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Thread: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

  1. #526
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Thank you guys!


    I am really looking forward to getting her afloat again. The smell of salt water and the sound of seagulls - Oh yes!


    The hatch-casing is nearly ready to be bolted down.















    I find it more difficult to joint big timbers than smaller ones.
    Larger timbers means longer surfaces that needs to match, but also you have to work with more effort just to get the cuts done and the saws I am using are not meant for big dimensions.

    I love to use Japanese saws (cuts on the draw rather than the push, and thus the blades can be made very thin).
    When cross-cutting with a goal to just leave the scribed line intact, the blade simply isn't stiff enough to get a clean start of the cut.
    I tried using a 90° support block to get started, and this helped, but ended up buying a stiffer fine-teeth saw.
    Another lesson I learned, is that you need to support the work pieces so that your cuts are vertical.
    If you need to hold the saw at an angle you risk that the blade bends and go off your line.







    I have adjusted the length of the cabin sides and they are resting on the carlins.
    The angle is also adjusted so they face a bit inwards at the top. Not much, but they would appear to point outwards if they are 90° to the beams.








    The post going all the way down to the floors have been secured with 16mm bolts.







    The next task is making the corner-posts to join the cabin sides.
    I have studied pictures of the original cabin, and it looks like they have used corner-posts that are rounded on the outside.
    This is easier to manufacture, and less risk of making errors on the cabin-sides.




    Cheers,

    Ole

  2. #527
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    I find decent dovetails on timbers that size impressive Ole ! Well done.
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
    Grateful Dead

  3. #528
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Some time ago I read an article in "Wooden Boat Magazine" or "Classic Boat" about a way of measuring the camber of for instance the cabin roof, making the curve with somewhat less radius on the top than towards the sides.
    It had to do with a couple of sticks/battens put together, that could slide from one side to the other with a marking device to draw the curve.

    I know this is a bit unclearly explained, but those of you that have seen the article will probably know what I mean.

    Anyone out there with knowledge of how to build such a device?
    Comments appreciated

  4. #529
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    I also admire those dovetails. Very well done.
    Chuck Thompson

  5. #530
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Svaap the device is very easy to make, I've done it myself. I think I got the method from either Greg Rossel or Bud McIntosh's book. The general method is to have two boards about as long as your greatest beam. Drive two nails in the floor (or use clamps on the bench or something) that are spread exactly to the max beam of the boat. A line between the nails is your baseline, as if the deck were flat. In the center of the line drive another nail above the line the distance of the maximum deck camber.

    Now place your boards so that they rest on the two outside nails and the bottom corners meet perfectly at the center one. This will look like a shallow roof truss or something. Fasten a gusset or otherwise secure the boards so the angle doesn't change. Remove the center nail, put your pencil in the crotch where the two boards join, and slide the boards across the two outside nails, from one to the other.

    The scribed line is a fair curve with the right shape for deck beams. It puts most of the curve in the middle and gradually less to the sides. To get a tighter curve for cabin beams just connect the boards a bit higher in the middle. You can play with it til you get a pleasing shape.

    Is that what you were wondering? I can draw it out if its unclear.

  6. #531
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    Sweden,Scilly Isles, Siberia
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Lovely work as always Ole. The 6in nails fastning the cockpit coamings is a treat...

  7. #532
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Houston, Texas
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Quote Originally Posted by J.Madison View Post
    Svaap the device is very easy to make, I've done it myself. I think I got the method from either Greg Rossel or Bud McIntosh's book. The general method is to have two boards about as long as your greatest beam. Drive two nails in the floor (or use clamps on the bench or something) that are spread exactly to the max beam of the boat. A line between the nails is your baseline, as if the deck were flat. In the center of the line drive another nail above the line the distance of the maximum deck camber.

    Now place your boards so that they rest on the two outside nails and the bottom corners meet perfectly at the center one. This will look like a shallow roof truss or something. Fasten a gusset or otherwise secure the boards so the angle doesn't change. Remove the center nail, put your pencil in the crotch where the two boards join, and slide the boards across the two outside nails, from one to the other.

    The scribed line is a fair curve with the right shape for deck beams. It puts most of the curve in the middle and gradually less to the sides. To get a tighter curve for cabin beams just connect the boards a bit higher in the middle. You can play with it til you get a pleasing shape.

    Is that what you were wondering? I can draw it out if its unclear.
    J.

    For those of us that are not as smart or as skilled as Ole - OK, me - please draw it out.

  8. #533
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    May 2010
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Thank you Jonathan -spot on!

    We welcome your drawing..


    Cheers,

  9. #534
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Central Connecticut
    Posts
    54

    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    I have also used a low stretch string for the eyebrow curve on barn doors.
    I can't get enough of the work you are able to accomplish. Beautiful boat.

  10. #535
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
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    Bergen, Norway
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    324

    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Quote Originally Posted by J.Madison View Post
    Svaap the device is very easy to make, I've done it myself. I think I got the method from either Greg Rossel or Bud McIntosh's book. The general method is to have two boards about as long as your greatest beam. Drive two nails in the floor (or use clamps on the bench or something) that are spread exactly to the max beam of the boat. A line between the nails is your baseline, as if the deck were flat. In the center of the line drive another nail above the line the distance of the maximum deck camber.

    Now place your boards so that they rest on the two outside nails and the bottom corners meet perfectly at the center one. This will look like a shallow roof truss or something. Fasten a gusset or otherwise secure the boards so the angle doesn't change. Remove the center nail, put your pencil in the crotch where the two boards join, and slide the boards across the two outside nails, from one to the other.

    The scribed line is a fair curve with the right shape for deck beams. It puts most of the curve in the middle and gradually less to the sides. To get a tighter curve for cabin beams just connect the boards a bit higher in the middle. You can play with it til you get a pleasing shape.

    Is that what you were wondering? I can draw it out if its unclear.
    That is just beautifully simple. Thanks for the explanation.

  11. #536
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Heres a rough sketch of the layout.



    Hopefully its big enough to see. The gusset is critical as the angle between the boards can't change. With the pencil in the center it is slid back and forth to draw a master beam pattern. All the beams can then be taken from this pattern, referencing at the center for the shorter ones.

    This is all off the top of my head so hopefully it works as advertised.

  12. #537
    Join Date
    May 2013
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Quote Originally Posted by J.Madison View Post
    Heres a rough sketch of the layout.



    Hopefully its big enough to see. The gusset is critical as the angle between the boards can't change. With the pencil in the center it is slid back and forth to draw a master beam pattern. All the beams can then be taken from this pattern, referencing at the center for the shorter ones.

    This is all off the top of my head so hopefully it works as advertised.
    Got it. I didn't realize that each board has to be little longer than the beam of the vessel.

  13. #538
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Thanks Jonathan,


    I assembled the jig on top of the cabin-sides, and fixed a template-plank to draw the curve on to.














    The negative template i cut from the line could be used directly on the planking stock for the beams.









    After some planing on the top and the sides, they could be lifted onto the boat.







    They are not cut to the correct height yet, and they will be let into the sidewalls after they again have been adjusted to their right height.


    Cheers,

    Ole

  14. #539
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Today I cut the beams down to 65mm in the outer ends, and 80mm in the center with a natural curve between these points.
    A lot of sanding later and they finish was very much improved.









    The cabin-sides were cut down in the top, and the correct bevel was planed.








    The beams will be cut down into the sidewalls.














    It is starting to look like a boat!!


    /Ole

  15. #540
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    I googled suppliers for hot-dip galvanizing, trying to find a company not too far from were we live, as I need to make a lot of bolts for the boat soon.
    Doing this, I came over a product that is supposed to replace traditional galvanizing with a paint-on substance (of zink), with superior performance.
    Sounds to good to be true, but neutral tests have been performed, and the product is approved by offshore installations, both as a repair paint and to replace ordinary hot-dip galvanizing on bare steel/iron. So I bought a 5 kg can and will be trying it.

    If it performs as good as they say, it has the additional advantage that the product can be applied at home, and no need to gather a lot of items before sending them along for galvanizing. The mechanical grip on the steel is supposed to be better, and it can take bends after applied, without cracking.

    Still, I can't avoid thinking - what if it doesn't perform as good as it needs to, and all my bolts are deep into the boat.... ! Scary !









    Tried it on some bolts before threading.







    120my is required, but 180my is recommended for offshore applications - so this it will be!


    Anyone heard about this product??


    Yesterday I mixed some nice ingredients to paint the mating surfaces for the cabin-sides.
    I took some linseed paint, a bit of tar, and lots of wood preservatives and mixed it together.
    It smelled really like proper "boat-soup"....








  16. #541
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Today I cut the aft planks for the cabin-trunk to length.
    It takes a bit of plundering, as I needed to assemble the part together to make sure they align right, before I mark the cut and let the saw chew on the oak.
    Using a straight-edge to guide the circular-saw is safer than free-hand sawing.








    It looks a bit odd still, but it will be okay when the curve is established and excess wood cut away.







    Cheers,

  17. #542
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    Wellington, NZ
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    542

    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    I've used a spray on product called "Zinc-it" with good results.
    The first time I came across it was doing annual maintenance in a Chlorine gas production facility.
    I was servicing a long list of 316L pressure transmitters.
    After the normal routine, the standard practice was to clean with solvent then spray the entire TX with "zinc-it" to protect the stainless from the chlorine gas which ate it.
    I was smart enough to not go back there again (horrible job!) to check performance, but the site guys were adamant it was the business.

  18. #543
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    I wonder if a coat of epoxy over the zinc paint would be acceptable ? It would strengthen the coating .... which if it's anything like the material I've used is a little soft. I would be worried about it being scrapped off while driving.
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
    Grateful Dead

  19. #544
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Thanks for the comments on the zink.

    The supplier actually suggests using a top coat for high abrasive surfaces.
    I asked about the danger of scraping off the coating when pounding the bolts into tight hardwood holes, but I was told that the coating would be much stronger than ordinary hot dip galvanizing in that respect.
    I will try to do some tests on that issue.

    Thanks!

  20. #545
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Quote Originally Posted by svaap View Post
    Thanks for the comments on the zink.

    The supplier actually suggests using a top coat for high abrasive surfaces.
    I asked about the danger of scraping off the coating when pounding the bolts into tight hardwood holes, but I was told that the coating would be much stronger than ordinary hot dip galvanizing in that respect.
    I will try to do some tests on that issue.

    Thanks!
    Wow !! It must be a LOT better than anything I've ever seen!

    I'd run a few tests.
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
    Grateful Dead

  21. #546
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Ole, I'd pay for hot dipping .
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
    Grateful Dead

  22. #547
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    I ran a simple test of how a hot-dipped bolt and a zinc-painted bolt could take being driven into a 16mm dia. hole in a 5" thick plank of white oak.
    It may be that the Zinga (paint) had not cured properly, which makes the test completely without value, but it did not stick as good to the metal as hot dipping did:














    The pounding from the hammer took some of the top surface.


    But that was nothing compared to after they had driven through the oak!








    Well, I think it is due for a phone-call to the supplier tomorrow.


    I made the template for the front plank of the cabin, and tuned it to fit to the mast beam.







    This plank will have to be made i two heights, as the core (marrow) of the tree is in the plank, and this is prone to splitting..

    I'll keep you posted on the comment from the supplier of the zinc-paint.



    /Ole

  23. #548
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    I am not so surprised that the paint sheared off. Hot dipping forms a thin alloy layer so the zinc is welded on rather than glued on with the paint. You may need to go to the effort of roughening the bolt to key the paint on.
    It really is quite difficult to build an ugly wooden boat.

    The power of the web: Anyone can post anything on the web
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  24. #549
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Thanks for posting the results.... pretty much as expected . Hot dip galvanising is hard to beat .
    '' You ain't gonna learn what you don't want to know. ''
    Grateful Dead

  25. #550
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    Default Re: Restoration of MINDE, a 1903 Pilot Cutter

    Quote Originally Posted by Nadermargh View Post
    Hi Ole,
    great progress. Lovely to see her taking shape.
    You refer to the National List of Preservative Vessels. Although I have not got any further researching the history of my Colin Archer boat I would like to contact the register. Do you know how I could contact them?
    Keep up the good work,
    Kit.
    FYI

    http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...-May-30th-2014

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