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Thread: Some people just need to die.

  1. #36
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    A good question.

    Is a partner killing the man who killed his wife or child no better than the killer ?
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  2. #37
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    Wrong is the possibility of executing an innocent man or woman.
    But there does seem to be a rash of DNA based reprieves, a possibility at least . Dead is so final.
    But these convictions in which you speak happened years ago and now with the improvement in forensics which have cleared those not guilty can also be used unequivocally to prove guilt.

    Some people need to die.

  3. #38
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    There will still be mistakes, samples get mixed or contaminated .
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
    Grateful Dead

  4. #39
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by S.V. Airlie View Post
    You're killing someone is just as bad as someone killing someone else! What separates you from each other? You are no better than the other guy.?You would go to the grave being a murderer regardless!
    Murder is a word designed by religion to differentiate between what is and is not approved.

  5. #40
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    And many were on death row for up to as many as 18 yrs. It's only a miracle that they weren't executed 10-15 yrs ago and lived long enough to be found innocent. If they are found guilty through improved scientific means, put them back in jail. Future improvements in IDing them may happen five years down the road too.

  6. #41
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    It wasn't a criticism RP. Just make sure the person you take revenge on is the right one.

    I know of a young man who was rather badly abused as a boy, one day as an adult he saw and thought he recognised the man. He attacked and beat him savagely..... he KNEW it was his abuser.


    But it wasn't. He got 2 years for his mistake , the innocent man he attacked was lucky to survive.
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  7. #42
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by Keith Wilson View Post
    Unfortunately, not true - at least not with the degree of accuracy required to justify killing people. And the inconsistency with which the death penalty has been applied - often dependant on race, class, the quality of one's lawyer, or just pure dumb luck - is another fairly powerful argument against doing something irrevocable. You make a mistake with a life sentence, you can always apologize and let the guy out, but not if he's dead.

    Although I agree that there are a few people the world would be better off without, our system for determining exactly who they are is not good enough.
    Once again, I find myself saying "What he said". Particularly the last sentence (pun intended ).

    Thank you Keith.
    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

  8. #43
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Hey, a cop interviews 10 witnesses to a crime, every witness has a different description. The crime may happen at night or some other circumstance but, there rarely is full agreement among them. So, If you saw someone kill your wife are you sure about his identification? Considering the circumstance, I'd question it. A blue jersey become black, tan pants become blue jeans, 6'2" becomes 5'10", dark Blue Ford becomes black....

  9. #44
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    So, as a killer, using your logic, you should be removed from society too. You killed, you are no better than the killer!In fact, by law, you'd be arrested for killing someone no matter what!

  10. #45
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    There will still be mistakes, samples get mixed or contaminated .
    So what is wrong with that? People die, fact of life. I think you need to move past the dying part. Just think of it as a transformation of energy.

  11. #46
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rum_Pirate View Post
    No.
    It would simply be removing them from society for which they have turned their back on.
    It would also (as said in an earlier thread) prevent any reoccurrence of another murder by that individual.

    Alternatively, if you feel that the murderer should be forgiven and allowed to continue in society without appropriate punishment then you apparently won't mind if somebody robs you of everything that you possess.
    Your claim that you would kill someone is baseless and likely a product of some ego thing.

    The truth is that you don't know what you would do if your family were murdered, and I hope you never find out.
    Rattling the teacups.

  12. #47
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by delecta View Post
    So what is wrong with that? People die, fact of life. I think you need to move past the dying part. Just think of it as a transformation of energy.
    Yes, people die but, people should not die abruptly by another man's hand!

  13. #48
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by delecta View Post
    So what is wrong with that? People die, fact of life.
    I wonder if you would be so cavalier if you were the one scheduled to die?

  14. #49
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    I think these two should apply for the position of Prison executioner. If they kill someone, who 10 yrs. later is found innocent, it shouldn't bother them at all. They like playing God apparently.

  15. #50
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by S.V. Airlie View Post
    I think these two should apply for the position of Prison executioner. If they kill someone, who 10 yrs. later is found innocent, it shouldn't bother them at all. They like playing God apparently.
    There is no God, now what?

  16. #51
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    So, you'll fill in then.

  17. #52
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by Too Little Time View Post
    But you are willing to take the risk of locking up an innocent man for as long as he lives.

    It is hard to say which is worse.
    Fortunately we don't need to guess, there are people who have been imprisoned for decades before being exonerated. I'm sure it wouldn't take too much digging to find out some of their opinions on the death penalty. I'll look when I have time if no one's found it yet.

    Quote Originally Posted by Reynard38 View Post
    I've heard it said that the death penalty is not a deterrent, and maybe that's true.
    Well one this is for certain. The convicted won't be commenting another crime.
    Very true, regardless of innocence or guilt.

    Quote Originally Posted by delecta View Post
    So what is wrong with that? People die, fact of life. I think you need to move past the dying part. Just think of it as a transformation of energy.
    People die, but we draw a rather sharp distinction between people dying and people killing.
    I'll just take my chances with those salt water joys.

    AR

  18. #53
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by CWSmith View Post
    The death sentence has never been effective regardless of how it is administered.

    I am perfectly happy with caging the beasts. We must be better than them.
    True words, here.

  19. #54
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by delecta View Post
    So what is wrong with that? People die, fact of life. I think you need to move past the dying part. Just think of it as a transformation of energy.
    And here is where you become dangerously close to justifying the crime.
    "Please be more specific or we'll choose to order a cheaper bilge-rat to replace you."

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  20. #55
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by delecta View Post
    So what is wrong with that? People die, fact of life. I think you need to move past the dying part. Just think of it as a transformation of energy.
    So this is compassionate conservatism. Who cares if someone entirely innocent gets killed - just collateral damage, no big deal.

    See why so many of us are fighting so hard against your vision of what our country should be? In order not to speak for others - I personally will stand against this kind of thinking with everything I've got.
    "If it ain't broke, you're not trying." - Red Green

  21. #56
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    I have advocated Living Death incarceration, which serves both society and the victim's family and friends. No contact, ever, by anybody. Food and water delivered automatically by machine. No media at all except for good works books.

    Living Death is only for crimes that can be incontrovertibly proved, i.e. caught in the act, or DNA evidence.

    When the criminal walks out of the sentencing court, that is the last time anybody sees or hears from him/her. So it's like the death penalty, without actual execution. Some may object saying it is mental torture. My response is, O well.
    Gerard>
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  22. #57
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gerarddm View Post
    I have advocated Living Death incarceration, which serves both society and the victim's family and friends. No contact, ever, by anybody. Food and water delivered automatically by machine. No media at all except for good works books.

    Living Death is only for crimes that can be incontrovertibly proved, i.e. caught in the act, or DNA evidence.

    When the criminal walks out of the sentencing court, that is the last time anybody sees or hears from him/her. So it's like the death penalty, without actual execution. Some may object saying it is mental torture. My response is, O well.
    Cruel and unusual.
    Rattling the teacups.

  23. #58
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    That's an ancient punishment, walling up or Immurement.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immurement.

  24. #59
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by delecta View Post
    So what is wrong with that? People die, fact of life. I think you need to move past the dying part. Just think of it as a transformation of energy.
    We'll see what you say when you are falsely accused, but you won't care will you 'cos everyone dies .
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
    Grateful Dead

  25. #60
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gerarddm View Post
    I have advocated Living Death incarceration, which serves both society and the victim's family and friends. No contact, ever, by anybody. Food and water delivered automatically by machine. No media at all except for good works books.

    Living Death is only for crimes that can be incontrovertibly proved, i.e. caught in the act, or DNA evidence.

    When the criminal walks out of the sentencing court, that is the last time anybody sees or hears from him/her. So it's like the death penalty, without actual execution. Some may object saying it is mental torture. My response is, O well.
    It's not mental torture, it's just torture.

    Disgusting.
    I'll just take my chances with those salt water joys.

    AR

  26. #61
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    A good question.

    Is a partner killing the man who killed his wife or child no better than the killer ?
    Just so, no better at all.
    Are vendettas, or tit for tat murders as we experienced during the Troubles acceptable?
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

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  27. #62
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Vendettas target the family of the party concerned, not just the individual. Vendettas are in essence about power, and political in their nature.

  28. #63
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    I agree, there are people that have even admitted to their crime. A certain Ex Colonel in the RCAF for example. The trial is over, he's admitted to his crime. To me there should be no more cost than 10 fathoms of line at 2 bucks a foot. I'll pay for it. You can use any old tree near the courthouse where he was pronounced guilty. The cost is that we keep them on death row for decades, appealing etc. Once someone admits to killing children, or mutilating women or whatnot, they're fair game for the cheapest method of execution we can find and be damned to doing it in a humane way, they weren't humane when they committed their crime. Deterrence has only the smallest bit to play. If it keeps one person from committing that type of crime again, then it was all good if you ask me. It has more to do however with making sure scum like that don't re-offend. Or reproduce and attempt to raise children.
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  29. #64
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    We'll see what you say when you are falsely accused, but you won't care will you 'cos everyone dies .
    His 'everyone dies' argument is ironic since 'everyone' includes the victims in his OP. Not so smart this one.
    "Please be more specific or we'll choose to order a cheaper bilge-rat to replace you."

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  30. #65
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sailor View Post
    I agree, there are people that have even admitted to their crime. A certain Ex Colonel in the RCAF for example. The trial is over, he's admitted to his crime. To me there should be no more cost than 10 fathoms of line at 2 bucks a foot. I'll pay for it. You can use any old tree near the courthouse where he was pronounced guilty. The cost is that we keep them on death row for decades, appealing etc. Once someone admits to killing children, or mutilating women or whatnot, they're fair game for the cheapest method of execution we can find and be damned to doing it in a humane way, they weren't humane when they committed their crime. Deterrence has only the smallest bit to play. If it keeps one person from committing that type of crime again, then it was all good if you ask me. It has more to do however with making sure scum like that don't re-offend. Or reproduce and attempt to raise children.
    You need to be clear that it's been found that 35% of all confessions are false. You'd be killing a significant amount of innocent people.
    "Please be more specific or we'll choose to order a cheaper bilge-rat to replace you."

    ~seanz

  31. #66
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by delecta View Post
    "HOUSTON -- A man accused of killing an 11-year-old Houston boy as the child walked home from school sobbed in court Monday as prosecutors told the judge the boy was stabbed at least 20 times."

    http://www.cbsnews.com/news/prosecut...bbed-20-times/
    Quote Originally Posted by delecta View Post
    So what is wrong with that? People die, fact of life. I think you need to move past the dying part. Just think of it as a transformation of energy.

    ...

  32. #67
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    There are a couple of interesting details in the linked story:

    "Jackson was arrested Friday at the Salvation Army in downtown Houston, where he had maintained a room since mid-April, according to investigators."

    "Prosecutors say the 27-year-old Marine Corps veteran admitted he was the man seen on a surveillance video near the crime scene and also told police he was at the crime scene."


    I wonder what happened to Mr. Jackson that moved him from the Marine Corps to living at the Salvation Army to killing a child. I find it hard to believe there weren't warning signs that he was headed down a bad path. At some level the death penalty and/or life in prison is a reflection on us for failing a member of society.


    Then there was this:

    "Authorities initially charged a 31-year-old man with a long criminal history days after the killing, but that charge was dropped when detectives found evidence to support his alibi."

    Which I think supports temperance in applying "justice". The mob mentality is far from rational, especially when it comes to crimes against children.
    Steve

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  33. #68
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by delecta View Post
    In this day and age we can without a doubt determine in most cases if someone is guilty, those people need to die. I don't care if it is a deterrent, it really isn't the point for me. I don't think these people should continue to live and enjoy any form of life.
    Forensics play a big part in TV shows, but people are convicted by prosecutors, judges and juries, often with no forensics involved. A belief that Science has solved the problem of guilt is simple-minded.
    Well, Mr. Botard, do you still deny all rhinocerotic evidence?

  34. #69
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    But, NCIS is so real!

  35. #70
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    Default Re: Some people just need to die.

    Quote Originally Posted by PhaseLockedLoop View Post
    Forensics play a big part in TV shows, but people are convicted by prosecutors, judges and juries, often with no forensics involved. A belief that Science has solved the problem of guilt is simple-minded.
    I really don't care, if you feel better about sentencing someone to life in prison while you hmm and haw trying to make up your mind and consul your conscience perhaps you shouldn't have convicted them in the first place. I'm talking about clear, cut cases.....smoking gun so to speak.

    Some people just need to die.

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