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Thread: Oz Politics.

  1. #28666
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Stand by for a snap election in the shelter of the covid success glow.

    Never mind that it's mostly down to the states.

  2. #28667
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Christian Porter is trending on Twitter for all the wrong reasons........I was thinking yesterday he may be the one the current scandal has implicated.
    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  3. #28668
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Quote Originally Posted by skuthorp View Post
    Stand by for a snap election in the shelter of the covid success glow.

    Never mind that it's mostly down to the states.

    I think there is a downhill trajectory beginning to ferment with the Morrison leadership and the Lib Govt. There is a lot of mud and some is beginning to stick....enough to impact the all important swinging vote.
    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  4. #28669
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Well he is the 'don't ask, don't tell, I don't want to know' PM.But then that's what all those 'advisors and staffers' are there for, not to tell their minister (officially) what if he did know (officially) might embarrass him in the house at question time.

    (cue here 3 wise monkeys cartoon with scomo's face)

    Of course, constitutionally, they don't exist, and I wonder where the Finance Department hides them on their books?

  5. #28670
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Re the present hoo-ha about a minister and historic rape.
    Regardless of the probable veracity of the allegations I do not see how this can go anywhere further safely in law.
    The minister will, and must survive in the short term otherwise anyone could be open to such allegations, but it will stick.
    Being intensley political will not help, neither has Morrison's responses to allmost anything that as Prime Minister he has responsibility for. And he/they have done it to themselves.
    There may or may not be an enquiry but I'm not sure it can help, other than force a change in culture and the choices that parties make in selecting candidates.

  6. #28671
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    "force a change in culture"
    Now I contradict myself, you cannot force that kind of change. It's a long term project and to an extent goes against generations of conditioning, privelige and assumptions. I'm reading a book on the situation of 'upper class' girls and women in Georgian England. It was a hot bed of child abuse, child rape, sexual slavery and girls as young as 14 being sold off to old roues as breeding stock. I can guess at what the conditions were for their female servants.
    I shudder to think the situation if every woman who has been abused or otherwise interfered with brought it up. There would be a heck of lot of men in all sorts of situations who could be pinged, not just the now prominent ones. And an enquiry? I cannot see but it would not be able to make a determination, and Porter would come out of it likely worse off. I do not have much time for Porter politically, but I do not think he should be pushed out over this allegation.
    I do not think a proper determination could be reached, unless more specific information surfaces.

    Meanwhile….the PM seems to have run for cover…… again. I'm wondering if the attitude re women in his happy-clappy church is part of the problem? Often enough the leaders of such cults have been found to have a very loose idea of moral behaviour.
    Last edited by skuthorp; 03-03-2021 at 02:37 AM.

  7. #28672
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Meanwhile, in schools all over Australia hundreds of schoolgirls have submitted complaints of sexual assault by pupils in some of the most expensive boys schools….
    Hasn't made the headlines, maybe sacrificing Porter is the easier option seeing that our government subsidise these schools and their pupils to a large degree.

  8. #28673
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Christian Porter teared up over the so called false accusation today.
    This on the Clover Moore case.
    ​In a world full of wonders, man invented boredom.

  9. #28674
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    With respect to the alleged suicide of the woman making the accusation, there must be a n in depth coronial inquest into her death. Questions like was there contact between Porter or someone on his behalf and the woman in recent time after the allegations began to circulate? Phone records etc. Testimony of family and others she may have confided in must be investigated. Another thing to be considered l: a historic murder cold case can be reopened and investigated, statements taken from those who were close to the victim at the time and those the defendant might have bragged to etc all secondary witness statements gathered etc etc.
    The presumption of innocence does not preclude a thorough investigation.
    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  10. #28675
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Behaving just like we allow politicians to behave Gary, and he's a nasty one.
    Nevertheless, proving innocence in the circumstance after 30 years is difficult if not impossible, and Isuspect that no more damage can be done to him.

  11. #28676
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Quote Originally Posted by skuthorp View Post
    Behaving just like we allow politicians to behave Gary, and he's a nasty one.
    Nevertheless, proving innocence in the circumstance after 30 years is difficult if not impossible, and Isuspect that no more damage can be done to him.
    Wonder if there is any DNA evidence?
    ​In a world full of wonders, man invented boredom.

  12. #28677
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Looks like there will be further investigations into the death of Kate Thornton.

    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  13. #28678
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    My wife just read out a piece by someone alleging that Porter had abused her verbally in the workplace. From the point of view of someone who has taken too many similar statements, it not only rang true but sounded like the work of a pretty exceptional and exceptionally intelligent, objective and fair-minded individual. As the Twitterer said, the fact that Porter allegedly abused her verbally does NOT take away his right to be presumed innocent of the rape allegation, but if similar cases of abuse arise or one of them can be substantiated then it shows that he's probably not suited for his office.

    The other point is that we really, really need to make sure that no one else will commit suicide because of whatever may have occurred. Even if you want to be a stone-hearted "rationalist", surely it just makes economic sense to provide support for people who feel they may have been abused?

    The schoolboy issue that Sku mentioned could be another big bombshell.

    Jeez I'm glad I'm out of spending my time digging into this sort of stuff; it all feels worthwhile when you can get the bastards but when you can't it's nauseating.

    Mind you, I may be biased because I was working on an abuse enquiry when Brandis was A-G. He came in to give a speech once, presenting that over-inflated lightweight prat Tim Wilson, and we had to go out and de-oil ourselves afterwards. It was nice to know that Annabell Crabb and Andrew Denton drew far bigger crowds among the A-Gs staff.
    Last edited by Chris249; 03-03-2021 at 05:36 AM.

  14. #28679
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Re the Casino matters. Will any process be serious here? I doubt it. It's not in the interests of Governments for the Casino's to lose their licences, kill the cash cow? I don't think so! All sorts of legal shenannigans will go on and a few scapegoats (maybe) found and we'll all be told by the PR firms and their legal guns for hire that it's all been fixed. And 'Fix' will be the right word as the money launderers rejig their operations, establish dummy corporations and go on as before.

  15. #28680
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    https://johnmenadue.com/christian-po...s-rule-of-law/

    Christian Porter is responsible for serial breaches of the law, as documented repeatedly by Pearls and Irritations. These revelations alone should be enough to see Porter removed from official duties but his relentless persecution of Witness K and Bernard Collaery – both denied natural justice and prosecuted in secret – are hardly the stuff of a model litigant. Yet now the besieged Attorney-General calls for rule of law to apply in respect of the rape allegations against him.

    “In this last week I have tried to do what I have tried to do all of my life: respect the rule and the processes and the law.”
    So said Christian Porter yesterday in his media conference.
    Yet his behaviour as the first law officer of the nation indicates he has no idea what the rule of law is. Because as Attorney General he has repeatedly made a mockery of the rule of law.


    Porter’s persecution of Bernard Collaery and Witness K

    Porter’s comments stand in stark contrast to his unrelenting prosecution of Bernard Collaery and his client Witness K for having the temerity to expose in 2004 the Coalition Government’s illegal behaviour in bugging the offices of the East Timorese Cabinet.
    In his press conference Porter was particularly animated about the potential loss of his career; his life’s work.
    “If I stand down from my position as Attorney-General because of an allegation about something that simply did not happen, then any person in Australia can lose their career, their job, their life’s work, based on nothing more than an accusation that appears in print.”
    Yet Porter has had no compunction about destroying the life’s work and career of highly esteemed former ACT Attorney General Bernard Collaery.
    In an ABC article “Christian Porter and a secret trial have destroyed my practice, Witness K lawyer Bernard Collaery says“, Collaery blames Christian Porter for ruining his career. Collaery said Porter had chosen to pursue the prosecution.



    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  16. #28681
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Meanwhile on SkyNews twitter feed there is no mention of the Christian Porter allegations, nil, not a single reference to Christian Porter by name, yet they feel the need to cover the issue confronting New York's mayor.......

    As the good proffesor used to say, Why is it So?


    all I could find is this:



    which links to this!

    https://www.skynews.com.au/details/_6236437336001
    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  17. #28682
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    You can tell from Porter, he knows, people just don't believe him when he says he's not a sleeze bag.

    This is from before the revelation/allegation.
    https://johnmenadue.com/the-first-la...yond-reproach/


    he federal government and particularly Christian Porter have been unrelenting in their prosecution of Bernard Collaery and his client Witness K for having the temerity of exposing the Coalition Government’s illegal behaviour in bugging the offices of the East Timorese Cabinet.In early February, as Crikey reported, Porter and his bureaucrats tried to prevent Bret Walker SC from participating in the case by initially refusing to provide him with permission to join the case under national security provisions, and refusing to agree to moving the hearing dates.
    Porter was also accused of interfering in the court proceedings by screening documents held by Woodside Petroleum. Independent senator Rex Patrick used Senate question time recently to ask why Porter demanded the federal government have “first access” to documents held by Woodside before they were provided to Collaery.
    Treating a companies documents as state secrets..? Does this mean Westside has a higher clearance level than politicians?


    “Christian Porter’s proposed Commonwealth Integrity Commission is designed to protect politicians and public servants from investigation and exposure.”
    hristian Porter appointed former Liberal Party senator Karen Synon to the $496,560 a year position .... despite her not meeting the requirement ...that she be an “enrolled legal practitioner” of a state Supreme Court for at least five years — a minimum qualification for even a lower-rung member of the AAT.
    last year Porter gave himself the power to decide if and when a journalist would be prosecuted for reporting government secrets. While the directive was described as a “safeguard”, it allows Porter — a politician — to authorise prosecutions of journalists in situations where they may have been critical of his own government.
    Read it and weep.
    It's all fun and games until Darth Vader comes.

  18. #28683
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  19. #28684
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    (2) Prof Ben Saul on Twitter: "(thread) My legal views on Christian Porter: 1) it is normal that the same conduct of a person may be subject to different legal processes for different purposes - criminal, civil, employment, disciplinary, human rights, ombudsperson, coronial etc" / Twitter

    (thread) My legal views on Christian Porter:



    1) it is normal that the same conduct of a person may be subject to different legal processes for different purposes - criminal, civil, employment, disciplinary, human rights, ombudsperson, coronial etc

    2) The standards of proof may differ between processes for different purposes. Non-criminal processes may not depend on the existence of any criminal process, let alone a conviction on evidence beyond reasonable doubt, or the views of police

    3) The govt is not legally required to establish an ad hoc inquiry into the matter. It is a political question of what our democracy expects of the character and fitness of any politician, particularly a cabinet minister and first law officer

    4) and whether we trust the Prime Minister alone to judge it when he has a clear partisan political conflict of interest, the matter is so serious, and larger issues of violence against women are of such public concern

    5) It is well accepted that the content of due process varies according to context. An inquiry for determining the fitness of the Attorney-General could readily meet necessary due process standards if appropriately structured

    6) It is irrelevant that Porter thinks all he could do in an inquiry is deny the allegations. It is his choice not to respond more fully. The purpose of an inquiry is to allow the complainant’s evidence to be independently tested so far as possible...

    7) including by considering any views Porter may wish to put after he is fully informed of the evidence; to forensically test his version of events; and to consider other evidence or witnesses. An inquiry would ensure, not undermine, due process in these circumstances (end)
    Last edited by Hallam; 03-04-2021 at 08:52 PM.
    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  20. #28685
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Ooerr! WA Libs go green! Promise to end coal fired power sooner than Labour. In 2 years if my ears don't deceive me!

    Who'd a thunk it eh?

  21. #28686
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-03-...sions/13233360

    This might get the Feds thinking.
    ​In a world full of wonders, man invented boredom.

  22. #28687
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    The Porter affair has claimed the scalp of the CEO of Minter Ellison after a personal request from the PM to take him on. The board sacked her over that and part of 're-evaluation of the standards of the clients they take on'. Pressure from young lawyers who seem to be mostly female these days and seem not have had confidence in their boss..

    Very, very interesting from the Liberal Governments lawyers with $93 million in contracts.

  23. #28688
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Q&A

    Constutional law expert re Porter and not being stood down is very compelling, ministerial responsibility etc. Of course Howard trashed that principle. But the PM and the Minister do not 'officially' know what's in the documents having no doubt been advised by party functionaries and various guns-for-hire that they in no circumstance should know….'officially' that is.
    Lib rep is predictable attempting to blame Labour for most things, including state responses to Covid. Answer to every question includes a shot at Labour.

  24. #28689
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Much commentary by high profile luminaries in the legal profession calling out the PM on his "Rule of Law" BS defence of Porter including this from WA:

    WA Conduct Rules s6 - A practitioner must not engage in conduct which demonstrates that the practitioner is not a fit and proper person to practice law. Shouldn’t this be tested?

    It is more than obvious the Government does not want further scrutiny into the matter and this may well be a major hit to Morrison in that his and the Gov'ts modus operandi is catching up with them and possibly time is up, a tipping point has been reached as the blatant lack of integrity and good governance verging into unlawful practices is finally going to bring them undone. I think we may be about to see some unhinged behaviour from some of the the Sky News commentators. It was Peta Credlin who thought she caught out Dan Andrews.....someone needs to put the spotlight on her!

    Also just this arvo Macquarie Group managing director James Hooke has come forward to provide information of first hand relevance to the now deceased Woman's case.........

    Christian Porter alleged rape: Accuser’s ex-boyfriend James Hooke reveals new details

    [ A former boyfriend of the Adelaide woman who accused Attorney-General Christian Porter of an alleged rape has revealed for the first time that she had relevant discussions with him in 1989, the year after the alleged incident, and is calling for an independent investigation into the matter.

    In a statement detailing his contact with the woman in the 1980s and his conversations with Mr Porter in the early 1990s, Macquarie Group managing director James Hooke has also offered to co-operate with any inquiry.
    In the statement provided to news.com.au, he notes that he is the man referred to as “James” in the woman’s unsworn statement and the extracts from her diaries.
    He also claims that he had relevant discussions with Mr Porter about his relationship with the woman in 1992 in Perth and subsequently. Mr Porter strenuously denies the rape allegation.
    “I continue to be devastated by the untimely death of my very dear friend, and I am enormously concerned for the privacy and dignity of her family,’’ Mr Hooke said.
    “I am also concerned for the wellbeing of Christian Porter. I have known all of them for approximately 30 years. We all find ourselves at a very upsetting time.
    “Mine is just one set of recollections, and I am aware of the fallibility of human memory, however unintentional.


    That said, I have what I consider to be clear recollections of relevant discussions I had with her over the years from mid-1988 until her death.
    “I also have what I consider to be clear recollections of relevant discussions I had with Christian Porter from April 1992 in Perth and through the mid-1990s.” ]

    Somehow I don't think Porter will be returning..........
    Last edited by Hallam; 03-12-2021 at 12:54 AM.
    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  25. #28690
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    And so It goes.......

    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  26. #28691
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    and Mr James Hook's initial statement;

    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  27. #28692
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    I smell the stench of a cover up.......

    AFP didn't pass on documents detailing allegation against Christian Porter to NSW police | Australian politics | The Guardian


    The Australian federal police did not pass on documents containing an allegation of historical rape against the federal attorney general to
    New South Wales police, instead providing officers with a “summary”.
    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  28. #28693
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    ....and now talk of Christian Porters Govt issued phone being wiped??

    While I am against the notion of "Trial by Media", in the absence of due process the media is the vehicle that forces the unwilling to be brought before a process of accountability. We saw this with the years leading up to the Child abuse royal commissions. The Churches and other institutions would always protect the institution at the expense of the victims welfare.......same dynamic is now in play with the Federal Liberal Govt. what was learnt from the previous royal commision into institutional responses?? Obviously nothing! The Lib Govt is doing precisely what the Catholic and other religious and govt institutions did in avoiding accountability and protecting alleged abusers while discrediting and attacking victims testimony.

    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  29. #28694
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hallam View Post
    I smell the stench of a cover up.......

    AFP didn't pass on documents detailing allegation against Christian Porter to NSW police | Australian politics | The Guardian


    The Australian federal police did not pass on documents containing an allegation of historical rape against the federal attorney general to
    New South Wales police, instead providing officers with a “summary”.
    And are we surprised? No we are not. To coin a phrase….."There are crooks on both sides".

  30. #28695
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Are the WA Libs surprised? They were in strife anyhow having been compromised by religious groups, but that is ridiculous.
    And they've got 2 Federal ministers on the missing list……….. unlikely to return as ministers, and then there's Porter's seat….pouff.

    Interesting times eh?

  31. #28696
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Long ironic laughter here, Korman a climate convert?
    Korman a fake and a hippocryte is more like it, a politician through and through with all of a politicians doublespeak and lack of any ethics.
    Just another gun-for-hire spouting whatever he's being paid to say.
    Last edited by skuthorp; 03-15-2021 at 09:26 PM.

  32. #28697
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Murdoch Tabloids printed an article by Christopher pyne on March 15;




    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  33. #28698
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Did anyone else think how interesting it is that as right wing terrorism is gaining prominence, ASIO had announced a change in language used to describe terrorist activity, preferring to use non descriptive terminology.
    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

  34. #28699
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    TThe AFP have been in the pocket of the Right for probably all of it's existence. And by their nature policing and intelligence forces, always after more powers, can be assumed to be the same.
    As for not passing on information about a RW politician to a presently Labor state police force…………..I doubt they needed to be so careful.
    And the toddler and the phone? Everybody knows it's a lie, a blatant and risible one, but just another in a string of such matters.

  35. #28700
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    .....and front page headline in the Australian today: “ Spy threat to overtake terrorism as major threat”
    The propaganda machine in sync: Lib govt - ASIO - Murdoch press!
    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. Leonardo da Vinci.

    If war is the answer........... it must be a profoundly stupid question.

    "Freighters on the nod on the surface of the bay, One of these days we're going to sail away"
    Bruce Cockburn

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