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Thread: Microsoft anounces the Surface

  1. #1
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    Default Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Yup, the tablet to compete against the iPad.

    Same Nvidia ARM processor as the iPad, more memory (32Gb standard, option for 64Gb), with a built-in cover that doubles as a keypad, and just barely thick enough for a USB port. Supposedly, the pricing will match the iPad ($499 for the base machine).

    This is one hell of a gamble for Microsoft, since a failure in this marketplace will hurt very badly.... but based on the brief review (highly preliminary, since it won't be available until Windows 8 gets released in the fall), it looks like they've done a good job of getting the basics right.

    One thing is for sure; it will be easier to develop applications on it, and with a USB port, it will beat the iPad in terms of connectivity.

    We'll have to wait and see how it does, but it sure will be interesting.

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    I put a thick armored case on my Ipad as it's thin size and lack of handholds makes it easy to slip away. I was recently reading about heat generation for Ipad3 users who did lots of gaming and wonder if this could be an issue for this pad, wrapping something in silicone rubber then cranking up the heat leading to problems.

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by LeeG View Post
    I put a thick armored case on my Ipad as it's thin size and lack of handholds makes it easy to slip away. I was recently reading about heat generation for Ipad3 users who did lots of gaming and wonder if this could be an issue for this pad, wrapping something in silicone rubber then cranking up the heat leading to problems.

    I notice the same problem, with the iPad I got on Sunday for Father's Day. It's not convenient to hold in your lap; I was watching various videos on it (via Xfinity), and really couldn't find a comfortable way to hold it. Also, the rear-firing speaker was reasonably loud and clear, but the volume and tone varied a lot as I moved the thing arounds, owing to reflections off nearby surfaces.... I guess earbuds are the solution to that.

    So far, heat doesn't seem to be a problem, as far as I can tell.... it get warm while running or charging, but not hot.
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    The support for a pen seems like a very good idea.
    I never learned from a man who agreed with me.

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Pless View Post
    The support for a pen seems like a very good idea.
    To me, the support for USB, SD memory, and external video output is even more of a good idea. The iPad is a fabulous device (I'm enjoying the one I just got), but let's face it: it ain't a paragon of connectivity or expansion. My daughter puts a lot of educational software and kid movies on hers, for my granddaughter.... but she can't fit more than one or two movies at a time, in the 16Gb, along with her apps.... so she's constantly shuffling stuff in and out.... and she can't load the kid movies that I've been finding for her.

    I can see a lot of applications for the Surface which the iPad would be unsuitable for.... things requiring interconnection. True, you can always connect an iPad via WiFi, but if you're building peripherals, WiFi is more expensive to add to a circuit design, than USB.
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface


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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Norman Bernstein View Post
    This is one hell of a gamble for Microsoft, since a failure in this marketplace will hurt very badly....
    You're right, they better nail it. How's that screen compare to the new retina display?

    Couldn't they have come up with a better name though?
    I never learned from a man who agreed with me.

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Pless View Post
    You're right, they better nail it. How's that screen compare to the new retina display?
    According to the articles, the 'pro' version is a full 1920 x 1080 HD.... not sure about the lower order version. Since the processor, including graphics, is the same chip used in the iPad, it appears that the 'engine' behind the display is every bit as good.

    The Pro version runs the full blown Windows 8... the regular version runs Windows RT, which, I presume, is a stripped down version, sort of analogous to what Windows CE was, to Windows XP.

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Pless View Post
    Couldn't they have come up with a better name though?
    Hehehehe.... I bet they spent a fortune on focus groups, to come up with the name. At least, it isn't so blatantly obvious, like preceeding every product with an 'i' like Apple does. THAT is getting rather tired, IMHO.
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Pless View Post
    Couldn't they have come up with a better name though?
    The name was taken from a product they already had in production. It's a touch screen technology made for the Samsung SUR40, and it's now called PixelSense.

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    I read a comment elsewhere that one of the nice features of the iPad is that you can read the screen both ways, whereas with the Surface you can't.

    The keyboard/cover is a nice touch, however.

    A Ballmer presentation though, isn't a Jobs presentation.
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Norman Bernstein View Post
    Yup, the tablet to compete against the iPad.
    ..
    One thing is for sure; it will be easier to develop applications on it, and with a USB port, it will beat the iPad in terms of connectivity.
    Too late, again. The iPad created the market then Google cleaned up all the price points below.
    It is probably a great device, but I don't think that matters any more, as the established competition already does it right.

    But the Surface needs a USB port, it is Windows after all, it being a file manager OS.

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by GaryK View Post
    It is probably a great device, but I don't think that matters any more, as the established competition already does it right..
    I don't know whether the Surface tablet will succeed or not... but your presumption that it has no chance vaguely reminds me of the 'three biggest lies' joke, the first of which is 'I'll always love you'......

    Sorry, but that kind of prediction is a fool's errand
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Norman Bernstein View Post
    TMy daughter puts a lot of educational software and kid movies on hers, for my granddaughter.... but she can't fit more than one or two movies at a time, in the 16Gb, along with her apps.... so she's constantly shuffling stuff in and out.... and she can't load the kid movies that I've been finding for her.
    Why isn't she using the cloud?
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Pless View Post
    Why isn't she using the cloud?
    I believe she is... but up/downloading a 4Gb movie is pretty slow.
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    I'm interested in seeing how it does. I hate Flash, but too much of the web still uses it for me to buy an iPad; I've been contemplating various other tablets for some time but I'm not making a decision any time soon.


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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    It will be interesting to see if the Surface becomes a hit or another miss like the Zune. The Zune was not a bad product. It was just waaay too late an entry into a market dominated by Apple.


    Meanwhile Microsoft's partners feel sandbagged:

    If the newly unveiled Surface tablets are a hit, where will that leave Microsoft's many Windows 8 allies?

    You can almost picture Microsoft's longtime hardware partners offering up polite, but terse, applause for the newly unveiled Surface tablets. Most were mum yesterday after the event.

    How else are they supposed to react? For companies such as Hewlett-Packard or Acer, which have depended on Microsoft and its Windows operating system for its PCs and laptops, this is a slap in the face.

    At best, Microsoft's Surface is implicit commentary that the original equipment manufacturers can't cut it in the tablet arena. At worst, Microsoft means to stake a dominant position, leaving even less room in a business already dominated by Apple's iPad.

    "The move is a vote of no confidence in these partners, who should rightly feel slighted...or challenged," said Jan Dawson, an analyst at research firm Ovum....


    The biggest problem with Microsoft's slight against its partners is that the software giant has a point. The tablets in the market -- virtually all of which are admittedly using the Android operating system -- look downright generic.

    Commercial success has been elusive for pretty much of all of the companies who have entered the tablet arena. As the first Android 3.0 tablet, the Motorola Xoom flopped pretty badly. Hewlett-Packard's WebOS-powered TouchPad disappeared before it even got a chance to get on its feet. Research in Motion had to offer dramatic discounts to move its BlackBerry Playbook. The standout feature for Amazon's Kindle Fire was its $200 price point, but momentum has disappeared. The Asus Transformer Prime is an interesting tablet, but one that lacks mainstream appeal.

    Many were likely hoping to hop on the Windows 8 bandwagon when that came along, but it's unclear how enthusiastic many will be with Surface on the horizon.

    LG is reportedly putting its tablet initiative on hold as it focuses on its smartphone business. Lenovo and Dell, meanwhile, said they would continue to support Windows 8. Acer and Hewlett-Packard declined to comment. CNET also contacted Samsung and HTC for comment. We'll update the story when they respond.

    The companies are likely stay quiet as they digest the news.

    Microsoft only told its partners on Friday that it was coming out with a tablet, according to a person at one of the hardware vendors who spoke on the condition of anonymity. Microsoft shared no specifics, knowing full well that details would leak, robbing Steve Ballmer of his Apple moment.

    "We're all taking a wait and see approach," said the vendor contact.

    http://m.cnet.com/news/with-surface-...tners/57456117
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Hewlett-Packard declined to comment
    On what standing would they comment? Their own tablet was scrapped before launch and they themselves now are quickly circling the drain. . .
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Nice lookin' hardware. I've heard great things about MS's phone interface, I wonder if they've managed to adapt it well for their 'pad.
    I'll just take my chances with those salt water joys.

    AR

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Flying Orca View Post
    I hate Flash...
    Hate's a big word. What's wrong with Flash? As a web developer I love programming with ActionScript, and Flash simply rocks when you consider the alternatives.

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Flash is ok, but every now and then, Adobe messes things up. I had to uninstall Flash 11.3 the other day, and reinstall 11.2. The update has a bug which interferes with running videos and other flash apps in Firefox 13.

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by AndyG View Post
    What's wrong with Flash?
    Misuse. An idiot web designer/developer can do much more damage with Flash than with plain HTML or even LAMP...

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by AndyG View Post
    Hate's a big word. What's wrong with Flash? As a web developer I love programming with ActionScript, and Flash simply rocks when you consider the alternatives.
    Hate is indeed a big word, and I'll tell you why I use it: it breaks the web for far too many people. CSS is brilliant in that it divorces presentation from content; on a properly coded HTML/CSS site, I can get decent functionality even with a text-only browser. The mildly visually impaired can apply their own style sheet and see my content displayed in a way that works for them. Ditto the users of any display device, from Braille reader to smartphone. I consider accessible web to be good web.

    Flash welds content to presentation so thoroughly that you can't even copy the freakin' text - you can only replay the content in the designer's chosen presentation, regardless of whether it works for you, as many times as you like. It does NOT degrade gracefully, it forces the viewer into one - usually sucky - presentation. Half the time it doesn't scale properly if you need to use the scaling built into modern browsers.

    I could go on, but you probably get the picture. For the PITA it causes people with disabilities alone it should be shunned and discarded. Using it is a declaration to the world that you don't give a crap about the people for whom it doesn't work, and that's an uncool attitude to take toward people with disabilities IMNSHO.


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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    No ITunes kinda store that sells nearly every song, movie and latest app in two clicks. Might be a better mouse trap but does not have the content that seems sexy enough for the consumer to jump after spending thier money in an iTunes/apple world. then again they might have a play with cloud computing and lifestyle intergration to be released with these new products.

    we can always look at the MS smart phone which has gone no where too.
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    I will not be buying one.
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Hoppe View Post
    No ITunes kinda store that sells nearly every song, movie and latest app in two clicks.
    I've used iTunes for years on Windows computers.

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    But not the app store.
    "it takes two to behavior"


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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Montgomery View Post
    But not the app store.
    Give them time.

    I'm in the market for something and SWMBO was urging me to IPad it. Now with this we'll wait and see. I need a Windows compatible setup for work software and I'd love to have something IPadlike which can handle it.
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    No doubt there is a a pool of consumers who have been holding out for a Microsoft Windows tablet. It will be interesting to see how large that pool turns out to be.
    "it takes two to behavior"


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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Montgomery View Post
    No doubt there is a a pool of consumers who have been holding out for a Microsoft Windows tablet. It will be interesting to see how large that pool turns out to be.
    The problem with all the others is they sucked. We'll have to wait and see how this one works before we commit. If it doesn't then I'll have to either buy her an IPad and use her laptop (Toshiba and it sucks) or I'll ignore her and get a laptop which suits my needs.

    IPad here we come.
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Norman Bernstein View Post
    I don't know whether the Surface tablet will succeed or not... but your presumption that it has no chance vaguely reminds me of the 'three biggest lies' joke, the first of which is 'I'll always love you'......

    Sorry, but that kind of prediction is a fool's errand
    I wasn't stating a fact, but a prediction, so "lies" don't come into it.
    The prediction is based on Windows 7 phone, Kin, Zune...

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    So are any of you now buying Microsoft stock?

    A last-minute invitation giving journalists and analysts just four days' warning; a US West Coast unveiling of "a major product" touted as "something you won't want to miss"; a presentation of an own-brand device by the company's chief executive, touting its design aesthetic and magnesium-sintered parts in exploded view. You could easily have mistaken Monday night's unveiling of Microsoft's Surface tablet range for an Apple event - though you would never mistake Microsoft's bombastic Steve Ballmer for a charismatic Apple executive.

    Yes, Microsoft is getting into the iPad space; after sitting on the sidelines for years, it has now started running after the fastest-growing sector of the computing market with its Surface.

    The fascinating thing about the announcement, though, was how dramatically it shows the Apple-ification of Microsoft.

    The company that brought the world Windows, and got rich on it, has for years had serious Apple envy.

    When Bill Gates was still working full-time at the company, he would fume during visits to London at Apple's Regent Street store, opened in late 2004. "We need to have those!" he would complain, to the despair of his minions, who would forbear from pointing out that Microsoft didn't really make things like Apple did; it made software.

    Apart from the Xbox, a Microsoft store at that time would have been a showcase of lots of boxes of software, and a few mice and keyboards. The laptops and desktops on which Windows ran were all made by other companies, such as Dell or HP.

    And that was a good arrangement for Microsoft: software is wonderfully profitable, because once you've made one copy, the next billion or so cost nothing to copy. It made Microsoft the most valuable company in the world by the end of 1999.

    Yet now Microsoft is not just snubbing those companies that made it rich by making PCs that ran Windows; it's positively apeing Apple, making something the same size as an iPad, putting its own name to it, deciding the price, and selling it through its own stores, both physical and online. (Gates will be happy.)

    But is this just some bizarre financial bromance? Or something deeper?

    "Why would Microsoft hedge against what it has, the most brilliant business model of the 20th century?" muses Horace Dediu, a former Nokia executive who now runs the Asymco consultancy. "Because," he answers, "it doesn't work any more."

    He says that's because of the rise of mobility - the fact that increasingly we use smartphones and tablets to work anywhere and any time, where just 10 years ago we would have had to sit in front of a desktop, or unfold a laptop. Now iPads are used to create art or hold flight manuals for pilots; meanwhile, nearly a million Google Android smartphones are being activated every day.

    Mobility is big. Smartphones have been outselling PCs since autumn 2010; and though the tablet business is only two years old, a total of 108m are expected to ship this year (against about 400m PCs); the research company IDC upped its forecast ahead of Microsoft's announcement. IDC has consistently lowered its forecast for future PC sales while it keeps pushing it up for tablets.

    "The rate of growth in these platforms is almost vertical," says Dediu. "Microsoft's for Windows is pretty much flat."

    Google is following the same path: it has bought Motorola Mobility, the US smartphone and tablet maker, and later this month is expected to announce an own-brand 7in tablet. (Larry Page et al won't be pleased at Microsoft stealing their thunder; Ballmer, who hates Google, will be delighted; it might also explain the last-minute nature of the announcement.)

    The Appleification of Microsoft is happening because the company has got no choice.

    The smartphone and tablet pose what Benedict Evans, an analyst at Enders Analysis, on Tuesday called "an existential threat" to Microsoft: if it can't get a credible foothold there, then its growth just stops. So far it hasn't managed it in smartphones.

    Tablets suddenly look like a necessary product.

    Of course, this adventure could go horribly wrong.

    Think of the Zune - a Ballmer-ordered product (he literally snapped his fingers in a top-level meeting and said: "We need one of those!") that came far too late in 2006 to compete with the iPod, which had already passed its glory days; Apple already had its eyes then on the iPhone, which has supplanted and far exceeded it for profitability. Zune never went anywhere (literally; it was never sold outside North America) and was quietly killed last year.

    Then again, the Xbox 360 games console has done well, cementing the company's position in millions of living rooms around the world.

    Except when you look at the numbers: total sales are put at 67.2m since 2005. Next year is expected to see a new generation - the Xbox 720 - for which a leaked internal document forecasts 100m sales in 10 years.

    Dediu laughs: "A hundred million? That's equivalent to a hundred days' of Android activations. And that's their ambition for 10 years?"

    Nobody's expecting that Microsoft is going to stop Dell or HP selling Windows computers - or that they're going to stop doing so immediately. But the signs of strain are there already.

    Last summer, HP said it would quit the PC business because the margins are razor-thin (it dumped its chief executive and recanted); Dell keeps trying to push into services, and makes nothing on consumer PC sales.

    But in making the first big move into the Windows tablet market, Microsoft has shown that it realises the need for reinvention.

    The old Microsoft would have let a thousand PC makers build tablets - big, small, great, awful, pricey, cheap. The new one will control the apps that run on the Surface, via an online store, will decide the price and the models.

    It's a long time since 2004, when an ebullient Ballmer came to London and told an audience of journalists (then prodding him about the iPod): "With great respect to Apple, there's no way anything gets to critical mass with Apple, because Apple just doesn't have the volumes."

    Even then, the iPod was outselling Microsoft's then mobile offering, Windows Mobile. If you can't beat them, join them - and ideally, steal their clothes too.


    http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/it-p...620-20nap.html
    Last edited by Tom Montgomery; 06-19-2012 at 11:07 PM.
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    I wonder how it will go running Linux?
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Does it have built in GPS?
    Will

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by WX View Post
    I wonder how it will go running Linux?
    It's got a USB port, so getting Linux running on it may be doable.

    I'm definitely interested - Microsoft's hardware is historically pretty high quality.


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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    We need a Fake Steve (Ballmer). . .
    I never learned from a man who agreed with me.

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    The main difference between apple and any other company is that most tablet adopters have already bought into the apple/iTunes universe. It is apple to lose the market share it dominates. apple app developers and the music business has now have a long term relationship which trust and profitability has proven quite successful. Most importantly to this whole digital pie, the consumer has bought into a "trusted" system where a hip company holds thier credit card indefinitely and encourages almost daily purchases. In this ecosystem digital world, think how hard it is going to be to make a smooth transfer of iTunes purchased content to a more open source system. Historically speaking, Apple has rarely made it easy or readily accessible to go back and forth between platforms especially when it comes to direct, long term customer purchases. therein lies the the busines burden that Microsoft has to overcome.

    Microsoft has launched tablets twice before with little success. finding a way to bridge the gap between the computer and the smart phone, there is much riding on the cloud doing the computing power of a pc or Mac and convience of a smart phone. Without an Internet connection, this tablet is just another reader.
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Saying that Apple's success means Microsoft can't succeed in the tablet market may have all the prescience of saying that RIM's success means that Apple can't succeed in the smartphone market.


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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Flying Orca View Post
    Saying that Apple's success means Microsoft can't succeed in the tablet market may have all the prescience of saying that RIM's success means that Apple can't succeed in the smartphone market.
    A valid point, though to be fair RIM didn't sell smartphones, it sold portable email terminals :-)

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaa View Post
    A valid point, though to be fair RIM didn't sell smartphones, it sold portable email terminals :-)
    BlackBerry is a smartphone.

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Donn View Post
    BlackBerry is a smartphone.
    It is now. It was not at the time the first iPhone appeared.

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Donn View Post
    BlackBerry is a smartphone.
    Does BlackBerry (RIM) have a bright future?
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaa View Post
    It is now. It was not at the time the first iPhone appeared.
    The first BlackBerry phone was released in 1999, the first iPhone in 2007.

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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Donn View Post
    The first BlackBerry phone was released in 1999, the first iPhone in 2007.

    They had 8 years head start and

    BlackBerry No Longer Smartphone Leader for Businesses - DailyTech


    www.dailytech.com/BlackBerry+No...for.../article23320.htm
    Nov 18, 2011 – For 2011 so far, BlackBerry has 32.2 percent of the business marketwhile iPhone has 45 percent.
    Thou shalt incur undying wrath if thou post anything, however true, that is negative (however so slightly) of the Democrats or of POTUS on this forum.

  44. #44
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Donn View Post
    The first BlackBerry phone was released in 1999, the first iPhone in 2007.
    Yes, but those Blackberries weren't smartphones. There were what's now called "feature phones" with a specific (and for a while unique) feature set that included email.

    For example, I used to have a phone which had a keyboard, a set of applications (calendar, music player, games, etc.) including downloadable ones, and other features. But no one called it a smartphone.

    Kaa

  45. #45
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Blackberries were never cool... they were an expensive business tool used by lawyers, sales and management. they were part of the man, a legacy memory of what gen x and gen y kids know as the phone that kept Dan or mom from talking to them during a family moment and demanded a parents attention from their important little league game.

    What were have witnessed over the last 5 years, a smartphone camera revolution that makes cyber destinations like Facebook relievant. MS has not had a play in this really... It the age of texting and immediate upload of pictures, likes and time relivant hand held games. servers yes. Consumer interaction not really. as apple puts it, Idevices get love and other communication tools get ignored.
    “Get your facts first, and then you can distort them as much as you please.”
    Mark Twain

  46. #46
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaa View Post
    Yes, but those Blackberries weren't smartphones. There were what's now called "feature phones" with a specific (and for a while unique) feature set that included email.
    Nope. The BlackBerry which came out in '99 was a two-way pager only.

    In 2003, they brought one out with cell service, email, text messaging, web browsing, etc.. The '99 model (850) ran on DataTAC (ARDIS).

  47. #47
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaa View Post
    A valid point, though to be fair RIM didn't sell smartphones, it sold portable email terminals :-)
    And security, yes. Nevertheless I think it can be argued that they got the smartphone ball rolling.


  48. #48
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaa View Post
    It is now. It was not at the time the first iPhone appeared.
    I disagree; I was using a Blackberry Pearl when the first iPhone was released. The Pearl was some nine months old at that point and was definitely a smartphone.


  49. #49
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    Quote Originally Posted by Flying Orca View Post
    And security, yes. Nevertheless I think it can be argued that they got the smartphone ball rolling.
    I think I'll disagree. Being a smartphone is really about being a relatively open platform for a myriad of apps (well, besides being a small general-purpose computer that happens to make phone calls). RIM, on the other hand, built enterprise-driven centralized systems with Blackberries being, in effect, thin clients.

    Kaa

  50. #50
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    Default Re: Microsoft anounces the Surface

    The "Simon" was the first smartphone. 1992.


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