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Thread: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

  1. #36
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Quote Originally Posted by Solstice View Post
    All I was trying to indicate was that I was not looking for opinions, because I have discussed this issue with boaters and shipwrights for years, and many people in this field suffer from having inherited opinions that are based more on theoretical issues than actual experience. When it comes to opinions, I am no more interested in those that agree with me, as some posters have indicated, than those that disagree - I was asking for real-life experiences, good or bad, in order to learn from those who have been in my situation before me.

    When the advice on how to "do it right" is coming from people who, despite having rich experiences in general, have never tried my suggested approach, nor heard of, nor seen, this approach, why should value be assigned to this opinion? Why must a new approach be shut down, ridiculed, and garner almost hateful responses just because it doesn't adhere to the traditional way of doing something? How do we learn new approaches at all, if not by having someone willing to take a chance, and quite possibly fail, perhaps fail many times?

    My search for new methods will continue, as it does in all aspects of my life. I am quite grateful to those of you have shared your experiences, and have indicated an open mind to alternative approaches. The decks on my boat will be finished correctly, whether that involves tearing off the existing teak planks or not, but I don't yet feel I have enough information to make a truly informed decision.
    Well, I used to be in the yacht brokerage business and have spent a lot of time in professional boatyards and working with marine surveyors. I've also done a lot of my own work restoring boats. You asked for an opinion, I'll be happy to give it to you.

    1. Your solution isn't at all "new." Very, very few things under the sun are "new." You don't think your Grand Banks isn't the first one to have this problem. (Which, inidentially, was caused by somebody else's "new" idea of sanding down the decks rather than maintaining them properly.)

    2. The repairs necessary are complicated by the deck construction technique which is inherently defective, although it does last for a good long time, which is long enough for the manufacturer not to get sued over it. The "old fashioned" way of laying properly caulked solid teak decking on deck beams without plywood underlayment costs more and requires more skill and time to build, but lasts much longer, particularly if properly maintained. Owing a Grand Banks, you've gotta dance with the girl ya brought. It's time for a deck rebuild. Simple as that.

    3. Do you think you are the first guy to think of slathering googe on top of a leaky deck? You want experienced opinions? I've seen it done more times than I can count. It has long been a standard practice on workboats where economy is essential. It gets a few more working years out of a boat and that's fine. (Before 'glass, they used Arabol lagging adhesive (Much like Elmer's glue) and "yellowjacket," a polypropelyne mesh fabric. It worked great... for a while.)

    4. Now for the opinion: Even the best 'glassing job is going to look like crap in short order. To get a good looking job, with a fair surface is going to be difficult and nasty. You will have to do a huge amount of sanding and fairing of cured resin to level it all out. It won't last because the substrate will expand and contract and crack the cured resin. It will then leak and everything below will eventually rot.

    5. From a broker's perspective, everybody who sees a boat like a Grand Banks with a 'glassed over deck is going to walk away shaking their head and muttering, "Who was the jackass that ruined such a nice boat." They'll probably list it for you, but at a hugely reduced price. Grand Banks put those teak decks on their boats because they realized that the teak decks increased the value of the boat far beyond the cost of the time and materials to do it. Call it "flash" if you want, but that is one of the features that makes the Grand Banks boats desireable in the marketplace.

    Bottom line, your "new idea" is nothing more than slapping a band aid on a sucking chest wound.

    Remember, now, these are just opinions... your mileage may differ.

  2. #37
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Cleek View Post
    Even the best 'glassing job is going to look like crap in short order. To get a good looking job, with a fair surface is going to be difficult and nasty. You will have to do a huge amount of sanding and fairing of cured resin to level it all out.
    I am assuming you are referring to glassing over planks as ending up looking like crap, and not just glassing jobs in general. I have already glassed my flying bridge deck and my boat deck, and the fairing was neither difficult nor nasty. I even used a long-board, to a certain extent, to get the result I wanted. I am very familiar with glassing jobs and know the tricks to getting the surface close to needing little extra sanding and fairing.

    I had to patch in a new section of plywood on my flying bridge helm (where the old instruments were) before glassing, and did not find that work to be very difficult either. A photo is attached to show the end result. As you can see by the reflection, this came out extremely fair.



    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Cleek View Post
    From a broker's perspective, everybody who sees a boat like a Grand Banks with a 'glassed over deck is going to walk away shaking their head and muttering, "Who was the jackass that ruined such a nice boat."
    I think it is a strong statement to claim that "everybody" will have this reaction. Even though many new Grand Banks boats today are sold without teak decks, I can see why those seeking out a 'woodie' may want it for the traditional look. If so, my boat won't be the one they select, but, then again, there will be those who see the value in having a maintenance-free setup and a much more modern look. And, I am not fixing my boat for ease of resale - I'm fixing it for me. I'm running an online forum for Grand Banks owners and enthusiasts and can say that I am far from alone in having this desire.

    But now we are debating opinions, which serves no purpose. You are entitled to yours as I am entitled to mine. I will take your comments under consideration with the knowledge that by using the statement "slathering googe" you indicate that I am dealing with someone who has strong feelings on this subject and would not consider any approach other than plank removal as the correct way to go. And you may very well be correct.

    I view several construction methods originally used on this boat as being far from the "right way", and I have, I believe, managed to correct them. The teak decks represent the main remaining task.
    Last edited by Solstice; 12-03-2012 at 05:48 PM.

  3. #38
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Does this guy have a question for which he does not also have the answer?

  4. #39
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Quote Originally Posted by JimConlin View Post
    Does this guy have a question for which he does not also have the answer?
    Am I stepping on somebody's toes, Jim? Is this not a discussion forum where we get to present our views/issues/problems and solicit feedback from others? Is it because I am new that I am not supposed to voice my own thoughts on a subject I brought to this forum due to its reputation for having knowledgeable members?

    I find your posted reply quite rude. It is a snide, personal attack - not dealing with any specific issue I have brought up. It adds nothing to this discussion. Luckily, I am confident your attitude is not representative for this forum and its other members.
    Last edited by Solstice; 12-03-2012 at 06:21 PM.

  5. #40
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    If you must goober over a teak or other planked but not canvassed deck, get the seams sealed and level and then use a product like SaniTred. That will stay waterproof, incredibly easily cleanable, and comfortably non-skid.

  6. #41
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Thanks for the hint, Ian - I will definitely investigate that product.

  7. #42
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Read all you can about SaniTred. Once you're at it, there's a binder coat before you even get to your colour. Then a coloured layer. Once that's dry you paint again and pour a huge amount of their rubber bits over the wet. Let that dry, Vacuum up the excess. Paint again.

    If you want a smooth around the perimeter, against the house, and around the deck fittings, tape before the painting that preceeds dumping the rubber bits and remove the tape before you dump the rubber - before the stuff cures. It does not peal clean like paint so you need to remove the tape while it's still wet. A bit tricky to get a nice edge.

    I've not had a good time with Sanitred on a surface very far off level. I was able to manage my deck that, given the shere, means it's not quite level, but I did not even dare do the cabin house which is steeply arched.

    It's cool stuff.

  8. #43
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Sol, Things to think about; until you get the failing teak deck off, no visual survey of the underside of the ply will completely ensure that creeping corruption is not occurring and could well continue even after you have poured a lot of your valuable time, energy and materials into a covering over the teak. There is something to the Grand Banks and Swan effect, where the teak deck that is so ubiquitous to that type of boat, the one that dosn't sport one stands out a bit, but it sounds like resale is not your current main concern. On solid layed, full thickness decks, with no serious structural problems, but too thin to caulk one more time, we will use the elastomeric rubber, ( fish boats, work boats etc) but the cosmetics are decidedly below GB general standards...If one were forced by economic issues etc, I might refasten the deck planks you've got, bury them with a thin high quality plywood, set in some or another rubber goo, then glass and finish as you have done on the other sections you have repaired, knowing that there is a slight chance you may be kicking a hand grenade down your own fox hole...But this is real life, we all rolls the dice, and takes our chances at some point... Best of luck, Steve/BT

  9. #44
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    While I haven't done the job you are discussing, I have had to work on a boat that did make such a repair of glassing over a teak deck and I can tell you what his experience had been, though possibly not the complete cause.

    We were asked to replace a windlass and two mooring winches on a 90' cruiser that would have been about 30-40 years old. The owner had not done the deck repair but it had been done shortly before he had purchased the vessel about three or four years prior to us working on it.

    When we removed the windlass we found that the ply substrate under the teak deck, which was about 8-10mm thick and which was under about 3mm of glass and epoxy, was completely rotten and that the glass had separated from the teak back about half a metre from the windlass cutout. The mooring winches were much the same but not quite as bad, ie the ply was rotten, the teak and glass had separated but only about 100-200mm back from the windlasses.

    As an engineering company we didn't do the repairs to the deck but contracted in another boat builder to do it and the repairs opened up a real can of worms for the owner. He had pointed out that there were also a couple of quite "drummy" parts of the foredeck and side decks and when those areas were opened up for repair the glass on them just kept peeling back like orange peel. Much of the ply below had also rotted like the other areas but had been hidden from below by the deck head linings.

    Needless to say, the deck repairs ended up being a major repair.

    I gather that most of the problems had occurred where glass had been layed up to edges but not around them, so letting moisture in between the glass and teak and glass and ply, the rot possibly having even started prior to the glassing, however I don't think that was so much the case in the "drummy" areas on the foredeck where it was suggested that the glass and timber had most likely moved and expanded and contracted differently in the heat.
    Larks

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  10. #45
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Teak like pigment, Cogeniac? Had to grab hold of the anchor not to fall off from laughing so hard.

    Larks, thanks for taking the time to write about your experience - definitely something to be learned from that.

    Steve, I agree that there could be issues within the teak sub-deck that would be undetectable from underneath, and I will probably end up pulling up sections just to see what it looks like. The cockpit will be completely redone, as I desire a new lazaret hatch configuration, and it probably has had some leaks in it. As I mentioned earlier, the side decks are fairly straight, with very little hardware to remove, and the most leaky place, so tearing off a section will be a good indication as to the condition of the rest of the deck.

    I will take the advice received so far to indicate that covering existing teak planks is a bad idea, no matter how clever I think I might be. I will rebuild a section of the deck with new ply and glass, take some pictures, and report back.

    Just as a side note, after recently stripping varnish from the hand rail, varnish that had been in place for at least 28 years, I can say without reservation that those who claim you cannot get anything to stick to teak just aren't doing it right.

  11. #46
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    You would be wise to inspect your fuel tanks well before undergoing deck repairs. I have done a few teak deck removals and sub deck repairs to a few Marine Trader trawlers and found tank tops rotted out from leaky teak decks.

  12. #47
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Mike, Grand Banks has indeed had the same problem with leaks around the deck fill. I fixed mine years ago and the tanks are coated with an anti-corrosive epoxy paint.

  13. #48
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    What is an anti corrosive epoxy paint??? Is it an epoxy with an anti corrosive additive or simply an epoxy coating applied to clean metal to protect it from corrosion?
    Larks

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  14. #49
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Normally I try to refrain from obvious tooting of my own horn but, for those of you who may think I may be a bit abrupt in some of my postings reqarding certain approaches to restoration or creating a long lasting job using certain modern materials is because I have been there, done that and have seen it fail time and time again! In fact I can honestly say that I was once involved with the restoration of a famous yawl some twenty plus years ago in that after a new planked Cedar deck was laid, the owner and his builder proposed to cover the decking with canvas set in epoxy resin. I mentioned that I would not recommend that kind of approach to the project as the canvas should be set in white lead so as to be allowed to move as the deck flexed and expanded and contracted with changes in humidity. I was howled off the job as for not knowing what I was talking about. The job was done in the manner that was proposed and I bit my tongue and stepped back from making further comment.

    Two years later, the decking had to be replaced as nearly every seam had cracked and water had intruded under the fabric which was in the process of delamination in some places. The removal of the fabric made a mess out of the cedar as the resin would not allow paint stripper to be used to soften the bond. I understand that some of the wood had to be partially replaced as well as a result of the difficulty in removing the fabric.

    Jay
    Last edited by Jay Greer; 12-05-2012 at 08:47 PM.

  15. #50
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Larks, in this case I was using Sterling U-4747, a high-build strontium chromate epoxy primer. It is listed specifically as an anti-corrosive, but I really don't know whether it has specific functionality not found in other epoxy paints/primers.

  16. #51
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Jay, as you already surmised, I was quite disappointed with your initial reply. I became even more disappointed after I did some research on the forum to find that you have extensive experience and have been a very active member for many years. For new members like me, who don't know the dynamics of this forum and the experience of the various members, I found your reply discouraging, haughty, and somewhat insulting. You could have taken the time to give a proper reply the first time around. I doubt you would have given the response you gave me had someone walked into your yard with a job proposal.

    With all due respect, comparing the application of canvas set in epoxy with glass cloth set in epoxy is like comparing apples and oranges. The sole purpose for the glass is to add strength (not for thickness, not for abrasion resistance), and glass cloth is recommended exactly in the cases where lateral strength is required. Also, the materials available twenty years ago is not an accurate indication of what's available today. Both resins, additives, and glass cloth fabrication has improved since then.

    Now, I assume you may have experience with using glass cloth/roving and epoxy resin (poly is an entirely different animal), and would very much like to hear about that, if you don't mind sharing. Or, if you have already accounted for this experience on this board, perhaps you could provide a link to the previous discussion(s).

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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Quote Originally Posted by Solstice View Post
    Jay, as you already surmised, I was quite disappointed with your initial reply. I became even more disappointed after I did some research on the forum to find that you have extensive experience and have been a very active member for many years. For new members like me, who don't know the dynamics of this forum and the experience of the various members, I found your reply discouraging, haughty, and somewhat insulting. You could have taken the time to give a proper reply the first time around. I doubt you would have given the response you gave me had someone walked into your yard with a job proposal.

    With all due respect, comparing the application of canvas set in epoxy with glass cloth set in epoxy is like comparing apples and oranges. The sole purpose for the glass is to add strength (not for thickness, not for abrasion resistance), and glass cloth is recommended exactly in the cases where lateral strength is required. Also, the materials available twenty years ago is not an accurate indication of what's available today. Both resins, additives, and glass cloth fabrication has improved since then.

    Now, I assume you may have experience with using glass cloth/roving and epoxy resin (poly is an entirely different animal), and would very much like to hear about that, if you don't mind sharing. Or, if you have already accounted for this experience on this board, perhaps you could provide a link to the previous discussion(s).
    Of course you are offended if you don't realize that those of us who are against your proposal are trying to do you a favor. Yes, I have had a bit of experience working with both polyester and epoxy resins as well as a variety of different fibers on a commercial basis. I have lived long enough to see the results of mixing modern multiple materieals of a differant modulus of elasticity and UV resistance as light, time, moisture and temperature cause the inevitable degradation of structures that then again need expensive efforts to place them in a usable condition. There are certain ways that these materials can be sucessfully used but yours is not a project I would recommend them for. But then, I don't know much about boat building.
    Jay

  18. #53
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay Greer View Post
    Of course you are offended if you don't realize that those of us who are against your proposal are trying to do you a favor.
    I ask people all the time to show me why my proposal is wrong. In my profession I rely on it as a sanity check. Nothing about that process is the least bit offensive. It was just your first reply of "Wrong!" that set me on edge, and a few follow-ups from other members who also felt it was more important to indicate their opinion about me and/or the question than to contribute to the discussion. However, that's done with and there are no hard feelings.

    Perhaps the question I asked was considered so far out, so ridiculous, that the poster must be regarded as an ignoramus of the highest order. That's a dangerous assumption to make. Those of us who work on our wooden boats as a hobby, or labor of love, can benefit greatly from having access to those who do this as a profession. But, the parameters for how we do our work are different. As a professional, I would refuse to do any proposed job where there was more than a minimal chance of it failing. As a hobbyist/owner I am there to keep an eye on the result and can afford to make mistakes.

    Over a period of several years I have posed this specific question to professionals with the basic feedback being that it won't work. Not one of these people had, by the way, done it - perhaps for the reasons I mentioned above. They either had experience with a somewhat similar approach, or they just knew. In order to avoid doing everything myself I rely on other people's experience, which often leads to knowledge. This is very valuable. An opinion exists at the opposite end of the spectrum, and I have no room in my life for anything based on unsupported belief, whether it concerns deities or teak decks.

    So far, Bob Adams is the only member who has reported experience with pretty much the exact approach I was planning. His horizon was five years out and we don't know how much longer that job held up (or will hold up). Rogue had a different approach, though still covering the planks, and his has been good for twenty-two years. Larks had an experience apparently with the exact approach I was thinking of, and it had failed three to four years later. So, what is the conclusion to draw from this? I'd say the work Larks was exposed to must have been a poor job, which even the best rated yards are capable of (I have personal experience with this).

    Again, I very much appreciate the feedback from all those who have shared their knowledge with me, and feel confident that the approach I take will either give an excellent result or teach me another lesson - either way is OK with me.

  19. #54
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Quote Originally Posted by Solstice View Post

    Again, I very much appreciate the feedback from all those who have shared their knowledge with me, and feel confident that the approach I take will either give an excellent result or teach me another lesson - either way is OK with me.

    Will it be "OK" with your boat? We are more interested in the boat.

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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Solstice - I think that a good deal of what you see as curtness directed at you personally, is really more weariness and impatience with the seemingly endless ways that people propose to misuse and mismatch various building components. Understand, I'm not addressing your exact proposal (which I'd be quite skeptical of, but would need more information to fully evaluate_... just the amazing number of cockamamie schemes that have been put forward here... even in the few short years I've been checking in. This dynamic is further exacerbated by the number of armchair builders to speculate, encourage, spin off even goofier permutations, and otherwise muddy the waters and misinform the uninitiated. Those of us who have a dollop of experience do sometimes get frustrated with it. So, please do excuse any perceived curtness, and definitely do not take it personally. People here really DO have the best interests of your boat in mind.
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    So, please do excuse any perceived curtness, and definitely do not take it personally.
    No, David, he should take it personally. It takes a great deal of time to answer these queries. Then the questioner blows off the answer. If he knows the answer, why did he ask it. I have little patience with those that come on to ask a question then insult those that try to help him.

    If a person is too broke or too lazy to do restore a boat in a manner that will not put it in danger, he should sell it.

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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Pat - you and I and Jay and others are all guilty of being brusque with newbies at times. This can raise their hackles to the point where they react badly. I don't blame any of us for being tired of the bootless inquiries, and the stubborn ignorance. It's just that that weariness can come across as rudeness. You're right - it does take time and energy and thought to frame a cogent reply. And... all the time you're wondering if the OP will hear you, or will know enough to even understand what you're saying. How much energy should you invest? Are you really going to provide the whole cv... so they'll have some sense that you're not just another fool mouthing off? So you give the short reply, not couching your response sufficiently in gentle reassurances for some, and misunderstandings ensue.

    Just because I think I understand the dynamic doesn't mean I have an answer. My own answer has become - I don't attempt to give advice at all unless I'm possessed of enough time and composure and goodwill to do it carefully. Vishnu instead of Shiva. I don't always succeed, by I am getting better at it. YMMV, of course.
    David G
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  23. #58
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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    "If a person is too broke or too lazy to do restore a boat in a manner that will not put it in danger, he should sell it."

    This doesn't help; opinions come for free around here. If you don't like the return on the investment of your time to profer your opinion, then STFU .

    This was a legitimate question from a new member in the OP...

    "“If you did this successfully did you glass over the seam compound (which I would think would be the worst approach), replace the compound with thickened epoxy, or glue wood splines in the seams to create as much of a solid surface as possible? If you tried a similar approach and it didn't work, why did it fail? Did the glass/resin layer work its way loose, or did have you problems getting it to stick in the first place? Did the glass/resin layer develop cracks that allowed water intrusion?”

    Jay didn't attempt to address the question and came out with a smackdown and you doubled down on this? If this topic has been covered by either of you in an earlier thread, a link would be in order. If you have no patience for the topic of this thread, feel free to add your opinions elsewhere; same rates apply. / Jim

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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    Just because I think I understand the dynamic doesn't mean I have an answer. My own answer has become - I don't attempt to give advice at all unless I'm possessed of enough time and composure and goodwill to do it carefully.
    The guy came on seeking someone to endorse his googe repair technique, then he insulted anyone that told him there was a better way to do it. Adding for spice, comments about what a bright and successful person he is.

    Sorry, this is not what _I_ think this venue is all about. Evidently others have different ideas. (See #63)

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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Quote Originally Posted by David G View Post
    Solstice - I think that a good deal of what you see as curtness directed at you personally, is really more weariness and impatience with the seemingly endless ways that people propose to misuse and mismatch various building components.
    ...
    This dynamic is further exacerbated by the number of armchair builders to speculate, encourage, spin off even goofier permutations, and otherwise muddy the waters and misinform the uninitiated. Those of us who have a dollop of experience do sometimes get frustrated with it.
    Understood, and appreciated.

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    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    I have never done any thing like this before, but I think for this job, you could do a quantitative analysis of different alternatives in terms of time and materials, and then that might better inform you of whether to glass over the teak, or to pull off the teak and glass over the current plywood, or to restore the teak and keep it as it is. The epoxy and glass will probably be a fixed cost no matter which approach you use, if you convert to a glass deck.

    The differences will be the time needed to prep the teak vs. the time needed to remove it and prep the plywood. The prep work to restore the teak may be about the same as the prep work to glass it.

    You could also include a list of pros and cons of each approach with the likelihood of a good or bad outcome, and the probable consequences (and their costs) of each outcome, ranging from "a successful job with maintenance free decks" to "waterlogged teak and ply decks that need to be completely removed and replaced."

    If you are going to encapsulate the teak, then obviously you will want it to be as dry as possible so that it doesn't move and there is as little moisture as possible for rot. Will you be able to do this work indoors with a way to dry the deck? (The recent magazine article on the Vaitses method described how they tented the boat and used de-humidiers to remove several hundred pounds of moisture before encapsulating the hull with glass.) This could be factored into your analysis.

    If you can assign actual numbers to the different options, you may find that either one option looks a lot better than the others on a quantitative basis, or that there is so much uncertainty that you may as well follow your gut and hope for the best.



    Brian

  27. #62
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Brookings, Oregon
    Posts
    548

    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Quote Originally Posted by chas View Post
    "If a person is too broke or too lazy to do restore a boat in a manner that will not put it in danger, he should sell it."

    This doesn't help; opinions come for free around here. If you don't like the return on the investment of your time to profer your opinion, then STFU .

    This was a legitimate question from a new member in the OP...

    "“If you did this successfully did you glass over the seam compound (which I would think would be the worst approach), replace the compound with thickened epoxy, or glue wood splines in the seams to create as much of a solid surface as possible? If you tried a similar approach and it didn't work, why did it fail? Did the glass/resin layer work its way loose, or did have you problems getting it to stick in the first place? Did the glass/resin layer develop cracks that allowed water intrusion?”

    Jay didn't attempt to address the question and came out with a smackdown and you doubled down on this? If this topic has been covered by either of you in an earlier thread, a link would be in order. If you have no patience for the topic of this thread, feel free to add your opinions elsewhere; same rates apply. / Jim
    +1

    Next we hear that boat werkers don't get the respect they deserve......

    For gosh sakes lighten up P-Dawg

  28. #63
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    atascadero, ca.
    Posts
    380

    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    I like to clarify the conditions that caused me lay a doorskins and roofing tar/arabol/yellow jacket over my decks. It would not have been my first choice at all. Sometime in the early '70's a lot of bad work was done to the boat; some of this was on the cockpit area, which is the area I covered over. The sidedecks had been replaced with mahogany over ply and caulked. The cockpit itself was non-exsistent, just a big hole. I had tried to save the Mahogany decking by refinishing it, tearing out the old seam compound, sanding each seam, using Smith's cpe on the seams, Decko-Grove 2 part seam compound, re-bunging, sanding the whole thing down, and varnishing. It looked beautiful! I was planing to fit in a small footwell instead of the large cockpit that had been in before, and was drawing that up and getting ready to cut the wood for it when we finally got an offer on the house we had been trying to sell for two years. Over joyed, I went to check on the boat before heading off to work; it had been a day or so since I had been down to her. I walked up to see my beautiful, varnished decks, and noticed that in every single seam, the seam compound had pulled away....The house sold; we had 45 days to finish the boat project and move aboard. In extreme frustration, I came up with my decking plan of cutting the doorskins w/staggered seams, slathering the area with roofing tar/doorskin/roofing tar, held down with ringed boatnails, then the arabol (lagging compound), and finally marine paint and non-skid. This was a fast, watertight solution to my problem. It was a solution that I hoped would last for 3 or 4 years or until our situation changed again and we weren't living aboard. That it worked so well surprises me to this day. But it is still waiting there for me to redo it...
    Would I recommend someone doing it this way? No, except in cases of extreme need...
    If I had old teak decks that needed refurbishing, I'm pretty sure that I would tear them up and go with fiberglass (or whatever is the high tech solution these days) over staggered-seam plywood, painted, non-skidded, and be done with it. I have also been part of laying the truckbed liner goop on decks and I would run, not walk, away from that...

  29. #64
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Location
    long beach, ca, usa
    Posts
    25

    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Solstice,
    If you are still around, what did you do to your deck and how has it turned out after so many years?

  30. #65
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    1,620

    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    A chain saw project no doubt.

  31. #66
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    South Puget Sound/summer Eastern carib./winter
    Posts
    16,227

    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    He gone .

  32. #67
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Location
    long beach, ca, usa
    Posts
    25

    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Somewhere in this thread someone "suggested" that the original poster go the the fiberglass forum. That may not have been a bad idea. A wood cored fiberglass deck would have considerably less potential flex than a traditional wood deck. That deck may tolerate a rigid resin treatment and not develop cracks over the seams.
    There is one boat owner in my area who is going to attempt applying penetrating epoxy to his Formosa 41 teak on fiberglass deck and then polyurethane/non-skid. It might work.
    This boat is not historical or an important representation of its type. It's really a Taiwan tub, no offense intended. He wants to go sailing and he is getting old. He does not want to work on a huge project even if his marina would allow it.
    For almost any wooden boat it would be a sacrilege. It would probably ensure its premature destruction.
    I hope Solstice found a different boat and success.

  33. #68
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    South Australia and Tasmania
    Posts
    18,338

    Default

    I've just replaced the teak over ply deck on my wooden boat. Unlike the OP it was more ply than teak. 2 layers of 9mm ply with a thin layer of teak over that, maybe around 6mm originally. I elected to replace the whole thing-except for a few small areas where the ply was OK and easier to work around than to remove. It's now epoxy glass over ply. Certainly glad I didn't just glass over the teak, which I never considered to be an option. The teak mostly looked pretty good from on top. The ply mostly looked pretty good from underneath. It was what was going on in between that was horrendous. A bit of glass slapped on top, whether it later cracked or not, would have killed the boat.

    Sent from my CPH1851 using Tapatalk

  34. #69
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    10,826

    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Ok, I have not done this, but I will ask a question. In building various types of wood-epoxy boats, I have always heard that if you keep encapsulated wood less than 3/4 inch think, the bonding on each side will be strong enough to resist the dimensional change due to moisture absorption. Assuming the teak is around 1/2 to 5/8 inch think and one does a good job of prepping, etc, and then lays a relatively thick about of glass, will there be that much expansion and contraction of the underlying teak? This sounds like what Bob describes in post #6. I can understand not wanting a teak deck in a warm climate, they do get hot.

  35. #70
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    South Puget Sound/summer Eastern carib./winter
    Posts
    16,227

    Default Re: Fiberglassing a Teak Deck

    Peb,
    On one hand, the thinner the wood , the better the potential for the epoxy to "saturate" through. This is the original WEST theory with cold molding,using one eighth inch strips. The very thin wood MAY be actually saturated.
    But for the stability of the wood itself, square is the most stable shape. So, the 1/2 inch teak decks best be 1/2 inch wide.
    This is why deck planks ARE always narrow. Rarely square, but closer to it.
    I occasionally recommend folks run a few saw kerfs down a wide plank before doing some sort of epoxy fix.
    bruce

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