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Thread: Restoring Lively Lady II

  1. #36
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    The good weather held all weekend thank God but heavy rain was (and did come early this morning) predicted today. To beat that - We sanded the boat really well. As we wrapped up for the night on Saturday I had 2 10'x30' clear plastic sheets that i hung off the side to keep the moisture off. I ran a small heater inside that warmed up the hull. So when we got back on sunday morning we could begin the paint prep. We sanded it ok - there are still some blemishes to be fixed next time - then we rolled on 2 coats of sandable wood primer which helped greatly. luckily the yard warmed up to nearly 63 degrees. The primer was dry within 2 hours. the starboard side of the keel to hull proved not be as bad i thought initially so i grinded, sanded and filled in the large but manageable void too. Easy enough really when luck falls on one's side and motivation along with it. As the primer dried - we began painting the bottom with can of west marines cheap copper bottom paint. I sure i wouldn't have paid for the job i did but it is good enough till spring. We really moved again 3 guys on her again!

    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 12-15-2014 at 01:42 PM.
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  2. #37
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    As the bottom painted dried - we began putting on the enamel white with a little thinne after a scuffing and a wipe down with acetone. The sun came out and the wind died. Nearly perfect conditions to do a one coat wonder. ( I plan on doing second coat dockside in the next cycle when i have time and weather on my side). the sun remained for a hour after we had finished allowing the enamal to dry to the touch before I left.

    I thought it came out pretty well and so did my friends.







    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 12-15-2014 at 01:45 PM.
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  3. #38
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    I am not quite happy with the port side of the keel. I am going to go back tonight and resand and grind out my work. I think i want a better filler than what i used. I might as well do it right this time. I have 2 more days and can work as couple more hours. additionally, i have a bit more taping to do at the water line and need to add a possible boot stripe....

    On the flip side - Hopefully the paint is dry enough as the rain did come down this morning in buckets. The weather window is closed until the following weekend and i will be back at the dock. I am sure that I will post the work i will need to redo - . All in all good weekend spent with friends making this boat beautiful.
    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 12-15-2014 at 01:47 PM.
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  4. #39
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Wow Ted, she looks amazing! Glad the keel void is not serious. Get ready for some fun! Small boats rock rock. Ha ha.

  5. #40
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Great boat, I wonder if Lively Lady 1 is the Sir Alec Rose one, they are certainly different

  6. #41

    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    I love the lines on your boat... nice job.

  7. #42
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Thanks! Really happy to get this far with all that has been going on and the weather too. I really had to know how bad she was before i got too deep.

    Frankly i got pushed a bit more than i wanted do my discretionary budget evaporating. My son had to have all four impacted wisdom teeth pulled and insurance only covered a 1/3 as well as having to come up with other some "top secret" christmas cash deposits on some summer family travels.
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  8. #43
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Well done Ted,
    She cleaned up very nicely.

  9. #44
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Did you end up putting any new glass on the keel joint Ted? I was looking at a chico on the hard last weekend but didn't take a photo for you because it had an odd cabin top.

  10. #45
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Hoppe View Post
    I am not quite happy with the port side of the keel. I am going to go back tonight and resand and grind out my work. I think i want a better filler than what i used. I might as well do it right this time. I have 2 more days and can work as couple more hours. additionally, i have a bit more taping to do at the water line and need to add a possible boot stripe....

    On the flip side - Hopefully the paint is dry enough as the rain did come down this morning in buckets. The weather window is closed until the following weekend and i will be back at the dock. I am sure that I will post the work i will need to redo - . All in all good weekend spent with friends making this boat beautiful.
    I am not a boat restorer by any means but am following your thread with interest.
    I guess I am confused by your plan as you seem to be rushing thru a quick fix/ sanding and painting job in order to rush it back into the water for the winter, and then pull it out and re-do it all in the spring? Why wouldn't you slow down and do it all right, once? It doesn't even seem like your epoxy patches have time to cure. Maybe I ammissing something?
    thanks and good luck!

  11. #46
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Quote Originally Posted by LennieG View Post
    I am not a boat restorer by any means but am following your thread with interest.
    I guess I am confused by your plan as you seem to be rushing thru a quick fix/ sanding and painting job in order to rush it back into the water for the winter, and then pull it out and re-do it all in the spring? Why wouldn't you slow down and do it all right, once? It doesn't even seem like your epoxy patches have time to cure. Maybe I ammissing something?
    thanks and good luck!
    that is a really good question.

    there are many ways to start a restoration. everyone has a perspective and their own ideas on how to go about it. Most restorations are based on time, place, cash and availability. so when I picked up this 1200 dollar boat in late September and sailed it down from Bodega bay nearly 100 miles away - I had no idea what the boat looked like out of the water and worried about the hull's integrity . Frankly from my dock side buyers estimate - I knew I could bring her to a reasonable state quickly. my restorations are about personal journey, learning as I go and taking in the pieces to pull this project together. I am so happily married with an active teenage son, work full time as a shooting producer, support two other family businesses that involves weeks of travel, am a flag officer in charge of events at a local yacht club and am actively involved in the Master Mariners where I working hard to turn this year into a world class event week to complement our wonderful regatta.

    there are lots of factors and compromises to think about and everyone makes them - it took me two months to get a spot at the only DYI place within 50 miles. Many will tell you that the Berkeley Marine Center is a great place to begin an assessment. To haul out a boat like this costs around 400 dollars. Every day it is on the hard it means about 50 dollars a day. Taking a boat out of the water in winter here lately means that 5 out of 7 days a week it is raining in an open dirty, wet yard. One can either chose to pay someone or do it yourself (remember this is a hobby of repair) in addition to the lay days and supplies or get enough done to keep the hull in better condition and work from the water up. I just don't see how i could justify to pay 350 a week for the next 2 months so I could work 7 hours a week. particularly poignant fact is that I could have a 1/2 complete boat that is sailable now, improves every week and yet could be worked on within 5 minutes from my home by bicycle. like I said, it is about the fun adventure that happens when you are working on something worthwhile - why rush something you love.

    The other part of the question is the epoxy I used was a West System GFlex - the cure time is about 12 hours at 60 degrees. I ground out the area, laid down some fiberglass tape, mixed in some mahogany flour and had the epoxy in setting for 24 hours before painting. it is a goto epoxy when you are looking for a fast cure, excellent underwater service and takes paint well.
    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 12-15-2014 at 11:33 PM.
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  12. #47
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Hoppe View Post
    that is a really good question.

    there are many ways to start a restoration. everyone has a perspective and their own ideas on how to go about it. Most restorations are based on time, place, cash and availability. so when I picked up this 1200 dollar boat in late September and sailed it down from Bodega bay nearly 100 miles away - I had no idea what the boat looked like out of the water and worried about the hull's integrity . Frankly from my dock side buyers estimate - I knew I could bring her to a reasonable state quickly. my restorations are about personal journey, learning as I go and taking in the pieces to pull this project together. I am so happily married with an active teenage son, work full time as a shooting producer, support two other family businesses that involves weeks of travel, am a flag officer in charge of events at a local yacht club and am actively involved in the Master Mariners where I working hard to turn this year into a world class event week to complement our wonderful regatta.

    there are lots of factors and compromises to think about and everyone makes them - it took me two months to get a spot at the only DYI place within 50 miles. Many will tell you that the Berkeley Marine Center is a great place to begin an assessment. To haul out a boat like this costs around 400 dollars. Every day it is on the hard it means about 50 dollars a day. Taking a boat out of the water in winter here lately means that 5 out of 7 days a week it is raining in an open dirty, wet yard. One can either chose to pay someone or do it yourself (remember this is a hobby of repair) in addition to the lay days and supplies or get enough done to keep the hull in better condition and work from the water up. I just don't see how i could justify to pay 350 a week for the next 2 months so I could work 7 hours a week. particularly poignant fact is that I could have a 1/2 complete boat that is sailable now, improves every week and yet could be worked on within 5 minutes from my home by bicycle. like I said, it is about the fun adventure that happens when you are working on something worthwhile - why rush something you love.

    The other part of the question is the epoxy I used was a West System GFlex - the cure time is about 12 hours at 60 degrees. I ground out the area, laid down some fiberglass tape, mixed in some mahogany flour and had the epoxy in setting for 24 hours before painting. it is a goto epoxy when you are looking for a fast cure, excellent underwater service and takes paint well.
    Thanks for the thorough response. The boat looks great and I will follow all the way through. I understand the trade-offs you are dealing with and will be rooting for you as you proceed.
    good luck!

  13. #48
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Got her back in the water after stopping in settle up on the bill, eat some pizza and enjoy Carl's 29th or 92nd birthday cake.



    I was quite pleased that about how much i got done with all the rain and bad weather. I was even happier that the yard bill hadn't broken my bank and will allow me to return back in the summer. I must be more than a little Scottish than i take credit for and obviously come from the most frugal Yankee forefathers - So for less than 1k i was in hauled, painted and released. Next time I haul it should be about the same except with better eye appealing results.

    I hadn't counted on and didn't think they were gonna a launch her be due to the rainy weather... So after i left the office i climbed aboard, warmed up into the cabin and was puttering around when i got a knock on the hull... "Ready to go in..." Yep i said and began to hustle to secure the electrics, heater and tools. As soon as they had me in the cradle and lifted the rain stuck again. the torrents of water made for a questionable finishing touch on the keel and third coat of bottom paint on the stands voids. Within 30 mins i was from the pads into the water. I passed the car on to my wife and hopped aboard. The 6 hp outboard was a bit stubborn and took 5 pulls with the choke on to get going. I motored way with the wind picking up and the rain soaking trough my foulies. Lively Lady was underway against ebb from Berkeley to the Alameda - with a clean bottom she did nearly 6 knots at 3/4 throttle - that goes to show me what a clean bottom will do!



    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 12-22-2014 at 03:32 PM.
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  14. #49
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Here i am headed into the rainstorm - holding a cup of cold coffee from the morning thermos, an oat/peanut power bar yet hardly containing my huge smile knowing the next few weekends she be even better. (Note the unsecured line... a bit too cold for me to retrieve it on the wet and slick foredeck.)

    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 12-22-2014 at 03:40 PM.
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  15. #50
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Nice to have her back in her element. Looking forward to some sailing reports. Does winter there shut you down?

  16. #51
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    She looks like a lot of fun!
    Great work on the freshening. Can't wait to see what you do in the spring.
    Ron

  17. #52
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Keep at it, Ted!

    Something about cosmetics (paint) is that there is always a next time. I think it takes most people a couple of goes to get really great results but as long as you see improvement every time you know you are headed in the right direction. She looks so much better now!

    I agree that (paraphrasing you) restoration is much about process.
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  18. #53
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Y View Post
    Nice to have her back in her element. Looking forward to some sailing reports. Does winter there shut you down?
    Around here have a mild winter. I think it is similar to Adelaide. The rain has been three times the usual as our draught seems to be breaking - we have had 15 inches this last month - 8 of them last week. Our sailing season is broken into three different ones. We have winter sailing which is when we tune up as the winds can be flukey but the dry days are delightful. Our Spring and summer sailing is tremendous as winds are 12 to 25 almost every afternoon. Late summer and fall are warm with good winds - it is like sailing the Med. When i get around to warmer, longer days. Epoxy sets in hours and primer does well without primer. Thats when the long sanding boards will come out. I might be a bit odd in the world of restoration but i need to be practical. I learned recently that life is quite uncertain so i really work hard to make the most out of everything i have. The boat is no exception. She is ready to sail at a moments notice and can never be perfect. Still - i am expecting to be pushing the boat in January when we will do the Three Bridge fiasco - nearly 300 boats tray to sail around all three bridges (25 miles) before 7 pm.





    There is much to do in the interior. I have a nice bronze and porcelain Wilcox head with a 3 gallon holding tank i need to pick up and prepare. it will go forward as will the new sink, gimbaled stove, and molding - all plenty to do when the weather is wet. I am lucky to have a nice wood shop right off the dock.
    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 12-22-2014 at 07:42 PM.
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  19. #54
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    That photo gives a clear path to the term pipe berth.
    One of the most enduring qualities of an old wooden boat is the smell it imparts to your clothing.

  20. #55
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Ted...is there any fiberglass sheathing on the hull? The photos look like it's just wood and paint (or epoxy?). Very impressive that the hull has stood up so well over time. Beautiful boat with an enviable pedigree. I hope she will bring you a great deal of joy and pleasure over the years.

  21. #56
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    no fiberglass or epoxy sheathing at all on the wood. The right combo of weather and water has added life to this finely crafted boat. The next time I haul her out, i will use an epoxy with mahogany filler to fill the divots and deep scratches. Then i will decide on the course of care. I would hate to sheath anything that has lasted so long and so well. Hopefully my skills will be good enough when the time comes to replace the fine planking so beautifully done.

    The two pipe berths that are set before the sink on the port and starboard sides are pretty roomy with great headroom. I can imagine the boat sleeping three soon.
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  22. #57
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Thanks Ted. No need to sheath. Perhaps a few coats of Epoxy resin at some point as a sealer. I'll be looking forward to more on your restoration. Best of luck!

  23. #58
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    I did pull the aft winch mounts. I am glad i did. They were rotten just below the surface with numerous spiders living in the honeycomb rot. Now i must decide where the winches go. Stay inside with a rebuild or go outside for better cockpit comfort? (the last two pictures were taken before the deck got sanded and primed)

    What would be your preference?





    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 01-29-2015 at 02:14 PM.
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  24. #59
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Pretty sure it will be easier on the back to leave them in the current positions. I mean reaching out over the coamings, not sitting. The crew can't be allowed to get too comfortable, after all!

  25. #60
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Quote Originally Posted by Don Kurylko View Post
    Pretty sure it will be easier on the back to leave them in the current positions. I mean reaching out over the coamings, not sitting. The crew can't be allowed to get too comfortable, after all!
    My wife is looking forward to reading and taking warm sunny naps on those wide benches. I like the fact that it is harder to throw away a winch handle away when it remains inside for 80 percent of the time when mounted that way. I am considering a modification that keeps them inside but is more sculptured to accommodate a better back resting position. I started to gather teak to begin. I make one and see how it goes - a inside drink holder underneath would be quite trick!
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  26. #61
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    New update - I am rebuilding her into a racing weekend boat. Made a beautiful spruce boom but it look like she was a toothpick. I am planning on using the forward traveller above the cabin hatch board so this has cause me to change for something cutting edge. So a this is my first venture into a carbon fiber boom. I located a two 10 foot sections of carbon masts left over from what i was told... the AC45 boats. I fused the sections together with a very tight sleeving together (nearly 18 inches tube within a tube) with gaps filled in with epoxy, carbon rods and carbon tape. They should withstand sever compression, a good blow, be very rigid and last a long time. I increased the boom from 8 feet (old IOR boom made of Cedar) to just over 12 feet of wrapped carbon and bronze. She now will be able to carry loose footed sails as well as shelved foots incase I want to go back. Ideally i will get a flat sail with 100 more square feet of main which will do wonders for her speed plus be able to reef in quick time when it blows. I will be able to now fly blades for upwind legs or use her great genoa to power her DDW.

    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 03-26-2015 at 11:48 AM.
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  27. #62
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    I like some of the old school bronze which i plan to use. Some more boom pictures included too. For bails - I plan on using this high tech web straps which have great tensile strength, superior holding without any holes in the boom and can be adjusted on the boom for more fine tune adjustments. I also plan on making a solid bronze, stainless and carbon fiber vang to work as a topping lift and provide boom control. The old bronze and carbon will look sexy and durable. As for the outhaul and the reefing - they will be internal with custom carbon-stainless fittings, custom covered sheeves and (2) 4 to 1 blocks to cheek blocks with spectra line leading to clam and cool Harkin cleats that can be loaded by stepping on them at the foot of the mast then locked in. There are no sharp edges and lines will easily be able to be restrung from time to time.





    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 03-26-2015 at 11:26 AM.
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  28. #63
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Started to bend wood for the solid carbon vang.





    Bending wood for brackets and mounts.

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  29. #64
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    The carbon fiber outhaul came out well. The boom will be exceptionally strong with internal rigging. The ring was hand stitched -- not my strongest suit but durable .
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  30. #65
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    I am constructing removable boom bails and vang - below is a blank for the bails. The nylon straps with buckle will be stronger and lighter than steel plus there will be no holes at critical stress points.

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  31. #66
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Ted , is that steel directly into carbon I see ?

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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Quote Originally Posted by John B View Post
    Ted , is that steel directly into carbon I see ?
    I picked up the u-bolt from the boat show over the weekend. It is rated quite high and should outlive the rest of the boat. There are two backing plates which sandwich the 1 1/2" of solid carbon fiber. The stainless washers were mounted on a bed g-flex with predrilled holes. After the cure, I will redrill, fill again with gflex, then after the cure - drill again then coat in teflon. the total mast including the bronze gooseneck is 12.2' and weight is 28 LBS!

    I couldn't help it after a long day at work - raised an old Olson 25 sail from a previous boat. My boom is going to be great and the sail... well it will do. Moreover I will be ready to to do a club race on saturday with that old sail.

    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 04-16-2015 at 12:42 AM.
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  33. #68
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Something horrible is going on near the top of that sail.

  34. #69
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    That what happens when a lady wears a thong. (The insignia tape rolled bound the sail which was rung up before I had a chance to to clean it.)
    Last edited by Ted Hoppe; 04-16-2015 at 03:18 PM.
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  35. #70
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    Default Re: Restoring Lively Lady II

    Sounds well insulated there Ted . I don't have expertise with carbon but just know to be extra careful with metal near it, I've heard the horror stories. The best one being the million dollar racer cruiser with a faulty watermaker. The whole boat went live, the crew began to get shocks off the staunchions and SS fittings began to be visibly eroded away in the time they were aboard, the time it took to turn around and head for home.

    And I've seen a few fizzing jibs where they've used steel grommets which have broken through the plastic washer isulation . ( back in the day, I think they mostly use carbon grommets on those now)

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