Italian cruise ship aground-at least 3 dead

[Bob Adams]

Oh dear:

http://news.yahoo.com/italian-cruise...035356831.html

[The Bigfella]

I'd heard 8 dead... they all jumped for some unknown reason

[Bob Adams]

I'd heard 8 dead... they all jumped for some unknown reason

Rapid, severe list is probably why, there were reports of panic, she's completely on her side now..Can't seem to post pictures,I wonder how they are going to salvage this one, in pieces I'd bet.

[orbb]

In this day and age, how does this happen? That ship probably has the capability to steer itself by GPS.

[The Bigfella]

and therin maybe the problem

[Peerie Maa]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-16560617



Significant bottom damage.

[orbb]

and therin maybe the problem

I guess I am saying that there must be multiple, redundant systems dedicated to navigation, in addition to the humans. There must be a series of cascading failures to get to this point.

[Tom Hunter]

Andrew posted a very interesting link in the bilge thread: http://www.seanews.com.tr/article/AC...ational-error/

After reading it, all I can say is wow.

[tomlarkin]

I'm not sure you're supposed to aim directly at the lighthouse.

[CrosbyStriper]

The Ship is the Costa Concordia, one of the very nice Italian Costa Line.

The ship isn't even that old either, I wonder if it was an accident, or negligence of the crew...

[Bob Adams]

Link lost when the thread in the bilge was deleted:


http://www.seanews.com.tr/article/AC...ational-error/

[Bob Adams]

69 missing now:

http://entertainment.verizon.com/new...org%3E&ps=1018

[Donn]

Link lost when the thread in the bilge was deleted:


http://www.seanews.com.tr/article/AC...ational-error/

The link was posted back in post #8. I checked before I deleted my thread.

[Gerarddm]

Stupefying. Photos show these huge boulders the size of VW Bugs wedged into gashes in the hull. How fast was she going? The captain has a lot to answer for, as does the crew for their ineptitude during evacuation.

[Windsong]

There is no excuse for this happening. Clear weather, high tech vessel, common passage. This is inexcusable. Complacency is probable cause.

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

Costa Crociere are a very old established cruise line, who have been the Italian arm of Carnival Corporation for many years now. There are I think five sister ships to this design.

I would expect there to have been two officers and two quartermasters on the bridge, assuming the Captain was at dinner.

In addition to a multiplicity of redundant systems. This ship cost around US$430M when built, in 2006.

Carnival's and Costa's technical standards are excellent.

Guessing wildly, and that is really all that I can do, my guess is that the course on the autopilot was inadvertently altered, or possibly the autopilot was disengaged, and nobody noticed for almost forty minutes, until the island loomed up and the course was hurriedly altered to starboard, but too late and she scraped the rock ledge; it would quickly have become apparent that the situation was grim and they beached her in a hurry.

No points for getting into trouble but quite good marks for the response.

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

Here is quite a different explanation for what may have happened:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-accident.html

[Ian McColgin]

It will be interesting once a full investigation is completed. I think we can rely on Andrew for the latest here.

[Rich Jones]

Obviously, everyone on the bridge was asleep at the wheel. No lookout? No radar? How could you possibly get this close to land and not see the lights on shore? Arrests for gross negligence will certainly result.

[Breakaway]

Here's a poignant excerpt from ACB's link in #18( italics mine):

Despite the disaster which befell the Concordia, Mr Latarche said that modern ocean liners have a very good safety record, even though the fact that the average tonnage of cruise ships has doubled in the last decade makes a full-scale evacuation at sea almost impossible.

Kevin

[Hollingsworth]

Here is quite a different explanation for what may have happened:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-accident.html

Fascinating.

[Bob Adams]

Andrew- That link could explain how she got on the rocks, the events afterward are questionable based on some early passenger interviews. I mentioned in an earlier post I thought she'd not float again. How do you think they will get her out of there? I can't fathom how they could right her with all that superstructure.

[Peerie Maa]

Andrew- That link could explain how she got on the rocks, the events afterward are questionable based on some early passenger interviews. I mentioned in an earlier post I thought she'd not float again. How do you think they will get her out of there? I can't fathom how they could right her with all that superstructure.

If she is on sand she may settle into a scour pit, which will make it extremely difficult. If the bottom is firm enough, which I doubt or she will not have rolled as she has, it is possible to fit weldments to the ships side from which you can rig wires to pull her upright.

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

I am not knowledgeable about the modern large cruise ships with diesel electric propulsion.

Whether the ship is worth salvaging will be a matter of how much it would cost to repair her. Let's assume she is insured for US$500M; 20% of that vill be TLO and 80% will be All Risks so if the cost of salvge and repair looks likely to be more than US$400M she will be a Constructive Total Laoss and the wreck will be cut up and removed in sections.

If the cost of repair looks much less then attempts will be made to salvage her.

What follows is based on the techniques used in the salvage business in the 1970's which was when I was involved.

As a salvage job, it breaks down into four parts - getting the oil off before it leaks, patching the accessible holes, bringing her upright, and floating her off.

This ship was built in Italy and is six years old, so locating and pumping out the fuel should not be too hard.

Clearly the visible damage is relatively easy to patch, and damage under water but clear of the bottom can also be closed with welded patches.

Tanks and compartments open to the sea can be sealed on the upper sides and top and "pressed up" with compressed air to de-water them even if they are open to the sea underneath. It is also possible to use expanded polystyrene granules if the compartment cannot be sealed well.

It should be possible to roll the ship upright using parbuckles; barges can be anchored to seaward and tackles taken to masts erected on the ship's side for the purpose. Of course, that has never been done with a ship this big.

Since the Mediterranean has no significant tides, the actual refloating may be quite tricky. As the ship was deliberately beached when drawing not much more than normal there will not be much margin of floatation to work with. It may be necessary to cut away some weight to get her to float.

All this depends on the weather, of course.

[peter radclyffe]

http://www.facebook.com/

[PatCassidy]

With absolute certainty, this was a result of human error. With a high level of certainty, everyone involved was fatigued.

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

These big cruise ships are very well run - I don't know, but I'm going to assume that operating procedures will be standardised pretty much across the whole Carnival - Holland America - Princess - P&O - Cunard - Costa fleet, with allowances for national and regional differences.

I'm expecting hours of rest to be strictly complied with in advance of the new convention coming into force, and I'm expecting two officers on the bridge, with two quartermasters. Which does not explain what happened, of course.

[PatCassidy]

"Hours of rest"

a) Each person assigned duty as officer in charge of a navigational or engineering watch, or duty as a rating forming part of a navigational or engineering watch, on board any vessel that operates beyond the Boundary Line shall receive a minimum of 10 hours of rest in any 24-hour period.

(b) The hours of rest required under paragraph (a) of this section may be divided into no more than two periods, of which one must be at least 6 hours in length.

Six hours.... You get off watch... You go to sleep 45 minutes later. You get a call 20 minutes before watch starts. Your 6 hours of sleep has been reduced to 5 hours and 5 minutes.... The reality is less sleep than that.

Now do that for 4 to 6 months without a day off....

[peter radclyffe]

http://video.corriere.it/nave-concor...2-5f77182bc574it may have taken a similar route last year

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

Well spotted Peter.

I watched that and said, out loud, "Oh B....y H... !"

Gianni Onorato fronted up decently I thought, on the next clip.

[peter radclyffe]

http://video.corriere.it/elicottero-...2-5f77182bc574

[peter radclyffe]

yes Andrew,like the Inca it may have been sightseeing Giglio

[PatCassidy]

Some other things to do during your time "off": mooring stations in and out of port, fire drills, abandon ship drills, security drills, medical emergency drills, passenger drills, garbage management plans, oil pollution drills, officer meetings, safety inspections, requisitions, inventories ...

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

yes Andrew,like the Inca it may have been sightseeing Giglio

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS_Mikhail_Lermontov

[skuthorp]

There was some video this morning and someone said that they take this route 50 times a year and the rock they hit wasn't charted. I have no idea if he knew what he was talking about of course.

[Ian McColgin]

I'm impressed by the seamanlike acumen that's able to assign fault to the crew on the basis of no information. Brilliant.

[Captain Intrepid]

I'm impressed by the seamanlike acumen that's able to assign fault to the crew on the basis of no information. Brilliant.

Aye. I find the best thing to do when incidents like this occur is to sit back, gather as much information as possible, and wait for the investigation before you start nailing hides to the wall.

[matoi]

One news portal states that the captain and first officer are under arrest because of abandoning ship before completing the evacuation of passangers, besides other more obvious reasons.

What I find much more surprising is the tone and statements of the person interviewed by BBC:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-16560617

I'd like to know who that person is. That interview makes me much more afraid of stepping aboard such a vessel than this accident alone.

[matoi]

Further crazy news:
Prosecutor Francesco Verusio told the daily television La7 that the commander brought the ship to the island so close because he wanted to greet another person with a siren/horn.
The speed of the vessel at time of impact was 21kt, the news state.

[Woxbox]

I'm still trying to figure out where the ship hit exactly. The link above shows it struck south of Giglio while heading north. But the photos seem to show it just north of the town, turned south. Had the ship turned, hoping to make it into that tiny port before it went down?

[matoi]

Shortly after scratching on the rocks, the person commanding the ship (at this moment it is not clear who it was) dropped the port side anchor and steered hard to port(*), the vessel than made a quick 180deg turn and went aground.

I don't understand this very well, but this is what the news currently say. I've put the (*) because our news say that they turned the steering to the left, and I'm not 100% sure what our journalists/translators mean by that ;-)

[WX]

Earlier Saturday Francesco Schettino, captain of the Costa Concordia, had told Italian television that the vessel had hit a rocky spur while cruising in waters which, according to the charts, should have been safe.

"As we were navigating at cruise speed, we hit a rocky spur," he told Tgcom24 television station:

"According to the nautical chart, there should have been sufficient water underneath us," he added.

Holidaymakers from Britain, France, Italy and Germany were forced to flee the 1,500-cabin Costa Concordia in lifeboats when it hit a reef less than two hours after leaving port.

Some leapt overboard and swam to shore as the ship started to sink into the waters near the island of Giglio, off the Tuscan coast.

The captain has been detained.

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

Shortly after scratching on the rocks, the person commanding the ship (at this moment it is not clear who it was) dropped the port side anchor and steered hard to port(*), the vessel than made a quick 180deg turn and went aground.

I don't understand this very well, but this is what the news currently say. I've put the (*) because our news say that they turned the steering to the left, and I'm not 100% sure what our journalists/translators mean by that ;-)

Thanks, your news service seems better than ours, but I've seen a report that the the person commanding the ship was trying to get the ship, which was clearly sinking rapidly, alongside the harbour wall so that passengers could step ashore, without needing to use the ship's boats, knowing that he had many elderly and unfit passengers aboard.

[peter radclyffe]

Further crazy news:
Prosecutor Francesco Verusio told the daily television La7 that the commander brought the ship to the island so close because he wanted to greet another person with a siren/horn.
The speed of the vessel at time of impact was 21kt, the news state.

http://youtu.be/_ZTCOcx7TrU

[jackster]

Apparently, the Captain was arrested!
http://www.ktvz.com/travelgetaways/30212867/detail.html

[PatCassidy]

Check out the blown-up chart and AIS track for the Costa Concordia. What the hell were they thinking?

http://gcaptain.com/cruise-ship-cost...a-sinks/?37456

[Bob Adams]

Shortly after scratching on the rocks, the person commanding the ship (at this moment it is not clear who it was) dropped the port side anchor and steered hard to port(*), the vessel than made a quick 180deg turn and went aground.

The port side is exposed, I don't see any evidence of anchor deployment....does anyone else?

[Andrew Craig-Bennett]

The hawsepipe is below water.

It would be a sensible thing to do and since using anchors to manoeuvre into and out of berths is commonplace in Italian ports the crew would be able to do it very quickly.

[Bob Adams]

Yup. I was working from memory, just woke up prior to reporting for my second shift of the day, 2nd look at the pictures makes me want to delete that post. Suffice to say, this story is just begining.