Page 1 of 8 12 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 35 of 264

Thread: This man's fear is palpable.

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 1999
    Location
    Louisville, Kentucky
    Posts
    31,106

    Default This man's fear is palpable.

    . csme acro
    I came across this on Facebook 10 minutes ago. It affected me deeply. I am still feeling emotional. So I thought I would share:




    This is what I wore to work today. On my way to get a burrito before work, I was detained by the police.

    I noticed the police car in the public lot behind Centre Street. As I was walking away from my car, the cruiser followed me. I walked down Centre Street and was about to cross over to the burrito place and the officer got out of the car.

    "Hey my man," he said.

    He unsnapped the holster of his gun.

    I took my hands out of my pockets.

    "Yes?" I said.

    "Where you coming from?"

    "Home."

    Where's home?"

    "Dedham."

    How'd you get here?"

    "I drove."

    He was next to me now. Two other police cars pulled up. I was standing in from of the bank across the street from the burrito place. I was going to get lunch before I taught my 1:30 class. There were cops all around me.

    I said nothing. I looked at the officer who addressed me. He was white, stocky, bearded.

    "You weren't over there, were you?" He pointed down Centre Street toward Hyde Square.

    "No. I came from Dedham."

    "What's your address?"

    I told him.

    "We had someone matching your description just try to break into a woman's house."

    A second police officer stood next to me; white, tall, bearded. Two police cruisers passed and would continue to circle the block for the 35 minutes I was standing across the street from the burrito place.

    "You fit the description," the officer said. "Black male, knit hat, puffy coat. Do you have identification."

    "It's in my wallet. May I reach into my pocket and get my wallet?"

    "Yeah."

    I handed him my license. I told him it did not have my current address. He walked over to a police car. The other cop, taller, wearing sunglasses, told me that I fit the description of someone who broke into a woman's house. Right down to the knit cap.

    Barbara Sullivan made a knit cap for me. She knitted it in pinks and browns and blues and oranges and lime green. No one has a hat like this. It doesn't fit any description that anyone would have. I looked at the second cop. I clasped my hands in front of me to stop them from shaking.

    "For the record," I said to the second cop, "I'm not a criminal. I'm a college professor." I was wearing my faculty ID around my neck, clearly visible with my photo.

    "You fit the description so we just have to check it out." The first cop returned and handed me my license.

    "We have the victim and we need her to take a look at you to see if you are the person."

    It was at this moment that I knew that I was probably going to die. I am not being dramatic when I say this. I was not going to get into a police car. I was not going to present myself to some victim. I was not going let someone tell the cops that I was not guilty when I already told them that I had nothing to do with any robbery. I was not going to let them take me anywhere because if they did, the chance I was going to be accused of something I did not do rose exponentially. I knew this in my heart. I was not going anywhere with these cops and I was not going to let some white woman decide whether or not I was a criminal, especially after I told them that I was not a criminal. This meant that I was going to resist arrest. This meant that I was not going to let the police put their hands on me.

    If you are wondering why people don't go with the police, I hope this explains it for you.

    Something weird happens when you are on the street being detained by the police. People look at you like you are a criminal. The police are detaining you so clearly you must have done something, otherwise they wouldn't have you. No one made eye contact with me. I was hoping that someone I knew would walk down the street or come out of one of the shops or get off the 39 bus or come out of JP Licks and say to these cops, "That's Steve Locke. What the F*** are you detaining him for?"

    The cops decided that they would bring the victim to come view me on the street. The asked me to wait. I said nothing. I stood still.

    "Thanks for cooperating," the second cop said. "This is probably nothing, but it's our job and you do fit the description. 5' 11", black male. One-hundred-and-sixty pounds, but you're a little more than that. Knit hat."

    A little more than 160. Thanks for that, I thought.

    An older white woman walked behind me and up to the second cop. She turned and looked at me and then back at him. "You guys sure are busy today."

    I noticed a black woman further down the block. She was small and concerned. She was watching what was going on. I focused on her red coat. I slowed my breathing. I looked at her from time to time.

    I thought: Don't leave, sister. Please don't leave.

    The first cop said, "Where do you teach?"

    "Massachusetts College of Art and Design." I tugged at the lanyard that had my ID.

    "How long you been teaching there?"

    "Thirteen years."

    We stood in silence for about 10 more minutes.

    An unmarked police car pulled up. The first cop went over to talk to the driver. The driver kept looking at me as the cop spoke to him. I looked directly at the driver. He got out of the car.

    "I'm Detective Cardoza. I appreciate your cooperation."

    I said nothing.

    "I'm sure these officers told you what is going on?"

    "They did."

    "Where are you coming from?"

    "From my home in Dedham."

    "How did you get here?"

    "I drove."

    "Where is your car?"

    "It's in the lot behind Bukhara." I pointed up Centre Street.

    "Okay," the detective said. "We're going to let you go. Do you have a car key you can show me?"

    "Yes," I said. "I'm going to reach into my pocket and pull out my car key."

    "Okay."

    I showed him the key to my car.

    The cops thanked me for my cooperation. I nodded and turned to go.

    "Sorry for screwing up your lunch break," the second cop said.

    I walked back toward my car, away from the burrito place. I saw the woman in red.

    "Thank you," I said to her. "Thank you for staying."

    "Are you ok?" She said. Her small beautiful face was lined with concern.

    "Not really. I'm really shook up. And I have to get to work."

    "I knew something was wrong. I was watching the whole thing. The way they are treating us now, you have to watch them. "

    "I'm so grateful you were there. I kept thinking to myself, 'Don't leave, sister.' May I give you a hug?"

    "Yes," she said. She held me as I shook. "Are you sure you are ok?"

    "No I'm not. I'm going to have a good cry in my car. I have to go teach."

    "You're at MassArt. My friend is at MassArt."

    "What's your name?" She told me. I realized we were Facebook friends. I told her this.

    "I'll check in with you on Facebook," she said.

    I put my head down and walked to my car.

    My colleague was in our shared office and she was able to calm me down. I had about 45 minutes until my class began and I had to teach. I forgot the lesson I had planned. I forget the schedule. I couldn't think about how to do my job. I thought about the fact my word counted for nothing, they didn't believe that I wasn't a criminal. They had to find out. My word was not enough for them. My ID was not enough for them. My handmade one-of-a-kind knit hat was an object of suspicion. My Ralph Lauren quilted blazer was only a "puffy coat." That white woman could just walk up to a cop and talk about me like I was an object for regard. I wanted to go back and spit in their faces. The cops were probably deeply satisfied with how they handled the interaction, how they didn't escalate the situation, how they were respectful and polite.

    I imagined sitting in the back of a police car while a white woman decides if I am a criminal or not. If I looked guilty being detained by the cops imagine how vile I become sitting in a cruiser? I knew I could not let that happen to me. I knew if that were to happen, I would be dead.

    Nothing I am, nothing I do, nothing I have means anything because I fit the description.

    I had to confess to my students that I was a bit out of it today and I asked them to bear with me.

    I had to teach.

    After class I was supposed to go to the openings for First Friday. I went home.

    -Steve Locke
    https://www.stevelocke.com/blog/i-fit-the-description



    "We have come to live in a society based on insults, on lies and on things that just aren't true. It creates an environment where deranged people feel empowered." -- Colin Powell, 10/30/18

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Nashville TN
    Posts
    29,667

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    There are two sets of laws in effect. Innocent until proven guilty and guilty until proven innocent, and in the latter case, always suspect.
    One of the most enduring qualities of an old wooden boat is the smell it imparts to your clothing.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Fredericton, New Brunswick
    Posts
    40,605

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    I saw that a while back too - and yeah, it's a stunning story. But probably wouldn't be stunning were I a black guy. That's exactly the point, eh? Exactly why it's important that folks like us read it.
    If I use the word "God," I sure don't mean an old man in the sky who just loves the occasional goat sacrifice. - Anne Lamott

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Rockford, IL
    Posts
    11,314

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Most Blacks find themselves in the second group.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    2,924

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Maybe I'm just feeling extremely vulnerable as I'm sitting here at my desk after going into self isolation on 3/13 after being on the road from 3/10 to 3/12 for a long scheduled series of teaching events of several art workshops at two universities in my state. I also spent my 60th birthday alone in a hotel room on the night of 3/11 due to this unavoidable schedule, then the aforementioned isolation (just 6 quick trips to the market in that entire time).

    I am this man in the blog post above, but I am white and have never faced this situation, but I can see these police officers. Bearded, muscularity that doesn't happen without the aid of chemical enhancement and massive amounts of gym time, the sunglasses, the pack like surrounding attitude all in the pursuit of maximum intimidation.

    The opening line from the police officer, tinged perhaps with a bit of sarcasm or condescension when he says; "Hey, my man." That police officer is not feeling any kinship with this man and I'm sure he doesn't feel that Steve Locke is "his man," I'd doubt if he saw Steve as anything but a suspect, so this opening was extremely disingenuous.

    I too am emotional by reading this, in fact the tears are literally streaming down my cheeks as I am continually reminded as to the type of country we live in. This man, Steve Locke is someone's son, perhaps someone's husband and or father, someone's grandson, or nephew, someone's sibling. How would any of us feel if this happened to us a dozen times or only once, how would we feel if this happened to anyone we cared about or cared for?
    "Unrepentant Reprobate"
    Lew Barrett



  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 1999
    Location
    Louisville, Kentucky
    Posts
    31,106

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    .
    I was stopped one time on an early Saturday afternoon in Amherst, Ohio. This was back in the 70's. My girlfriend was in my car with me.

    The cop who had pulled me over parked close behind me while a second squad car pulled up in front of me. The cop who had pulled me over walked up to my driver side window.

    I saw that he had unsnapped the holster of his gun.

    On seeing that I became quite alarmed.

    He asked for my driver's license. Apart from reaching for my wallet and handing him the card I kept my hands on the steering wheel. I presume the cop in front of me was running my car's license number. The cop at my door asked where I had come from and where I was going. The cop then took my driver's license went back to his car for about 5 minutes. My girlfriend and I asked each other WTF?

    The cop came back, handed me my license, and then said, "I apologize Mr. Montgomery. A bank in the neighborhood was robbed by an armed man not 15 minutes ago. Your car fit the description as does your own appearance. I am satisfied you are not the perpetrator. Again, my apology for the inconvenience. Have a nice day." The entire stop lasted under 15 minutes.

    I've thought about that stop many times in the years since. I was frightened. I was a white kid in my late 20's from a small, lily-white town only 10 miles away (as the address on my driver's license revealed). Would a young African American male in his 20's from Lorain, Ohio (the next city bordering Amherst on the north) been treated exactly the same? I seriously doubt it.
    "We have come to live in a society based on insults, on lies and on things that just aren't true. It creates an environment where deranged people feel empowered." -- Colin Powell, 10/30/18

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Portland, Oregon
    Posts
    64,021

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    I got a small dollop of grokking when I was a long-hair in the 60's & 70's. There are parts of the rural Pacific NW where it was not safe to linger. And ANY interaction with LEO's was to be avoided. There's a reason 'Easy Rider' became an iconic movie. Same attitudes and tribalism.

    And yet, I was white, and benefited from that. I was a redneck, and spoke the language. So I never reached the level of 'other'... of constant underlying wariness & fear... of disenfranchisement from normal consideration... that my young black friends describe to me.
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    https://www.facebook.com/HarborWoodworks/

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Location
    huntsville, al, usa
    Posts
    6,283

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    ok, so what did you want the police to do there? see a person matching a description of a robber and not stop them?

    i've been stopped more than once for "fitting the description". maybe i should write up a facebook post and complain about it.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Fredericton, New Brunswick
    Posts
    40,605

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by AlanMc View Post
    ok, so what did you want the police to do there? see a person matching a description of a robber and not stop them?

    i've been stopped more than once for "fitting the description". maybe i should write up a facebook post and complain about it.
    Maybe treat folks of different colours with the same level of respect when they're stopped?
    If I use the word "God," I sure don't mean an old man in the sky who just loves the occasional goat sacrifice. - Anne Lamott

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Nebraska
    Posts
    24,249

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Yeah, but - that's you!

    The old saying 'don't judge til you've walked in anothers' shoes' comes to mind.
    There's a lot of things they didn't tell me when I signed on with this outfit....

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Sep 1999
    Location
    Louisville, Kentucky
    Posts
    31,106

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by AlanMc
    i've been stopped more than once for "fitting the description"..
    Is that right? And did the cops invite you into the squad car so they could transport you to the victim for identification?
    "We have come to live in a society based on insults, on lies and on things that just aren't true. It creates an environment where deranged people feel empowered." -- Colin Powell, 10/30/18

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Entry Level
    Posts
    21,490

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by TomF View Post
    Maybe treat folks of different colours with the same level of respect when they're stopped?
    Yeah. Every situation involving color is pre-loaded, as it were. Comparisons to how white people feel about it have to be seen in that light.
    Had every Athenian citizen been a Socrates, every Athenian assembly would still have been a mob.

    -- James Madison, Federalist 55

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    2,708

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Hairy situation and he had every right to feel as he did. I qonder without sarcasm, would he have felt better if the cops were black and had treated him exactly the same? What if the white woman were a black woman?

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    2,708

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Hey, true story, I realized a few months back that I felt uncomfortable in an area of high black population. I thought about why for a while. Then I realized why. I was worried what THEY thought of me being white and what their reaction to my presence may be. Im still not certain what to make of that.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Portland, Oregon
    Posts
    64,021

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by sleek View Post
    Hey, true story, I realized a few months back that I felt uncomfortable in an area of high black population. I thought about why for a while. Then I realized why. I was worried what THEY thought of me being white and what their reaction to my presence may be. Im still not certain what to make of that.
    What you should feel about that is relieved. That was an early sign of a common white blindness to our own unconscious racism. I regard myself as an ally, and yet I had a similar experience as a teen. A white kid from a very white state, visiting SoCal. Bad neighborhood. Getting late. Just two of us. I was a little nervous when a group of white kids came down the sidewalk toward us. Later, a similar group of black kids came toward us. We crossed the street. Then we talked about why. THAT was my first cause for such self-examination and self-awareness.

    The fact that you had that glimmer is good and hopeful.
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    https://www.facebook.com/HarborWoodworks/

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Location
    Pleasant Valley NS Canada
    Posts
    20,049

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    When I moved to St. Vincent and the Grenadines I was the only white guy for miles, the only white guy in the boat shop I ran, and the only white guy in the neighbourhood that I lived in. I come from a small, lily-white town. It was an adjustment...
    Hope for the best, but plan for the worst.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    2,708

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Idk man... I never hated a black man for being black. I have hated some for their attitude, work ethic, and been plenty annoyed by their intentional abuse of the English language. But every time I have been concerned for my own safety was because I dont know how I would be treated by them because I'm seeing what their opinions of white people are, and I happen to be white.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Location
    Pleasant Valley NS Canada
    Posts
    20,049

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by sleek View Post
    Idk man... I never hated a black man for being black. I have hated some for their attitude, work ethic, and been plenty annoyed by their intentional abuse of the English language. But every time I have been concerned for my own safety was because I dont know how I would be treated by them because I'm seeing what their opinions of white people are, and I happen to be white.
    Kinda like being a black man in a white neighbourhood, eh?
    Hope for the best, but plan for the worst.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    2,708

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    What it seems to boil down to, is that I'm afraid they will be racist towards me, because they are afraid I will be racist towards them. I thought about just saying eff it and trust them to be logical, but can you really trust an angry/scared person to be logical, especially when their whole life chances are good they have been raised to hate whitey?

    I'm certain I'm going to draw a negative reaction or be called racist for my comments here, but its been my reality, one i didn't create and have no control over. So if you want to condemn me for being racist, go ahead, I will just know you are an idiot blinded by social ideology and lack of logic.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    2,708

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by mmd View Post
    Kinda like being a black man in a white neighbourhood, eh?
    Probably exactly like it. And I dont see a way to break this on an individual bases. Though an individual can certainly make it worse.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Portland, Oregon
    Posts
    64,021

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by mmd View Post
    When I moved to St. Vincent and the Grenadines I was the only white guy for miles, the only white guy in the boat shop I ran, and the only white guy in the neighbourhood that I lived in. I come from a small, lily-white town. It was an adjustment...
    A big adjustment, methinks. And I get the impression that the islands are a relatively friendly place to make such a leap. I'd hate to try it in Compton - or parts of Cincinnati or Birmingham.
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    https://www.facebook.com/HarborWoodworks/

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    2,708

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    The fear of fear itself.... we certainly have that.

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    2,708

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    A big adjustment, methinks. And I get the impression that the islands are a relatively friendly place to make such a leap. I'd hate to try it in Compton - or parts of Cincinnati or Birmingham.
    Or Chicago

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Location
    Chattanooga, TN
    Posts
    18,724

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by sleek View Post
    ...but can you really trust an angry/scared person to be logical, especially when their whole life chances are good they have been raised to hate whitey?

    The answer to that question is yes, undoubtedly and absolutely yes. Hiding behind your fear of what may happen will never help heal the wounds. So yes you have to trust and put your fear behind you.

    Chad
    There are three ways to do things: The right way, the wrong way and my way.

    Three Little Birds
    Love is My Religion

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Location
    Pleasant Valley NS Canada
    Posts
    20,049

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    A big adjustment, methinks. And I get the impression that the islands are a relatively friendly place to make such a leap. I'd hate to try it in Compton - or parts of Cincinnati or Birmingham.
    While I have never been to Compton or Cincinnati or Birmingham, there certainly was a significant level of racist violence in St. Vincent. While I was there there were several murders of white tourists by blacks and murders of blacks by whites. One of my neighbours - a man of East Indian descent - shot a young man dead in the street for going into the man's yard and taking a handful of mangoes from a tree in the yard. He was not prosecuted. The Tourism Department ran an ad campaign while I was there that used the phrase, "white tourists are not the ones who enslaved you!". Poverty was rampant and the rich/poor divide was (and still is) a yawning chasm. While firearms are ostensibly illegal there, handguns were pretty common.

    I was never armed, I went out at all times of the day and night unarmed and usually unaccompanied, and the only part of town that I avoided at night was the red light district, not so much out of fear for my safety but for protection of the reputation I had to maintain as a manager of a very public business. My usual means of self defense was to be friendly and say 'hello'. I was only ever challenged once, as I was walking home late at night through a not-so-nice section of town. Two guys stood in my path and menacingly said, "What you doin' here, white man?" Before I could say anything, a woman's voice yelled out of an upstairs window, "You boys leave Massa Mason alone! I talk to him afore. He a good man. You go on now, Massa Mason, you be OK." (Yes, they really did call me Massa Mason. It felt really weird.)
    Hope for the best, but plan for the worst.

  26. #26
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Portland, Oregon
    Posts
    64,021

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Not as benign as I had imagined, then. That, too, is sad.
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    https://www.facebook.com/HarborWoodworks/

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  27. #27
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    northwestern Wisconsin
    Posts
    6,432

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by sleek View Post
    Idk man... I never hated a black man for being black. I have hated some for their attitude, work ethic, and been plenty annoyed by their intentional abuse of the English language.
    I'm guessing (and only guessing--by all means correct me if I've misunderstood you) that you mean the "white" way to use the English language is the "correct" way. In other words, using a different culture's set of grammar and usage rules--one that is just as clearly systematic and "correct" as white English--is "abuse."

    "I be hungry," for example, is every bit as grammatical as "I am hungry." They are simply different grammars. To say one is correct and the other is "abuse" is a completely arbitrary distinction, and a clear expression of racism.

    Note that I'm not calling you a racist, or a bad person--just pointing out that it's all too easy to grant our own position a privileged status, and see markers that don't match our culture (clothes, language, etc) as "abuse" of culture. Rather than an expression of a different, and equally valid, culture--which it is.

    Tom
    You don't have to be prepared as long as you're willing to suffer the consequences.

    www.tompamperin.com

  28. #28
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Location
    Pleasant Valley NS Canada
    Posts
    20,049

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    Not as benign as I had imagined, then. That, too, is sad.
    You gotta get out of the resorts and off the beach once in a while to see a place as it really is...
    Hope for the best, but plan for the worst.

  29. #29
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Tulsa, Okla.
    Posts
    23,748

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    For Sleek and company.
    "para todo mal, mezcal, y para todo bien también" (for everything bad, mezcal, and for everything good, as well.)

  30. #30
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    2,708

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by WI-Tom View Post
    I'm guessing (and only guessing--by all means correct me if I've misunderstood you) that you mean the "white" way to use the English language is the "correct" way. In other words, using a different culture's set of grammar and usage rules--one that is just as clearly systematic and "correct" as white English--is "abuse."

    "I be hungry," for example, is every bit as grammatical as "I am hungry." They are simply different grammars. To say one is correct and the other is "abuse" is a completely arbitrary distinction, and a clear expression of racism.

    Note that I'm not calling you a racist, or a bad person--just pointing out that it's all too easy to grant our own position a privileged status, and see markers that don't match our culture (clothes, language, etc) as "abuse" of culture. Rather than an expression of a different, and equally valid, culture--which it is.

    Tom
    We had the same English class, we were all taught the same way to speak, sentence structure, enunciation, etc... Its therefore NOT a privilege thing...I made and make efforts to be correct to what I was taught, they take efforts to be incorrect intentionally. I suppose its a cultural thing, some way to maintain an identity, away from standard American culture. On the surface you want to say, thats fine. But then, you want to yell at them, assimilate ready! Quit creating a culture gap that won't be reconciled with! I view it as part of the problem. I have never met any color person who intentionally abused the English language who i would consider a quality individual. To me, from experience, its a representation of attitude and character, and commonly, is a negative one.

  31. #31
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Location
    Portland, Oregon
    Posts
    64,021

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by mmd View Post
    You gotta get out of the resorts and off the beach once in a while to see a place as it really is...
    I've never been at all, but that has always been my approach elsewhere.

    If I went, I'd try and con Wiz into being my guide... <G>
    David G
    Harbor Woodworks
    https://www.facebook.com/HarborWoodworks/

    "It was a Sunday morning and Goddard gave thanks that there were still places where one could worship in temples not made by human hands." -- L. F. Herreshoff (The Compleat Cruiser)

  32. #32
    Join Date
    Jun 2000
    Location
    Pleasant Valley NS Canada
    Posts
    20,049

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Sleek, with respect, your arguments are beginning to sound increasingly bigoted. 'Your way' is not the only 'right way'. Your fear of the 'other' is becoming quite noticeable. It seems that you are in the minority hereabouts in those attitudes. Maybe this would be a good time to stop posting (digging yourself deeper) and reflect on what the others here have been saying in contrast to your thoughts on the subject, and consider that maybe, just maybe, you might be in need of an attitude adjustment. I am trying to be the peacemaker here, not slagging you. Take a breath, and think outside the box of conformity that you are confined within.
    Hope for the best, but plan for the worst.

  33. #33
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    northwestern Wisconsin
    Posts
    6,432

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by sleek View Post
    We had the same English class, we were all taught the same way to speak, sentence structure, enunciation, etc... Its therefore NOT a privilege thing...I made and make efforts to be correct to what I was taught, they take efforts to be incorrect intentionally. I suppose its a cultural thing, some way to maintain an identity, away from standard American culture. On the surface you want to say, thats fine. But then, you want to yell at them, assimilate ready! Quit creating a culture gap that won't be reconciled with! I view it as part of the problem. I have never met any color person who intentionally abused the English language who i would consider a quality individual. To me, from experience, its a representation of attitude and character, and commonly, is a negative one.
    Yep. That's a racist attitude. Thanks for making your stance clear.

    Think about it this way: You say "Its therefore NOT a privillege thing"--but here's why it is.

    As a white person, you have the PRIVILEGE of having your way of speaking be enshrined as the "correct" way, and teachers graded papers according to the rules you were PRIVILEGED to grow up with from infancy, while others were forced to learn a new way of speaking and using language, or be considered dumb, or ignorant, or "abusing" language if they dare to speak the way they speak at home.

    Really, not too far from the Indian boarding schools which strove to wipe out native languages and culture, with all too much success.

    Tom
    Last edited by WI-Tom; 06-30-2020 at 02:22 PM.
    You don't have to be prepared as long as you're willing to suffer the consequences.

    www.tompamperin.com

  34. #34
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    2,708

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by mmd View Post
    Sleek, with respect, your arguments are beginning to sound increasingly bigoted. 'Your way' is not the only 'right way'. Your fear of the 'other' is becoming quite noticeable. It seems that you are in the minority hereabouts in those attitudes. Maybe this would be a good time to stop posting (digging yourself deeper) and reflect on what the others here have been saying in contrast to your thoughts on the subject, and consider that maybe, just maybe, you might be in need of an attitude adjustment. I am trying to be the peacemaker here, not slagging you. Take a breath, and think outside the box of conformity that you are confined within.
    Ok. The English language we were all taught, is not MY WAY. It is however the RIGHT way, and I'm simply expressing an irritation to its bastardization, and drawing a connection to the types of individuals who do it intentionally.

    I am being very open and internally diagnosing my otherwise irration fear of those who fear me, and look at the situation for what it is. Fear of fear. It does apply here.

    I'm actually surprised here at the reactions I'm getting, especially because I'm being honest, open, and forthright

  35. #35
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    Tulsa, Okla.
    Posts
    23,748

    Default Re: This man's fear is palpable.

    White folks can be some strange creatures, for most of my childhood I was raised by uncles and aunts on my dads side of the family. I was a grown man before I had a clue that moms side was native American. People would ask me back then and I would say I don't think so. A few years ago I talked to my son in law who is half Cherokee and half Shawnee and told him that. He said Bob you was Indian when Indian wasn't cool. I feel I was cheated in some way. I hope things in this country get better for all our brothers and sisters
    "para todo mal, mezcal, y para todo bien también" (for everything bad, mezcal, and for everything good, as well.)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •