to cleaning up the mortises with a chisel.



    And a few hours later I had all the mortises cut and my posts were done.



    Cutting the side rails and tenons is next. Project for another day though. Of course by the time I had finished this job the day had turned to sunlight and blue skies. Perfect boat working weather. But too late for me to make any progress on Petrel at this point. Maybe tomorrow if the weather stays decent.

  4. #2594
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    Default Re: Restoration of the BC Salmon Troller "Petrel"

    Spade bit and a power drill ... That's progress Chris and it is all skilled woodworking. We are living aboard now so I feel your pain re the weather. Sometimes a bit of 6 mil poly and one of those 250 watt halogen heaters makes a more comfortable workspace. Not to be left unattended. / Jim

  5. #2595

    Default Re: Restoration of the BC Salmon Troller "Petrel"

    Hot buttered rum works as well as a hot shower.

  6. #2596
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    Default Re: Restoration of the BC Salmon Troller "Petrel"

    Quote Originally Posted by chas View Post
    Spade bit and a power drill ... That's progress Chris and it is all skilled woodworking. We are living aboard now so I feel your pain re the weather. Sometimes a bit of 6 mil poly and one of those 250 watt halogen heaters makes a more comfortable workspace. Not to be left unattended. / Jim
    Hey Jim, I hope you are enjoying the move aboard. You have a diesel stove on Accolade yes? Stay warm in any case!

    As for Petrel, I've been tempted to add some plastic and a heater as you suggest but after the first 20 minutes or so I'm usually too warm when I'm working on her, even down to freezing temps. The problem is just when I'm sitting in my comfortable chair at home with the heat running, looking out at the cold and trying to give myself the motivation to get up and go out into the cold. I guess it's mental rather than physical.

    Quote Originally Posted by Downwindtracker2 View Post
    Hot buttered rum works as well as a hot shower.
    Yep, indeed. Although it's Bourbon for me by preference. Not hot of course, but it does the trick.

  7. #2597
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    Quote Originally Posted by cstevens View Post
    Hey Jim, I hope you are enjoying the move aboard. You have a diesel stove on Accolade yes? Stay warm in any case!

    As for Petrel, I've been tempted to add some plastic and a heater as you suggest but after the first 20 minutes or so I'm usually too warm when I'm working on her, even down to freezing temps. The problem is just when I'm sitting in my comfortable chair at home with the heat running, looking out at the cold and trying to give myself the motivation to get up and go out into the cold. I guess it's mental rather than physical.



    Yep, indeed. Although it's Bourbon for me by preference. Not hot of course, but it does the trick.
    Chris you're really cut all those mortises by hand? bless your little heart !

    I ripped the broken dried out cane out of my canoe seat last night, my hands still hurt LOL

    Sent from my LG-M430 using Tapatalk
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  8. #2598
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    Default Re: Restoration of the BC Salmon Troller "Petrel"

    Quote Originally Posted by DeniseO30 View Post
    Chris you're really cut all those mortises by hand? bless your little heart !

    I ripped the broken dried out cane out of my canoe seat last night, my hands still hurt LOL

    Sent from my LG-M430 using Tapatalk
    I did Denise. And while I'm still a long way away from expertise, I definitely know my way around a mallet and socket chisel far better now than I did when I started. So mission accomplished there at least. And yeah, I was pretty sore last night. Next time I think I would go with the router and template. I'm glad I did it this way as a learning exercise but it was a lot of work. If these shelves work out my plan is to build more of them for our storage room and I'll want to set up a bit more of a production process for that.

    I spent some time this afternoon on the side rails but nothing worth going into any detail on. Just cutting them to length. After some consideration of different techniques I'm planning to cut the tenons using the plunge router and a simple guide. That's the next step. But in the meantime, a question for everyone:

    I've been considering different ways of fastening the shelves together. Glue would work of course and be the simplest option. But that's permanent and I can imagine wanting to take the shelves apart at some point. I could use draw bolts and that's probably the "right" way to do it. But that's a bit of work so I'm wondering if there are any easier options for mechanically fastening a blind mortise and tenon joint. It's tempting to simply run lag bolts into the end grain but probably not a good idea. Any other suggestions?

  9. #2599
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    Default Re: Restoration of the BC Salmon Troller "Petrel"

    wedged tenon, (I want to try someday too) don't know that this would survive swing and sway of shelves






    A cross dowel would lock them in. (drill through mortise, then drill through the tenon, a slight misalignment will make it very tight.

    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  10. #2600
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    Default Re: Restoration of the BC Salmon Troller "Petrel"

    You could just assemble it dry, unless the tenons are loose.Otherwise, you can pin the tenons with 3/8-1/2" dowel.
    Fasten it to the wall,just in case.

    The few wedged tenons I've done were troublesome.
    Test fitting is almost impossible because they don't come apart.

    For next time,chopping big mortises is easier when the bench is lower, like knee to mid-thigh height.
    That also means that you can use your weight to hold things down(aka, ass clamp)
    A solid bench that doesn't bounce transfers force better.
    Working over the bench support leg really helps.
    R
    Last edited by Ron Williamson; 02-18-2018 at 09:07 PM.
    Sleep with one eye open.

  11. #2601
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    Default Re: Restoration of the BC Salmon Troller "Petrel"

    Quote Originally Posted by DeniseO30 View Post
    wedged tenon, (I want to try someday too) don't know that this would survive swing and sway of shelves

    A cross dowel would lock them in. (drill through mortise, then drill through the tenon, a slight misalignment will make it very tight.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Williamson View Post
    You could just assemble it dry, unless the tenons are loose.Otherwise, you can pin the tenons with 3/8-1/2" dowel.
    Fasten it to the wall,just in case.

    The few wedged tenons I've done were troublesome.
    Test fitting is almost impossible because they don't come apart.

    For next time,chopping big mortises is easier when the bench is lower, like knee to mid-thigh height.
    That also means that you can use your weight to hold things down(aka, ass clamp)
    A solid bench that doesn't bounce transfers force better.
    Working over the bench support leg really helps.
    R
    Thanks Ron and Denise. Denise, someday I might try a wedged tenon just for fun but not on this project I think. Ron, assembling dry would be a true test of my joinery skills for sure, but I suspect I'll need a bit of help there for my first attempt. Doweling/draw boring might be the way to go but I'm not sure how easy it would be to take apart later. Once the dowel is in place I don't think it's going to come out very easily, especially if the hole is offset to pull the joint together. Hm.

    As for my workbench... It's tough to see in the photos but it's actually a pretty good height for working. Here's a better shot of it:



    I'm not sure how tall it is exactly. A bit lower than waist height in any case. But I found working with the chisel on it to be easy enough. It was a bit tall for drilling with the brace though. It's quite an old bench - from the late 1800's I'd guess - but very sturdy. It doesn't move at all no matter how I hammer, lever or pry on it.

    But the comments about the bench got me thinking...



    There you go. Mortise and tenon with a draw bolt. Simple, sturdy and not so much work as all that when I think about it. Maybe that's the right idea for my shelves after all.

  12. #2602
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    Default Re: Restoration of the BC Salmon Troller "Petrel"

    Chris,
    Go with the bolts. Obviously the strongest and most durable solution as well as simple to achieve.

  13. #2603
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    Quote Originally Posted by navydog View Post
    Chris,
    Go with the bolts. Obviously the strongest and most durable solution as well as simple to achieve.
    Because the posts are so large you could probably go in with the heavy screw or lag bolt at an angle, kind of like when toe nailing studs in a wall.

    Or, cheaper than through bolts would be a lag bolt with the head recessed or not,

    Sent from my LG-M430 using Tapatalk
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

  14. #2604

    Default Re: Restoration of the BC Salmon Troller "Petrel"

    A trick I used on one of benches,was to drill the hole the size of the nut, then chop a flat facing the upright. The problem is finding old style square nuts.

  15. #2605
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    Quote Originally Posted by Downwindtracker2 View Post
    A trick I used on one of benches,was to drill the hole the size of the nut, then chop a flat facing the upright. The problem is finding old style square nuts.
    Tommy Mac did that on a bed they built on one of the television episodes. But cross dowel nuts are pretty cheap.


    Sent from my LG-M430 using Tapatalk
    Denise, Bristol PA, Oday30, Anchor Yacht Club, On tidal Delaware River. my current project; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...0-Ducker-Resto

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