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Thread: LYS Build Plans #582

  1. #1
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    Default LYS Build Plans #582

    Mostly I blame my Son in Law (and my Daughter for marrying him). Don't get me wrong, I love them both and he is a great guy. I have heard it said that women tend to marry someone like their father, and she found someone that likes boats as much or more than I do. Did I mention that he is also builds wooden boats? He has built cedar strip canoes and stitch and glue kayaks and the like.

    For a long time I have been living in Central Florida far from either oceans or bays. The siren song of water and waves, the sight of a 180 degree horizon of blue green water, sunsets and sunrises on the water, all these things have been out of my mind for many years. Oh, to be sure there are lots of fine lakes around, and I have enjoyed the occasional afternoon boating on them with one friend or another, but somehow I could walk away at the end without being haunted by the longing for a boat of my own. I was content borrowing and or renting the boating experience.

    Then it happened. Daughter and Son in Law bought a place on the water. Now even to get to their house I have to drive over several bridges and look at all that water and all those boats. Standing in their back yard I have to listen to the waves, smell the salty sea air, hear all of the sounds of river and ocean beyond. Once again I can not stop daydreaming about boats.

    Well, after lots of searching and planning, I settled on Walter Baron's Lumber Yard Skiff. The 16' version is really big for that size boat but still fits in my garage. I like the boat's heritage as a work boat. The building process is well within my skills and space available (2 car garage). It also promises to be a relatively quick build. I enjoy building, but I also want to be boating before too long.

    Many thanks to Spokaloo, chilli, PNWCrabber, martin1302, CJ, and others for their excellent build threads here on the forum and elsewhere. Those threads and web sites have been an valuable resource as I planned and thought through this build.

    So, enough about me, on to the build.

    It is a Lumber Yard Skiff, so I have to get the material from the local lumber yard, right? Anyway, I plan on encapsulating with epoxy and glassing at least the bottom, so why cover up beautiful expensive marine plywood? The local yard has a plywood they call Marine Tech which looks ok and is certainly for exterior use (they say it is for decking pontoon boats and such), so I went with that. The rest of the lumber is right off the plans, Fir and Spruce etc.

    The lumber arrived a couple days ago. My wife's first question was "Is that enough wood to build a boat?"


    20150715_093227_sm.jpg
    Last edited by shuffjb; 05-07-2018 at 01:20 PM. Reason: Fix Pictures

  2. #2
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Stern Posts cut

    20150716_075457_sm.jpg
    Last edited by shuffjb; 05-07-2018 at 01:20 PM. Reason: Fix Pictures

  3. #3
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Side Panels butt Joined


    20150719_130909_sm.jpg
    Last edited by shuffjb; 05-07-2018 at 01:21 PM. Reason: Fix Pictures

  4. #4
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Side Panels cured, screw points ground, and standing up ready for next weekend. It already has a boaty shape.

    20150719_162146_sm.jpg
    Last edited by shuffjb; 05-07-2018 at 01:21 PM. Reason: Fix Pictures

  5. #5
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Great progress so far! I look forward to your build. By the way, did you decide on the LYS or the LYSS and why?

  6. #6
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    I picked the standard work skiff (LYS) because it is a little wider in the rear and a little less rocker. Kind of a guess since I couldn't see them side by side. I think it will be a bit roomier. I also want to stay a bit closer too the "work boat" heritage.

    Time will tell if I am happy with the choice.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Quote Originally Posted by shuffjb View Post
    Mostly I blame my Son in Law (and my Daughter for marrying him).
    For once I'm happy to be blamed for something

    I'm pretty excited to come out this weekend and lend a hand!
    Jon
    Building - Ulua Outrigger

  8. #8
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Quote Originally Posted by shuffjb View Post
    ...The lumber arrived a couple days ago. My wife's first question was "Is that enough wood to build a boat?"
    And, of course, you answered "No, dear - this is just to get construction started", or words to that effect...

    Tom

  9. #9
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Great to see another one of these put together. It's funny, I picked the LYSS because that's the boat in the picture on the cover of the construction manual. I called Walt to confirm and I thought that was such a beautiful picture I decided to emulate it as best I could (although there is no water like that water in the Pacific Northwest). Didn't give much thought to anything other than that but I knew I wanted a console and decks too.

    Good luck with your build - you're making great progress!

  10. #10
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Quote Originally Posted by Mad Scientist View Post
    And, of course, you answered "No, dear - this is just to get construction started", or words to that effect...

    Tom
    LOL, pretty much Tom. I did have fun with some friends who were over for dinner. I offered to show them my new boat. They followed me into the garage with high expectations and chuckled when I showed them showed them the stacked lumber (That crazy John is at it again they were thinking).

  11. #11
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Quote Originally Posted by PNW Crabber View Post
    Great to see another one of these put together. It's funny, I picked the LYSS because that's the boat in the picture on the cover of the construction manual. I called Walt to confirm and I thought that was such a beautiful picture I decided to emulate it as best I could (although there is no water like that water in the Pacific Northwest). Didn't give much thought to anything other than that but I knew I wanted a console and decks too.

    Good luck with your build - you're making great progress!
    Thanks for the good wishes. I love that picture as well. Actually my wife loves the color in that picture so now I know what color paint I need to find.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Well not much progress today, will probably jump ahead a big bunch this weekend when Jon (son in law) comes over to help.

    Besides the fun of building, here is my mission profile for the LYS: Wife and I and maybe another couple Running around the bays and rivers and some mild off shore excursions. We will also spend some time in the Lakes of Florida and North Carolina. I will dust off my fishing gear and skills just to have more reasons to go out. To that end I am probably going to add in a casting deck forward as well as sticking with the Center Console look.

    For the center console, I was thinking about sticking with the basic one in the plans, but I have been following Walter's build of a fishing skiff on his facebook page and I like the look of the console he has done there so maybe I can adapt something similar for my console. Seems like a good place for battery and gas tank.

    https://www.facebook.com/15947015410...e=3&permPage=1

    Anyway, I plan to deck the sides and front as the plans show. This will give me good attach points for a Bimini top as well as adding some stiffness and a place to step when getting onto and off of high docks.

    For power I already have a Mercury 25hp 2 stroke with controls. From all I hear this should be enough to make her go.

    I am still up in the air about leaving the stern and bow posts long. I like the look on Spokaloo's boat, but since I am decking the sides and bow, it may not blend well with the long posts. I may split the difference and leave them at 4-6" or so and put a cross piece through the middle to act in place of cleats. There is probably a nautical name for this. Thankfully I don't have to decide until we flip her over and work on the finishing.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Quote Originally Posted by shuffjb View Post
    Thanks for the good wishes. I love that picture as well. Actually my wife loves the color in that picture so now I know what color paint I need to find.
    So I actually asked Walt about the color. It is Petitt Platinum - it looks blue due to the reflection of the sky on the water. I actually made the decision to paint my boat with high end SW house paint in a very light gray - hoping to achieve the same results.

  14. #14
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    You can cut the posts anytime, even after you deck it. It's a wood boat, do what you want!

    Good on you, get building. Keep us posted.

    E

  15. #15
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Had a good building day this Saturday. As Jon (my Son in Law) puts it "the boat became 3D"

    First, cleaned up the side posts and cut the bottom bevel on the transom:

    20150725_093845_sm.jpg

    Jon attaching the stern side posts:

    20150725_103305_sm.jpg


    For all of the fretting and mental gymnastics I have been going through, the stem turned out to be relatively easy. I looked at some pictures from an LYSS that was built at the Wooden Boat School. When cutting the stem, they set up the table saw for 1/2 of the angle on the stem and the fence for 1/2 of the width of the 4x4 (which is really 3.5 x 3.5 or at least mine is). Then they cranked the saw so it only cuts about 3/4 inch and run the stem through one side, then the other. We did a lot of checking to be sure we were hitting the center. Then we cranked the saw up another 3/4 inch or so, run it through again, and so on. Disaster almost got us when I cranked the saw too high on the last cut and it broke through. We were all smiles and stoked by how cool the angle looked until we turned it around for pass 2 and there was no more wood where the wedge used to be. Gack! (and other words followed). After some head scratching and walking around to look at the angles, an idea came to us. We just but the offcut back in place and fudged the fence in a little to account for saw kerf. The woodworking gods smiled down and we got a textbook stem:


    20150725_134649_sm.jpg
    Last edited by shuffjb; 05-07-2018 at 01:24 PM. Reason: Fix Pictures

  16. #16
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Now time to fair the bottom edge of the side panels. Jon showing the old man how to use the nifty Japanese pull saw while Chris (another Son in Law) is helping to hold things steady. These razor pull saws are amazing! I am glad he left it for me to use during the rest of the build, it has come in handy. The transom is clamped to a dolly in the background waiting for it's meeting with the sides.

    20150725_140022_sm.jpg

    After Lunch, Stem and port side panel meet for the first time (note appropriate boat building footwear):

    20150725_142205_sm.jpg

    I am probably too fussy about screw patterns, but my airplane building experience (a story for another thread) makes me feel out of kilter if I don't lay out a grid for screw placement. Anyway, drilled and countersunk:

    20150725_145820_sm.jpg

    Glue, Screw, flip, repeat for the starboard side and we have the classic LYS "butterfly" (that's what I choose to call it):


    20150725_155217_sm.jpg
    Last edited by shuffjb; 05-07-2018 at 01:26 PM. Reason: Fix Pictures

  17. #17
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    So, this was about as far as I thought we would get. For context, my Daughters are inside with an infant, a toddler and a 4 year old and the clock(s) are ticking... It was pouring rain off and on, so they couldn't even walk around the neighborhood. As it turns out, the 4 year old and the toddler are keeping each other occupied, so it wasn't bad for them.

    But seeing the sides standing up inspired us to keep on going. So the plans call for a Spanish Windlass (twisty rope and stick thing) and two regulation IKEA chairs (just kidding, that is what I had in the garage that turned out to be the right height). I used a come-along because I had one, but I did tie some properly nautical bowlines in a couple of loops of rope to hook the come-along to:

    20150725_163926_sm.jpg


    So at this point I am cringing and looking for excuses to delay the next part because this is where things have gone sideways for several folks. Well, since you have seen Chris and Jon, here I am. Do I look scared? I was, but excited and happy too.


    20150725_163946_sm.jpg
    Last edited by shuffjb; 05-07-2018 at 01:28 PM. Reason: Fix Pictures

  18. #18
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Well, here goes, we started cranking the come-along a little at a time. In other builds, I have seen wax paper used to help the sides come in smoothly. We just scooted the IKEA chairs along to keep up with the slow cranking. Heard a few creaking/cracking noises along the way:

    20150725_165449_sm.jpg

    And...

    20150725_184132_sm.jpg

    Maybe it was the pink scooter, maybe this Marine Tech plywood doesn't have voids in the wrong place, who knows? I am a happy boat builder, because it was: Glue, Clamp, Screw the starboard side, crank the come-along, Glue, Clamp, Screw the port side and Shazam! It is a boat!

    View from the bow:

    20150725_184156_sm.jpg

    I have seen the centerline thingy in other builds, so I figured I would add one here too. For what it's worth, she measures 30" from the butt blocks to the centerline both sides. That seems like a good thing. The shape looks right which is the other test for boats and airplanes.

    Now we really were out of time for building, but it was a good day.

    One question that keeps coming back to mind: What do you guys use to fill the holes where the countersunk screws are? I plan on glassing the whole exterior. Everything I read on this seems to say epoxy thickened with wood flour, but I wonder if I use wood putty of some sort that is compatible with epoxy if that would be ok? I am just looking for something not quite so fussy for the filling and sanding of all those holes. It seems like this can be a relaxing Zen-like experience, but the ticking timer of the epoxy would make it not so relaxing.

    Next on the schedule are the Chine Logs. Jon helped me rip them the next day and I am fussing with getting them bent to the right shape. I may resort to steam like PNWCrabber, but I don't have the gear around.

    John
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by shuffjb; 05-07-2018 at 01:30 PM. Reason: Fix Pictures

  19. #19
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Looking great! My kids are both very young right now (2.5 years and 7 months) but I'm looking forward to the day that I can build a boat with them. Thanks for sharing.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    With small holes like that you might find thickened epoxy not so bad. Mix small batches, and where you are you can get away with using a slow hardener which will give you extra time.

  21. #21
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Quote Originally Posted by shuffjb View Post

    Next on the schedule are the Chine Logs. Jon helped me rip them the next day and I am fussing with getting them bent to the right shape. I may resort to steam like PNWCrabber, but I don't have the gear around.

    John
    Sorry we ran out of time Sunday to test fit the chines. They seemed pretty limber. I bet they could do with a hot wet towel wrap and maybe a heat gun. Clamp them into place, and let them rest a day before gluing and screwing them in. Or perhaps the sikaflex/pl would work fine on damp wood, I haven't used it until now. For epoxy I'd do whatever dampening needed to clamp them in place, then wait for the dry time and then glue them in.

    But WOW that was fun! I've been doping around in my garage for a few years now by myself. It is so much better with good company! (and beer, and BBQ)

    I'm already eying my garage for a possible LYS build. I'm pretty sure it could live in the canal most of the year, but I should probably finish my long running Ulua build first.
    Jon
    Building - Ulua Outrigger

  22. #22
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Well the chine logs kicked my butt for most of a day. I finally weighted them down with the curve built in overnight and they were still tricky pull into place. Anyway, once I clamped the stern end with a block across the transom to stop it from rising, I was able to put other end low in the bow and bring it up as I pulled in the middle. This is definitely one where a crew of benders would have helped. Really not that much force required, but hard to do delicate adjustments while under pretty big tension. So Chine Logs mounted, check.

    I put the stern and bow posts on wheels (small 4 wheel auto dollies) and played tetris with the garage for several hours, now the Wife's car fits in the boat shop again. I will be cleaning up and fairing the chines this week in evenings. If all goes well, this weekend will be when the bottom goes on, then she will be a boat for sure.

  23. #23
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Glad to hear it went well. I firmly believe the doug fir I used would have cracked/snapped without steam. Looks like you are making great progress. I started out using bondo but if you let it cure past the soft stage it's a bear to sand. I then switched to System Three epoxy with microballons which was great - sanded easily, cures well and is pretty much compatible with anything you want to put over it.

  24. #24
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Quote Originally Posted by Crazer View Post
    With small holes like that you might find thickened epoxy not so bad. Mix small batches, and where you are you can get away with using a slow hardener which will give you extra time.
    Thanks for the information! I am going to have to dive into the epoxy pool sooner or later, so sooner it is.

  25. #25
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Quote Originally Posted by PNW Crabber View Post
    Glad to hear it went well. I firmly believe the doug fir I used would have cracked/snapped without steam. Looks like you are making great progress. I started out using bondo but if you let it cure past the soft stage it's a bear to sand. I then switched to System Three epoxy with microballons which was great - sanded easily, cures well and is pretty much compatible with anything you want to put over it.
    Thanks for the info! I just got the trial kit from bateau and will be playing around with that. It has microballoons and wood flour and some other stuff. I was going to dive into the epoxy sooner or later anyway, so sooner. Oh and I forgot to thank you for the info on the paint color, that will help when the time comes.

  26. #26
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Well, some days you get big visible progress and some days you don't. Spent more hours than I thought I would fairing up the chines. I was using the hand plane, so that slowed me down, but watching the big lovely curlicues of wood come off the blade is really nice. All my helpers are out of town, so wrestling the sheets of 3/4 plywood took lots more time than I figured it would. Anyway, what project takes as long as we think it will? Here she is with the 3 big bottom panels rough fitted:

    20150801_161449_sm.jpg

    Next morning I trimmed the panels even closer using the band saw. Another time sink while I set up a table to support the panel. Half way through the first cut, a little bit of wood flipped into the slot between the blade and the guide on the saw, big friction and a loud pop! Broken blade I thought (as well as saying a few plumbing words). Congratulating myself for keeping a spare blade handy, I proceeded to open the saw and found out that the blade was just popped off the wheels. Whew! Still, another time sink, but this is supposed to be fun time anyway, so why not take more of it? Blade back on and me more vigilant for little chips, got the panels trimmed down to no more than 1/4" oversize.

    Time to layout the screw holes and get ready to put the bottom on. In several pictures from a build at the Wooden Boat School, they were using a custom marking device with tape and a pencil to offset the screw holes. Not sure if it is Walter's or a Wooden Boat School thing, but props for the idea. It took me 2 tries to get the offset right and the hole for the oversize panel to stick out big enough. Here is my version in use (1/2" ply):

    20150802_131248_sm.jpg

    More gluing and screwing in my future now. Hoping to get the bottom completely on this week since I will be out of town next weekend.

    John
    Last edited by shuffjb; 05-07-2018 at 01:58 PM. Reason: Fix Pictures

  27. #27
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    When using your marking jig keep in mind that when you are marking plywood 3/4" higher than the chine the angle of the fasteners will make them land farther outboard. You want to mark the ply so the fasteners land in the center of the chines at the same angle as the chines.

  28. #28
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Thanks for the heads up. I was making it cut to fit, so my first version was to the chine itself, but when I put the 3/4 ply in there I needed to change the offset as you point out so that the line falls at the correct depth to hit the center of the chine.

  29. #29
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Well the bottom is on and the project will be parked for a week or two, off to my nephew's wedding.

    I am debating whether to flip her over and finish the inside before fairing the edge of the bottom. I feel like I am going to be putting a few more screws through the sides or bottom as part of the finishing, so I don't want to put on any glass yet. Laying the glass and painting seem so much easier upside down. I would have to make the console removable (or at least not attach it until she is right-side up for the last time).

    What does everyone think?

    John

  30. #30
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    I sort of went through the same debate in my mind and decided if I needed to I would just turn it over again. As it turns out, it was so easy to roll over the first time I wouldn't hesitate to go back and forth if you wanted to - just need a little man power.

  31. #31
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Thanks for the reply, good to know it is pretty easy. I will feel better if I get all the inside framing in place.

    Just put on my first batch of Epoxy putty (wood flour filled) to fill a few screw holes. Using Marine Epoxy from Bateau.com. Got one of their trial kits to try the process. Painless so far, will see how it looks after cure.

    John

  32. #32
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Today was console day. All of the looking and thinking finally jelled into a design. I ended up near to the dimensions of Walter's sketch. The main change I made was to incline the Helm and Throttle panel. Here are some pics of the mockup:

    From the right

    20150815_124939_sm.jpg

    20150815_125140_sm.jpg

    From the left

    20150815_125227_sm.jpg

    Dead on. The throttle will be surface mounted to the right of the Helm.

    I will scan my sketch and post it later, but it is 24 wide, 18 deep and 42 to the top of the flat panel above the Helm.

    Now to build it and continue filling screw holes:

    20150815_125250_sm.jpg

    John
    Last edited by shuffjb; 05-07-2018 at 02:01 PM. Reason: Fix Pictures

  33. #33
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    I remember filling screw holes and it felt like forever. I should have started with the epoxy and microballoons - it would have gone much faster. Your console looks great! I kicked around the idea of the slanted helm but decided to forgo to follow Walt's original look. I am thinking I am going to put a removable bar behind the helm to lean against. Either way, we will need to compare notes after sea trials.

  34. #34
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    Smile Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Thanks for the kind words on the console. It seems like I spent a lot of time getting to what turned out to be a pretty basic design. I look forward to comparing notes. Thanks also for the micro balloons tip, the wood flour is ok, but it takes a lot to thicken the mix. I just got a batch of micro balloons, so the next hole filling session I will try them as filler.

    I looked at leaning posts and all kinds of seating ideas. I settled on a flip-back cooler seat:

    WiseCoolerSeat_8WD159-784.jpg

    I will need to raise it up some to get good sight lines and maybe kind of serve as a leaning post. Shouldn't be too hard, lots of 2X4, 2X8 drop offs laying around . Again, sea-trials will tell the tale.

    As promised, here is the sketch. Typical orthogonal views, Top with Side under it and Helmsman's (Helmsperson's?) view to the right. One detail not spelled out is that the front and back panels are 24 wide and the side panels 18, butting into the front and back so the actual width stays 24 but the depth front to back is 18 + 3/4 + 3/4 for the front/back panels. Oh, and the grid is 3" = 1 square in case you want to interpolate some dimension I didn't draw.


    ConsoleSketch.jpg

    For anyone else who is daydreaming/designing consoles, I found this sketch very helpful profile-console-redrw-72-1.jpg

    John
    Last edited by shuffjb; 05-07-2018 at 02:06 PM.

  35. #35
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    Default Re: LYS Build Plans #582

    Sons in Law and another boatbuilding friend dropped in on Sunday, so I took advantage of the extra hands and decided to flip the boat over. As everyone says, it is easy with 2 or 3 guys. Rolled her out so the transom was at the edge of the grass, then picked up the bow and over she went. Of course I had to stand inside for a quick "lawn trial" (pics when I get them).

    I am working on the top rails and framing for the side decks. Sure is scary to cut out part of the but block for the rails, but the joint continues to hold. Here she is after the flip:


    20150817_110505.jpg


    20150817_110625.jpg

    Wow, this is a big boat for 16'

    John
    Last edited by shuffjb; 05-07-2018 at 02:08 PM. Reason: Fix Pictures

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