Process of choosing a new build trailer sailer design...29 months later...a decision!

[skaraborgcraft]

It was never going to be easy. But its been a lot of fun. I thought for those that may be in a similar position,i would go through the designs that took my interest,and why they ended as runner ups. Basically,i was after a much easier boat to launch and recover than my 25ft 3ton Koster K25,it needs a crane each time,and a crane for setting up the mast,which itself has a total of 10 wires holding it aloft. I wanted something a lot simpler to deal with,with the option of trailing to other areas behind a "normal" car,so i could dispense with my old faithfull,if rather thirsty Range Rover (diesel) I will try to attach pictures as i go for those that may not be familiar with the designs. Im not going to be doing this in one sitting,so this will last out a few days,maybe, before revealing the final choice.

[skaraborgcraft]

CMD Windward 21 was probably one of the first boats that caught my eye,i thought its chine hull and rig was attractive,but its weight was given as 2250lbs,which although around of a third of my current boat,i was thinking of the time of something a bit lighter. I still have not seen any photos of a completed boat,but the designer assured me several had been built.

[JimD]

On Karl's website W21's weight is given as 1200 pounds.

[skaraborgcraft]

A Bolger Chebbacco was next up for consideration. I actually like the double chine version. Big cockpit, small but adequate cuddy,good outboard arrangement and around 1000lbs displacement......this won over the Windward 21..... ...to be continued

[skaraborgcraft]

On Karl's website W21's weight is given as 1200 pounds.

Thanks Jim....weird,thats the figure i took off his site 2 years ago....i may have screwd up...but not an issue for me. Cheers

[Jamie Orr]

A Bolger Chebbacco was next up for consideration. I actually like the double chine version. Big cockpit, small but adequate cuddy,good outboard arrangement and around 1000lbs displacement......this won over the Windward 21..... ...to be continued

Where are you located? There is a good network of Chebacco owners, any of whom would be happy to give you a test drive. I have several email addresses for owners, and www.chebacco.com is a good source.

You don't even have to be serious about building - it's a good excuse to go sailing and a chance for the owner to show off his pride and joy!

Jamie

[Sayla]

CMD Windward 21 was probably one of the first boats that caught my eye,i thought its chine hull and rig was attractive,but its weight was given as 2250lbs,which although around of a third of my current boat,i was thinking of the time of something a bit lighter. I still have not seen any photos of a completed boat,but the designer assured me several had been built.

Cape Henry weighs in at between 1.16ton to 1.45 ton (full load), pretty roomy, generous cockpit, tabernacle mast, fairly normal car to tow, chined / ply construction / shallow V, definitely coastal seaworthiness with hydrostatics / numbers - looking like my first option for trailering apart from own design, but that's not happened / over yet



For the style you're looking at, how about a Romily? or in a Cat-ketch a B&B http://www.bandbyachtdesigns.com/index.html (- quite roomy, lightweight, offset c/board, shoal draft)

Or one of these sounds like the weight you're after
- Eun na mara



sayla

[DGentry]

Well, I'm interested in what you have chosen . . . especially as I'm sure you know that used fiberglass trailer sailors - already complete with trailer, motor, sails, etc - are going for peanuts. None of them look as nice as a Chebaccco, of course, but the many thousands of dollars and many hundreds of hours of labor you'd save by just buying a used boat seem like a nice consolation.
Is that what you've decided? Or perhaps a B&B Belhaven or a Norwalk Island Sharpie? Perhaps a Night Heron folding trimaran? All those are nice, but I'm just rambling, now . . . .

[skaraborgcraft]

Jamie, i recall your messages and good words about the Chebbacco, and that is one of the reasons she was a serious consideration,i still have the building plans.

Sayla, both the Cape Cutter and Cape Henry were looked at,the Cape Henry being a little more weight than i wanted. The 19ft is a nice boat, but an explanation will follow......

Mr Gentry, there is absolutely no reason to waste a thousand hours and spend 10 times as much money,to get a craft that will do what i need of it and be fit for purpose. However, some people are afflicted with a condition that requires them to to do the above, with no logical reasons,other than they choose to create. More to follow.......

[Jamesh]

Come on tell us!!
Penguin? Sweat pea?
Romilly?
Hartley 21!!?
Bay cruiser 20 / 23???
My own trailer sailer comes in at 23 ft and 2200lbs lines look right compared to other designs just got larsson elements of yacht design v complicated and narrow production boat focus. which book to people recommend for lighter craft design? James

[skaraborgcraft]

So, there i was with Chebbacco plans in hand and pretty much eager to start when a sudden house move put that to rest. Over the following few months i kept a track or my own thoughts and needs(and those of my wife),and kept an open mind to any further options should anything come up.
There then started the disscussion started by Keyhavenpotterer,originally about a chined mini-transat boat,that quickly developed into the Souriciou thread.




Now, there was a few people who didnt like this boat at all. I cant say its overall shape appealed to me, looking as someone said "like a suppositary". However,the idea of steering from inside in the dry was novel and for someone who is sailing on a large lake in Sweden,was a feature that could prolong my sailing season until the ice starts forming. It was also light at 530kg. I really liked the idea,but i didnt like the hull so much,and saw the rig as being tricky to put up singlehanded.

But the idea of a truely lightweight trailer sailer was then planted in my head....so i had to look at alternatives.There is a mass of choices,i really liked the Blue Storm and Blue Eyes design but the only one that held up against the others,in my opinion at least, was the humble Hartley TS16.






Thousands of Australians couldnt be wrong! Here was a well tried boat. I ended up buying plans for the12,14,16 and 21. I got as far as consulting with a designer to using a drop bulb keel as used in Souriciou,in the Hartly,and have all the drawings to do so. I wanted to modify above the sheer to give some more internal space,to achieve a flush deck and remove the doghouse. I had a pretty good picture in my minds eye of what i wanted, but i made a pretty rough scale model to just to check,and bounce ideas. Thread was here; http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...-Top-or-Bottom

[skaraborgcraft]

I spent a lot of time working on the TS16 idea. I drew out all the frames onto pattern ply, and added another plank onto the sheer to form the cabinside/cockpit coaming. It was all looking quite well in my eyes. Another good point was that i could build up to 18ft in length inside my workshop, and anything above that would need me to extend,something that is in process,but was not at the time.

Jamesh........i did look at sweet pea.....i prefered the Hartley.


So,it came to the end of another summer here in Sweden,i had to put my boats away and head back to the UK for some work over the winter period. Of course,that meant i had spare time in the evenings to browse the internet.....
To be continued

[skaraborgcraft]

James, im sure someone can advise on a book,but i dont know of any specifically pointed at light displacement. I think its more a process of lightweight construction and design to suit. Ply on stringer or cold moulded veneer is a very strong and light way to build in wood.

[skaraborgcraft]

I do realise that the boats that i have shown so far,and the boats that are to come,may appear to make me look like some headless chicken running in circles. The point is,if you bear with me, some things become more clear as time goes on. Please do remember that in a thread that can be posted in 24 hours, cant convey what has gone on in the posters life over the 29 month period,and all those little things that can bring on changes,ideas or needs. More to follow.....

[Jamesh]

I was thinking of strip planking over a thick plywood base 18mm gerr has scanning rules but i could not figure out what sn meant as page 154 is missing in Google books. but i think 18 mm cedar or pine would be about right its what Steve redmond uses on elver my design uses a master curve as Steve does but being longer and transomed has lots more space. James

[Jamesh]

If you like ts 16 why not ym senior great little boat? Or if sailing in Sweden then a swaggie for comfort!!!

[skaraborgcraft]

James, im familiar with the YM senior,but it wont plane like the TS16. Swaggie is not particulary light,and has a deepish keel.so is not easy to launch of a trailer.

Sn in Gerrs book is a formula taken from these sizes;

Sn= LOA (ft) x beam (ft) x depth of hull (ft) divided by 1000. if you work in metric,replace ft with M and divide by 28.32

Plenty of Gerrs book secondhand on amazon....worth getting if you are curious or indeed designing to build.

[skaraborgcraft]

Sooooooo, although i didnt go as far as buying plans for this,i was interested in the Porgy boats from Tad Roberts



But at the time,i was still pretty convinced by the lighter weight and planing performance of a modified TS16. I have to say there is still something about the Porgy boats i like, but not enough to commit to a build.

It was then after some thought that although the TS16M (M for modified),was fine for two people,it was of no use for anymore in modified form. One of the best pics i have seen of a Hartly was this one;



Nine people in this shot,its not actually the one i was looking for which showed 8, but shows,although small in size, the hull was a good load carrier. But with my shortened cockpit and flush decks,it was not a boat for crowds like this,let alone 4-5 sitting comfortably in a cockpit. Keeping an open mind,i thought back to that large cockpit of the Chebbacco, and then found interest in this......... to follow

[skaraborgcraft]

I got kinda nostalgic......i still have my Nordic Folkboat and Koster, and like a boat to have a traditional look/style, which i admit may seem a bit odd after working on a modified TS16 with bulb keel and astro domes,but there you go! I recall this next boat from the past,and dissmissed it, but now saw it through a different set of wyes and liked what i saw. There was a thread here: http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...Seal&highlight=



I recieved the study plans and was impressed with what i saw. Roomy enough cockpit,excellent outboard arrangment, good sized cuddy and powerfull but not complicated rig.Beniguet is a real nice package.The weight was a lot more than Chebbacco, and after considering a 400kg TS16, the Beniguet at 850kg, suddenly seemed expensive, so i was considering at the time Oughtreds Wee Seal....




This particular Wee Seal being very nice. What put me off however was the outboard arrangement was not as good as Beniguet,cockpit was smaller, and she seemed to be just a little too shapely (if thats possible), but im partial to a double ended boat.

Someone suggested Eun Mara..



Now, if wee seal was too curvy,the eun mara was kinda opposite. Although the sheer was less springy,something in the proportions of the plan view was not to my liking. I know this sounds highly critical,and maybe it is,but with good reason;i am in no way knocking Iain Oughtreds design work,he is very skilled in drawng peachy looking craft, but if you are going to be spending hundreds of hours and a heap of money,it needs to be on a boat that is 100% right. She is a great boat,but there is a lot of spars and sails to be made,and two centreboards to build. Capable,but overly complicated for what we were after.

If you have read the link above,you will have read that another Vivier/Clint Chase design of "jewell" was put forward..



Another great design and very nice rig.My better half had found this boat though,as more looking like the Folkboat that she is rather partial to, a Whisstocks design 074..




I still like the Whisstock boats and have several plans, we decided that the 074 would be a cheaper build than Beniguet on the fact of its lighter displacement. Poor Wee Seal got relegated at this point and 074 became primary. My better half then suggested John Welsfords 6M Whaler..........to follow

[skaraborgcraft]

The Whaler was the lightest of the bunch,at least on paper at 300kg,so in theory at least should be the cheapest build...



I like this boat a LOT. Light weight,shallow draught,huge cockpit large enough for any party of people i would consider going for an afternoon sail with.....i sent for plans.
I liked what i saw,easy build method on stringers,it all it needed was a wee cuddy for the better half for calls of the natrual kind,and possibly room enough for a bunk. I drew up this sketch for a cuddy on Whaler...



I know John had disscussed cabin arrangments for this particular design in the past,and i only ever found one picture online of a whaler with a cabin.....and i was not impressed. I know JW may have been busy at the time with KHP and his cruising canoe and other projects,but i never did get any answers to questions i had;i didnt persist because i dont believe that should be neccessary. Regardless of designers assistance or lack off, there was nothing i could see wrong with this boat. Even if i didnt make a solid cuddy,i could make a folding sprayhood and enclosed tent system,that would/could enclose the whole cockpit and make it a very adaptable trailable dayboat/weekender . This then became the first choice. Bearing in mind this desicion was made last year,i had another winter to get through, and Whaler was still number choice come spring time. I was not/am not, in a rush to build, i need to extend my workshop for whaler and new this would be a project over at least 2 summers,or a winter build if my work schedule allowed for it. I have been quite happy with material lists and ordering epoxy to have on hand when the time comes etc, and doodling sketches of whaler with different cabin sizes and cockpit arrangements. The only issue i have with open boats is rain water collection, and i really wanted a self draining cockpit; i know JW has already said this is achievable on whaler,but it would not be needed inside a fixed cuddy,so i was working on that at the time,cockpit vs cuddy length,and playing with different rigs,even though i like the rig she has been designed with. Of course, just when you are ambling along in life with no thoughts of any change in particular...WHAM!

Can this forum be a curse and a blessing? Just as you feel confident you have found the right boat, someone goes and posts a picture of another that blows your mind. It was with mixed feelings that i had to realise and admit to myself,that despite whalers ability to undertake all i could ask it to, and still could, this boat just had everything i was looking for AND that certain something that cant be put into words....y,know, that frustrating thing you cant explain to people, yet i know i dont need to try explain it to people who know the feeling. Finale to follow....... Goodnight!

[Hwyl]

Blue Lightning http://www.bluelightning.co.uk/ts/bluelightning.shtm

[Tom Painter]

Great thread. I'm on the boat design Ferris wheel myself.

Here's some fuel for the fire:

Cardigan Bay Lugger



No plans, just kits or finished boats. That's OK, it's the idea. This looks very much like a cabin-on-a-caledonia (or 6m whaler) to me....hmmm...
http://www.swallowboats.co.uk/content/view/95/109/

Needs a Norwegian tiller......that cabin looks highly Oughtred derivative. Ideas, ideas..

[John How]

Kinda glad I didn't see that "Whisstocks design 074" before I started my own build. It has just about everything we were looking for but I like my sail plan better though so I'm happy with what I've chosen. Looking forward to your choice and build.

[skaraborgcraft]

Hwyl, the Bluelightning range of boats are very well designed and fast boats. Asthetically,they look to much like a glass boat,and the epoxy sheathing inside and out is not a build system i wanted on this boat,as i dont enjoy working with that amount of epoxy work unless im being paid for it.

Tom, theres a lot of similarity with some swallow boats and Oughtreds, both going back to some Norse looking row boats, but seem to have a shape that is generally appealing to the public.I think thats a Cardigan Bay Weekender. Its been interesting to see how Swallow Boats have developed their range over the last decade,and what really sells. I drew that rig for the 6M whaler,and it looked ok. The other rig that looked promising was a high peaked gunter with mizzen,pretty much like the Swallow Boats Raider. I drew it so it would fit on the existing lug main mast,allowing for a light wind rig with just a change of mainsail. Jib and mizzen sailing is just so controllable in all winds .

John, You dont often see Whisstock boats being mentioned on the forum,i dont know why, his boats are well engineered,plans are ridiculously cheap, and he always answers emails promptly and is happy to take skype or telephone calls. I know a lot of people need to know help will be availiable should they need it,and i reccomend his plans. George was very helpfull when discussing the 074, as it was originally drawn as an unballasted boat, and i wanted to build as light as possible for easy trailing. Apart from some visual issues with the coachroof and compaionway slide,074 has a lot going for it,and still has. It was the closest boat visually my better half could find to a Folkboat with the keel cut off,which is part of what we was after,nice looks,performance but without the weight and draft issues;074 is a s close as it gets!

[skaraborgcraft]

Before i reveal my choice, these are the two boats that i have been looking after for the past few years. The Folkboat was the first boat i bought in Sweden. Important detail is the simple rigging,only 3 stays with a on/off adjustable backstay tensioner for inducing mast bend(only really needed in very strong wind). Bow profile on a Nordic Folkboat gets me everytime.I think the earlier boats had the better looking coachroofs,low,with small portlights.




The Koster double ender came along a few years later, my love for the shape,especially aft, is what grabs me. But she has 10 stays supporting the mast! She is also considerably heavier than the folkboat,yet will sail remarkably well in light winds for her 3 tons,and can only be put down to her fair lines,she is not overcanvassed.



So, i was asking a lot. I enjoy sailing on anything, but as an owner and more so as the builder,i need to have some kind of "connection" with the next boat,if it didnt "hit the spot", then it wouldnt get built. As Dave G said in an earlier post, i could quite simply go and buy a plastic boat,go sailing and have more than a pocket full of change left over. The same could have been said about buying old wooden boats,its does not make any "logical" sense to buy something that will be in a continous state of decay if its not looked after (sounds like the human condition), but everyone on this forum does it anyway.....but maybe for different reasons,to each their own. We need a smaller,lighter boat with glued construction, one that will allow us more sailing time,and with less pre and after-season maintenance issues. One of the biggest issues i have is having to haul the boats out before the onset of frosts,to allow the boats to dry out........some of the most pleasant days are in late autumn,and a glued construction will allow us to keep the boat afloat until iceing is an issue. More sailing time/less work.

Im hoping the plans will arrive in the post today........

[Paul Pless]

Before i reveal my choice,

You're killing me.

[John How]

You're killing me.

Yes, he is being quite evil!

[Yeadon]

... $10 says this turns into a "I put a cabin on a Snooty Tern" thread.

[Paul Pless]

Snooty Tern

snort, cough, sputter. . .

brilliant!

[skaraborgcraft]

... $10 says this turns into a "I put a cabin on a Snooty Tern" thread.

Noooooooooooo! Who gets the $10?

[sailoar]

I bet it's a Kotik. Or maybe he hired Oughtred to draw a cuddy and half-decking for the Caledonia.

[skaraborgcraft]

Ok ,ok... without wishing to be called Belzebub himself i guess im ready to tell you whos plans DID NOT turn up today! Despite my earler remarks on this thread concerning the shape of Wee Seal and Eun Mara,i did however say Iain Oughtred did draw a fine boat,and in my opinion,this one, does it for me......Kotik..







This is the first Kotik launched,owned by Mikhail Markov (currently doing Raid Finland). What can i say? Simple rig, gorgeous stem and even better aft. I have Tom Painter to thank for posting the original photo (and also to blame possibly at some point in the future).

I will be the first to admit that she is a little more boat than we was looking for, She carries almost as much lead in her keel as the whaler displaces! She is a wee bit deeper than we would have liked,but she is within launch and recovery capability at the local slip. All boats are a compromise.....but Kotik will give me the edge over Whaler when it comes to more adventurous trips. As much as i liked the Vivier Beniguet, i have to own up and say the plan price was off putting, so either im real tight, or she just didnt grab me that much; when i saw Kotik, i was in touch with Mr O and money was transfered,without question,without doubts,bargain! I have normally found, when something is right, you know it, and you dont find yourself questioning your motives,you just move in that comfortable feeling and knowing of , "its right". This is one happy-chappy!

[skaraborgcraft]

Congrats Sailoar! You wrote that as i was downloading pics! Sorry....no prize.

[Hwyl]

Wasn't planing one of your parameters?

[Tom Painter]

Didn't see that coming

Ooh new Kotik pic!! SWEET

[skaraborgcraft]

No,planing was not a parameter, but i got excited about planing performance with the TS16M, my wife finds that kind of sailing enjoyable......for about 30 minutes.

[skaraborgcraft]

Didn't see that coming

Ooh new Kotik pic!! SWEET

Cheers Tom, a nod is as good as a wink to a blind man....

Iain sent that one,recently from Mikhail in Finland. Sweet thing eh?

[sailoar]

Uh-oh, I think I might have to get a larger car.

"Honey, can we buy a larger car? Yes, I know we have only one kid. But a bigger one could carry more of her friends! What? No, this has nothing to do with boats, really!"

[skaraborgcraft]

Having had a hard-on for a Venus 28 for almost 2 decades, but realising a 10ton boat is now wasted on me, Kotik sooths my need for a shapely double ender. I no longer need a boat to go transatlantic, but i may at some point wish to cross the North Sea between UK and Scandinavia. My better half wants to visit the Norwegian Fjords,i have long wanted to visit the Lofoten Islands. We can do both by sea,or we can take her on a trailer and cover larger distances by road. From looking for compromise,we feel we have actually got more,from less,or vice-versa, less is more, which i always thought would be a good name for any small cruising boat...LESSISMOR.
Looking back over this thread,i would gladly own any of the boats that have been mentioned,but none wrapped up requirements in a good as looking hull as Kotik, and that was my self indulgance......logically, we could go lighter, but long term view won out. That is not to say a whaler wont get built, i already have the materials on hand,with Kotik materials en-route. Workshop extension is in progress,but i had an agreement with my better half, that Kotiks building frame does not go down until both the Folkboat and Koster have found new homes;we still have the vattensnipa and the Michalak family skiff to use,so we wont be boatless. Sometimes letting go of stuff,especially boats,is hard, but, looking ahead, i have absolutely no doubt that this "compromise" is the right way for us to go.

[skaraborgcraft]

Sailoar, towing wise we was/are all ok upto 1100kg,and thats with the current banger that the better half has been , er...shall we say...eager to replace for some time. Some Volvos just go on and on.....they dont breakdown,you just get bored s**tless driving the same car year after year(not something i have a problem with). Admittedly,whaler or the TS16M would be no more than 750KG all up,so you could tow that with a wee car. I have been driving Range Rovers for around 9 years,as working vehicles,but after selling them both a few years ago,surplus cash from saved running costs is noticable. Im in no hurry to go back!!

[sailoar]

Having had a hard-on for a Venus 28

Honesty is the best policy.

Great decision process, and thanks for sharing it. I have no desire to pass beyond the Golden Gate into the wrongly named Pacific, but on a summer afternoon the Bay still qualifies as open water. And yet I don't want a bigger car, so I'm still looking for that beautiful, safe, sub-1000 lb. boat. It might be a half-decked Caledonia.

[skaraborgcraft]

Sailoar, always pays to be realistic with your needs,its too easy to delude yourself and going way over the top. I still find it hard that a Caladonia weighs as little as it does, but thats good for trailing and you can always add ballast. I thought of this route myself....but i wouldnt cross the North Sea in one (the wife wont let me). Im surprised Iain has not offererd this as an option on the plans,or maybe he does now,but i know he is not averse to the idea. I consider Whaler to be a bit more ruggedly put together,but i wouldnt want to try to right either of them solo in a rough sea. Cheers

[sailoar]

i wouldnt want to try to right either of them solo in a rough sea

True - and I'm on the light side. There was a good thread a while ago about good small boats for the Bay, and the crux of it was that no trailable boat is Bay-proof; stout things like Bears and Folkboats get slammed over on an average day, and it's a matter of picking your places and times, i.e. not around Alcatraz on a 30-knot day at full ebb. D'oh!

Sorry for the diversion - back to you. I bet you'll be watching for the mail truck tomorrow like a kid at Christmas.

[Tom Painter]

Sweet thing eh?

No doubt about it, Kotik is an aesthetic perfection. I'm still playing with WSII.



Looks like 3s a crowd on Winkle...how's 'bout a shorter cabin trunk?







Made a 1/4 scale bird cage too just to see how I like her...hmmm

[stromborg]

When I bought my set of Wee Seal II plans Iain mentioned the availability of the Kotik changes as a reasonably priced add-on. It's the "Mama Bear" choice in the Seal line (Wee, Kotik, Grey) and I thought quite lovely. After lofting Wee Seal I realized that the boat really pulling at my heart was Eun Mara, less fancy and more work-like. If Eun Mara wasn't there I'd probably be working on a Kotik too.

Nice choice!

Steve

[skaraborgcraft]

Tom, thats not a bad idea,and it still looks proportionally correct in your sketch.Winkle was very nicely put together,its a shame that after building a wee seal and a Whaler that Simmons and Broome went out of buisness......goes to show that the woodenboat market is a real tough one in the UK,as there was nothing wrong with the quality of work,just a shortage of customers i guess. Thats a nice half-birdcage too. Cockpits are a real issue.....they are too large at sea, and never big enough for daysailing. 4 people in a Folkboat cockpit is too many, thats what attracted me to whaler,all that open cockpit space. Until the plans arrive,i have no real idea how big the cockpit is on Kotik,but i will go one of two ways, either seating on deck with small draining footwell, or a cockpit shallow,self draining,but big enough to lay on the benches.Outboard motor well and how that fits into the equation will be the biggest issue.It was the hull shape that grabbed me,and i have alternatives in my head that i need to put onto paper with regards to cockpit and cabin,and will need to run some stuff past Iain first.
No mail on the weekends in Sweden, so maybe plans will arrive Monday afternoon.

Steve, Eun Mara is as peachy as small canoe yawls come,and i have admired her lines for many years, but put side by side with Kotik, my "Archer/Venus Syndrome" takes over and Kotiks lines just do it for me. Nothing logical about it, just a strange sense of pleasure from a certain shape.I had also read through the hardware list from Classic Marine for the items for Eun Mara, and was left with a sense of "HOW MUCH!". Obviously you dont have to fit bronze deckware,and most items can be handmade given time, but it was a lot of fittings and a lot of blocks. I just wanted to keep things as simple as possible. I like free standing masts and balanced lugs,and dont see why anyboat needs to have more than 3 shrouds (for my needs and purpose). I dont love the yawl rig that much that i want to compromise the simplicity. Have you built your Eun Mara yet? Cheers

[skaraborgcraft]

True - and I'm on the light side. There was a good thread a while ago about good small boats for the Bay, and the crux of it was that no trailable boat is Bay-proof; stout things like Bears and Folkboats get slammed over on an average day, and it's a matter of picking your places and times, i.e. not around Alcatraz on a 30-knot day at full ebb. D'oh!

Sorry for the diversion - back to you. I bet you'll be watching for the mail truck tomorrow like a kid at Christmas.

Designed for the job 16ft Great Pelican!

[stromborg]

Steve, Eun Mara is as peachy as small canoe yawls come,and i have admired her lines for many years, but put side by side with Kotik, my "Archer/Venus Syndrome" takes over and Kotiks lines just do it for me. Nothing logical about it, just a strange sense of pleasure from a certain shape.I had also read through the hardware list from Classic Marine for the items for Eun Mara, and was left with a sense of "HOW MUCH!". Obviously you dont have to fit bronze deckware,and most items can be handmade given time, but it was a lot of fittings and a lot of blocks. I just wanted to keep things as simple as possible. I like free standing masts and balanced lugs,and dont see why anyboat needs to have more than 3 shrouds (for my needs and purpose). I dont love the yawl rig that much that i want to compromise the simplicity. Have you built your Eun Mara yet? Cheers

Well, if we all had the same boat this would be a very dull place.

I'll start Eun Mara as soon as I get the Deer Isle Koster I'm building now out of the shop and on the water (her decks will go on today).

Steve

[Paul Pless]

Interesting thread, thanks!

[skaraborgcraft]

Thanks for taking the time just to say so....very civil of you. Cheers