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Thread: Oz Politics.

  1. #24291
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    There are quite a number of towns and even the state of Tassie I believe who have banned plastic bags...then of course there is packaging.
    I was in Coles the other day and was stunned to see plastic packaged roast potatoes on sale.
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  2. #24292
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larks View Post
    I look in here from time to time and see the same quibbling going back and forward over and over about the same issues over and over and often wonder why I don’t see anyone paying much concern over this, which personally I believe to be a much more urgent and greater tangible threat to our environment than global warming.

    The vid’ says this is on the Amazon but I saw and was sickened by this same action daily for the 4 months that I was in Vietnam last year, trucks and residents simply hurling all of their rubbish into the river alongside the prawn farms and fishing ports that are now essentially devoid of fish stocks, forcing fisherman further and further afield to find a catch.

    When it boils down to it, this seems is as much a cultural issue as anything else - both in consumer behaviour and disregard for the environment and needs a massive cultural shift world wide to fix it - but what are any of the worlds governments doing about it?
    Greg, we as the dominant species on the planet, should be able to walk and chew gum at the same time. The disposal of GHGs into the atmosphere (not just CO2) and plastics into the rivers and oceans are part of the same problem: A desire to avoid the real monetary cost of our consumerist society.

    The idea we can't tackle all of these issues simultaneously, (plastics, groundwater pollution and disruption, ecological devastation/habitat clearance, mass extinctions, GHG emissions, chemical overuse, so on and so forth) is simply wrong. We can, and we should. Further the idea that a seemingly intangible threat to the environment such as AGW isn't as important because it's not immediately apparent like a truck dumping plastics into a river is not logical. Think of the various cases of chemicals being released into the environment causing all manner of ecological and human health problems (and economic problems), the latest being the use fire retardants on air force and navy facilities. Many affected people couldn't sell their properties now, and then there are issues of health problems on top of that. But apparently Defence don't want to admit a single cent of liability.

    Bye the way - if any of you had ever actually met the guy you’d have found that PD is actually quite a nice and personable bloke. But I guess it’s pretty easy to make disparaging personal remarks about a guy based just on how he’s portrayed in the media...........rather hypocritical given the levels of righteous indignation expressed about not all that dissimilar behaviour elsewhere on this thread, but easy.
    I'm sure he's lovely to chat to. But then again Amon Göth was a loving family man and generous to his friends and colleagues, but on the other side of the garden wall he was a murderous Nazi who was capable of the worst kinds of atrocities.

    Dutton's comments on all manner of issues, the latest being victim blaming for rape, are egregious in the extreme and reveal the true character of the man. I wouldn't pee on him if he were on fire. Remember, it was all those 'normal people' who ended up becoming the monsters of the Nazi era. 'Normal people' in their hundreds of thousands signed up to the worst of ideologies. I sincerely believe we are witnessing the cusp of a new era of similar hate and human rights violations. And it's all those 'normal' and 'nice and personable' people that will commit the atrocities... Just like before.

    So it's up top us to call out the precursive behaviour, such as victim blaming, tarring an entire ethnic community with the crimes of a few, and all of the other hideousness that Dutton is responsible for.

    I'm anti-fascist. So was my Granddad.
    Last edited by Duncan Gibbs; 06-23-2019 at 10:42 PM.
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  3. #24293
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    [QUOTE=Duncan Gibbs;5920739]
    Quote Originally Posted by Larks View Post
    I look in here from time to time and see the same quibbling going back and forward over and over about the same issues over and over and often wonder why I don’t see anyone paying much concern over this, which personally I believe to be a much more urgent and greater tangible threat to our environment than global warming.

    The vid’ says this is on the Amazon but I saw and was sickened by this same action daily for the 4 months that I was in Vietnam last year, trucks and residents simply hurling all of their rubbish into the river alongside the prawn farms and fishing ports that are now essentially devoid of fish stocks, forcing fisherman further and further afield to find a catch.

    When it boils down to it, this seems is as much a cultural issue as anything else - both in consumer behaviour and disregard for the environment and needs a massive cultural shift world wide to fix it - but what are any of the worlds governments doing about it?[/video]
    Greg, we as the dominant species on the planet, should be able to walk and chew gum at the same time. The disposal of GHGs into the atmosphere (not just CO2) and plastics into the rivers and oceans are part of the same problem: A desire to avoid the real monetary cost of our consumerist society.

    The idea we can't tackle all of these issues simultaneously, (plastics, groundwater pollution and disruption, ecological devastation/habitat clearance, mass extinctions, GHG emissions, chemical overuse, so on and so forth) is simply wrong. We can, and we should. Further the idea that a seemingly intangible threat to the environment such as AGW isn't as important because it's not immediately apparent like a truck dumping plastics into a river is not logical. Think of the various cases of chemicals being released into the environment causing all manner of ecological and human health problems (and economic problems), the latest being the use fire retardants on air force and navy facilities. Many affected people couldn't sell their properties now, and then there are issues of health problems on top of that. But apparently Defence don't want to admit a single cent of liability.


    I'm sure he's lovely to chat to. But then again Amon Göth was a loving family man and generous to his friends and colleagues, but on the other side of the garden wall he was a murderous Nazi who was capable of the worst kinds of atrocities.

    Dutton's comments on all manner of issues, the latest being victim blaming for rape, are egregious in the extreme and reveal the true character of the man. I wouldn't pee on him if he were on fire. Remember, it was all those 'normal people' who ended up becoming the monsters of the Nazi era. 'Normal people' in their hundreds of thousands signed up to the worst of ideologies. I sincerely believe we are witnessing the cusp of a new era of similar hate and human rights violations. And it's all those 'normal' and 'nice and personable' people that will commit the atrocities... Just like before.

    So it's up top us to call out the precursive behaviour, such as victim blaming, tarring an entire ethnic community with the crimes of a few, and all of the other hideousness that Dutton is responsible for.

    I'm anti-fascist. So was my Granddad.
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  4. #24294
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duncan Gibbs View Post
    Greg, we as the dominant species on the planet, should be able to walk and chew gum at the same time. The disposal of GHGs into the atmosphere (not just CO2) and plastics into the rivers and oceans are part of the same problem: A desire to avoid the real monetary cost of our consumerist society.

    The idea we can't tackle all of these issues simultaneously, (plastics, groundwater pollution and disruption, ecological devastation/habitat clearance, mass extinctions, GHG emissions, chemical overuse, so on and so forth) is simply wrong. We can, and we should. Further the idea that a seemingly intangible threat to the environment such as AGW isn't as important because it's not immediately apparent like a truck dumping plastics into a river is not logical. Think of the various cases of chemicals being released into the environment causing all manner of ecological and human health problems (and economic problems), the latest being the use fire retardants on air force and navy facilities. Many affected people couldn't sell their properties now, and then there are issues of health problems on top of that. But apparently Defence don't want to admit a single cent of liability.


    I'm sure he's lovely to chat to. But then again Amon Göth was a loving family man and generous to his friends and colleagues, but on the other side of the garden wall he was a murderous Nazi who was capable of the worst kinds of atrocities.

    Dutton's comments on all manner of issues, the latest being victim blaming for rape, are egregious in the extreme and reveal the true character of the man. I wouldn't pee on him if he were on fire. Remember, it was all those 'normal people' who ended up becoming the monsters of the Nazi era. 'Normal people' in their hundreds of thousands signed up to the worst of ideologies. I sincerely believe we are witnessing the cusp of a new era of similar hate and human rights violations. And it's all those 'normal' and 'nice and personable' people that will commit the atrocities... Just like before.

    So it's up top us to call out the precursive behaviour, such as victim blaming, tarring an entire ethnic community with the crimes of a few, and all of the other hideousness that Dutton is responsible for.

    I'm anti-fascist. So was my Granddad.

    I thoroughly agree Duncan, in fact I couldn’t agree more, the human race should be able to deal with both problems at the same time. Why is it then that only the one issue of global warming keeps coming to the forefront in every argument, news paper, media release and discussion, including on here? Is it perhaps because there’s no industry in debating the clear and undisputed disaster of dumping all of this waste while there is absolutely an ongoing and profitable research industry in global warming for as long as two polar opposite groups of environmental scientists can continue to argue the issue and therefore for as long as the media can continue to set the rest of the world to hating each other for disagreeing with one point of view or another?

    As for comparing anyone to a Nazi homicidal sadist Duncan, really?? ..... and here’s you worrying about being on the cusp of an era of hate and human rights violations..... (BTW, what makes you think he was a loving family man and generous to his friends and colleague?? I only know of him from his role as a concentration camp commandant portrayed by Ralph Feinnes, and I don’t recall that being particularly generous in regards to personal characteristics)
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  5. #24295
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    I agree we "could" do all these things at the same time. The chance of it happening though? Very slim. Better chance of turning a battle ship with a paddle. The damage is done and keeps getting done. Get ready for the after effects. Things are going down. Maybe from the ashes something good will come?
    (edit.. that bloody rash just turned up)

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    And I see crude oil is being spilt into the Amazon. That can't be ideal.

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  7. #24297
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larks View Post
    I thoroughly agree Duncan, in fact I couldn’t agree more, the human race should be able to deal with both problems at the same time. Why is it then that only the one issue of global warming keeps coming to the forefront in every argument, news paper, media release and discussion, including on here? Is it perhaps because there’s no industry in debating the clear and undisputed disaster of dumping all of this waste while there is absolutely an ongoing and profitable research industry in global warming for as long as two polar opposite groups of environmental scientists can continue to argue the issue and therefore for as long as the media can continue to set the rest of the world to hating each other for disagreeing with one point of view or another?
    Whilst the scientific community has reached perhaps one of the broadest ever consensuses on a single theories outside of evolution, gravity and relativity, there is a small, but vocal shibboleth, mainly composed of non-scientists, but also mostly exploration geologists as the scientists represented, that continue to shriek that it's all a giant hoax. Tens of thousand of scientists over forty years have amassed mountain ranges of data and observations, conducted experiments and tested modelling and the overwhelming consensus is that AGW is real and happening and has dire consequences for life on this planet. Opposite this vast population of scientists is a concerted group who have had access to vast sums of money to peddle the idiotic notion that all of these other scientists are wrong. The same thing happened with the tobacco industry and is also happening with the sugar and processed food industries. The vested interests have far more money, and if they shut up and acquiesced to the overwhelming evidence, I'd suggest we could all get on with building the green economy, that would also include addressing single use plastics and all the other issues where humans are having deleterious impacts on our one and only home.

    Climate change is the lightening rod issue for the vested (usually right wing) interests, and they have loud voices. Address climate change and a big part of doing so will to address all the other issues that come under its umbrella.

    As for comparing anyone to a Nazi homicidal sadist Duncan, really?? ..... and here’s you worrying about being on the cusp of an era of hate and human rights violations..... (BTW, what makes you think he was a loving family man and generous to his friends and colleague?? I only know of him from his role as a concentration camp commandant portrayed by Ralph Feinnes, and I don’t recall that being particularly generous in regards to personal characteristics)
    How do you think Nazism and fascism generally takes hold? Are people turned into monsters overnight? You don't think it can happen again? You and I were both born within 25 years of that last global catastrophe ending with large parts of the world left in smoking ruins and piles of corpses.

    Only 700 km south of Vienna from 1992 to 1995, 100,000 people were slaughtered at the alter of nationalist and sexist ideology that was whipped up.

    Only months ago did we see a man born and raised in Grafton massacre muslims in Christchurch.

    It can't happen? Dutton's dogwhistles don't matter? His utterances have no consequence? Really?

    And, yes! Many of the Nazis, many of the war criminals from Bosnia, and all manner of murderous tyrants have the outward appearance of being "nice and personable" to those that they want to be. Dutton's victim blaming of women who've suffered rape, his despicable notion that they aren't allowed to access safe abortion facilities in Australia because they might try and stay and give birth here, is horrific. His statements deserve nothing but scorn and derision. As does he. He's well on his way to getting fitted up for his brown shirt IMO.

    Don't think it can't happen.

    Our Western democracy is only a young creature and still fragile, as we're witnessing in the USA, Poland, Hungary, the Czech Republic and Italy, as well as the dog-whistling, nationalist idiocy of the Tories in the UK. Look at the rise of the far right in other parts as well, like Brazil, Turkey, Russia, so on and so forth.

    It can happen and it will unless we are vigilant.
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  8. #24298
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duncan Gibbs View Post
    Whilst the scientific community has reached perhaps one of the broadest ever consensuses on a single theories outside of evolution, gravity and relativity, there is a small, but vocal shibboleth, mainly composed of non-scientists, but also mostly exploration geologists as the scientists represented, that continue to shriek that it's all a giant hoax. Tens of thousand of scientists over forty years have amassed mountain ranges of data and observations, conducted experiments and tested modelling and the overwhelming consensus is that AGW is real and happening and has dire consequences for life on this planet. Opposite this vast population of scientists is a concerted group who have had access to vast sums of money to peddle the idiotic notion that all of these other scientists are wrong. The same thing happened with the tobacco industry and is also happening with the sugar and processed food industries. The vested interests have far more money, and if they shut up and acquiesced to the overwhelming evidence, I'd suggest we could all get on with building the green economy, that would also include addressing single use plastics and all the other issues where humans are having deleterious impacts on our one and only home.

    Climate change is the lightening rod issue for the vested (usually right wing) interests, and they have loud voices. Address climate change and a big part of doing so will to address all the other issues that come under its umbrella.


    How do you think Nazism and fascism generally takes hold? Are people turned into monsters overnight? You don't think it can happen again? You and I were both born within 25 years of that last global catastrophe ending with large parts of the world left in smoking ruins and piles of corpses.

    Only 700 km south of Vienna from 1992 to 1995, 100,000 people were slaughtered at the alter of nationalist and sexist ideology that was whipped up.

    Only months ago did we see a man born and raised in Grafton massacre muslims in Christchurch.

    It can't happen? Dutton's dogwhistles don't matter? His utterances have no consequence? Really?

    And, yes! Many of the Nazis, many of the war criminals from Bosnia, and all manner of murderous tyrants have the outward appearance of being "nice and personable" to those that they want to be. Dutton's victim blaming of women who've suffered rape, his despicable notion that they aren't allowed to access safe abortion facilities in Australia because they might try and stay and give birth here, is horrific. His statements deserve nothing but scorn and derision. As does he. He's well on his way to getting fitted up for his brown shirt IMO.

    Don't think it can't happen.

    Our Western democracy is only a young creature and still fragile, as we're witnessing in the USA, Poland, Hungary, the Czech Republic and Italy, as well as the dog-whistling, nationalist idiocy of the Tories in the UK. Look at the rise of the far right in other parts as well, like Brazil, Turkey, Russia, so on and so forth.

    It can happen and it will unless we are vigilant.
    Way off beam, Duncan. Way off beam.

    WW2 had less to do with fascism than it did with the control of resources and revenge for the perceived damage done by reparations. It was about unbridled power... and that isn't how fascism is defined. Were the Japanese fascist?

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Bigfella View Post
    Way off beam, Duncan. Way off beam.

    WW2 had less to do with fascism than it did with the control of resources and revenge for the perceived damage done by reparations. It was about unbridled power... and that isn't how fascism is defined. Were the Japanese fascist?
    And SS officers went home at the end of a day feeding Jews into the gas chambers and bounced their children on the knee.
    The Japanese set up a medical research facility where they called their victims logs and taught medical students how to deal with gunshot wounds they had inflicted themselves.
    You are correct as to the cause of WW2 and it being a continuation of the first.
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    Careful Duncan, that horse is looking very high from here - all I said was he’s actually a pretty nice guy if you ever met him..........
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    Quote Originally Posted by Larks View Post
    Careful Duncan, that horse is looking very high from here - all I said was he’s actually a pretty nice guy if you ever met him..........
    I’m sure he is. That won’t unsay what he said, nor the consequences of his words. Nor will it unsay his belaboured wheezing upon that big dogwhistle of his about “floodgates” opening WRT the medivac laws, including his repetition of the Trump language surrounding refugees being terrorists, criminals and rapists. As I said, swell guy. I’m sure he looks even better in that brown shirt.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WX View Post
    And SS officers went home at the end of a day feeding Jews into the gas chambers and bounced their children on the knee.
    The Japanese set up a medical research facility where they called their victims logs and taught medical students how to deal with gunshot wounds they had inflicted themselves.
    You are correct as to the cause of WW2 and it being a continuation of the first.
    The Japanese might not have been the classic ideal of fascist, but they certainly weren't that far off with their own version:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statism_in_Shōwa_Japan
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duncan Gibbs View Post
    The Japanese might not have been the classic ideal of fascist, but they certainly weren't that far off with their own version:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statism_in_Shōwa_Japan
    Good Dog Man... do you even read the links you post?

    Early Shōwa statism is sometimes given the retrospective label "fascism", but this was not a self-appellation and it is clear that the comparison is inaccurate.

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    Larks – I agree completely with you – rubbish is a blight and doesn’t get as much focus as global warming. Along with over fishing, pesticides wiping out insects, the threat to pollination = food, and a bunch of other stuff.
    In trying to understand it I can only think that global warming is perceived as more critical; it’s harder to reverse and the point where the effects are permanent is imminent.
    Maybe a single big issue, global warming, is as much as this animal species can manage at one time?
    We haven't had universal problems that require a unified global solution before.

    I read once somewhere that there is zero oil extracted for the making of plastic. All oil is drilled exclusively for fuel. Plastic is a by-product of the process. An added ‘benefit’ and less profitable than fuel.
    I would imagine that as demand for fossil fuels drops, there’ll be less material to create bi-products and plastic may become a far more expensive material. Drilling for oil will be purely for the production of medicines and critical tech components. At that point you might see mining old landfills for recyclable material and more concerted efforts to ‘harvest’ floating garbage……. We live and hope.

    As for PD – nice guy in person ...maybe, but the hate he spills into the political world is atrocious. He does not give respectful consideration to issues like, for example, the traumatised Sudanese youth for one, and does not deserve respectful consideration himself in the public sphere. The guy, in public, is a liar. 300 rapists and child molesters were going to be claiming the right to come to Australia on the medevac bill. He, and the devout Christian Scomo, were instrumental in keeping children in conditions that reduced them to dejected, desolate shells with serious mental illness. He was prepared to let those children suffer on needlessly. Those are not hall marks of a ‘nice guy’ in any language or time. I have no problem in using the moniker Potato Head for that despicable piece of excrement. It’s pretty light compared to his actually harmful rhetoric.
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    Quote Originally Posted by gypsie View Post
    Larks – I agree completely with you – rubbish is a blight and doesn’t get as much focus as global warming. Along with over fishing, pesticides wiping out insects, the threat to pollination = food, and a bunch of other stuff.
    In trying to understand it I can only think that global warming is perceived as more critical; it’s harder to reverse and the point where the effects are permanent is imminent.
    Maybe a single big issue, global warming, is as much as this animal species can manage at one time?
    We haven't had universal problems that require a unified global solution before.

    I read once somewhere that there is zero oil extracted for the making of plastic. All oil is drilled exclusively for fuel. Plastic is a by-product of the process. An added ‘benefit’ and less profitable than fuel.
    I would imagine that as demand for fossil fuels drops, there’ll be less material to create bi-products and plastic may become a far more expensive material. Drilling for oil will be purely for the production of medicines and critical tech components. At that point you might see mining old landfills for recyclable material and more concerted efforts to ‘harvest’ floating garbage……. We live and hope.

    As for PD – nice guy in person ...maybe, but the hate he spills into the political world is atrocious. He does not give respectful consideration to issues like, for example, the traumatised Sudanese youth for one, and does not deserve respectful consideration himself in the public sphere. The guy, in public, is a liar. 300 rapists and child molesters were going to be claiming the right to come to Australia on the medevac bill. He, and the devout Christian Scomo, were instrumental in keeping children in conditions that reduced them to dejected, desolate shells with serious mental illness. He was prepared to let those children suffer on needlessly. Those are not hall marks of a ‘nice guy’ in any language or time. I have no problem in using the moniker Potato Head for that despicable piece of excrement. It’s pretty light compared to his actually harmful rhetoric.
    Where do you guys get off? Seriously?

    The people responsible for those children being there are their parents. No-one but their parents.

    Then, there's the care for the many hundreds more lives that would be lost if the despicable trade facilitated by Labor and the Greens between 2008 and 2013 were to resume.... and you can guarantee that it would resume if Labor breathed half a word about letting that lot into Australia if they were in power again.

    Labor and the Greens killed 1,200 plus - many of them children during 2008-13 with their stupid policy.... and you call him Potato Head? Methinks Australia would benefit from having re-education camps. It's gone to the nutters without them.

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    Yeah you guys. Look how kind hearted they are.
    https://amp.theguardian.com/australia-news/2019/jun/24/children-isis-terrorist-khaled-sharrouf-return-australia-removed-syria

    what could go wrong?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Geftb View Post
    Yeah you guys. Look how kind hearted they are.
    https://amp.theguardian.com/australia-news/2019/jun/24/children-isis-terrorist-khaled-sharrouf-return-australia-removed-syria

    what could go wrong?
    I imagine a weather eye will be kept on them.

    A friend of mine is again over in the Bosnian area, working as a volunteer with the refugees. It would be really nice if we as a species could come up with some sort of united nations approach to dealing with areas of conflict. Perhaps we could call it the league of nations, or something like that? It would jump in and bang heads together before these things get out of hand. Exercise global power to stop problems. Easy, eh?

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Bigfella View Post
    I imagine a weather eye will be kept on them.

    A friend of mine is again over in the Bosnian area, working as a volunteer with the refugees. It would be really nice if we as a species could come up with some sort of united nations approach to dealing with areas of conflict. Perhaps we could call it the league of nations, or something like that? It would jump in and bang heads together before these things get out of hand. Exercise global power to stop problems. Easy, eh?
    Removing the power of veto might help.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WX View Post
    Removing the power of veto might help.
    Well that's it really hey.
    Or get rid of the security council altogether and introduce mandated responses. The security council flies in the face of a United Nations - more like a handful of disunited nations bickering at the top table.
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Geftb View Post
    Yeah you guys. Look how kind hearted they are.
    https://amp.theguardian.com/australia-news/2019/jun/24/children-isis-terrorist-khaled-sharrouf-return-australia-removed-syria

    what could go wrong?
    I'm glad they are being brought home and I hope they are given support to get back into a normal life. I also think the girls should be encouraged to write about their experiences.
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    Quote Originally Posted by WX View Post
    I'm glad they are being brought home and I hope they are given support to get back into a normal life. I also think the girls should be encouraged to write about their experiences.
    Why just the girls? Misogyny?

  22. #24312
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Bigfella View Post
    Why just the girls? Misogyny?


    Every spring we go to this sheep farm out back of Goldburn. Old place but fun to catch up with friends and stay in the shearers quarters. Light fires, eat meat drink beer sing songs.

    The farms got hundreds of rabbit traps every where. It's cool to show the kids how to set them up and tell the stories of Australia's struggle with pests.

    Thing about rabbit traps, they grab at a whisper. It takes the smallest most insignificant thing to make them snap.


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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Quote Originally Posted by gypsie View Post
    Every spring we go to this sheep farm out back of Goldburn. Old place but fun to catch up with friends and stay in the shearers quarters. Light fires, eat meat drink beer sing songs.

    The farms got hundreds of rabbit traps every where. It's cool to show the kids how to set them up and tell the stories of Australia's struggle with pests.

    Thing about rabbit traps, they grab at a whisper. It takes the smallest most insignificant thing to make them snap.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Last I heard, it's $1,000 a trap for being in possession. Do trot down to the nearest police station and report them please.

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    Australian Christian Lobby backs high profile homophobe. Whoda thunk it?

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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Quote Originally Posted by WX View Post
    I'm glad they are being brought home and I hope they are given support to get back into a normal life. I also think the girls should be encouraged to write about their experiences.
    The things those kids would have seen makes me shudder. Its going to be a long and rocky road to recover from that. If at all possible? I'm not sure I want to read what those girls have seen.

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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Anyway, the point of the post was, it was those children's parents who put them in that position and they have been given a chance.
    So Ian's argument regarding "parents fault" Does not stand.

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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Bigfella View Post
    Why just the girls? Misogyny?
    Not at all but the girls would have had the worst of it in my opinion. By all means the boy/s should be given the same encouragement.
    ​"Life is under no obligation to give us what we expect." Irrfan Khan. RIP

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    Default Re: Oz Politics.


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    Quote Originally Posted by The Bigfella View Post
    Last I heard, it's $1,000 a trap for being in possession. Do trot down to the nearest police station and report them please.


    Rabbit traps fined? Rightly too, they nasty annoying things.


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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Quote Originally Posted by Geftb View Post
    Anyway, the point of the post was, it was those children's parents who put them in that position and they have been given a chance.
    So Ian's argument regarding "parents fault" Does not stand.
    Oh, Ian's argument stands. The government of Australia told the parents - do this and you will never be allowed into Australia. Those parents then used their kids in an attempt to force the government. They are still using the kids to do that... and they have been given multiple other options. Parents fault. 100%

  31. #24321
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Bigfella View Post
    Oh, Ian's argument stands. The government of Australia told the parents - do this and you will never be allowed into Australia. Those parents then used their kids in an attempt to force the government. They are still using the kids to do that... and they have been given multiple other options. Parents fault. 100%

    It's my recollecttion that the notice from Scomo on Manus was given to those parents after they'd been captured.
    How many of those kids were jailed post Scomo's declaration?
    Department of immigration stats say there were 1,700 children in detention when the Libs took over and started to implement their policy of persecution. Isn't there a norm related to retrospective ruling....?

    But i can see why you are attracted to the line - easy to remember and someone else's fault. ticks all the boxes.
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

  32. #24322
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Anyone here watch Sky? Is it just Liberal politicians and their sychophants? The viewership numbers would say yes; Libs and hangers on.

    The doco on the WFT week when Turnbull was rolled, would be nice to see - even if it makes no material difference.
    The more we see the delusional self referencing motions of Canberra on display - maybe the more we will be able to manage it.

    Interesting insight from a Lib pollie on the Lib's use of Sky News - or is it religious adherence? https://www.theguardian.com/australi...-ringside-seat
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gypsie View Post
    Anyone here watch Sky? Is it just Liberal politicians and their sychophants? The viewership numbers would say yes; Libs and hangers on.

    The doco on the WFT week when Turnbull was rolled, would be nice to see - even if it makes no material difference.
    The more we see the delusional self referencing motions of Canberra on display - maybe the more we will be able to manage it.

    Interesting insight from a Lib pollie on the Lib's use of Sky News - or is it religious adherence? https://www.theguardian.com/australi...-ringside-seat
    When I do bother watching the news I do watch Sky (and I’m not a Literal politician nor am I a sycophant) and I also watch the ABC, SBS and anything else that may be on - because I don’t believe anything that any of them preach but often find them entertaining. And I expect (hope) that sometimes there may even be some element of truth laying somewhere in between the opinionated garbage that they’re all sprouting on opposite sides of the cauldron.
    Larks

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    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

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  34. #24324
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquinian View Post
    See, if I do a single Google search, and click on a single link, I find this: https://academic.oup.com/jcb/article/38/6/656/5123585
    Yes - dog with bone and all that.
    The paper suggesting there is no drop in krill numbers just didn't sit well. So a bit of sniffing around.

    https://scholar.google.com.au/schola...tic+krill&btnG

    So Krill exists thorughout the oceans. But most of it is in the high latitudes.
    The krill in the south Atlantic (deep ocean krill) are possible doing okay - but that is not indicative of krill numbers in the Antarctic. The deep ocean krill have a whole other set of enviornmental pressures and are not dependent on sea ice. They need ocean shelves..... (you can never have enough storage - boom boom!).
    It is not only krill studies that are proving radical drops in krill bio-mass. Studies in why penguin, petrel and other seabird numbers are dropping and such, are also pointing at this. Penguin starvation is also an indicator of the reduced sea ice - because they can't get to the most productive seas to eat.

    Basically it is sea ice. The algae baby krill lives on, lives on sea ice. The Antarctic is warming faster than anywhere else - which i didn't know. I thought it was all about Greenland...... Sea ice is changing and krill are not surviving. Baby krill need to find a stable food supply within 10 days of hatching on the ocean floor. They rise up and hey presto - no sea ice, they fall back down.

    Studies back to 1996 are showing the drop in bio-mass - it's not a recent thing.
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Larks View Post
    When I do bother watching the news I do watch Sky
    Cool - as a non-viewer i'm curious; what do you think of the way the Lib pollies respond to Sky by the minute. Is the coverage good and unbiased enough to be taken that seriously?
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

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