Where is the criticism of Executive Privilege?? UH ? Oh.. OK, then why??

[pefjr]

Don't you lefties just love Jon Stewart . You do love Jon right??? Well, I guess not.http://www.realclearpolitics.com/vid...privilege.html

[Phillip Allen]

don't ya just hate being lied to... I do. it certainly didn't help Nixon

[Vince Brennan]

don't ya just hate being lied to...

We got used to it with Cheney, Rumsfeld and Da Chimp.

[Phillip Allen]

We got used to it with Cheney, Rumsfeld and Da Chimp.

when you say Chimp, are you refering to the current one?

also, I frequently get Rumsfeld and McNamera confused... I wonder why that is?

[bobbys]

[Phillip Allen]

I strongly suspect he's coverning for one of his own burglars... perhaps Hilly... I wonder if there are any blank bits of 'tape' in his office recordings and other 'non'-private papers

[Gerarddm]

Is executive privilege in the Constitution, or inferred therefrom?

The thing that really incenses me is signing statements, and I don't care which Prez does it.

[Paul Pless]

I strongly suspect he's coverning for one of his own burglars... perhaps Hilly...

What the hell would Hillary, the Secretary of State have to do with Fast and Furious? Think about it, its well below her current pay grade. . .

[bobbys]

[ccmanuals]

Is executive privilege in the Constitution, or inferred therefrom?

The thing that really incenses me is signing statements, and I don't care which Prez does it.

Good question. Is it unconstitutional for the legislative branch to demand that the executive branch provide them internal documentation. Wouldn't this be contrary to separation of powers? Why couldn't the legislative and executive branches demand that the judicial branch, i.e. Supreme Court, turn over internal documents? When was the last time you head the executive branch turn over congressional documents for an investigation?

[wardd]

when you say Chimp, are you refering to the current one?

also, I frequently get Rumsfeld and McNamera confused... I wonder why that is?

everything confuses you especially facts

[ljb5]

This is an example of a false equivalency.

Bush used executive privilege to prevent investigation of crimes. (Specifically, leaking Valarie Plame's CIA status and the illegal firing of attorneys at the DOJ.)

Issa is not investigating a crime. He is investigating a policy. (A very dumb and botched policy... but not an illegal one.)

Investigating a policy (for political reasons) is not the same as investigating a crime.

================================================== ==========

As a side note: Bush once used executive privilege to withhold information about Cheney's meetings with oil execs. Although I would have like to have seen what was in those documents, I felt at the time (and still do) that that information belonged to the executive branch, not the legislative branch and therefore could not be compelled. I believe that is the view which ultimately won out on that issue.

[Phillip Allen]

This is an example of a false equivalency.

Bush used executive privilege to prevent investigation of crimes. (Specifically, leaking Valarie Plame's CIA status and the illegal firing of attorneys at the DOJ.)

Issa is not investigating a crime. He is investigating a policy. (A very dumb and botched policy... but not an illegal one.)

Investigating a policy (for political reasons) is not the same as investigating a crime.

================================================== ==========

As a side note: Bush once used executive privilege to withhold information about Cheney's meetings with oil execs. Although I would have like to have seen what was in those documents, I felt at the time (and still do) that that information belonged to the executive branch, not the legislative branch and therefore could not be compelled. I believe that is the view which ultimately won out on that issue.

if you're talking about the gunrunning 'policy' then it IS a crime... a felony
further, because the original crime ended up in a murder... I want to see accessory before the fact charges to be filed

[ccmanuals]

But a gun running sting operation is not a crime. Law enforcement uses sting operations all the time from drugs to money.

[ljb5]

if you're talking about the gunrunning 'policy' then it IS a crime... a felony

So why isn't Issa investigating Bush, Gonzales and Mukasey for felonies?

As ccmanuals just pointed out, sting operations are common in law enforcement. Quite possibly ill-advised and sloppy.... but common and legal.

[pefjr]

This is an example of a false equivalency.

Bush used executive privilege to prevent investigation of crimes. (Specifically, leaking Valarie Plame's CIA status and the illegal firing of attorneys at the DOJ.)

Issa is not investigating a crime. He is investigating a policy. (A very dumb and botched policy... but not an illegal one.)

Investigating a policy (for political reasons) is not the same as investigating a crime.

================================================== ==========

Bush once used executive privilege to withhold information about Cheney's meetings with oil execs. Although I would have like to have seen what was in those documents, I felt at the time (and still do) that that information belonged to the executive branch, not the legislative branch and therefore could not be compelled. I believe that is the view which ultimately won out on that issue.

This action by Obama is just the Prez. stepping in another of Bush's footsteps. They see it as a easy way to circumvent the investigation. This is a direct result of an unbalanced power in our government,.Too much power was given to the Prez, all the way back in 1950 with Korea. It increased dramatically in 2001. Now, we have to live with it until Congress takes it back. Not likely, they enjoy their freedom from being the scapegoat.

[Gerarddm]

if you're talking about the gunrunning 'policy' then it IS a crime... a felony
further, because the original crime ended up in a murder... I want to see accessory before the fact charges to be filed

It certainly is not a crime, no matter how much you'd like to believe it. It was a botched sting.

And following the old absurd trope about how 'guns don't kill people, people do', your second argument is also invalid. Perhaps the accessory charges you describe should be laid at the feet of the weapon manufacturer?

[bobbys]

So if Obama knew nothing why does he need to invoke EP.

If he knew nothing why is he not interested in finding out who did know?.

Is someone in the DOJ lying to him?.

As the Boss why would he not want to find out?.

If They say Obama goes over every detail in a "kill" list are we to assume he cares not a whit about Border agents and Mexicans being killed..

If Holder and Obama knew nothing about what went on Are there forces at work undermining our national security and they are inept?.

Looks to me like the smartest guy in the room just painted himself in a corner...

[bobbys]

So why isn't Issa investigating Bush, Gonzales and Mukasey for felonies?

As ccmanuals just pointed out, sting operations are common in law enforcement. Quite possibly ill-advised and sloppy.... but common and legal.

.

Rep Cowdy called for anyone that knew to be accountable.

Bush, the Whig party anyone.

[bobbys]

But a gun running sting operation is not a crime. Law enforcement uses sting operations all the time from drugs to money.

.

This Sting violated the National sovereignty of another country.

I thought libs were concerned about this?.

Or is this..... that was then and this is now?

[bobbys]

This is an example of a false equivalency.

Bush used executive privilege to prevent investigation of crimes. (Specifically, leaking Valarie Plame's CIA status and the illegal firing of attorneys at the DOJ.)

Issa is not investigating a crime. He is investigating a policy. (A very dumb and botched policy... but not an illegal one.)

Investigating a policy (for political reasons) is not the same as investigating a crime.

================================================== ==========

As a side note: Bush once used executive privilege to withhold information about Cheney's meetings with oil execs. Although I would have like to have seen what was in those documents, I felt at the time (and still do) that that information belonged to the executive branch, not the legislative branch and therefore could not be compelled. I believe that is the view which ultimately won out on that issue.

.

HHMMMM so if a defense is no one knew about it then how can Issa be investigating a policy ?.

Should not Holder and Obama be asking for a investigation with Congress.

[bobbys]

We got used to it with Cheney, Rumsfeld and Da Chimp.

.

So if you are used to lying it does not bother you someone is lying to you now?.

And some one is Lying now.

But you still have Bush/Cheney residing in your brain.

Well so does Holder.

And to think you guys called Bush dumb he masterminded everything even into the future!

[bobbys]

don't ya just hate being lied to... I do. it certainly didn't help Nixon

.

The end justifies the means.

[bobbys]

Don't you lefties just love Jon Stewart . You do love Jon right??? Well, I guess not.http://www.realclearpolitics.com/vid...privilege.html

.

I cannot watch it but are you saying our NORM missed this one.

Why i thought he gave us a weekly Jon Steward clip.

Well.

Shiver Me Timbers!!!

[ljb5]

So if Obama knew nothing why does he need to invoke EP.

If he knew nothing why is he not interested in finding out who did know?.

Is someone in the DOJ lying to him?

The issue is Separation of Powers.

Who runs the Department of Justice?

The Department of Justice is run by the Executive Branch, not by the Legislative Branch.

The Executive Branch is separate and distinct from the Legislative Branch. It is not subordinate to it.

The Legislative Branch has no authority under the Constitution to run the Department of Justice.

If Issa wants to run the Department of Justice, all he has to do is resign from Congress and get elected President.

He cannot legally work for both the Legislative Branch and the Executive Branch at the same time.

[Donn]

^ Wrong.

Congress is not trying to 'run' the DoJ. They are investigating it.

Wiki:

The Supreme Court has legitimated Congress’s investigative power, subject to constitutional safeguards for civil liberties. In 1927, the Court found that, in investigating the administration of the Department of Justice, Congress was considering a subject “on which legislation could be had or would be materially aided by the information which the investigation was calculated to elicit.”

[Gerarddm]

O dear. I can see certain people here are finding delight in chasing their tails.

BTW, did the Mexican gov't complain about their sovereignty being infringed? I have not heard that, just checking.

[skuthorp]

For "Executive Priviledge" I read "the Divine Right of Kings" or being above the law. Just another transfer of powers?

[Donn]

PS...there is no "d" in privilege.

[wardd]

^ Wrong.

Congress is not trying to 'run' the DoJ. They are investigating it.




Wiki:

and here i thought issa was on a witchhunt

[pefjr]

PS...there is no "d" in privilege.

Merci beaucoup

[RonW]

Vince Brennan said in post # 3 --

We got used to it with Cheney, Rumsfeld and Da Chimp.

Da Chimp Hey vince, who is the da chimp ?? Sounds awful disrespectful to me. Are you referring to Mr. Obama ? If so it also sounds racist...

You liberals are a strange breed, I guess it is OK. if you guys do it, and terrible if someone else does it, is that the way this game works ?

[Paul Girouard]

I guess it is OK. if you guys do it, and terrible if someone else does it, is that the way this game works ?

Short answer , Yes!

[RonW]

I am really disappointed in Vince Brennan referring to our president as the Da Chimp disrespectful and RACIST ..

[Paul Girouard]

I am really disappointed in Vince Brennan referring to our president as the Da Chimp disrespectful and RACIST ..

He was referring to Pres. Bush , so that makes it OK, in some folks book.

[pipefitter]

He was referring to Pres. Bush , so that makes it OK, in some folks book.

And yet the same folks wonder why, in seeming frustration, that they have such a difficult time with attracting recruits to their cause, and why they continuously end up politically similar to their opposition.

It's just easier to chalk it up to low information voters. It's pretty sad when after working so hard to elevate themselves to that of intellectual superiority, and yet not be able to get past the fact that even ignorant people understand simple and blatant irony.

I recall getting jumped on for calling Obama "Curious George." I had no idea at the time whether Curious George was black or white. It was the "Curious" part that should have been obvious.

[pefjr]

Yes, the dems do jump quite often when they consider their god has been denigrated. "Thou shall not take the name of the Lord your god in vain."

[John Smith]

Yes, the dems do jump quite often when they consider their god has been denigrated. "Thou shall not take the name of the Lord your god in vain."

I think "Executive Privilege" gets abused. So does the power to investigete get abused.

Maybe it's just me, but if we want to investigate a stupid program started by the ATF, we should call witnesses involving all along its birth and life. When the Chairman of the Committee is abusing his power, the only way to fight it seems to be to abuse another power.

Then there is an argument, the truth of which I cannot atterst to, that some documents are covered by law and cannot be turned over.

All of this is a great example of how political parties are bad for the nation.

If one looks at the bigger picture, one will recall that Clinton, ultimately, was CLEARED by Starr on all but Monica, and that has a lot of questions in its procedures past Clinton getting oral sex from Monica. Holder, whatever else his role may or may not have been in FAST and Furious, ended the program.

Bush exercised the Privilege to let people hide behind far more evil things. We went to war, and one hell of a lot of people suffered, behind lies, and that should be investigated.

Meanwhile, the same congress that will not fund anything that might give Obama, and the American people, a victory, is wasting time and money in this investigation. I say that because they are obviously not investigating how this program got started and how we can prevent something similar from starting inthe first place.

[ccmanuals]

John, anyone who believes Ron Paul is the second coming is not really interested in cohesive arguments.

[wardd]

the repubs know what the program was, how it worked and why it failed now they want to know what holder ws thinking while sitting on the toilet

is there no end to their nonsense?

[John Smith]

the repubs know what the program was, how it worked and why it failed now they want to know what holder ws thinking while sitting on the toilet

is there no end to their nonsense?

Not likely.