Another Long Point

[Popeye53]

I have decided to post this new thread documenting the building of my long point skiff. I am in Canada on the West Coast near Prince Rupert (up near Alaska). At this point I have been working on the jig and studying the plans/other builds for quite a while waiting for the plywood to show up. Will use local wood for everything I can. Pics are making the yellow cedar inner stem.

[beernd]

Changed links = no pictures

[Popeye53]

Sorry bout that - just figuring things out..

[jahlinux]

I use a free Flickr account for my pictures. Once logged into Flickr I select the picture size I want and "right click" it and copy the image address. (I use 640 x 478) Then in the post select the insert image icon and then the "From URL" tab. Paste the Flickr web address into the blank line, uncheck "Retrieve Remote File" box. Click Ok and the picture should show up in your post.

How does Yellow Cedar compare to mahogany in weight? I'm getting worried about the weight of my boat. I purchased the rest of the wood I'll need to complete the boat, 1 3/4" philippine mahogany is not very light.



I know the plans called for pine, but I wanted to use something a little more durable. I have a local wood supplier who stocks philippine mahogany in the dimensions I needed so I decided to go with the mahogany. There is no way my boat is going to weigh 400 lbs. It would be interesting to find out what other Long Points weigh. I have decided on at least a 20Hp outboard, but may need to consider a 30Hp based on the final weight of the boat.

Glad you started your thread, keep the pictures coming.

[skaraborgcraft]

Some mahoganies are FAR less durable than SOME pines. However,those boards look rather nice,but im curious how much you have to pay to get boards like that in your location. Couldnt you have used fir? Cheers

[jahlinux]

The 1-3/4 x 11 boards are $15.42 a foot. It was an expensive trip that day.

[Gib Etheridge]

Yellow cedar would be my first choice for everything except the plywood, everything, and where you live that should be easy. I'm looking forward to watching this. Please keep the pictures coming.

[Popeye53]

I switched to Flickr as well with no probs. Yellow cedar is lighter than mahogany but heavier than red cedar. I just love working with it. The smell the feel the way it works - lovely. I pay 1.20 a board foot for air dried clear (only about a year tho). I bought 20 foot clear red cedar for around twice that and ripped it up for rails and chines. I love the real dark red mahogany but it is even heavier than Philippine. I would not worry about boat weight, your boat will ride nicely with some weight, the boat will be nice and strong and the trailer doesn't mind.

[Popeye53]

I thought about fir as well but the splinters are pretty nasty.

[Popeye53]

I finished the chines and transom and made a garboard pattern from doorskin.



Here is a pic showing the scarfing sled settup. Rain halted us here. Need another tent!

[jahlinux]

Looking good, I like that scarfing sled. I didn't get any work done on my boat yesterday, Ill try again today.

[Sealevel24]

Looking good, I like that scarfing sled. I didn't get any work done on my boat yesterday, Ill try again today.

Like the scarfing sled. Do you put anything between the plywood sheets to hold them down?

[Popeye53]

I screwed the sheets together. I could have used double sided tape I suppose.

[Popeye53]

Scarfing sled worked well once it was all set-up to run.



Ply glued up.

[peabody]

Thats beautiful! Looking good .....wishes i had wood working skills like that.
peabody

[jahlinux]

Save those pieces of wood from your transom, they work great as wedges when gluing up the breast hook. That jig looks like it does a great job.

[potomac]

I like the jig too. Can you give us some details? Thanks- Aaron

[Popeye53]

Here is a good pic of that finished machined scarf.. My pattern needed more length for the planks. I scarfed on another 1/4 sheet to each sheet of planking stock.




Today I cut out, planed and sanded the garboards. But I got a point wrong on the pattern and drawing the line fair with the batten caused a wavy line. I thought this must be normal and the planks fit on ok..



Major thanks to Jahlinux for spotting the error and informing me in time that his planks were 'straight edged' I adjusted the pattern and re-sawed the planks successfully from the same pieces.

[jahlinux]

The shape of your garboards are radically different then mine. Have you mounted them yet?

[Popeye53]

No not yet..

[jahlinux]

Here is a picture of the pattern I used for my garboard planks.

[Popeye53]

Tks. John

[jahlinux]

Hmm.. I had better rethink this. Thanks John. I wonder if you could send me the width at either end of the pattern.

The pattern is 16' long. The bow measures 27" and the stern is 11-1/2". I added ~3/4" extra to the pattern. Any luck fitting your planks on yet?

[Popeye53]

Thanks for this. Recut the planks . I will post a pic.

[Popeye53]

First plank glued and screwed.

[Popeye53]

Both garboards on.



Tools for gains - Sharp chisel, N0. 92 & No. 78 Stanley Rebate planes.



My first gain attempt. Not perfect but easier than expected.

[Popeye53]

By the way, here are the details on the scarfing sled Aaron. It is from Woodhaven products. It is beautifully made (in USA not China) and has clear instructions (written by an American) that make it a joy to put together. You must supply the base (MDF) and a sacrificial layer on top of the base (MDF) and I painted mine. The resulting weight is considerable but that helps keep everything rigid I suppose. Details here:

http://www.woodhaven.com/Woodhaven-3...&searchSize=12

Tim

[Popeye53]

Weather has been miserable but today the sun came out. We have a lot of rain here in the NorthWest. Planing and belt sanding plank 2



Test fit plank 2. Should get both planks on tomorrow.

[Popeye53]

I have 5 planks on now. I chose to 'pad' the molds as per Holzbt's build, so as to do away with ribands and beveling planks etc. This made the patterning of the garboard a little trickier. To pattern the garboard all you really have to do is measure the distance from bottom to upper edge of plank at each station, transfer the points to the plank stock adjusting for the slight bottom bow rise. A fair batten through the points will give the correct shape in this case because the bottom is flat, giving you a straight frame of reference. If there was a curved line on both sides of the plank you would have to spile it properly. On the whole though it has proved to be easier I think, and has saved time. The 2nd and 3rd plank simply follow the line of the garboard 'sheer'. So I used the garboard plank pattern to draw these out. I screwed the planks on right through the glue join with small screws. I found this easier and more effective than clamping planks 2 and 3.

[davebrown]

You're flying along! Thanks for the informative pics.

[jahlinux]

Your boat is looking great! I better get busy before you catch up to me.

[Bill Wiegmann]

Your planks look great! Thanks for the comments on padding the molds. I will file this information away for when I start my build in the fall.

[Popeye53]

Haha John! I'm a chasin' but don't think I'll catch!
Tks. Bill - looking forward to seeing you start. Seems like more people are turning around and deciding to build this design. The Jig is actually fun to build, and works well.

[Popeye53]

Today I started on the first layer of bottom. Everything going swell so far..

[Popeye53]

I was having some trouble marking and flipping the heavy 3/4 Maranti so I decided on the hinge it up goop and drop method!

[Popeye53]

I got the first layer of the bottom done. I will do the second layer in three parts because I don't have enough 3/4 Maranti. It should be ok. I seem to running out of cabosil. I ordered some more with my fiberglass cloth order today. The cloth was pretty pricey. 190can for 1 gallon cabosil and 36 x 5 foot 6 oz cloth.

I did a trial lift of the bow and stern in turn with a buddy today and the boat popped up off the jig easy as pie. Happy about that.

[Popeye53]

I shaped and fitted the outer stem today. I pilot drilled, counter bored and lagged the piece in place with my impact driver. It went on very solidly with loads of squeeze out. I used lots of thickened epoxy. I started sanding it down but decided to wait till it cured a bit more.

[jahlinux]

The stem looks great! Do you already have the second layer of plywood on the bottom? How did you trim up the plywood flush with the sides?

[Popeye53]

Thanks John. I cut the bevel on the table saw and shaped the ogee mainly with the bench sander. The bottom is on. I will post a pic. I trimmed the bottom with the power planer. I will ease the edges a bit then glass the bottom tomorrow. BTW how much epoxy have you used up to date? Do you think two gallons will be enough?

[jahlinux]

I'm using MAS resin and so far I've used a gallon of the Low Viscosity and working on my second. I'm also almost through a gallon of the FLAG resin. I think three gallons should be enough. I was afraid to use a power planer on the bottom, thought I would dig the sides up too much. But, it looks like you did a great job with it.

[Popeye53]

The power plane did dig in a little bit at the bow but the glass will cover it. I learned to bevel the bottom as I planed and that solved the problem. I am using west 205/105 and looks like I will have to order another gallon. This build is costing more than I had anticipated. I will glass the bottom tonight once it cools down a bit. I feel like I should refrigerate the resin..

[upchurchmr]

I don't know if you were joking about refrigerating the resin, just in case - don't!
The resin goes on a lot better when it is warm.
Once it gets over 100 degrees the resin laminates and lays down much better.
I now set the cans on a heating pad when it is not hot here.

Sorry if I am preaching to the choir.

[Popeye53]

Thx Upchurchmr,

I was actually serious! Good info. I thought that it would kick off quicker when warm. I guess viscosity wins over pot life.

[Popeye53]

Ok got the bottom glassed. I was wondering whether it was wise to put two layers of cloth on at once but John (jahlinux) did it and said it was ok and now I have tried it as well. it is a lot harder to saturate the 2 layers of cloth but it worked out ok. It was hard to get every bit of air out of the sides, lot's of elbow grease needed. I had a friend mixing 10 shot batches while I squeegeed. It took about seven and a half batches. Next time I'd be tempted to use one layer of 10 oz cloth.

[upchurchmr]

Popeye,

I thought the same about it kicking off quicker when warm, practically I could not tell enough difference to cause me an issue. The pot life difference between 80 and 100 degrees was not noticeable to me. This is with slow hardener. Fast at 100 is only good for small tasks.

Marc

[Popeye53]

Ok.. slow hardener. I am using 205 fast hardener so I had better just leave it be.

[upchurchmr]

Depends upon your temperature there. Some guys in Seattle said fast hardner was the norm and never had a pot life issue.

Ok.. slow hardener. I am using 105 fast hardener so I had better just leave it be.

[Popeye53]

I have the boat glassed and faired now. I want to put one more coat of epoxy on the bottom, more fairing and sanding and mount a skeg keel aft for more lateral stability just to be safe. I don't want to find out later I need one and wish I had done it. I am stalled out right now waiting for more epoxy.

[jahlinux]

Your boat is looking great! I'm hoping to get the breast hook, quarter knees, and seat riser installed this weekend.

[Popeye53]

Here is what I came up with. I want some directional stability without sacrificing the shallow draft capability and the flat resting position. Three runners just aft of the start of the hull rocker. Not fastened down yet. Still waiting for epoxy. I will start on the steering station tommorow. Let me know what you think..