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Thread: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

  1. #141
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Quote Originally Posted by Ben Fuller View Post
    Striking the rig when rowing any distance seems to me to be essential and the easier it is the more often you'll do it. I come down to the whaleboats where the rig came up and down fast. I was skeptical about air drag, until I dropped sticks to compare it. And the inertia of a mast makes a mockery of smooth rowing in any conditions save a mirror smooth.
    Interesting to hear your take on this. I find that I very often don't bother dropping the mast for rowing--it only takes a few moments to do, but I haven't found it makes much difference for me. I think that's because I'm largely rowing in smooth water with no wind. Offshore, rowing in a swell, it's different, and I'll definitely drop the mast. But I don't seem to end up doing that a lot. Though you can see that in the photo above, I did take the mast down. I wasn't expecting to sail again for hours that day, and there were strong winds in some of the channels so the mast would have been a problem there.

    I've rowed 15+ mile days--just doesn't seem to make much difference when it's calm whether the mast is up or down. I may be fooling myself, I suppose.

    Tom
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  2. #142
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    So far I find my Gartside 130 to sail better than it rows, though it was actually designed as a rowboat with the sailing aspect added later by Mr. Gartside as so many people wanted to sail the boat.Another 130 sailor shares my opinion.

    However I could be hampered by the fact that it came with narrow bladed open water oars and I don't drop my mast for the most part.

    I will try dropping the mast next time to see but as the previous owner had it extended to 14' it no longer fits nicely in the boat. I have been pondering building a slightly shorter one as I suspect it's also a little flexible.

    I will also be building more conventional Oars as well.

    Generally I find I average around 2.5-2.6 in a calm. 2sh in waves and tide. I've just started sculling eve the stern for fun and versatility and I average around 1 knot.
    Interestingly I don't find it much harder to row loaded for camping with two people than I do with my normal day gear.

    Yesterday I sailed 3.5 nautical miles downwind, Averaging 4+ knots and at points hitting 5.2 (probably surfing) This wasn't a really strong wind, just a good wind. The boat really feels like it loves to sail and gets going quickly. However the wind dropped completely for the trip back and I had the tide against me and some waves/wakes. It took me about an hour and 40 minutes to row back. I have a sore bum despite a cushion!

    I like how it rows too but feel that a pair of more conventional oars will get more out of the boat in the protected waters I'm in.(Inlet)

  3. #143
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Not hard to deal with spars that don't fit in the boat. Create a "bowsprit" or tuck it over the stern. I have some webbing straps to hold it into place. I do the same for long oars ( mine are ten footers) when sailing. Learned this from traditional færing use on the Norway coast.
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    I enjoyed reading through this revived thread.

    One issue I see overlooked is multiple rowers. The sail and oar armada seem to be all individualists. It seems to me that having two or more rowing stations can allow for a boat that is a better sailing craft, as you are "cheating" on the rowing with more horsepower (and by "horsepower" I mean teenage boys!). Are there any boats that fit well in this category?

  5. #145
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    You guys are killing me! I'm fighting the overwhelming urge to add a sail to the Peregrine 18 I'm building. At 18' and 48" beam, I think she could carry a modest sail. I'm constantly reminded of how it's been said that adding a sail to a rowboat will ruin a good rowboat.

  6. #146
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Quote Originally Posted by AJBTC View Post
    I enjoyed reading through this revived thread.

    One issue I see overlooked is multiple rowers. The sail and oar armada seem to be all individualists. It seems to me that having two or more rowing stations can allow for a boat that is a better sailing craft, as you are "cheating" on the rowing with more horsepower (and by "horsepower" I mean teenage boys!). Are there any boats that fit well in this category?
    My boat 'Lucia' fits in that category: As she is a double-ender on the waterline I knew she would be a good rowing boat, and I was relieved she is also a pleasant sailing boat. What she does not do is glide, or plane. The other boat in my video 'Two luggers at play' sports a gennaker and she just digs a bigger hole in the water. Frank
    www.oarandsail.nl

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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    It is a bit unfortunate that sail and oar designs are so focused on single handing. Some of Oughtred's longer boats could have two or even three rowers, but you would be more comfortable sleeping ashore. I have known some people to cruise and sleep aboard Caledonia Yawls with two adults and two kids, however.

  8. #148
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    The Caledonia screams multiple people. It's a big boat, rows best with a couple, plenty of space for a couple to sleep. Vivier's Ilur a much shorter boat has the displacement to support a couple.
    Ben Fuller
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  9. #149
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    I've never been in a Caledonia yawl, but here is my theoretical objection. It's a double ender, and in my experience that cuts down on usable crew space. Now, it's long, so maybe the lack of a transom cuts off 2.5 feet, so you're still talking about a relatively beamy 16.5' boat. That's doable. Second, the push-pull tiller. It places the helmsman farther forward, which is great for many reasons, but I think it does prevent room for another crew member.

    I wish there was a bigger Ilur. Vivier has a few boats in the 16-17 foot range, but they just don't seem to be the same.

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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Quote Originally Posted by AJBTC View Post
    I've never been in a Caledonia yawl, but here is my theoretical objection. It's a double ender, and in my experience that cuts down on usable crew space. Now, it's long, so maybe the lack of a transom cuts off 2.5 feet, so you're still talking about a relatively beamy 16.5' boat. That's doable. Second, the push-pull tiller. It places the helmsman farther forward, which is great for many reasons, but I think it does prevent room for another crew member.

    I wish there was a bigger Ilur. Vivier has a few boats in the 16-17 foot range, but they just don't seem to be the same.
    I think you are seriously underestimating the amount of room in a CY. There is at least one person here - jsjpd1 (Jim) - who has cruised with a family of five plus dog in one.

    http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...-in-open-boats
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  11. #151
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    "Sail and oar" is one of those terms invented to sound meaningful and redolent of tradition. Fail.
    "Be curious, not judgmental." - (Misattributed to Walt Whitman as recalled by) Ted Lasso

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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Quote Originally Posted by rbgarr View Post
    "Sail and oar" is one of those terms invented to sound meaningful and redolent of tradition. Fail.
    Is it really? I mean invented by whom and for what purpose? I don't think it's quite as bad as "tall ship" for example. Seems more like a reasonably accurate and concise description of a certain type of boat. We don't think "keel boat" is an artificial term. Or "shoal draft", "express cruiser", "blue water cruiser", "passagemaker" or any of a thousand other terms that seem "salty" (to use a term that is *definitely* redolent of something) through association with their namesakes. I suppose you could say "camp cruiser" instead, but I don't think that's quite the same thing. Lots of camp cruisers are primarily sailboats (Wayfarer). Some are sail-and-outboard. Sail and oar is a pretty specific type of boat that isn't really the same as some other type.
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  13. #153
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    I like Vivier's definition, from his blog: https://www.vivierboats.com/en/voile-aviron/

    "A group of passionate sailors, linking the practice of sailing, curiosity about our maritime inheritance, and a certain dissatisfaction about a pleasure which has become a mass leisure occupation, “invented” the “voile-aviron” (1). They also invented the principle of “voile-aviron” (2), meaning an alternative way of sailing, in boats which permit us to rediscover what modern sailing boats do not allow any more: to sail in an open boat in which the picnic basket happily finds a place, to discover the pleasure of rowing, silently, at sea or in a tidal river.
    The “sail and oar”, even though it was inspired by tradition, can also fit into today’s society. Lighter, due to modern construction methods that do not reject the use of wood, easy to transport by trailer and to launch, it is freed from harbour infrastructures and the littoral concreting. Of small size, it lends itself particularly well to individual construction in a garage and provides a marvellous way of using the talents of the handyman."

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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Quote Originally Posted by rgthom View Post
    I like Vivier's definition, from his blog: https://www.vivierboats.com/en/voile-aviron/

    "A group of passionate sailors, linking the practice of sailing, curiosity about our maritime inheritance, and a certain dissatisfaction about a pleasure which has become a mass leisure occupation, “invented” the “voile-aviron” (1). They also invented the principle of “voile-aviron” (2), meaning an alternative way of sailing, in boats which permit us to rediscover what modern sailing boats do not allow any more: to sail in an open boat in which the picnic basket happily finds a place, to discover the pleasure of rowing, silently, at sea or in a tidal river.
    The “sail and oar”, even though it was inspired by tradition, can also fit into today’s society. Lighter, due to modern construction methods that do not reject the use of wood, easy to transport by trailer and to launch, it is freed from harbour infrastructures and the littoral concreting. Of small size, it lends itself particularly well to individual construction in a garage and provides a marvellous way of using the talents of the handyman."
    I agree, that's an excellent definition. It manages to capture the essence of the thing without being precious. Unlike "lumberjack fashion" say, or "tiny houses" - which are in reality, and respectively, flannel shirts and shacks.
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Quote Originally Posted by Yeadon View Post
    I can't imagine how sailing and rowing little boats could be controversial in any way. I just know that I love what I do, and that I call it Sail & Oar™.


    - ability to transition quickly between sailing and rowing
    - ability to completely strike and/or deploy the sail rig quickly (2 minutes or less)
    I think these two are essential for me as well. If I have to beach the boat to take the sail off which involves disassembling the mast... well it doesn't make the oars a viable power source in the case of a calming or having to row the boat upwind to a dock or beach.

    I would add for me it would infer that the boat is pleasing to row and sail I have been on many boats that COULD be rowed, but were such a pain you would only do it out of necessity. And I spent an afternoon a sailing canoe that felt very uncomfortable under sail but paddled beautifully. "Sail and Oar" should mean that depending on the day you would do either or both.

  16. #156
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Hi all, I've got a variation on the theme to work out. I have a 14' Peapod shaped object that I'd like to put a downwind sail on. First thought was a square sail, but as I'll be single handed and using a steering oar, its probably best to only have one sheet to deal with and be able to let fly.

    I don't sew, so the $100 Optimist lace on training sails seem like a good place to start. Question I have, is weather I would be much better of with a more balanced lug sail cut from a flat cloth?

    Not having a boom to deal with would be a bonus. There is a reduced Opti sail available that has had the "peak" lobed off and is more of a rectangle. It comes with a sleeve, but I could handle setting grommets through the sleeve. Seems like the shorter leach and lower "peak" might set better boomless.

    The other thing to sort out is where to step the mast? I have no plans to add a rudder or hang leeboards, so I would want to optimize for down wind. I'm not much of a naval architect, but I did notice that "Viking" Longboats have the mast just forward of amidships. For a 14' dinghy that might be less than optimum when motor sailing. Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks, Woody

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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    I also have a 14' "peapod shaped object" (although mine is f********s) so while I have much less experience in rigging small boats than most here I'll venture a couple of thoughts. For sails, you might check out Duckworks (https://duckworks.com). They have a range of stock sails from various sources (Neil Pryde, Michael Storer's Really Simple Sails, etc.). I suspect that you will find something there that would work well. And regarding mast placement, I might look at other peapod lug rigs before Viking longboat practice. Take a look at the CLC Lighthouse Tender for example:

    https://www.clcboats.com/shop/kit_op...apod/1930.html

    Also this thread has a lot of good info about running downwind with a lug sail. Worth reading:

    http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...d-with-lug-rig
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  18. #158
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Quote Originally Posted by bark-eater View Post
    Not having a boom to deal with would be a bonus.
    ...
    Seems like the shorter leach and lower "peak" might set better boomless.
    ...
    The other thing to sort out is where to step the mast? I have no plans to add a rudder or hang leeboards, so I would want to optimize for down wind.
    The thing about boomless lugsails--boomless any sails--is that they require a very specific sheeting angle. Generally this ends up meaning the sheet must run to a point that is as far aft and as far outboard as possible. That is very difficult to achieve in a double-ended hull shape--your hull may well be too narrow to get the sheet as far outboard as it needs to be for good performance.

    The other thing about boomless sails is that they suffer a bit downwind, and you say you're trying to create a downwind-optimized rig. A boomless sail can be poled out with an oar--I do that sometimes--but otherwise you really can't spread the sail out to catch much wind. When you ease the sheet too far, it just allows the sail to balloon out into a giant wind-catching bag of sailcloth.

    And there's so much sail twist that the top of the sail comes forward of the mast WAY before the foot of the sail is anywhere near far enough outboard to really catch a following wind. I find that the sheet position for downwind sailing with my boomless rig is very very close to the sheet position for beam reaching. You just can't ease the sail enough without inviting the dreaded "death roll" wobbles that happen when the sail comes forward of the mast.

    So you seem to have some conflicting desires here. I myself sail a boat with a boomless standing lugsail and I like it just fine. But I wonder if, given the limitations you're working with, a balance lugsail with a boom, or a sprit boom (good compromise that offers lots of advantages) might be better for you?

    Tom
    Last edited by WI-Tom; 10-02-2022 at 12:12 PM.
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    I am not much of a sailor, but have played around with downwind sails on my double ended 18' row cruiser. The rig I found most practical is copied from this Balogh Sail Designs kayak downwind sail, called the BSD Twins: http://baloghsaildesigns.com/twins.html

    It uses two flat cut triangular sails with booms, one on each side of the mast. Each has a sheet but they are brought together on a bridle, which is the only control needed. It is powered up by pulling on the bridle, and completely depowered by slacking off. It works across 90 degrees, self points as a dihedral into the wind, and has no gybe issues crossing over.

    Mine is made from cheap polytarp and tape, no sewing. The booms are a couple of sticks. My mast is way overkill for this rig, it is the one intended for a 100 sq ft balanced lug. You could use a much lighter mast.



    This is an old poor video showing it in use in around 20 kts wind. The boat has no board, and is steered by a rope controlled rudder. This sail is around 40 sq ft, it is driving the boat at 4.5 - 5 kts, briefly 6 in a gust..


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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Quote Originally Posted by cstevens View Post
    I also have a 14' "peapod shaped object" (although mine is f********s) so while I have much less experience in rigging small boats than most here I'll venture a couple of thoughts. For sails, you might check out Duckworks (https://duckworks.com). They have a range of stock sails from various sources (Neil Pryde, Michael Storer's Really Simple Sails, etc.).
    I had not seen the Neal Pryde sails before, and may have learned new something from the illustration showing sails rigged either gaff headed or sprit.

    NeilPrydeRig.jpg

    I wonder if an Opti sail can be rigged gaff head?

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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    At risk of further drifting this thread (bark-eater, maybe you should start a new thread with your topic?) some thoughts. I have a Nutshell pram with that Pryde sail, set up with a sprit rig. I posted some details on it here:

    http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...-Rig-Questions

    Honestly for your purposes I think a sprit rig would make a lot more sense than a gaff rig. It's much, much simpler. Todd Bradshaw posted about sprit vs. gaff rigs on the WCHA forum some years back:

    http://www.wcha.org/forums/index.php...t-vs-gaff.754/

    A spritsail is about the easiest to operate and most user-friendly rig that can be put on a small boat or canoe. If equipped with a brailing line (which when pulled, quickly squishes the sail and sprit up against the mast in a bundle) it's also the fastest to furl and/or deploy. The biggest drawback to them tends to be limited downwind performance with the sail hanging out to the side. The lower corner tends to curl inward, toward the hull because they have no boom, and you temporarily lose valuable wind-catching sail area. The addition of a simple sprit-boom the package will help support the bottom corner when sailing off the wind, but will prevent being able to brail the sail (unless you detatch the boom from the clew corner first - as you will learn, canoe sailing is all about compromises, it's just a matter of which ones you want to make.)


    Gaff sails, on the other hand, tend to be about as complex, technically intricate, unforgiving to rig and non-user-friendly as anything you can hang up there. Yes, they can certainly be used on a canoe and can work fine, but most of the people who use them do so because they enjoy playing with a lot of rigging. Canoe-sized gaff sails tend to be rather stiff due to the weights of available fabric. Getting one to set nicely can be quite tricky since the various halyards, lacing and fittings are all pulling on the cloth in different directions. They have a nice "salty" look which some folks desire, but the general opinion is that they're usually unnecessarilly complex. A better option in a four-sided sail might be something like a lugsail (either balanced lug or standing lug) which can have a very similar profile and look, but with more simple rigging.
    So sprit or lug would be preferable to gaff. And as Tom suggests, A boom can be a handy thing to have. I debated whether to rig the Nutshell without the boom but in the end I'm glad I kept it. If I were going to rig a sail on my peapod-shaped-object I would likely use that sail with a sprit rig or this sail:

    https://duckworks.com/rss-kombi-sailing-canoe-lug-sail/

    with a lug rig.

    Michael Storer also has a useful guide to rigging different boats with the RSS sails here:

    https://reallysimplesails.com/rss-st...s-other-boats/

    He goes into some detail on mast position in that article.
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Quote Originally Posted by cstevens View Post


    So sprit or lug would be preferable to gaff. .
    I understand the tradeoffs with a small gaff sail. What got me thinking was that while the halyards and gaff add complexity, I could get the sail up and down very quickly, which is important, as this will be a 30/70% sail and oar boat. And I'm still intrigued with the $100 Opti sail.

    Here's the reduced Opti sail: https://www.intensitysails.com/opnotrsa.html

    optimist-r-a-d-sail-1.jpgAnyone think I could adapt this to a lugsail?

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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    ^^ Well, a brailing line, which I have rigged on the Nutshell, lets you brail up the sprit rig in a couple of seconds. Certainly faster than you could drop a gaff. But I expect you will be able to make anything work if you want to badly enough.

    Edit to add: Also brailing up the sprit rig keeps the rig out of the bottom of the boat, which is much better for rowing. Once you drop the gaff it's just in the way for rowing. With the brailing setup you can also just secure the entire rig as one piece, unstep the mast, and drop it altogether. Ben Fuller has a good article about doing that here:

    https://smallboatsmonthly.com/articl...g-sprit-sails/
    Last edited by cstevens; 10-02-2022 at 02:11 PM.
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    I'm seeing a signifigant difference in windage and weight aloft, comparing a bare pole and a brailed rig.


    Quote Originally Posted by cstevens View Post
    ^^ Well, a brailing line, which I have rigged on the Nutshell, lets you brail up the sprit rig in a couple of seconds. Certainly faster than you could drop a gaff. But I expect you will be able to make anything work if you want to badly enough.

    Edit to add: Also brailing up the sprit rig keeps the rig out of the bottom of the boat, which is much better for rowing. Once you drop the gaff it's just in the way for rowing. With the brailing setup you can also just secure the entire rig as one piece, unstep the mast, and drop it altogether. Ben Fuller has a good article about doing that here:

    https://smallboatsmonthly.com/articl...g-sprit-sails/

  25. #165
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Quote Originally Posted by bark-eater View Post
    I'm seeing a signifigant difference in windage and weight aloft, comparing a bare pole and a brailed rig.
    But it only takes a few seconds to pull the mast after brailing and then you have no poles at all.

    A sprit rig is much much handier for this size of boat. If it were me, the choice would be a no-brainer.

    Tom
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Quote Originally Posted by WI-Tom View Post
    But it only takes a few seconds to pull the mast after brailing and then you have no poles at all.

    A sprit rig is much much handier for this size of boat. If it were me, the choice would be a no-brainer.

    Tom
    Hopefully I can do a little pre-refit triage and put this tub in the water in the next couple of weeks. Then I can see if I can do a little real world stability testing. Its been 20 years and 50 pounds since I've stood on the rail of a real Peapod, but hopefully I'm being pessimistic about standing and moving around in this boat.

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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    I am curious about the direction this is taking. Woody asked about a downwind sail. You guys are advising various rigs for real sails, meaning shaped sails that generate lift. I had considered these when making a downwind rig for mine, but the problem to me is you do not want any lift. A simple traction rig of some sort will push the boat downwind, trying to use a real sail means gybing when steering across the wind direction, and risks the "death roll" as Tom says.
    My early test was a parafoil kite, very small when stowed but too long to deploy and retrieve and only works in very limited wind conditions. I was happy to run across the BSD Twins rig, which works, is dead simple to power up or down, stows quickly if using a halyard, and has no risk of death roll. What are the advantages of the rigs you are discussing over this one?
    (No, I do not work for BSD )

    -Rick

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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Speaking for myself Rick, I am just responding to bark-eater’s plan to use an Opti sail with a lug or gaff rig. I think there are better options. I agree that a pure downwind rig might be different but I have no experience or advice there. I think your setup is interesting and could be a good option. It also might be worth looking at canoe and kayak sail assist rigs?
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    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Ricks twin rig is a well engineered solution, that precisely fits my design criteria, but unfortunately "The Brendan Voyage" was one of my favorite books as a kid.
    Last edited by bark-eater; 10-02-2022 at 06:40 PM.

  30. #170
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
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    Fairfield, CA
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    2,629

    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Quote Originally Posted by bark-eater View Post
    Ricks twin rig is a well engineered solution, that precisely fits my design criteria, but unfortunately "The Brendan Voyage" was one of my favorite books as a kid.
    Ha, OK! I know little of sails, sometimes in these discussions I wonder what I am missing. This makes sense.

  31. #171
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Seattle, WA
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    5,691

    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Bark-eater, I just realized we are also having a peapod conversation on Facebook. Small world… I lived on a boat named St. Brendan when I was a kid so I understand the attraction. As I said above, I think you make anything work if you want to. It’s easy enough to try something different if you don’t like your first attempt.
    - Chris

    Any single boat project will always expand to encompass the set of all possible boat projects.

    Life is short. Go boating now!

  32. #172
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
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    Wrocław, Poland
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    13,481

    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Quote Originally Posted by bark-eater View Post
    Hopefully I can do a little pre-refit triage and put this tub in the water in the next couple of weeks. Then I can see if I can do a little real world stability testing. Its been 20 years and 50 pounds since I've stood on the rail of a real Peapod, but hopefully I'm being pessimistic about standing and moving around in this boat.
    Those are two different things. I rarely stand up to take down the mast in my boat--I do it sitting on a thwart. It's a fairly wobbly whitehall.

    Tom
    Ponoszenie konsekwencji!

    www.tompamperin.com

  33. #173
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Posts
    10

    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    35 years ago I could shimmy up a Laser mast before it went over. My design criteria right now is what I can handle 20 years from now, solo on open water. Assuming that I'm being over cautious in my minds eye and a brail-able and stow-able sprit rig is feasible, as well as being the most accessible and financially prudent, I still am wondering if a shaped sprit sail is really the next best thing to Ricks Twin Sails (TM) for sailing down wind..

  34. #174
    Join Date
    Jan 2000
    Location
    Cushing, Maine
    Posts
    4,325

    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    Quote Originally Posted by bark-eater View Post
    Hopefully I can do a little pre-refit triage and put this tub in the water in the next couple of weeks. Then I can see if I can do a little real world stability testing. Its been 20 years and 50 pounds since I've stood on the rail of a real Peapod, but hopefully I'm being pessimistic about standing and moving around in this boat.
    I've found best for stability in these little boats is standing on the floorboards with my knees braced on thwarts or on a coaming. Set up like that I can easily pull the sprit rig out and lower it down over my shoulder. For my boats where I can't see the mast step because of decking etc. I have built boxes or guides so that all I have to do is find the partner and then just lower the rig. Boats like whaleboats used to use chutes.
    Ben Fuller
    Ran Tan, Liten Kuhling, Tipsy, Tippy, Josef W., Merry Mouth, Imp, Macavity, Look Far, Flash and a quiver of other 'yaks.
    "Bound fast is boatless man."

  35. #175
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Atlanta
    Posts
    2,465

    Default Re: Definitions of "sail and oar" boat

    I'm useing a boomed spritsail designed in the 1800's for my Ducker .The boom is extreamly light ( bends like a heavy batten close hauled) and is fitted with a 2 part topping lift which functions as a brail : one part on each side of the sail. Haul this in - boom and sail are securely bound to the mast . As mentioned the boomed sail is more practical down wind . Typically when I brail up it is because the wind has dropped so low I can , for the moment, row the boat faster than she can sail .I just leave the mast up until I have completly given up on the winds return . I guess that's my definition of a sail and oar boat.
    Last edited by Bill Perkins; 10-17-2022 at 04:19 PM.

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