What high ranking OPEC leaders Really think about peak oil

[DanSkorupka]

Not in the news yet but my prof brought up this having been uttered by a member of the saudi royal family.

"My father rode a camel
I drive a car
My son flies an aeroplane
His son will ride a camel"

[The Bigfella]

Actually, his son will collect the rent on the shopping centre that you shop at.

This sort of racist sh!t belongs in the garbage bin

[Captain Intrepid]

While I'm not convinced to it's veracity, it's not exactly racist. My great grandfather rode a horse. If I lived in the middle east he'd have ridden a camel.

[Lew Barrett]

Actually, his son will collect the rent on the shopping centre that you shop at.

This sort of racist sh!t belongs in the garbage bin

I think the point isn't that Saudis ride camels, but rather that there will be a "peak oil effect" and that sooner or later, (and he's suggesting sooner) the reliance we have on oil will give way to a reliance on "something else." Unless we come up with a suitable substitute, that something else will be a camel (or horses) per his analogy.

The discussion is about peak oil, not what it means to ride a camel.

[wardd]

I think the point isn't that Saudis ride camels, but rather that there will be a "peak oil effect" and that sooner or later, (and he's suggesting sooner) the reliance we have on oil will give way to a reliance on "something else." Unless we come up with a suitable substitute, that something else will be a camel (or horses) per his analogy.

The discussion is about peak oil, not what it means to ride a camel.

big really didn't have a cogent argument but felt compelled to remark anyway

[skaraborgcraft]

Havent you heard? Last thing i heard a Saudi oil minister quoted that the US would be making up for any world shortage in production and the US will be self sufficient in oil in a few years? All we hear about is the Baaken fields,tar sand and shale gas, seems you have been sitting on a pretty huge reserve all this time..

[DanSkorupka]

To those who can't understand:
his father rode a camel before oil or at least before oil wealth allowed you to a modern vehicle, because animals were what you rode back in the day if you didn't want to walk.
He rides a car; a machine powered by oil
His son flies his own aeroplane, which A: runs on oil, and B: is more expensive than any car.
this is in reference to his son getting rich enough to by his own plane by selling oil.
The grandson will grow up after peak oil, when there is not enough oil to run a plane or car and without oil to sell for a profit, not enough money to buy either of them.
no car and no oil to run a car, and poverty means the man's grandson will be reduced to using draft animals, from the painfully recent ease and comfort of flying.
The camel is not just a stereotype or cliche' but indeed a very useful beast of burden that is still used widely in rural areas in the middle east as well as an instantly recognizable symbol.
As such the camel is going to be the first pick once cars become 3 ton paperweights, nevermind the technical detail of there not being enough camels on this planet for this.

But the lattermost point is not to be taken at face value as the entire saying is a metaphor to begin with.

The only thing race has to do with this is that the world's largest sellers of oil are in the middle east, which is where, you guessed it, middle eastern people are from.

I dislike all racism including against middle easterners.
The reason there is so much hate is because some Americans got a rude awakening that yes virginia it can happen here, and overreacted to some very un-muslim atrocities that happened in New York and DC in 2001

[LeeG]

Havent you heard? Last thing i heard a Saudi oil minister quoted that the US would be making up for any world shortage in production and the US will be self sufficient in oil in a few years? All we hear about is the Baaken fields,tar sand and shale gas, seems you have been sitting on a pretty huge reserve all this time..

Apples,oranges and apple sauce

[BrianW]

So the moral of the story, is that the USA needs more camels.

[LeeG]

So the moral of the story, is that the USA needs more camels.

Lerts, USA needs to be a lert.

[BrianW]

Lerts, USA needs to be a lert.

Maybe a system of colors representing different levels of lerts would help.

[Y Bar Ranch]

Actually, his son will collect the rent on the shopping centre that you shop at.

This sort of racist sh!t belongs in the garbage bin

Premature racecardulation, there, shipmate.

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

The original quote comes from the late Sheikh Rashid Al-Makhtoum of Dubai, and is very well attested.

"My grandfather rode a camel, my father rode a camel, I drive a Mercedes, my son drives a Land Rover, his son will drive a Land Rover, but his son will ride a camel<sup>".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rashid_...eed_Al_Maktoum</sup>

A more interesting expression of the same sentiment comes to me from an ex- Army friend of Brigadier Michael Barclay, and if you know the UAE at all you will know who I am speaking of, though you won't find him in Wikipedia.

In the early 1970's Sheikh Rashid commissioned a firm of British landscape gardeners to improve the Palace grounds. At the Creek end of the grounds was an old treadmill crane, long disused, which they proposed to remove, as they thought it was an eyesore..

Sheikh Rashid forbade this, saying that the old crane was the very first piece of western machinery installed in Dubai; it had been installed by his father, Sheikh Sayeed, in the 1920',s and he wanted it kept there, as a reminder to everyone that the people of Dubai had made their living as merchants before oil was discovered, and they would have to make their living as merchants after the oil was gone.

[The Bigfella]

I guess that's why they bought Harrods then eh?

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

Harrods was sold by Mohammed el-Fayed to Qatar Holdings, Ian - not to Dubai World.

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

But I dare say that Hamad bin Khalifa al-Thani shares similar sentiments.

[The Bigfella]

Harrods was sold by Mohammed el-Fayed to Qatar Holdings, Ian - not to Dubai World.

Yes, I was aware of that. Same broad landscape. The arab world as a whole seems to have done a reasonable job of diversification. Incidentally, I've met a few Saudi couples on holiday here in Malaysia. Quite interesting to talk to them.

[LeeG]

the real question is what US "leaders" think about the future of oil supplies and how the US should prepare for that future. So far we're importing less and paying more and not expecting to do anything different. Situation normal, waiting for divine intervention.

[AndyG]

BP's 2011 Statistical Review shows Saudi's "proven reserves" to be 265.4*10^9 barrels. This figure has remained almost constant (!) for twenty-two years, even with production at (a current) 11.161*10^6 barrels per day.

How DO they do that? ;-)

Andy

[LeeG]

BP's 2011 Statistical Review shows Saudi's "proven reserves" to be 265.4*10^9 barrels. This figure has remained almost constant (!) for twenty-two years, even with production at (a current) 11.161*10^6 barrels per day.

How DO they do that? ;-)

Andy

same as other OPEC nations when reserves jumped magically in the 80's with no new discoveries so as to allow for preferred rates of production.

http://www.theoildrum.com/files/Opec...serves%20N.png.

Thinking about the challenges KSA will have in the future is entertaining but it seems awfully misguided to not consider the same here.

[Nicholas Scheuer]

What's "racist " about camels?

[LeeG]

What's "racist " about camels?

dunno but they have a condescending look about them

[skipper68]

It's all politics and the BS that lobbiests push. The simple answer is Hemp. There will be a Peak CRUDE oil, but a short time for people to realize that Hemp, with it's thousands of uses will be a cheap alternative.Quote]In this day of oil wars, peak oil (and the accompanying soaring prices), climate change and oil spills such as the one in the gulf by BP, it’s more important than ever to promote sustainable alternatives such as hemp ethanol. Hemp turns out to be the most cost-efficient and valuable of all the fuel crops we could grow on a scale that could fuel the world.

And as it turns out, the whole reason for hemp prohibition – and alcohol prohibition – may have been a fuel the realization that OIL production is threatened by any competing fuel source, especially one that requires no modifications to your car] Notice Exxons new commercial about sugar cane for ethanol? That is because the $100.00 a gallon corn ethanol has lost the subsidies. In truth, at 10% the corn ethonal should add an extra $10.00 to a gallon of gas. {Hemp grows in moderate-poor soils (not fit for food crops)
Hemp grows in moderate-poor climates (not fit for food crops)
It is drought resistant, flood resistant, free of pest infestation, chokes out weeds without pesticides, needs no fertilizers, revitalizes the soil, has a 50 year crop rotation cycles know to remove toxins from the soil, based on climate it can have 3 harvest per year, 10 times more wood pulp than trees per acre, can be used for both gas and diesel, the byproduct of distillation makes high grade chicken feed, remaining fiber can be used to make canvas, rope, clothes that last up to 10 times longer than cotton, the seeds make a more nutritious flour than wheat, blablabla.
Ok all of what I’ve said is true and more good stuff is know about it. In mid-America we have more than 11 million acres of moderate-poor land not being used for crops. As the AFT likes to point out they burn millions of tons of pot a year grown in America. Most of the crops are grown under cover of forest, not out in the open. So it can grow under what would be very adverse conditions without cultivation.
Let’s review what I really just said:
To all the multinational corps. like Monsanto, Dow and others, we won’t need your pesticides or herbicides.
To all the multinational food growers, we won’t need your GMO corn for bio-fuel. As a result of the no cultivation thing, any idiot can grow it and get paid for it (uncontrollable market).
By the way OPEC at just 2 million acres we won’t need your oil anymore.
So you may have 1 or 2 players in the game that might not want hemp on the seen man. But like I said their not the real fight. The real fight will be public opinion. After almost 100 years of hearing that pot is harmful (not 1 death related to the use or consumption of hemp in 12,000 years?) it has been proven that even those that do smoke pot will not publicly admit it or support it.} http://www.hemp.com/hemp-university/...emp/hemp-fuel/

[BrianW]

I like the way you think Skipper.

[AndyG]

2 million acres for hemp? Right ballpark, I think, but a bit low, maybe.

The US transport system burns around ~1 TW. (I'm googling figures which range from 0.9 to 1.3 TW).

That's six thousand of these SEGS PV plants (= allows for nighttime!) which would cover ten million acres. That's only three Nevada Test and Training Ranges: not so insane an amount of land use, given the freedom from imports it would create.

Andy

[LeeG]

Skipper, you're a goof

[skipper68]

Skipper, you're a goof

We are exporting crude, so we DO have enough. It's the speculators getting rich off the commodity's that don't want cheap clean fuel..{Rising US crude output may open door to exports-API head | …
ReutersJun 15, 2012 · * U.S. currently restricts crude oil exports * US crude oil output for first quarter highest in 14 yrs *
}Wish you had read the link. Do you realize how clean it is, or how it would help the US economy and farmers? I'm talking about what your boat lines are made of. You wouldn't smoke THEM....

Why Hemp Biodiesel?


■Biodiesel is the only alternative fuel that runs in any conventional, unmodified diesel engine.
■It can be stored anywhere that petroleum diesel fuel is stored. Biodiesel is safe to handle and transport because it is as biodegradable as sugar, 10 times less toxic than table salt, and has a high flashpoint of about 300 F compared to petroleum diesel fuel, which has a flash point of 125 F.
■Biodiesel can be made from domestically produced, renewable oilseed crops such as hemp.
■Biodiesel is a proven fuel with over 30 million successful US road miles, and over 20 years of use in Europe.
■When burned in a diesel engine, biodiesel replaces the exhaust odor of petroleum diesel with the pleasant smell of hemp, popcorn or french fries.
■Biodiesel is the only alternative fuel in the US to complete EPA Tier I Health Effects Testing under section 211(b) of the Clean Air Act, which provide the most thorough inventory of environmental and human health effects attributes that current technology will allow.
■Biodiesel is 11% oxygen by weight and contains no sulfur.
■The use of biodiesel can extend the life of diesel engines because it is more lubricating than petroleum diesel fuel, while fuel consumption, auto ignition, power output, and engine torque are relatively unaffected by biodiesel.
■The Congressional Budget Office, Department of Defense, US Department of Agriculture, and others have determined that biodiesel is the low cost alternative fuel option for fleets to meet requirements of the Energy Policy Act.

This is a plant that could change the US economy around. It can be used to make stronger and lighter cars and trucks. It can be used to fuel it's own cultivation.

Hemp has the capacity to replace petroleum as a source of energy. Industrial geniuses like Henry Ford have long recognized the value of biomass fuel, calling it “the fuel of the future.” Ford constructed a car made from hemp plastic and ran the car on ethanol made from hemp. The plastic was lighter than steel and could withstand 10 times the impact without denting. Ford knew hemp could produce vast economic resources if widely cultivated. About six percent of contiguous United States land area put into cultivation for biomass could supply all current demands for oil and gas while maintaining a neutral carbon system.

By the process of pyrolysis, biomass material can be burned in a reactor to produce fuel oil. This method will produce 80 gallons of renewable gasoline fuel for every dry ton of biomass. This process also produces charcoal, with a heating value equivalent to coal when burned. This charcoal can be used as a raw material for organic fertilizer. The cellulose pulp from hemp can be used to make paper that lasts 100 times longer than wood paper. Hemp pulp can also be made into composite material for plastics for industrial use. Hemp fibers are some of the strongest found in nature, and increase the durability of cement and other building materials. Hemp fiber can be used to make clothing and fabric. Hemp seed is extraordinarily nutritious, containing omega fatty-acids — which the American diet is lacking. Overall, the entire plant has great and diverse value to humans.http://www.hemp.com/2011/04/hemp-to-...-fossil-fuels/ Our Constitution was made on hemp paper...yet is legally prohibited..Oh the irony!

[Waddie]

All we need to do is smoke the hemp and then we'd be too lazy to drive anywhere......... that would transform us into an energy surplus nation overnight....... but who would care...... however, we would be importing more salty snacks.....

regards,
Waddie

[Osborne Russell]

People dream up a hundred cool ways to substitute for petroleum. If five of 'em pan out, that's excellent. However, so long as oil is cheap, none will be tried, so when the oil runs out, we'll be standing there with our deek in our hand.

[LeeG]

Skipper, the US is an exporter of oil products, not crude. The difference is like that between a dinghy and the 40' cruiser it's sitting on.
Yes oil US oil production has gone up about 10% in 5yrs. It's now about what our production was in 1950. You are a bit confused about the available energy in biofuels compared to petrol.

[Bob Adams]

Skipper, you're a goof

Very constructive, I'd expect better from you. There are some very vaild points in what was said, it just doesn't fit your model.

[pefjr]

Camel riding is racist??? Camel shinola! Well, the man's point was so well buried in CS, BF mistook for a hate crime. What are you smoking BF?

[LeeG]

Very constructive, I'd expect better from you. There are some very vaild points in what was said, it just doesn't fit your model.

No, there aren't many valid points in that post. If money is no object you could run a lot of things on bio fuel, but if you do have to pay the bills you'll find that there are more net btu in petrol than biofuels per dollar. Now if you're willing to tax the hell out of oil you might make biofuels viable but that would require sacrifice which is something politicians would never ask of Americans.

[skipper68]

Oil is not cheap. It also destroys the environment. Think about it. Hemp oil used to harvest hemp, to run machines using hemp fuel and coal. Using hemp to create electricity...it's boundless. It's not a dream, but could be the salvation of this country.http://www.forbes.com/sites/alisongr...tion-for-hemp/

Newly proposed legislation would legalize the cultivation of cannabis, in the form of industrial hemp, at the federal level.“To use their logic, all mushrooms should be illegal because there are some mushrooms that are hallucinogenic,” Roulac said.

Language supporting hemp has not reached the floor of the Senate or the House of Representatives for a vote since the 1950s, though Representative Ron Paul has repeatedly introduced a bill to lift restrictions on farming industrial hemp since 2005. The cultivation and research use of industrial hemp is allowed in nine states – including Maine, North Dakota, Oregon and Vermont – but those efforts remain hampered by the federal ban on growing hemp. In North Dakota, for example, cultivating industrial hemp is legal under state law, but federal agents could charge farmers with years of imprisonment or property forfeiture for growing the crop.

Once grown by the likes of George Washington and Thomas Jefferson, industrial hemp was a staple crop during the colonial era and the market for hemp has experienced a resurgence in the United States over the past two decades. Hemp can be cultivated for its seeds, fiber, oil and other byproducts, which have a variety of uses. Roulac said hemp seeds are high in omega-3 fatty acids, while its fibers are “ideal” for constructing houses, as material made of hemp is energy efficient, resistant to fire and insects, and more durable than wood. He added that legalizing hemp cultivation would have the additional benefit of job creation.

“We’re turning the hemp sector into a billion dollar industry, and guess what?” Roulac said. “The market place is voting.”

Of course- it was voted "NO!"

“Industrial hemp is used in many healthy and sustainable consumer products. However, the federal prohibition on growing industrial hemp has forced companies to needlessly import raw materials from other countries,” Wyden said in a press release on the website of Vote Hemp, a nonprofit lobbying organization based in Brattleboro, Vt. “My amendment to the Farm Bill will change federal policy to allow U.S. farmers to produce hemp for these safe and legitimate products right here, helping both producers and suppliers to grow and improve Oregon’s economy in the process.”

The 2010 U.S. retail market for hemp products was estimated at $419 million, and was on track to increase to roughly $450 million for 2011,said Tom Murphy, national outreach coordinator of Vote Hemp and spokesperson for the Hemp Industries

Have to keep big oil lobbyist in the money..not creating real jobs, and Independence from foreign country's.

[Bob Adams]

Forget it Skipper, he's a one trick pony. No view on energy matters but his own.

[LeeG]

Skipper, the energy available from growing plants is bounded to a much greater degree than the energy available from plants processed by 100 million years of heat and pressure into oil. I am in agreement with your sentiment that our present course is unsustainable but the path will come from a forced reduction in consumption and not getting low density sources to replace high density one.

[LeeG]

Forget it Skipper, he's a one trick pony. No view on energy matters but his own.

Click your heels three times Dorothy

[skipper68]

As for the cost to cultivate it- this is from 2009:HempNews » Hemp Ethanol will Only Cost 50 cents per Gallon
hempnews.tv/2009/09/06/hemp-ethanol-will-only-cost-50-cents-per-gallon Hemp turns out to be the most cost-efficient and valuable of all the fuel crops! We need to educate the public to think for the good of our country, and not Monsanto and Exxon/Mobil. The internet is a powerful tool. It is unlikely that the investment needed to improve hemp production technology will be made until legislative restrictions are removed from the crop.
Until then, we are hog tied by big corporations and the politicians they bought and paid for. It was grown in Kentucky, Wisconsin, California, North Dakota, South Dakota, Minnesota, Indiana, Illinois, Ohio, Michigan, Kansas, and Iowa, to name a few states. Some are very harsh enviroments, which shows how hardy it is. The USA is the largest importer of hemp.

•AUSTRALIA and NEW ZEALAND allow research crops. In Victoria, Australia, commercial production is now licensed.
•AUSTRIA has a hemp industry including production of hempseed oil, medicinals and Hanf magazine.
•CANADA started to license research crops in 1994 on an experimental basis. In addition to crops for fiber, one seed crop was experimentally licensed in 1995. Many acres were planted in 1997. Canada now licenses for commercial agriculture with thousands of acres planted in 1998. Over 30,000 acres were planted in 1999
•CHILE grows hemp mostly for seed oil production.
•CHINA is the largest exporter of hemp paper and textiles. (ma)
•DENMARK planted its first modern hemp trials in 1997. Committed to utilizing organic methods.
•FINLAND has had a resurgence of hemp (hampu) beginning in 1995 with several small test plots.
•FRANCE harvested 10,000 tons in 1994. France is the main source of viable low THC hempseed. The French word for hemp is “chanvre”.
•GERMANY only banned hemp in 1982, but research began in 1992 and many technologies and products are being developed. Clothes and paper are being made from imported raw materials. Germany lifted the ban on growing hemp November, 1995. The German word for hemp is hanf.
•GREAT BRITAIN lifted hemp prohibition in 1993. Animal bedding, paper and textiles have been developed. A government grant was given to develop new markets for natural fibers. 4,000 acres were grown in 1994. Subsidies of $230 Eng. pounds per acre are given by the govt. for growing.
•HUNGARY is rebuilding their hemp industry, and is one of the biggest exporters of hemp cordage, rugs and hemp fabric to the US They also export hemp seed and hemp paper. The Hungarian word for hemp is kender.
•INDIA has large stands of naturalized Cannabis and uses it for cordage, textiles, and seed oil.
•JAPAN has a religious tradition which requires that the Emperor wear hemp garments, so there is a small plot maintained for the imperial family only. They continue to import for cloth and artistic applications.
•NETHERLANDS is conducting a four year study to evaluate and test hemp for paper, and is developing processing equipment. Seed breeders are developing new strains of low THC varieties. The Dutch word for hemp is hennep.
•POLAND currently grows hemp for fabric and cordage and manufactures hemp particle board. They have demonstrated the benefits of using hemp to cleanse soils contaminated by heavy metals. The Polish word for hemp is konopij.
•ROMANIA is the largest commercial producer of hemp in Europe. Total acreage in 1993 was 40,000 acres. Some of it is exported to Hungary for processing. They also export to Western Europe and the United States. The Romanian word for hemp is cinepa.
•RUSSIA maintains the largest hemp germplasm collection in the world at the N.I. Vavilov Scientific Research Institute of Plant Industry (VIR) in Saint Petersburg. They are in need of funds. The Russian word for hemp is konoplya.
•SLOVENIA grows hemp and manufactures currency paper.
•SPAIN grows and exports hemp pulp for paper and produces rope and textiles. The spanish word for hemp is canamo.
•SWITZERLAND is a producer of hemp. The Swiss words for hemp are hanf, chanvre or canapa depending on whether you are in the French, German or Italian speaking area.
•EGYPT, KOREA, PORTUGAL, THAILAND, and the UKRAINE also produce hemp.
•UNITED STATES granted the first hemp permit in 40 years to Hawaii for an experimental quarter acre plot in 1999. Importers and manufacturers have thrived using imported raw materials. Farmers in the US seem to be missing out on this incredible plant

[Bob Adams]

Click your heels three times Dorothy

Dance pony dance. Gently now, we wouldn't want your blinders to fall off.

[skipper68]

If I could click my heels, it would be to let the world realize that it's the Politicians and Big Oil investors that have the blinders on.($$$$) They would look to the past 2000 years while looking towards the future. In a perfect world, hemp is the almost perfect "Perpetual Motion" solution. Sadly, it will take a serious calamity to get to the point where this miracle plant will be appreciated again.

[pefjr]

If I could click my heels, it would be to let the world realize that it's the Politicians and Big Oil investors that have the blinders on.($$$$) They would look to the past 2000 years while looking towards the future. In a perfect world, hemp is the almost perfect "Perpetual Motion" solution. Sadly, it will take a serious calamity to get to the point where this miracle plant will be appreciated again.

Skip, if you wanna get LeeG's interest in hemp, put it on a bicycle. http://www.calfeedesign.com/products/bamboo/

[skipper68]

It would take a billion people to take the blinders off. As long as there is no profit in the commodity's market for hemp futures, it will be ignored and Poo Poo'd. When "Peak Oil" does hit-(It will be a secret, of course, so the speculator's can cash in!) THEN there will be the recognition.It will be every country for itself then. Just getting this kind of info out is good enough for me.

[LeeG]

If I could click my heels, it would be to let the world realize that it's the Politicians and Big Oil investors that have the blinders on.($$$$) They would look to the past 2000 years while looking towards the future. In a perfect world, hemp is the almost perfect "Perpetual Motion" solution. Sadly, it will take a serious calamity to get to the point where this miracle plant will be appreciated again.

Skipper, the people who have their blinders on are average Americans. Politicians will be glad to represent their constituents interests if they have any. You have hit on an important point about looking beyond the unique circumstances of the last 150 yrs to a longer perspective but I don't think homo saps is capable of that. Meeting immediate needs and desires over rule any hypothetical reward for future generations. The changes brought by oil production not growing as fast as demand are happening now with higher prices and volatility. Collectively our country is kicking the can down the road. Every once in awhile Congress or some gov't agency conducts a study about oil depletion or the latest price jump and the recommendations are ignored because they run counter to the idea we can have infinite growth and infinite consumption. You blame oil companies and politicians but neither one of those groups created the oil or the demand.
Re. Hemp or biofuels. That'll work when we have no choice but it'll be when private ownership of autos is a luxury. Not there yet.

[skipper68]

BUT, cant we look before we have no choice? Henry Ford was black balled. Shall we continue to black ball what does work? If so, why?

[LeeG]

BUT, cant we look before we have no choice? Henry Ford was black balled. Shall we continue to black ball what does work? If so, why?

Sure we should, that's exactly what Robert L. Hirsch told Congress in 2005. The problem is that it would require a sacrifice now for a reward none of us will receive, our children would but we won't sacrifice for other folks children. The unstated narrative is that plentiful energy is our birthright and recent price spikes are a temporary inconvenience. So all kinds of self-indulgent fantasies are created about gov't keeping the magic hand of the market place from unleashing an infinite amount of non-renewable energy or in your case hemp oil.

On the mitigation options I think we're between #1 and #2. My guess is we'll trade unemployment for lower fuel costs. Either way it won't be pain free.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hirsch_report

The Hirsch report, the commonly referred to name for the report Peaking of World Oil Production: Impacts, Mitigation, and Risk Management, was created by request for the US Department of Energy and published in February 2005.[1] It examined the time frame for the occurrence of peak oil, the necessary mitigating actions, and the likely impacts based on the timeliness of those actions.
.........

Mitigation efforts will require substantial time.
Waiting until production peaks would leave the world with a liquid fuel deficit for 20 years.
Initiating a crash program 10 years before peaking leaves a liquid fuels shortfall of a decade.
Initiating a crash program 20 years before peaking could avoid a world liquid fuels shortfall.

[skipper68]

So all kinds of self-indulgent fantasies are created about gov't keeping the magic hand of the market place from unleashing an infinite amount of non-renewable energy or in your case hemp oil.

infinite amount of non-renewable energy....SEE? UGH..
How about an infinant amount of viable renewable energy? Perpetual Motion. The perfect balance. The REAL circle.No spell ck. sorry.Open your mind to the product, the history. Research for yourself. 2000 years cant be wrong.

[LeeG]

infinite amount of non-renewable energy....SEE? UGH..
How about an infinant amount of viable renewable energy? Perpetual Motion. The perfect balance. The REAL circle.No spell ck. sorry.Open your mind to the product, the history. Research for yourself. 2000 years cant be wrong.

Skipper, I have read up on this stuff. 2000yrs ago there were 200 million humans on the planet. If you want hemp to fuel our civilization imagine 100million in the US instead of 320million and 2billion on the planet instead of 7billion. That might happen in 200yrs. The problem you don't seem to understand is that all these people on the planet and all the groovy stuff we have in the US came from an inheritance of fossil fuels and it's ending this century. Hemp and bio-fuels cannot replace that inheritance. What we consume from a 100million year savings program cannot be replaced with a summer growing season of hemp.

[PeterSibley]

It can be replaced with sunlight though, not as cheaply but the same amount of energy or considerably more.

[skipper68]

You harvest it up to 4 times a year.No, it will not change tomorrow. But it is a start Get involved.

.It can be replaced with sunlight though, not as cheaply but the same amount of energy or considerably more.

It grows with or without sun or water. It cleans the soil as it grows. It doubles as it replenishes the soil to PH. It is cleaning up Russias Charnoble now.(sp-sorry)

[LeeG]

ok, now you're smoking it