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Thread: Camper Rowboat from Angus Rowboats

  1. #71

    Default Re: Camper Rowboat from Angus Rowboats

    That's an excellent idea regarding creating box-shaped sponsons that slot into the cockpit well for additional buoyancy. Another big plus with that idea (instead of creating permanent buoyancy structure in the cockpit well) is it frees up foot room when you're anchored.

  2. #72
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    Default Re: Camper Rowboat from Angus Rowboats

    Quote Originally Posted by JonW View Post
    That was the main advantage of a sliding rigger over sliding seat - more stable fore-aft trim. Terry's point is also very valid - changing technique to reduce the max-min shell velocity oscillations is frequently discussed on rowing forums.
    Reducing min-max velocity oscillations seems the more compelling argument to me. Maintaining a constant speed is more efficient than maintaining an accelerating/decelerating speed. Furthermore, the boats have to be designed for the high peak speed. This makes them longer & narrower, which increases wetted surface and therefore drag.

    Another advantage is control. With a longer drive and shorter recovery the oars are in the water more of the time so the boat is under better control. In wind and waves even the best designed ocean scull can go well off course during the glide. A wandering course takes longer to traverse than a straight one. Furthermore, part of the drive energy is wasted correcting the course. A rudder could compensate but that introduces a myriad of other compromises.

    Quote Originally Posted by JonW View Post
    The main disadvantage of a sliding rig in this application would seem to be it's relative complexity. The sliding seat is bullet proof, until the wheels fall off (a spare seat wouldn't take much space). The sliding rig requires more moving parts so has more places to fail.
    The sliding rigger version of the Row Wing(1) looks pretty much exactly the same as the sliding seat version(2)
    (1) http://www.rowalden.com/pubsite11/in...d=93&Itemid=79
    (2) http://www.rowalden.com/pubsite11/in...d=92&Itemid=78

    So I'd love to try a sliding rigger and see how it goes. Having said all this I do see two potential problems for ocean rowing.
    1. Connection to the boat.
    When the sea gets up I greatly appreciate the strong sense of connectedness I get from my feet being strapped firmly to the boat. In a sliding rigger the feet are strapped to something that moves. Not so good. The bum, however, has to be strongly connected as this is where the drive is transmitted. For this reason sliding rigger setups all have a seat back of some sort. A seatbelt might even have some merit. However, the bum is round and relatively soft compared to the feet. I suspect it would be impossible to enjoy the same level of body-english boat-control in lumpy seas. There are times when I feel like I'm standing on the boat and very solidly controlling it with my feet.

    2. Larger footwell.
    The feet are the lowest part in a sculling system. The cockpit floor has to be lowest where the feet go. In a sliding seat setup the feet go nowhere so this area can be small. When swamped there'd be about one bucket of water hurting stability, speed & control until the bailer got rid of it. In a sliding rigger it could easily be four buckets worth, probably more.

    An exercise evaluating all these pros & cons on the water would be very instructive. Unfortunately our club's ocean sculls (Maas Aeros & Maas 24s) can't take sliding riggers. But both Angus' "Expedition" & "Rowing Yacht" could. Perhaps that is reason enough to build one.

    Finally, my thoughts on a suitable tent attached.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  3. #73
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    Default Re: Camper Rowboat from Angus Rowboats

    There's also the front-facing rowing systems, as a kayaker/canoer I'm in favour of seeing where I am gong - there's a discussion thread on that here -


    http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/boat-design/front-rowing-system-canoe-37905.html

  4. #74
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    Default Re: Camper Rowboat from Angus Rowboats

    The Sliding rigger I built for my wife and I used 6 wheels, 4 above the beams and 2 below. The 2 below were to insure the rigger was retained even when the boat was bouncing down the road in the back of my pickup. They actually don't do anything (I discovered). There doesn't seem to be any real merit to the comment there are more moving parts. On my crudely built boats the rigger certainly weighs more than on a sliding seat, but the sliding mass in motion is much less.

    My boat is an 11' catamaran with very fine hulls. Pitching is not really visable. We are not serious rowers so no comment about efficiency.

    "The main disadvantage of a sliding rig in this application would seem to be it's relative complexity. The sliding seat is bullet proof, until the wheels fall off (a spare seat wouldn't take much space). The sliding rig requires more moving parts so has more places to fail.

    Regards

    Jonathan[/QUOTE]

  5. #75
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    Jan 2012
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    Twisp, WA (or cruising on the Marsh Duck)
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    Default Re: Camper Rowboat from Angus Rowboats

    Those intersted in Collin's boat but wanting to sail might be interested in my current project, 18'LOA, 42" beam, aft cabin, hull shape similar to IC 10. I expect she'll be fun and fast to sail and not bad to row, though a bit slower than the Angus Cruiser. I expect to carry lots of sail in light winds, less and less as the wind increases. I IMAGINE covering longer distances with less effort than in a boat that's only rowed. We'll see. I'll be putting her together as soon as the weather warms enough for epoxy to cure outside. http://scotdomergueblog@wordpress.com if you want to follow along.

    I've tried to insert a couple of images, but can't seem to make it work . . .

  6. #76
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    Default Re: Camper Rowboat from Angus Rowboats

    Scotd,

    Is it necessary to log in to see your blog?

  7. #77
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    Default Re: Camper Rowboat from Angus Rowboats

    Quote Originally Posted by scotd View Post
    Those intersted in Collin's boat but wanting to sail might be interested in my current project, 18'LOA, 42" beam, aft cabin, hull shape similar to IC 10. I expect she'll be fun and fast to sail and not bad to row, though a bit slower than the Angus Cruiser. I expect to carry lots of sail in light winds, less and less as the wind increases. I IMAGINE covering longer distances with less effort than in a boat that's only rowed. We'll see. I'll be putting her together as soon as the weather warms enough for epoxy to cure outside. http://scotdomergueblog@wordpress.com if you want to follow along.

    I've tried to insert a couple of images, but can't seem to make it work . . .
    The link doesn't work. However if you type it in and substitute a 'dot' for the '@' sign, then you'll get to the blog. No log in req'd.

  8. #78
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    Default Re: Camper Rowboat from Angus Rowboats

    Dryfeet, Thanks for the tip, I got in.

    Scotd, interesting boat. have you thought about Frank Smoots sail and rig for this boat? He has a low CE, easy hoisting, and about the same area you are talking about, all based on using windsurfer masts like you have obtained. Check out the thread "slickest folder ever" @ boatdesign.net in the Multihulls section. Or go to his site DIY-tris.com and look for the 2012 section. Are you going to have a ballasted centerboard? Sorry if you said so , I'm in a hurry to get back out to starting a new Kayak.

    Marc

  9. #79
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    Default Re: Camper Rowboat from Angus Rowboats

    Yes, my error when I typed in the url. It should be http://scotdomergueblog.wordpress.com/

    Thanks for the suggestion on sail rig . . . I've seen his diy site - interesting boats! I'll continue to contemplate and play with the stuff I've found/received for sail rig and then experiment once the boat's built.

    Current plan is a simple wood daggerboard, not ballasted. The cockpit side decks are flat, so should be reasonably comfortable to have body out over the water with feet in the well. I'd like to keep the whole thing as light and simple as possible. At the same time, it's all experimental! Once the basic boat is built, I'll try the easiest, simplest, lightest approaches - if they work well, great. If I can see or imagine better ways, I'll try them. Sail rig, daggerboard, rudder control (will try long tiller at first), sliding seat rowing (simple, short wood outriggers and seat tracks mounted to cockpit floor), etc. should all be easy enough to change.

  10. #80
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    Default Re: Camper Rowboat from Angus Rowboats

    Maybe the simplest downwind and reaching sail, and easy to set from a rowing boat or canoe is a small parafoil. Needs to get a fairlead forward. Could be tucked through a bite in a painter. Brian Schulz ( Cape Falcon Kayaks) used one with great success in a kayak trip down the Oregon coast.

    Not sure the reason for a daggerboard if not sailing; if it is ahead of the rowing position or ahead of amidships the boat will be gripy; we have had success rowing a ducker ( pure double ender) backwards with a inch or two of daggerboard in the sailing daggerboard spot. If I did anything for trim control in a pure rowing boat I would install an adjustable skeg as seen in many seakayaks, or an after daggerboard.
    Ben Fuller
    Ran Tan, Liten Kuhling, Tipsy, Tippy, Josef W., Merry Mouth, Imp, Macavity, Look Far, Flash and a quiver of other 'yaks.
    "Bound fast is boatless man."

  11. #81
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    Default Re: Camper Rowboat from Angus Rowboats

    I admire a purist, and this is a purist boat. It’s meant for what it is meant for. I don’t think a sliding rig would change much, the boat must be far too heavy to accelerate and decelerate significantly through the rowing cycle, and there would be the extra complexity to worry about.

    Even a pure rowing machine can still employ a simple downwind sail; for this boat I would recommend the fishing umbrella, folds away compactly when not in use, convenient handle hooks onto the coaming, doubles as a sunshade and - OMG - even works as a brolly . . . on a boat such as this everything needs to multitask
    Last edited by Terry Haines; 04-12-2012 at 06:27 PM.

  12. #82
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    Default Re: Camper Rowboat from Angus Rowboats

    Quote Originally Posted by scotd View Post
    Those intersted in Collin's boat but wanting to sail might be interested in my current project, 18'LOA, 42" beam, aft cabin, hull shape similar to IC 10. . .
    --- I like the idea. Aft cabin gets windage where it is of some use, in some situations, and I for one think even a rowing-orinted boat should have some kind of sail :-) Keep us posted. -- Wade

  13. #83
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    Ste Anne, Manitoba, Canda
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    Default Re: Camper Rowboat from Angus Rowboats

    The tread is a bit old, wondering if there have been any changes or upgrades made to the Angus Rowboat?

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