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Thread: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

  1. #1
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    Default Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Looking for design/plans for Classic Schooner build. Maybe little over 30' or so. Heavy displacement. No glass. What would be good source?

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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Quote Originally Posted by Wet Rail View Post
    Looking for design/plans for Classic Schooner build. Maybe little over 30' or so. Heavy displacement. No glass. What would be good source?
    Peterson's Susan. A bit under 30' Do a search of the forum for pictures of a build of one.


  3. #3
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    William Garden has some lovely little schooners that are superb cruisers, look quite classic, and are very nicely evolved from older stuff like the littlest Peterson. There are only a few schooners of less than 12 tons that are not just handsome but also really good boats.

    G'luck

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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    I'm afraid it really is a little small at 30' for the schooner rig to really come into it's own. On the other hand there are certainly cutters, yawls and ketches in that size range that offer the safety and utility of a split-up sail rig as well as classic good looks. Is there a reason why you specifically want a schooner rig on such a small boat? I'm afraid that the ruthless laws of scale and ergonomics are going to put the mainmast right smack dab in the way no matter what you do. After about 40' or so schooners become more all-around practical.

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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Well, I said little over 30'. Even up to 35' - 36' ish. I have sloop, had ketch, yawl. Very interested in Schooner this time. I do not want to large, I mainly single hand, so split rig is desired. Plus dealing with Marina (costs). I would guess largest sail around 300 or so.

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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    "right smack dab in the way" of what?

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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Each time I see this pic of "Susan" I'm stuck !!!
    This boat is too beautifull !!!!
    Gerard.
    SCHOONER FOR EVER, GOELETTE A PERPETE

    http://www.goelette-anthea.fr

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Quote Originally Posted by Wet Rail View Post
    Well, I said little over 30'. Even up to 35' - 36' ish. I have sloop, had ketch, yawl. Very interested in Schooner this time. I do not want to large, I mainly single hand, so split rig is desired. Plus dealing with Marina (costs). I would guess largest sail around 300 or so.
    Taping in at 30 ft exactly; the Little Maid of Kent




    http://www.atkinboatplans.com/Sail/L...aidOfKent.html

    I fail to see any issue with "comming in to its own" there ^^

  9. #9
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Quote Originally Posted by Wet Rail View Post
    Looking for design/plans for Classic Schooner build. Maybe little over 30' or so. Heavy displacement. No glass. What would be good source?
    This one might be a classic schooner dream......................

    Coaster I by Murray Peterson 34' 6" (or ?36'4") LOD x 29' 8" LWL x 11' 2" Beam x 5' 9" draft

    796 sq ft total sail area - it looks about 300 in the main

    From WB magazine No. 1
    "For such a comparatively small schooner, her gaff rig was surprisingly efficient and she could beat to windward as well as reach and run as well or better than most cruising boats of her size. Murray did a most unusual thing in installing the engine, a four cylinder Falcon, amidships in the hull with a double state room forward and the main cabin aft. At first many were critical of the arrangement but actually there was as much usable space as there would be on any 29' lwl cruising auxilliary and having the weight amidships gave her a stability and ease of motion not usually found in such craft."





    I really love the lines of these boats, and the way the stem forms out of them - I'm probably biased (I have plans for another coaster), but still, in that size, it's my fav'
    Last edited by Sayla; 02-28-2012 at 10:43 PM.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Gartside design? 36ft:
    http://www.peacefuljourney.ca/
    BEWARE: I am a native french speaker

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Quote Originally Posted by Wet Rail View Post
    Looking for design/plans for Classic Schooner build. Maybe little over 30' or so. Heavy displacement. No glass. What would be good source?
    How heavy?

    My favorite small schooner, Fame. . .



    Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Found this on the Wooden Boat plan index. http://www.woodenboat.com/boatplansa...ooner-646.html

    (do not know how to post pictures of it)

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    How about Robert Baker's design no. 19, "Samanthe"? LOA: 26' 8 1/2" Beam: 9" 4 1/4"

    Samanthe 2 by Chuck Hancock, on Flickr


    Robert H. Baker - Samanthe by Chuck Hancock, on Flickr
    Chuck Hancock

  14. #14
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Quote Originally Posted by Wet Rail View Post
    Found this on the Wooden Boat plan index. http://www.woodenboat.com/boatplansa...ooner-646.html

    (do not know how to post pictures of it)
    Here you go (pick the insert image icon, pick. from url, uncheck . retrieve remote file and place the url / image location in)

    - I presume you know where the web page is?

    http://www.skirayachtdesign.com/









    Interesting looking design - I hadn't noticed that one before - might be new

    Oh yeah - just read - Year of Design 2012

    sayla

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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    I think this one would be a good fit


    http://www.atkinboatplans.com/Articl...and/index.html

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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    "Oh yeah - just read - Year of Design 2012"

    sayla, what is Year of Desing 2012?

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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Quote Originally Posted by Wet Rail View Post
    "Oh yeah - just read - Year of Design 2012"

    sayla, what is Year of Desing 2012?
    It's a new design of Daniel Skira's - this year, 2012 - there may not yet be one built

    Go to the website http://www.skirayachtdesign.com/ and email him / ask about the design - I noticed that it's sawn frames (bit of a time saver) and double planked (probably not a bit of a time saver)

    In my own search for a schooner, I looked at a lot of different designs / designers, but I hadn't noticed that one; hence I thought it must be new (designed since I last looked)

    If you like spoon bow schooners, you may want to check out the schooners of Newfoundland as well - I believe it used to be like schooner central - you'll probably be in overload soon - google search Newfoundland schooners and start looking, www.schoonerman.com might have some good stuff on his website too.

    Farley Mowat's book (The boat who wouldn't float) is a nice looking 31' Newfoundland schooner - don't let the name of the book put you off, it was simply a dilapidated boat





    Check this one out http://www.meriah.com/file002a/page002a.ca.portal2.htm



    Even with older homegrown designs, if you have the availability of the lines you can take it from there fairly easily (not without some effort) as scantlings etc are very available, and see an N.A. to wrap it all up

    sayla

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    There's a few schooners in the book "Designs to Inspire" by the old "Rudder" magazine - you can preview the book through google books, and check out the schooner section

    The plans for this Bill Hand schooner were apparently free with a couple of the magazines


  19. #19
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Quote Originally Posted by SaltyD from BC View Post
    Taping in at 30 ft exactly; the Little Maid of Kent




    http://www.atkinboatplans.com/Sail/L...aidOfKent.html

    I fail to see any issue with "comming in to its own" there ^^
    Well, I've sailed three of them, one actually welded up out of steel and they are salty and cute, but hardly "into their own," as has been said. The schooner rig simply isn't efficient below about forty feet and doesn't really become worth the expense and trouble until around fifty and up. That's not just my opinion, but pretty much the general consensus. Schooners "look cool," but looks aren't everthing. Below around 35 feet, a schooner really becomes a "character boat," which is to say a miniature. Fun? Certainly, but not a particularly good sailer compared to other rig options.

    I'm quite partial to Murray Peterson's scaled down coasting schooners, but even they don't come into their own until he got to Coaster II, now named "Quissett," which we sold to Gary Duncan of Quicksilver Messenger Service back in the mid-seventies. Peterson built three "Coasters" for his own use back in the '30's, each successively larger. (Guess why?) Quissett was 42' on deck, but made up for length with a huge bowsprit and main boom overhang. I recall we kept her in a 60' slip at the brokerage and she just fit.



    Another "Maid of Kent" I knew was rigged not as a schooner, but, with the schooner masts in place, as a brigantine. Now THAT was a character boat. Everything on her was down to scale. Sailing her was quite a job, but she sure did turn heads.

    If you must, though, and you want a smaller boat, Atkin's "Young America," which is really a skipjack hull below the waterline, but is a beautiful looking little character boat that might suit your purposes. I sailed one in fairly heavy weather (about 25-30 knot winds and a lot of chop) on SF Bay years ago and she stood up to it pretty well. Not a witch to windward, but respectable. She benefits greatly from her loosefooted overlapping foresail. I have no idea why Atkin didn't do the same with "Maid of Kent." Small enough to single hand. Relatively simple to build.






    http://www.atkinboatplans.com/Sail/AmericaJunior.html
    Last edited by Bob Cleek; 02-29-2012 at 09:00 PM.

  20. #20
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Malabar II anyone? I know she's a bit bigger than what the OP mentioned but she's certainly the epitomy of a classic schooner. I'm on board with the Peterson schooners though. If you decide you like the Susan, I can put you in touch with Bill Peterson. I met with him a couple of weeks before Christmas. He says he's keeping track of the Susan build going on but doesn't hang out here. He will however, be more than happy to talk to anyone who goes to the effort to search him out he said.
    If one advances confidently in the direction of his dreams, and endeavors to live the life which he has imagined, he will meet with a success unexpected in common hours.
    -Henry David Thoreau-

  21. #21
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    I like this, maybe without pilot house/
    Quote Originally Posted by JoshuaIII View Post
    Gartside design? 36ft:

  22. #22
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Like this one too.

  23. #23
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Quote Originally Posted by Wet Rail View Post
    "right smack dab in the way" of what?
    The mainmast tends to end up right where the entrance to the cabin is. But, there are ways around this. That pretty Skira schooner appears to have deck-stepped masts, which is one way to solve the problem.

    Tom

  24. #24
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    The prettiest schooner ever drawn: Malabar II and available right from Wooden Boat store.
    Here she is under sail (give it a second to get going:
    Cheers,
    Vanmikey
    sailorswhipping.com

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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    I don't have an image at the ready, but how about Sam Crocker's Grey Gull. One of my favorites. Shown in "Sam Crocker's Boats."

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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Ted Brewer's 33' Ingenue looks like a nice design - www.tedbrewer.com.

  27. #27
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    I wish this were not on the wrong side of the continent.
    http://portland.craigslist.org/mlt/bod/2916310299.html

  28. #28
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    hey! thats my 'old' girl DECATUR in the video clip. wow!

    there's some pretty nice schooners listed in this thread.

  29. #29
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Well... because I've spent a lot of time looking for something similar:

    Fame is nice. The Sound Schooner is similar, but has a bit more "below". That said, it's 40', plus sprit, so outside what the OP poster put as his limit. Also, when he said "heavy displacement", I assumed that meant a bit of cruising room below. FAME, and the SS, weigh in about 12,000 pounds. Might be considered "light". Or at least light compared to some of the others.

    But clearly, Jay G. hasn't seen this thread yet. If he did, he would recommend Alden's design #274A, WANDERLURE II.37'3" LOA
    28'6" LWL
    10'6" Beam
    5'10" Draught

    Smaller than MALABAR. MUCH lighter than MALABAR II, but still can be considered "heavy". Originally gaff-rigged on both masts, then updated to Marconi main and gaff fore. Could even go with a staysail fore, which, while not solving all of the problems Mr. Cleek mentioned, helps. Something to think about.
    Heute ist so ein schöne Tag...

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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    I noted that, Bernadette, and thought it very nice!

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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    its interesting to note how the original malabar II handled in the video clip. with DECATUR i found she did sail "on her ear" as i put it. she was what i consider, somewhat tender. dont get me wrong, she handled light and heavy weather well but she did have a tendency to get over on her side pretty quickly. if at times i was feeling in the mood, i would sail her hard and invariably she would drag a fair amount of the sea over her side decks. given time i figured out her ways, and then we became the best of friends! i learnt a lot from sailing her and despite my greater love of cutter rig, i would say the schooner rig is very visually appealing but in my expereince, it was a lot of extra hard work for me.

  32. #32
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    by the way, i wonder where i can get a model of the malabar II like the one in the video clip? its a very classy model. one i would like to have for my home.

  33. #33
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    one of
    Chapell's Tancook Whalers should be right in your size range, or an Essex Ma Chebacco boat or a small pinky or dog body

  34. #34
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Is DECATUR the boat used in Message in a bottle?
    If one advances confidently in the direction of his dreams, and endeavors to live the life which he has imagined, he will meet with a success unexpected in common hours.
    -Henry David Thoreau-

  35. #35
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    Default Re: Dreaming of Classic Schooner

    Quote Originally Posted by Sailor View Post
    Is DECATUR the boat used in Message in a bottle?
    Do you mean the one they built in the movie?

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