20ft. Freighter Canoe build in Alaska

[Oyster]

Hi again, love the fishing shots. There are a lot of experts on here who can talk to you about prop pitch, rpm and speed. Getting the right prop is a huge first step, then getting it at the right depth and angle of attack is next. Apologies if you've gone through this exercise already.

hi johnno,
first and foremost i still have 3 grand children that i need to help catch their first fish, so the fishing shots won't be ending anytime soon. it takes me back to when my kids were coming of age and i could still tie some lead on with out a hook and then they figured out that dads rod was better. i should have bought fish hook stock, because they left a mountain of it in the creek, but what a time we had. any how, my two choices for props are 11 x 11 or 12.25 x 11 and i have tried both with very similar results. i am still tinkering with depth and angle. no apologies necessary because i am still working on my ignorance but gaining ground i think.
royce

[timo4352]

Royce
I found this site doing a quick search: http://www.outboard-boat.com/index.p...lers&Itemid=64
Looks like it might have some good setup info.
Do you have a tach on the motor? A vibratach or tiny tach (just found out about) would be useful to match the prop to the correct rpm. If it were mine I'd shoot more for torque than high end speed. At 12-18 mph you've already got a pretty fast canoe IMO. If you want more speed build a speedboat.

[Oyster]

Royce
I found this site doing a quick search: http://www.outboard-boat.com/index.p...lers&Itemid=64
Looks like it might have some good setup info.
Do you have a tach on the motor? A vibratach or tiny tach (just found out about) would be useful to match the prop to the correct rpm. If it were mine I'd shoot more for torque than high end speed. At 12-18 mph you've already got a pretty fast canoe IMO. If you want more speed build a speedboat.

timo,
thanks for the link, some good info there. yes i have a tach and been using it and gps to test performance. this set up is little different than a outboard on a planing hull. these mud motors are used mostly on flat bottom aluminum jon boats. my canoe is a displacement hull being used when lightly loaded as a planing hull. my ultimate goal would be 14 mph in a 8 mph current. maybe that is asking to much. having messed with engine mounting a good bit, i get the feeling the rub strips could be dragging it down but i don't know. i had it out yesterday with just me in it and had only the back 1/4 to 1/3 of the boat in the water running up river at 14.5 mph and it just felt like i was dragging a long rope. again am i asking to much out of a canoe and 23 hp?

[Oyster]

i scabbed some more plate onto the spacer and now the prop shaft skeg is almost flush with the bottom of the boat and about 2" above the keel. tomorrow i'll gather up some yutes for a day of fish and motor test

[ermine22]

Good morning,
I am requesting advice on the minimum layers of 6 oz fiberglass and epoxy needed for a lightweight 21 foot freighter modeled from a Mad River Kevlar Maine Grand Laker special, that will run with a 10 hp outboard, on moose hunts.
This boat is narrower and deeper than the Teslin freighter canoe design and has proven to be a very efficient design. The keel comes up 4 inches in the back 6 feet. The transom is 21 3/4 wide, midships it is 41 1/4 w and 20 3/4 deep. I want the boat to be able to be carried by 2 men off the rack of a truck down to a river.

It currently weighs 94 lbs and on the outside of the 1/4 by 1 inch sitka spruce strips, there are 3 layers of glass on the bottom and one on the side and on the inside 2 layers of glass on the bottom and one on the sides. There are longitudinal reinforcing strips of glass on the keel and chine on the outside and the same on the inside. The inside also has 2 inch wide glass "ribs" every foot. All the glass is regular "e glass" except for the bottom coat on the outside which is the more puncture and abrasian resistant "s glass".

Barney in Whitehorse Yukon

[Oyster]

Good morning,
I am requesting advice on the minimum layers of 6 oz fiberglass and epoxy needed for a lightweight 21 foot freighter modeled from a Mad River Kevlar Maine Grand Laker special, that will run with a 10 hp outboard, on moose hunts.
This boat is narrower and deeper than the Teslin freighter canoe design and has proven to be a very efficient design. The keel comes up 4 inches in the back 6 feet. The transom is 21 3/4 wide, midships it is 41 1/4 w and 20 3/4 deep. I want the boat to be able to be carried by 2 men off the rack of a truck down to a river.

It currently weighs 94 lbs and on the outside of the 1/4 by 1 inch sitka spruce strips, there are 3 layers of glass on the bottom and one on the side and on the inside 2 layers of glass on the bottom and one on the sides. There are longitudinal reinforcing strips of glass on the keel and chine on the outside and the same on the inside. The inside also has 2 inch wide glass "ribs" every foot. All the glass is regular "e glass" except for the bottom coat on the outside which is the more puncture and abrasian resistant "s glass".

Barney in Whitehorse Yukon

hi barney,
a couple things that i have been told, put equal layers of glass in and out, inside glass protects from outside impacts, when calculating glass lay up weights figure the resin will weigh what the glass weighs. in other words 1 sq yd of 6 oz glass will weigh 12 oz laid up. hope some of that helps
royce

[Oyster]

well, i've found the lowest the engine can run, did not notice any performance gain.

[Oyster]

you can probably see the strain on my copilot and navigators faces, this research and development is sure tuff stuff

[Oyster]

we did manage to land a few fish though

[gstanfield]

Very nice!

[Old Dryfoot]

Congratulations on a beautifully built boat, well done!

Now, could you please tell me(us) a little about your outboard? A post # would also work if you have already done this elsewhere in this thread.

Thanks.

[Oyster]

Very nice!

thanks george,
getting to the country with the ones i love is my raisons in the cake of life. we got a good trip next weekend, 3 daughters, 8 grandkids, 2 son in laws, me, the misses,and 4 rafts. overnight trip, aught to be grand.
royce

[Oyster]

Congratulations on a beautifully built boat, well done!

Now, could you please tell me(us) a little about your outboard? A post # would also work if you have already done this elsewhere in this thread.

Thanks.

hi dryfoot,
thank you.
some where in the threads there is something. the motor is a mud buddy 23 hp surface drive, air cooled briggs vanguard engine. if you google it, there is a lot more info out there
royce

[Old Dryfoot]

Thank you.

[ermine22]

Royce,
Thanks for your post re the weight per glass layer and the need to balance the glass layers in and out.
I will go with 3 layers on the bottom in and out, and 2 on the sides in and out.
I really appreciate the detail in your pictures and comments and all the good advice on this thread.
What material are your oar lock supports made of? Would you do them differently next time?
Thanks
Barney

[Oyster]

[QUOTE=ermine22;3445362]Royce,
Thanks for your post re the weight per glass layer and the need to balance the glass layers in and out.
I will go with 3 layers on the bottom in and out, and 2 on the sides in and out.
I really appreciate the detail in your pictures and comments and all the good advice on this thread.
What material are your oar lock supports made of? Would you do them differently next time?
Thanks

you bet barney,
i used 1/8 bending ply wood and it had really poor glue between lams. should have used marine plywood. next time i think i would make the lower scupper narrower, say 4" on the lower and 6" on the upper. then cut the outriggers tapered with a shoulder that would bear on the top of the wales. i feel it would be easier to fit up and get the proper amount of friction.
royce

[Tim Marchetti]

any updatses???

[Oyster]

any updatses???

hi tim,
boy o boy your boat is sure looking nice. again well done. i have been in montana the last couple weeks so not much to report. the fastest current it has been in is about 4 mph so far. i have plans to put in a stretch of the tanana river that has a couple nasty chutes that run 10 mph to see how she handles it and if i can make any up river headway. i will let you know how she does. did you ever find out what kind of speed they are getting with outboards on the other 20 footers you designed?
thanks
royce

[Tim Marchetti]

thanks Royce
sorry no speed info, but it's something I need to get. The speed thing keeps coming up. It's just something I don't give much thought to.

[Oyster]

made a two day trip into george lake, 3 miles of fast glacier silt river and 4 miles of mellow semi clear creek. miss pearl proved herself well in the stiff current.

[Oyster]

bullwinkle having his salad

[Oyster]

home for a couple days

[Oyster]

poor fishing, but landed a few baby pike

[Oyster]

pretty creek

[Sailor]

WOW, what a place to go boating. I'd love to wander around there in my canoe.

[Tim Marchetti]

home for a couple days

awesome!!!!

[Sailor]

Yeah, Awesome.

[Oyster]

1/8" plywood glue joints failed, next time i will not use plywood and will use epoxy plus cloth between layers

[Oyster]

running and fishing solo, i found the thwarts and gear a chore to get over and around. so i had some honeycomb frp and layed it down and made some seat pedestals and mounted them to it. i also mounted a dry box and cooler on the port side to counter my weight and leave a path to the bow. now to test it.