Let's have an argument.

[P.I. Stazzer-Newt]

Word confusion...


When to use "burnt" as against "burned" - or "learnt" v "learned".


What, in anything, do the learned gentlemen of the bilge think?

[ChrisBen]

burnt- Urban Dictionary: burnt

burned- Urban Dictionary: burned

[Phillip Allen]

why is it wrong to cheat on college exams? (looking for a particular phrase or word)

[S/V Laura Ellen]

I'll wait for Donn to drop in and give us the definitive answer.

[Peerie Maa]

If you had learnt a lot, you might be described as learned.

[Phillip Allen]

are we gonna include colloquial usage?

[P.I. Stazzer-Newt]

If you had learnt a lot, you might be described as learned.

Wise counsel, or the council of the elders?

[S/V Laura Ellen]

This is what I really like about the English language ... learn a few very simple rules and you're golden.

[Phillip Allen]

This is what I really like about the English language ... learn a few very simple rules and you're golden.

speak for yourself, Midas

[Peerie Maa]

Wise counsel, or the council of the elders?

[Phillip Allen]

Thank you Peerie, that puts everything in perspective.

[S/V Laura Ellen]

This is what I really like about the English language ... learn a few very simple rules and you're golden.

speak for yourself, Midas

I did, that is why I used the word I, as in "what I really like"

[Gerarddm]

I like using Churchillian spelling and syntax: pray, whilst you are up, get me a pint. Etc.

[Cuyahoga Chuck]

This is what I really like about the English language ... learn a few very simple rules and you're golden.

Whew! Where did you get that from.?
English has the MOST bizarre phonetic alphabet of any of the languages that use a phonetic alphabet. Most modern literary languages have rectified (modernized) alphabets that almost eliminate spelling problems. The phonetics of English is so filled with exceptions to rectify it now would (wud) be a literary nightmare.

[S/V Laura Ellen]

This is what I really like about the English language ... learn a few very simple rules and you're golden.

Whew! Where did you get that from.?
English has the MOST bizarre phonetic alphabet of any of the languages that use a phonetic alphabet. Most modern literary languages have rectified (modernized) alphabets that almost eliminate spelling problems. The phonetics of English is so filled with exceptions to rectify it now would (wud) be a literary nightmare.

sarcasm (ˈsɑːkæzəm)

— n
1. mocking, contemptuous, or ironic language intended to convey scorn or insult
2. the use or tone of such language


irony 1 (ˈaɪrənɪ)

— n , pl -nies
1. the humorous or mildly sarcastic use of words to imply the opposite of what they normally mean
2. an instance of this, used to draw attention to some incongruity or irrationality
3. incongruity between what is expected to be and what actually is, or a situation or result showing such incongruity
4. See dramatic irony
5. philosophy See Socratic irony

[Cuyahoga Chuck]

Word confusion...


When to use "burnt" as against "burned" - or "learnt" v "learned".


What, in anything, do the learned gentlemen of the bilge think?

Sorry, mate, but the confusion you have pointed out would be a mote in the eye of anyone trying to learn English compared to the obvious consternation involved in trying to come to grips with our phonetic alphabet.

[S/V Laura Ellen]

This is what I really like about the English language ... learn a few very simple rules and you're golden.

Whew! Where did you get that from.?
English has the MOST bizarre phonetic alphabet of any of the languages that use a phonetic alphabet. Most modern literary languages have rectified (modernized) alphabets that almost eliminate spelling problems. The phonetics of English is so filled with exceptions to rectify it now would (wud) be a literary nightmare.

What could be easier than this simple rule:

"It's I before E, except where it isn't..."

[Cuyahoga Chuck]

sarcasm (ˈsɑːkæzəm)

— n
1. mocking, contemptuous, or ironic language intended to convey scorn or insult
2. the use or tone of such language


irony 1 (ˈaɪrənɪ)

— n , pl -nies
1. the humorous or mildly sarcastic use of words to imply the opposite of what they normally mean
2. an instance of this, used to draw attention to some incongruity or irrationality
3. incongruity between what is expected to be and what actually is, or a situation or result showing such incongruity
4. See dramatic irony
5. philosophy See Socratic irony

Hang on to your erronious ideas if you like. My attempt to explain the phonetic problems of English was done in all seriousness.
The digraphs ""ie and "ei" are often phonetically the same except when they aren't. Got any nifty sayings that will guarantee a correct pronounciation of "ough".

[Peerie Maa]

Hang on to your erronious ideas if you like. My attempt to explain the phonetic problems of English was done in all seriousness.
The digraphs ""ie and "ei" are often phonetically the same except when they aren't. Got any nifty sayings that will guarantee a correct pronounciation of "ough".

Are you asking about the north or south of England?

[Cuyahoga Chuck]

Are you asking about the north or south of England?

If there is a difference that's your problem. I am talking abbout LITERARY English. The phonetics are a disaster.
We Slovaks (btw it isn't Slovaaaaks) live on only 25,000 sq. mi. but speak close to 30 different dialects. But everyone learns "Sturc'ina", the literary language concocted by Lid'ovit Stur in the 1850's. It has an easily learned phonetic alphabet. Modern Czech was codified by Jungmann in the 1840s with the same result. Both these languages have simplified alphabets with diacritics to indicate the softened letters or change of sound. Modern Hungarian is somewhat more complex because their language is that. They use both digraphs for softened sounds (Gyorgy= jorj) , (Nagy=naj) and diacritics. They have three levels of umlauts which I can't portray nor would ever try to say. None of these languages has anything like the literary puzzle brought about by the phonetic value of our old friend "ough". Or the silent "i" in "friend" marriage" or "parliament" or the strange spelling of "would" and "could".

[Old Dryfoot]

Hold your head and go WHAAA...

[Mad Scientist]

I recall reading about a study conducted by some learned gentlemen a while back - they concluded that, in terms of spelling, English is the most confusing language, followed closely by Scottish and Irish versions of Gaelic, and French.

IIRC, the whole thing started when one of those learned gentlemen overheard a complaint about the difficulty of French spelling, and intellectual curiosity kicked in.

Tom

[TomF]

I dunno the rules about "burnt" and "burned" etc. I've always said "the toast is burnt" and "the toast had been burned" but for no other reason than that it sounded better to my ear. As that ear was informed by a lot of reading, I've come to mostly trust it - but I'd be quite interested in the actual rule.

And yes, I think English must be a nightmare for people to learn; glad I'm a native speaker.

[beernd]

I am still glad I learned to read in Dutch, the whole thing was very logical to a six year old boy.

What if you turn the problem 180 degrees around, and say that the pronounciation has gone haywire.

For instant the word "caugh" is pronounced "coff" if you would pronounce the "au" as in "owl" and pronounce the "g" the dutch way you are aproaching a phonetic pronounciation.

[skipper68]

I was Burned when I read the answers. Insert "Big Blue Eyed EEK".

[skipper68]

Couldn't reply on edit.[This needs a serious investigation. Any links?]

[purri]

I defer to Fowler's "Common English Useage".

[skipper68]

I EXPECTCongressional inquiryI before E except after C. Wrong? No one will do "C".