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Thread: Oz Politics.

  1. #18166
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    and Cash has known for about a year .
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  2. #18167
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    Quote Originally Posted by WX View Post
    Have they actually started on that or is it still in the "we're gonna do'" stage?
    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    I can't tell, no big announcements, no tunnel boring machines on the news but he says he'll fund it .
    https://theconversation.com/turnbull...billions-74686

    Do you lefties ever do any research, or do you just prattle on?


    Work has now commenced on Snowy Hydro’s 2.0 Feasibility Study.
    The study will assist the Snowy Hydro team to plan for the engineering and market challenges of delivering this major project.
    The study will include a full environmental impact assessment, and will comply with all environmental, water and other regulatory requirements. The proposed expansion will have no impact at all on irrigators or downstream water users.
    The Snowy Mountains Engineering Corporation (SMEC) Australia has been appointed as the lead consultant engineer for the study. We are proud to be once again partnering with SMEC after our initial work together on the development of the iconic Snowy Scheme in 1949.
    The EIS alone will be a big job
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

    I'd rather look back at my life and say "I can't believe I did that" instead of being there saying "I wish I'd done that"

  3. #18168
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    I looked Ian, but that link didn't come up. Do you ever credit the text you post ?
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  4. #18169
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    I looked Ian, but that link didn't come up. Do you ever credit the text you post ?
    It isn't hard to work out where it came from - but, sorry, I forgot, you're a green. Try Snowy Hydro.
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

    I'd rather look back at my life and say "I can't believe I did that" instead of being there saying "I wish I'd done that"

  5. #18170
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    It's just polite to provide a link but you don't do polite do you ?

    and yes, I googled the first line and found it.
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  6. #18171
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    It's just polite to provide a link but you don't do polite do you ?

    and yes, I googled the first line and found it.
    I provide information. I couldn't care less about providing references... it ain't a thesis.
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

    I'd rather look back at my life and say "I can't believe I did that" instead of being there saying "I wish I'd done that"

  7. #18172
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    Yes, your lack of basic courtesy and refusal to credit those you quote is well known.
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
    Grateful Dead

  8. #18173
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    Yes, your lack of basic courtesy and refusal to credit those you quote is well known.
    Whoopsie doo. I'm sure Snowy Hydro's website administrator won't lose any sleep.
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

    I'd rather look back at my life and say "I can't believe I did that" instead of being there saying "I wish I'd done that"

  9. #18174
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    Just as a matter of interest, do you think that stolen images should be referenced? Perhaps you should look at a few threads of yours before getting so snooty about other people.
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

    I'd rather look back at my life and say "I can't believe I did that" instead of being there saying "I wish I'd done that"

  10. #18175
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    Google images ... there you go.
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  11. #18176
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    Yes, your lack of basic courtesy and refusal to credit those you quote is well known.
    Again, do you credit the image maker when you post photos that you haven't taken?

    I received a two page contract today for the use of 13 seconds of my video footage... and I will be in the credits for the documentary.... and I'll be paid for it. Do you pay for the images you use?

    Basic courtesy, eh?
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

    I'd rather look back at my life and say "I can't believe I did that" instead of being there saying "I wish I'd done that"

  12. #18177
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Google doesn't give that information.... it might link back to a shared image on the Woodenboat Forum or similar. The stuff you post has a recent author and it's a basic courtesy to credit it. I know you hate doing that though.
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  13. #18178
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    Google doesn't give that information.... it might link back to a shared image on the Woodenboat Forum or similar. The stuff you post has a recent author and it's a basic courtesy to credit it. I know you hate doing that though.
    Theft is theft - perhaps you should be a little less critical, particularly when you are the worst offender
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

    I'd rather look back at my life and say "I can't believe I did that" instead of being there saying "I wish I'd done that"

  14. #18179
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    Nup, you are.
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  15. #18180
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    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Bigfella View Post
    Do you lefties ever do any research, or do you just prattle on?




    The EIS alone will be a big job
    Work has started on the feasibity study which means as yet they haven't decided if it's a viable option. In other words, it may not happen and if it does it will be several years before consumers see any benefit. I'm not against it btw.
    My take is that if you poke someone with a sharp stick they'll get annoyed, if you smile and shake their hand they will be your friends.

    John Welsford

  16. #18181
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    Nup, you are.
    Are you sure you want me to be just as obnoxious as you are being, with every image you post?
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

    I'd rather look back at my life and say "I can't believe I did that" instead of being there saying "I wish I'd done that"

  17. #18182
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    Quote Originally Posted by WX View Post
    Work has started on the feasibity study which means as yet they haven't decided if it's a viable option. In other words, it may not happen and if it does it will be several years before consumers see any benefit. I'm not against it btw.
    This is the Nanny Country, mate... not China. In China, they can build a Westinghouse AP1000 nuclear reactor in four years from project conception. Here?

    It looks like they are fast-tracking the feasibility study.
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

    I'd rather look back at my life and say "I can't believe I did that" instead of being there saying "I wish I'd done that"

  18. #18183
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    "It looks like they are fast-tracking the feasibility study."
    May be they are hoping the problem will go away via 'clean coal'?

    I'm not sure how successful the government will be blaming the power problem on a previous government considering the time involved. I know this is 'traditional' behaviour from new governments, but this one is in it's second term, and only just made it last election.
    Re the NSW power station, any consideration there should take account of the inevitable clean up costs supposedly over $10 mill?. If AGL is forced to extend it's life, and it's not very reliable as it is, the taxpayer may be lumped with the clean up. This was one of the considerations re the Hazlewood, it was an expensive upgrade or closure, and seeing the plant was privately owned and the French owners could see the writing on the coal wall, they closed it.

  19. #18184
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    Quote Originally Posted by skuthorp View Post
    "It looks like they are fast-tracking the feasibility study."
    May be they are hoping the problem will go away via 'clean coal'?

    I'm not sure how successful the government will be blaming the power problem on a previous government considering the time involved. I know this is 'traditional' behaviour from new governments, but this one is in it's second term, and only just made it last election.
    Re the NSW power station, any consideration there should take account of the inevitable clean up costs supposedly over $10 mill?. If AGL is forced to extend it's life, and it's not very reliable as it is, the taxpayer may be lumped with the clean up. This was one of the considerations re the Hazlewood, it was an expensive upgrade or closure, and seeing the plant was privately owned and the French owners could see the writing on the coal wall, they closed it.
    There's a document out there on extending Liddell to 2032... and it isn't hard to do it:


    One industry executive with decades of experience and close knowledge of the power station said it could be more cost-effective to keep Liddell operating than to build a new power station.

    “I believe Liddell could certainly run longer than 2022,” the executive said.

    The government entity that owned the two power stations, Macquarie Generation, lodged a “statement of corporate intent” that suggested the decision to terminate Liddell would be based on economics and the prices set by the national electricity market rather than engineering.


    “A life extension study at Liddell has identified required upgrades and maintenance to allow for an extension of the engineering useful life from the current 50 years to 60 years ending in 2032,” the statement says.


    “However, no decision has been made on the extension of Liddell’s accounting useful life from the current end date in 2022.


    “It is apparent from work done to date that engineering considerations will not terminate operations at Liddell and instead any decision on life extension will be dependent on the economic viability of Liddell in the national electricity market.”


    Liddell had a forced outage rate of 46.1 per cent in the year before it was acquired by AGL and continues to be unreliable. Two of its four units were shut down during a heatwave in February, leading to power shortages.

    Even so, it produces about 8000 gigawatt hours of electricity a year, up from 7073 GW hours in the year before the AGL acquisition in September 2014.
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

    I'd rather look back at my life and say "I can't believe I did that" instead of being there saying "I wish I'd done that"

  20. #18185
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    "One industry executive with decades of experience and close knowledge of the power station said it could be more cost-effective to keep Liddell operating than to build a new power station."

    I'd say thats almost certainly correct in purely power supply terms. How much of a hard bargain will AGL drive I wonder, seeing the Government needs it operating more than AGL does.

    "Liddell had a forced outage rate of 46.1 per cent". No wonder AGL want to close it.

  21. #18186
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    46.1 % Not exactly reliable baseload power !
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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    My take is that if you poke someone with a sharp stick they'll get annoyed, if you smile and shake their hand they will be your friends.

    John Welsford

  23. #18188
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    Vote Compass was the biggest previous poll on SS marriage.Thanks Gary.
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  24. #18189
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    QLD seems to be the most conservative outside major population areas.
    My take is that if you poke someone with a sharp stick they'll get annoyed, if you smile and shake their hand they will be your friends.

    John Welsford

  25. #18190
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    No surprise there .... if you've lived in the bush in Queensland .
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  26. #18191
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    46.1 % Not exactly reliable baseload power !
    Your lack of understanding of the industry is showing again.
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

    I'd rather look back at my life and say "I can't believe I did that" instead of being there saying "I wish I'd done that"

  27. #18192
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    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
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  28. #18193
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeterSibley View Post
    Indeed.

    Taking a genset offline for deep maintenance doesn't mean that the other gensets aren't providing base load power.

    That's why excess capacity is needed. For solar and wind, a whole lot more excess capacity is needed
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

    I'd rather look back at my life and say "I can't believe I did that" instead of being there saying "I wish I'd done that"

  29. #18194
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    Quote Originally Posted by skuthorp View Post
    I'd say thats almost certainly correct in purely power supply terms. How much of a hard bargain will AGL drive I wonder, seeing the Government needs it operating more than AGL does.
    Good point, thats interesting to watch.
    win win for AGL - and the Federal G'umt left trying to dig themselves out of the coal pit.
    Why is 'Politically Approved' speech better than 'Politically Correct' speech?

  30. #18195
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    Of course when viewing the Government's indignation on this matter one always should be aware of distractions, and Churchill's dictum, 'never let a good crisis go to waste'.

  31. #18196
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    My take is that if you poke someone with a sharp stick they'll get annoyed, if you smile and shake their hand they will be your friends.

    John Welsford

  32. #18197
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    I suspect I'll have trouble with images - so I'll delete some from the twitter snips included in this lovely piece of literature from The Mocker:

    It’s time to plug the Gaia gasbags





    Peter FitzSimons and Jane Caro ... both ‘make much of their atheism, but their zealotry in denouncing others for sins against the planet gives rise to a secular fundamentalism’.

    The science is settled, and for the good of the planet we must act urgently to curtail our emission pollutants. No, not so much the greenhouse gases; rather, the Gaia gasbags, named after the pagan goddess of Earth.

    Every time we have a hurricane or a bushfire these insufferably self-righteous harbingers of climatic cataclysm pop up with all the fervour of a firebrand preacher. You know the score. Get down on your knees, shallow ones, for ye have sinned against Gaia. Bow your heads and repent of your wicked ways, for only I can offer you redemption.

    As with many an opportunistic preacher, the Gaia gasbags are very much into congregation shaming, and will exploit any occasion to do it. Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull discovered this on the weekend when he was photographed cradling his beer and his baby granddaughter at the football. “I don’t mind PM cuddling his granddaughter at the football,” tweeted Greens MP Adam Bandt. He doesn’t mind? The man is a prince. “But I do mind him threatening her way of life by making global warming worse.”

    (video of Bandt prattling on deleted)

    It takes a certain crassness to use a baby for scoring a cheap political point, and Bandt is your man. But like anything, a woman can do the job just as well, as demonstrated by social commentator and feminist Jane Caro.

    Cuddling his granddaughter while holding his beer is lovely,” she tweeted. “Explaining 2 her y he didn’t stand up for the climate-not so much.”

    Jane Caro @JaneCaro

    @TurnbullMalcolm cuddling his grand-daughter while holding a beer is lovely. Explaining 2 her y he didn't stand up 4 the climate-not so much
    11:07 AM - Sep 11, 2017


    Record-breaking hurricanes hitting the Americas and wildfires burning the western US,” thundered Fairfax columnist and author Peter FitzSimons. “Drought tightening its grip across Australia, as the prospect looms of the bushfire season from hell. This must be a good time for the federal government to lecture an energy company that says coal is dead and has no economic future.” That’s quite a thought bubble. Given around 73 per cent of our electricity is generated by coal, what could be a worse time to ditch it than now, when we are facing a looming energy crisis caused by the rush for renewables?

    But no, that consideration was lost in the sarcasm. “Your 45-year-old power station has plenty more to give and we’d like to use taxpayer dollars to prop it up,” sneered FitzSimons in reference to the government’s preference for the Liddell plant to defer its closure. If the handing out of taxpayer dollars bothers him so much, why does he not oppose the various governments’ dispensing billions in subsidies to the renewable energy industry?

    “I warrant that in 10 years’ time it will look criminal in its negligence,” predicted FitzSimons.


    Peter Fitzsimons arrives at Sydney International Airport. Photo: John Grainger

    As an aside, what is this school of thought which holds that prose can be transformed into something profound merely by italicising every ten or so words? What is criminal is the funding of feel-good energy schemes to the tunes of billions without sufficient thought to their viability. FitzSimons’s gushing enthusiasm for renewables does not lend itself to objectivity, if his celestial epiphanies serve as an example.

    My Qantas flight had to circle regional NSW,” wrote FitzSimons in February this year, “and there they were … dozens of turbines, atop a series of ridges stretching out to the west, lazily and gloriously spinning in the afternoon sun. Let a thousand flowers bloom. I have seen the future, and this is it.”

    It wasn’t just the turbines that were spinning in the afternoon sun. If you are going to paraphrase something you perceive to be a Great Leap Forward, make sure you know the historical context. Chairman Mao’s flowery appeal was supposedly to elicit constructive criticism of China’s communist party, just prior to the tragic attempts to industrialise and collectivise the country. In reality it was a ruse to expose the so-called ‘deviationists,’ many of whom would be purged in the Cultural Revolution.

    As for the “I have seen the future [and it works]” quote, that was the assessment of American journalist Lincoln Steffens, one of Lenin’s useful idiots, following his three-week tour of the Soviet Union in 1919. Surely FitzSimons — the Eddie McGuire of historians — would know this? He could save himself much embarrassment by taking that ridiculous bandana off his head and tying it tightly around his mouth.

    Because of climate change,” said Caro in October last year, “we really are in a sticky situation.” How sticky? “I see trouble ahead, real trouble ahead.” What does think she is, an astrologer? “I’m thinking about … climate change,” she wrote in January 2016, “because I am soon to become a grandmother. What else is there to think about?”

    Well for starters, what about curtailing her own emissions? “You really know you are travelling too much when even the (lovely) guy in the Qantas lounge raises his eyebrow at you & says ‘Back so soon?’,” she tweeted only two months after her plaintive climate soliloquy. Has she ever reflected on the fact that commercial airlines are a big contributor to carbon dioxide emissions?

    Jane Caro @JaneCaro

    You really know you are travelling too much when even the (lovely) guy in the Qantas lounge raises his eyebrow at you & says 'Back so soon?'
    8:02 AM - Sep 19, 2014


    Ditto for FitzSimons, who in May this year complained that the proposed banning of laptops on international flights would severely impede his ability to write.

    So why the double standards, doomsayers? Interestingly, both Caro and FitzSimons make much of their atheism, but their zealotry in denouncing others for sins against the planet gives rise to a secular fundamentalism. Like a haughty archbishop, it is a case of do as I say and not as I do.
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

    I'd rather look back at my life and say "I can't believe I did that" instead of being there saying "I wish I'd done that"

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    continued:

    “In Qantas lounge (again) on my way to WOMAD [World of Music, Arts and Dance festival] to talk about selling the reality of climate change,” she tweeted in March last year.
    When the irony was pointed out to her, Caro was unfazed. “I have a 70 acre plantation of hard wood eucalypts growing,” she replied. “I’m carbon negative.”

    Simon @simon_as_twit

    Replying to @JaneCaro
    @JaneCaro @deemadigan and not even the slightest hint of irony re flying to climate change conf... self awareness deficit.


    Jane Caro @JaneCaro

    @simon_as_twit @deemadigan I have a 70 acre plantation of hard wood eucalypts growing. I'm carbon negative.
    1:47 PM - Mar 13, 2016


    Carbon negative? Is this the Gaia version of purchasing the papal indulgences of old? Even assuming her reasoning is correct, Caro seemingly does not get that individual offsetting means nothing. She still contributes to the gross total of man-made emissions, which far exceed the result of any attempts to negate them.

    Amusingly, Caro’s invoking of carbon immunity reveals another of her inconsistencies, and that is her purported love of egalitarianism.

    Jane Caro @JaneCaro

    Replying to @GrayConnolly
    @GrayConnolly @stephenlaw60 I particularly loathe people inheriting unearned privilege & feeling somehow superior as a result.
    7:39 PM - Jan 25, 2014


    “I particularly loathe people inheriting unearned privilege & feeling somehow superior as a result,” she states. Ah, but who was feeling superior as a result of her tree-fest? Should we restrict airline travel to those with a rural weekender?

    Caro might care to check her spatial privilege. The world’s population is around 7.5 billion, and the total land surface is roughly 37 billion acres. That equates to around 4.93 acres per person. Now take into account the world is one third desert. How are the chances of everyone being allotted 70 acres of arable land looking?

    Could it be that these trendy virtue gimmicks are no solution? In July, FitzSimons heralded the coming of the great Tesla battery, quoting the South Australian premier with unquestioning acceptance. “Battery storage is the future of our national energy market,” said Jay Weatherill, “and the eyes of the world will be following our leadership in this space.”

    “BOOM!” championed FitzSimons sycophantically. Only a couple of months later he was lamenting the state of battery storage on his computer. “Battery power not close to what they claim! Never is, on ANY computer!,” he tweeted.

    Peter FitzSimons
    @Peter_Fitz


    Got the new Apple Macbook Pro.
    As ever, love it, EXCEPT battery power not close to what they claim!
    Never is, on ANY computer!
    8:33 AM - Sep 4, 2017


    Hello Fitz? Hello? Which bright spark regarded Elon Musk with his oversized Eveready as the energy messiah?

    It is time commentators belatedly admitted that the obsession with renewables, driven largely by a Greens agenda that regards coal as anathema, has been a costly debacle. Far from taking us to a land of milk and honey, we have been plagued with rent seekers, false prophets, and peddlers of energy elixir. Time also perhaps to shun the nuclear naysayers and consider what that form of power could offer us. Oh, and while we are at it, let’s plug the Gaia gasbags. The atmosphere will be a lot healthier for it.
    "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome and charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime" Mark Twain... so... Carpe the living sh!t out of the Diem

    I'd rather look back at my life and say "I can't believe I did that" instead of being there saying "I wish I'd done that"

  34. #18199
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Northern NSW Australia
    Posts
    62,815

    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Much better to do nothing eh Ian? Everything will work out !
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
    Grateful Dead

  35. #18200
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Wongawallan Oz
    Posts
    14,846

    Default Re: Oz Politics.

    Much better to act positively with planning, foresight and care than to throw the baby out with the bathwater - I’d have thought someone would have learnt something from South Australia’s issues.

    The bottom line is that we need reliable and affordable power. Not just for families to run their homes but for industry to operate within this country without interruption.

    Bugger up industry and the rest of the country will grind to a halt, simple really.

    The smart politicians and commentators and anyone else involved won’t be screaming ideology, they’ll be trying to find the balance between maintaining a reliable and affordable power supply while planning for a seamless and achievable transition to sustainable power, then planning it to the n'th degree to cover all eventualities and then implementing it.
    Larks

    “It’s impossible”, said pride.
    “It’s risky”, said experience.
    “It’s pointless”, said reason.
    “Give it a try”, whispered the heart.

    LPBC Beneficiary

    "Keep away from people who try to belittle your ambitions. Small people always do that, but the really great make you feel that you, too, can become great!"

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