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Thread: Oz Politics.

  1. #19146
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Poor didums, didn't like the content so criticises the format !
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  2. #19147
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    Poor didums, didn't like the content so criticises the format !
    Nah - as usual, you got it wrong.

    Had read it before. Didn't bother reading it again. Wouldn't bother reading it, given the formatting anyhow.

    Hmmm.... do I have to sign any register?
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

  3. #19148
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Bigfella View Post
    Oh dear. If you are going to C&P, would you please treat your audience with a modicum of respect... and reformat the bloody stuff please.
    Can't you read it?
    The definition of stupid has got to be the belief that more guns will negate the bloodshed done with guns.

  4. #19149
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Not if the format is uncomfortable .
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  5. #19150
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    Our 36 year old Xmas friends gathering today. Eventually the talk turned to politics, and there are long time Liberal, ALP and Green voters i the mix. Ages 75 to mid 20's men and women, the younger ones with toddlers.
    Main topic Parliament, and the unwillingness to vote for any of the present majors. Not doing their job and as Ian remarked above of the ALP, none of them worthy of their position. Probably a bit savage but you get the picture. Then the Manus/Naru refugees. It needs to be ended now, bring then here, some leader has to be brave enough to do just that on humanitarian, and legal grounds. Otherwise, do we continue this fiction until they all die?

  6. #19151
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    I see Sam is in more trouble over pro Chinese lobbying. Attempted to talk Plibersek out of a meeting with a group China does not approve of. The dynamics of the two majors re the two world powers is interesting, the ALP seemingly tending towards China, and the LibNats the US. Of course Hugh White thinks that if we ever really need the US it won't be there for us.
    Just recently someone suggested that Aus's position will be a neutral state, forced by the increasing multi-country origins of much of our voting population.

  7. #19152
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    The definition of stupid has got to be the belief that more guns will negate the bloodshed done with guns.

  8. #19153
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    A massacre in PNG would be very convenient for both government and opposition.

  9. #19154
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    I wonder if they considered ships instead?
    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-12-1...o-know/9240946
    The definition of stupid has got to be the belief that more guns will negate the bloodshed done with guns.

  10. #19155
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    A massacre is entirely possible. PNG is not peaceful place and poor foreigners are not welcome in numbers.

    Sam needs to go.
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  11. #19156
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    Quote Originally Posted by skuthorp View Post
    A massacre in PNG would be very convenient for both government and opposition.
    It’s a dangerous country for an outsider.
    The definition of stupid has got to be the belief that more guns will negate the bloodshed done with guns.

  12. #19157
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    There are thirteen companies that paid no tax ($0) in 2015-16, yet made $1.7m in political donations to the Liberal and Labor parties.
    The definition of stupid has got to be the belief that more guns will negate the bloodshed done with guns.

  13. #19158
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    Influence is cheap.... apparently.
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  14. #19159
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    Abbott and the yes vote...he ran away.
    http://www.news.com.au/finance/work/...55b5fcd#.s2qsu
    The definition of stupid has got to be the belief that more guns will negate the bloodshed done with guns.

  15. #19160
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    But when it came time to vote — and he could have voted against it — he made a gutless lurch for the door.
    Mr Abbott’s weak act didn’t have anything to do with democracy, it was a protest against it. And history won’t forget that.
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  16. #19161
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    But when it came time to vote — and he could have voted against it — he made a gutless lurch for the door.
    Mr Abbott’s weak act didn’t have anything to do with democracy, it was a protest against it. And history won’t forget that.
    Barnaby woosed out as well the gutless wonder.
    The definition of stupid has got to be the belief that more guns will negate the bloodshed done with guns.

  17. #19162
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    So when it came down to cases they couldn't bring themselves to do the job they are paid to do. Of course that's so they can say they didn't vote against it and hope people will forget what really went on.

  18. #19163
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    Representatives ??? or not.
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  19. #19164
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    Foreign Correspondent. A Iraqui boat person, a refugee, a doctor, imprisoned in a WA camp for a year, solitary because they regarded him as a trouble maker. Now one of the worlds foremost orthopeidic surgeons. Better value than all of the last 6 immigration ministers.
    How about we keep the Manus and Narau refugees and send some politicians back.

    Oh I think they are representing someone, or some industry, or themselves, but not the voters much.
    I don't think any of them represent me, they are way too grubby for that.

  20. #19165
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    That surgeon is an amazing man ! Talent and skill well used .
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  21. #19166
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    Interesting figure here, the spend in Aus. of Chinese tourists has exceeded $10 billion in the year to September.
    https://www.sbs.com.au/news/chinese-...ips-down-under

    I wonder what Americans spent?

    and on the banner below….China Air advertising flights Brisbane-Shenzen via Beijing.

    BTW, anyone watch Malcolm last night, I fell asleep!
    Last edited by skuthorp; 12-11-2017 at 02:37 PM.

  22. #19167
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    For a while, I liked the question, "Where's the real Malcolm?''
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  23. #19168
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    Bye bye, Shanghai
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

  24. #19169
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    You mean I should watch it on Iview Ian?

  25. #19170
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    Quote Originally Posted by skuthorp View Post
    You mean I should watch it on Iview Ian?
    What? Shanghai Sam's resignation? He's announced that he won't be returning to the Senate in 2018. I wonder what hack we'll get now? There's been some real duds from NSW in recent years.... but, that's Labor for you.
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

  26. #19171
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    Oh, I mistook the reference, I thought Mal had said something rash.

    Sam really had no option, but Sam being of the NSW right, Bill was of the wrong faction to sack him……...

    Whose next on the ballot paper? This doesn't seem to help. Who was No. 5? Countback?
    Labor (4) Doug Cameron, Sam Dastyari (*), Jenny McAllister (*), Deborah O'Neill (*)

  27. #19172
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    I wonder how all this would be viewed if it was USA instead of China ? Still a foreign power .
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  28. #19173
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    Quote Originally Posted by skuthorp View Post
    Oh, I mistook the reference, I thought Mal had said something rash.

    Sam really had no option, but Sam being of the NSW right, Bill was of the wrong faction to sack him……...

    Whose next on the ballot paper? This doesn't seem to help. Who was No. 5? Countback?
    Labor (4) Doug Cameron, Sam Dastyari (*), Jenny McAllister (*), Deborah O'Neill (*)
    The ballot paper doesn't come into it here. They can nominate anyone they want. IIRC, the state government has a role in approving it, don't they? What was the name of the goose that Bjelke-Petersen sent to Canberra, in defiance of tradition. Field?
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

  29. #19174
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    Geez - the old grey cells still work. 42 years ago.

    On 30 June 1975, Bertie Milliner, a Queensland ALP Senator, died suddenly. It had long been a tradition that when a casual vacancy occurred in the Senate, the relevant political party would nominate the replacement to the state premier, and the state parliament would formally appoint that person as the new senator. Following the usual practice, the Labor Party nominated only one person, Mal Colston, to replace Milliner. Country Party Premier Joh Bjelke-Petersen asked for a list of three names from which he would choose the replacement; he was possibly relying on a 1962 precedent, when his predecessor, Frank Nicklin, had also required such a list of names. The Labor Party refused to provide a list and insisted on Colston being appointed.
    Although Field had long Labor Party and union connections, he was certainly not an active politician and had never before sought to become one. Nevertheless, he made himself known to the Premier's office and offered his services. Although he would be technically a Labor senator, Field vowed never to vote for the Whitlam government. He was conservative and religious, and was openly critical of what he saw as a range of "immoral" policies being advanced by Whitlam and his government. That was exactly the sort of person wanted by Bjelke-Petersen, who responded by nominating Field in the Parliament of Queensland as the new senator.
    The parliament, and indeed the government, was far from unanimous in supporting the unconventional appointment, but it was approved by 50 votes to 26, the appointment being formally made by the parliament on 3 September 1975. Malcolm Fraser, the federal opposition leader, had misgivings, and stated publicly that Colston's name should have been accepted. However Fraser's deputy, the Country Party leader, Doug Anthony, had no such qualms.

    Field was automatically expelled from the Labor Party for offering his name for Senate selection against the official ALP candidate. He took his seat in the Senate as an independent on 9 September. When he was sworn in, most Labor senators boycotted the sitting. Labor Senate leader Ken Wriedt attended but sat with his back to Field.

    Field had resigned from the Education Department immediately prior to his Senate appointment, but there was a dispute about whether he remained a public servant when appointed, because the Education Act required him to give three weeks' notice. That may have made him constitutionally ineligible to be chosen as a senator, so the Labor Party challenged his appointment in the High Court. (The requirement had applied to several previous appointments but had always been ignored.)
    Field was thus on leave from the Senate after 1 October 1975, unable to exercise a vote. He had not given his maiden speech and had asked only a single question in Question Time. Going against established practice, the opposition parties refused to provide a "pair" to maintain the relative positions of the government and the opposition, which gave the opposition a majority in the Senate, allowing it to pass motions to defer consideration of supply, and thereby force the 1975 Australian constitutional crisis.
    Later life

    The end of Field's Senate term came on 11 November 1975, when the parliament was dissolved in a double dissolution. He stood at the consequent 13 December election that resulted in part from his appointment but was not elected. He formed his own party in 1976, which folded three years later, and he later joined the National Party.
    The controversy surrounding his and Cleaver Bunton's appointments prompted an amendment to the Constitution in 1977 to require casual Senate vacancies to be filled by a member of the same party. The appointment is still made by the State Parliament, which may choose not to fill the vacancy.
    Field lived out his days in Caboolture, Queensland. He suffered from Parkinson's disease in later life, and he committed suicide by hanging in 1990. He was survived by a daughter and a stepdaughter.
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

  30. #19175
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    Just read this– interesting update of Oz history, such as it is.

    The Mapping of Massacres



    "From New York to Cape Town to Sydney, the bronze body doubles of the white men of empire—Columbus, Rhodes, Cook—have lately been pelted with feces, sprayed with graffiti, had their hands painted red. Some have been toppled. The fate of these statues—and those representing white men of a different era, in Charlottesville and elsewhere—has ignited debate about the political act of publicly memorializing historical figures responsible for atrocities. But when the statues come down, how might the atrocities themselves be publicly commemorated, rather than repressed?

    In the course of her long career, the historian Lyndall Ryan has thought about little else. In the late nineties and early aughts, Ryan found herself on the front lines of what came to be known, in Australia, as the History Wars: skirmishes fought with words, source by disputed source, often in the national media. At stake was whether the evidence existed to prove—as Ryan and others had argued, and conservative historians and politicians refused to accept—that Indigenous Australians had been massacred in enormous numbers during colonization, from late in the eighteenth century to the middle of the twentieth. Even among those who grudgingly accepted that there had been widespread killings, there were still bitter, and, in some cases, ongoing, fights over the exact number of Indigenous people killed, the strength of their resistance to British settlement, and the reliability of oral versus written history. A truce has never been reached in what the Indigenous writer Alexis Wright calls Australia’s entrenched 'storytelling war.' (In October, Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull rejected the core recommendations of the government-appointed Referendum Council, which, after six months of deliberative dialogue across Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander communities, had called for establishing an Indigenous voice to Parliament, and a process of 'truth-telling about our history.')"

    https://www.newyorker.com/culture/cu...ping-massacres
    Last edited by Chip-skiff; 12-12-2017 at 12:31 AM.
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  31. #19176
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chip-skiff View Post
    Just read this– interesting update of Oz history, such as it is.

    "From New York to Cape Town to Sydney, the bronze body doubles of the white men of empire—Columbus, Rhodes, Cook—have lately been pelted with feces, sprayed with graffiti, had their hands painted red. Some have been toppled. The fate of these statues—and those representing white men of a different era, in Charlottesville and elsewhere—has ignited debate about the political act of publicly memorializing historical figures responsible for atrocities. But when the statues come down, how might the atrocities themselves be publicly commemorated, rather than repressed?In the course of her long career, the historian Lyndall Ryan has thought about little else. In the late nineties and early aughts, Ryan found herself on the front lines of what came to be known, in Australia, as the History Wars: skirmishes fought with words, source by disputed source, often in the national media. At stake was whether the evidence existed to prove—as Ryan and others had argued, and conservative historians and politicians refused to accept—that Indigenous Australians had been massacred in enormous numbers during colonization, from late in the eighteenth century to the middle of the twentieth. Even among those who grudgingly accepted that there had been widespread killings, there were still bitter, and, in some cases, ongoing, fights over the exact number of Indigenous people killed, the strength of their resistance to British settlement, and the reliability of oral versus written history. A truce has never been reached in what the Indigenous writer Alexis Wright calls Australia’s entrenched 'storytelling war.' (In October, Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull rejected the core recommendations of the government-appointed Referendum Council, which, after six months of deliberative dialogue across Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander communities, had called for establishing an Indigenous voice to Parliament, and a process of 'truth-telling about our history.')"


    https://www.newyorker.com/culture/cu...ping-massacres
    It's hardly an update of Oz history.... but if that's how you see history, so be it, for your "reality".

    .... and as if the Australian population would vote to have a third chamber in the houses of parliament? Would you vote to add an additional chamber to yours?
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

  32. #19177
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Bigfella View Post
    It's hardly an update of Oz history.... but if that's how you see history, so be it, for your "reality".
    Naturally, you didn't trouble to read the article and likely didn't even make it through the quote.

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  33. #19178
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    It's called the History Wars here and the preferred position of the Right is and has been Denial.

    “People would say to me, ‘We will never know how many massacres there were, or how many Aboriginal people were killed, so what’s the point in trying to find out?’ But they would never say that about World War One or Two.”



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  34. #19179
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    Some sections of old white Australia were guilty as hell of the killings and the resy by association, but even more culpable was the official position that the Aboriginal people did not exist and therefore had no claim to the country the europeans were stealing. This was not the position in the first instance but politics here and in Britain made it official soon enough.
    This BTW included several of my ancestors in Tasmania and the NW of the country.

  35. #19180
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    There was a story in my family about my great-great-grandmother in northern Utah nursing the frostbitten feet of troops after a heroic battle. There were monuments in nearby towns to the "great victory."

    When I looked into it, the men she cared for were in the California Volunteers, a unit moved to Utah to quell Mormon unrest, who'd just slaughtered a winter camp of Shoshoni on the Bear River. The commander, Connor, who'd murdered hundreds or even thousands of Indian in California, wrote a report that was as filthy a pack of lies as I've ever read. For a research project, I walked over the location of the massacre, making notes on his report, with a young Shoshoni woman whose ancestors had survived the killing. Sobering to be sure.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bear_River_Massacre
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