Drake -- 40' LOD Munroe-influenced ketch

[Dave Hadfield]

A friend went by Drake last fall from a cruise boat, and from her upper deck got a shot or two of Drake at her mooring.

I quite liked being at a mooring. This was my first year of it. I didn't mind the lack of electricity at all, and using the dinghy was seldom much of an inconvenience -- just once when I left without my cellphone, which I realized 5 minutes down the road. It's a good dinghy, 10 ft, of my own design, which rows well.

I love the privacy. It's not as good as being at anchor, but not far off. I've never been much for dock-life.

Sure made single-handing easier. Each time I left I attached a thick, 30 ft, floating line (3/4" yellow polypro with sections of pool noodle threaded on) to the buoy, which when I returned made hooking-on simplicity itself. I used chain over the bowsprit to hold her permanently, as you can see (I hope). To protect the edge of the oaken bowsprit, I made a chafe-guard from 2" copper water pipe, screwed in place. And then used a small loop of chain to keep it centered on the guard.

No problems -- no theft, only 1 minor ding (incident unknown), and she handled 50 kt winds several times, during which the chop in the harbour can get to 2 ft.

When the yard manager saw how much I liked it, he put out 4 more moorings -- hadn't had much demand in the past, but apparently the sight of Drake out there generated numerous inquiries.

[Stewart Readman]

A fine boat!

Hi Dave,

What a fantastic vessel! Wonderful photographs and information. Its great to get an insight into the history of this boat and to see that she has been well cared for and respected.
Congratulations and best wishes, Stewart

[htom]

Better and better. Thank you, Dave, and those who have provided photos and stories.

[LakeErieSailor]

Hi, Dave

Beautiful boat! I am very jealous.

I have some questions for you concerning a similar boat that I'm planning to build, an expanded version of Munroe's "Egret", "Snowy Egret", 39.5', Reuel Parker-designed. You mentioned sailing "Drake" on Lake Superior; I intend using my boat on Lake Erie and the upper lakes, but also in the Inside Passage of B.C. and Alaska, and also occasionally for short trips in the Gulf of Alaska, Cook Inlet and Prince Albert Sound. I think that Lake Superior has some characterstics in common with these waters, i.e., sudden weather changes, large waves, etc. So I (finally) come to my questions: how did your boat handle in Superior? Did you think it safe? Do you think that the "Snowy Egret" is a good choice for her intended use?

Reuel Parker originally designed her for a client in B.C., to sail around the San Juan Islands, so she's being used in at least some of the waters in which I intend to use her.

Your photo of "Drake" at her mooring is also very instructive. I'm presenty launching and recovering my 20' sharpie on a launch ramp over a 5' seawall into shallow water, which can be a pain. I have deeper water, 3' to 4' about 350' or so out, and have been considering making a mooring there. The nice thing is that in summer I could wade out to the boat; the downside is that others also could. Oh, well...

Thanks for any advice that you can give me.

[Dave Hadfield]

Thanks for the comments!

Erie, Drake would be better for heavy waters if she was about a foot, maybe 16", wider. She'd have a little more power to carry sail then.

In Superior (or Alaska I imagine), there sometimes aren't that many harbours, and if you can't make a harbour by sunset, you've got to head offshore and spend a night "at sea". Out there, you've got to be able to deal with 40 kts of wind -- it happens. If it's on-shore, you've got to be able to sail your way off. That takes a hull which must support enough sail to drive upwind against the wind and sea. Having the long keel allows heaving-to, as well.

Drake can do this against 25 kts, but probably not 40. If the boat lacks the power to do this, then the sailing plan must be adjusted to stay out of those situations, using careful judgement and not trusting forecasts.

I do like the centerboard. Even though she still draws 40", I can usually find a spot in a crowded anchorage even if I arrive late. Makes a huge difference for anchoring or hiding from storms.

For regular cruising of colder, wilderness waters, I'd have a permanent wood-burning stove of some kind, and a dodger.

[Dave Hadfield]

I like the Snowy Egret. http://www.parker-marine.com/sh39page.html

I'd prefer a shallow, 3/4 length keel. I don't see the external box-keel he mentions in the plans. Where is it? A shallow keel aids in heaving-to and generally in manners under sail. Drake self-steers. Mighty nice!

That companionway dodger could be extended a bit, then you could steer from under it using a simple tiller-line around the cockpit on 4 blocks.

Fine-looking boat, though. It would turn my crank....

[LakeErieSailor]

Hi, Dave

Thanks for the thoughtful advice. The "Snowy Egret" design appeals because of its relatively simple and inexpensive construction, but mostly because of the well-established and documented seaworthyness of the "Egrets" generally.

I haven't seen the plans yet, so I can't say about the outside keel. I've been in touch with the designer and will be getting the study plan from him shortly. If the outside keel is not shown, I'll be sure to ask him about it. From what you said about clawing off a lee shore, it would seem to be quite necessary.

If you're ever in the Monroe, Michigan area, either sailing or otherwise, let me know; my phone number is 734-289-4424. We live on the Lake Erie shore and I'd love to be able to tell you that you could sail right up to our place, but the water's way too shallow. Although a scant quarter of a mile away is Brest Bay Marina...

By the way, I've built another of Reuel Parker designs, the 20' Maryland Crabbing Skiff. For various reasons I wasn't able to get in any real sailing last year, but I intend to remedy that this year.

[Dave Hadfield]

Well you're not too far away from where I spent all my boyhood summers: Stag Island, in the St. Clair River, opposite St. Mary's Michigan. We still have a cottage there. If you're ever up that way let me know. I don't keep Drake there, but we have a 14 ft plywood sailboat that does very well and is lots of fun to sail.

DAVE

[Dave Hadfield]

Bump, to show a number of people at my boatyard, Dutchman's Cove, Penetanguishene, Ontario, information about Drake -- which has just launched! Successfully, too, though a month late.

It took up faster than I thought, though I had preswelled the centerboard trunk and the bottom 4 planks. In 36 hours, the bilge pump comes on once an hour. At first-splash, it was Niagara Falls.

[Don Kurylko]

David, I may have a clue for you as to the designer of your boat: William Roue, of Bluenose fame. If you look at page 119 of the latest issue of WoodenBoat, in the top left hand corner you will see a photo of a 54’ schooner designed by Roue advertised for sale. The hull shape and cabin style are remarkably similar to Drake. I would say that both boats stem from the same pen.

I googled Roue and came up with this URL http://www.joelro.com/wjr/DesignPortfolio.html
It lists a ketch, design #112, for a client named L.M. Waloon. LOA 41’ 7” LWL 35’. Unfortunately, no other dimensions or details are given, but I think it would be worth pursuing. They may still have the original plans I also checked the Kingman Brokerage site, but the schooner was not listed. An e-mail inquiry to them might turn something up too.

Good hunting,
Don

[Dave Hadfield]

Thanks, Don. Yes, she does look similar. https://proto2.yachtworld.com/privat...&slim=pp267098&

But her hull draws 6 ft, so it may just be a case of "convergent evolution".

Wouldn't I just love to be able to say she was designed by William Roue?!!!

[Don Kurylko]

With 6’-2” headroom and such large cabins on a 36' LWL, I’m willing to bet this schooner was originally a centreboarder. A boat this big with 6’ draft would not require such high cabin tops. But that aside, designers often rework similar designs for different clients. I’m not suggesting that this schooner and your ketch share the same hull. Rather, I think the styling is significantly similar and suggests that Roue could possibly be Drakes designer. Design #112 fits the dimensions of your boat remarkably closely. One of your B&W photos above shows the original boat, sans boomkin, and with a short bowsprit. It would certainly suggest a 41’-7” LOA on a 35’ LWL.

Perhaps MMD or some of our fellow Nova Scotians might know of this schooner and her builder and be able to shed some light on ketch design #112 as well.

Excerpted from Kingman website:

Designed by William Roue and built by Warren Robar in Novia Scotia (1964), WINTERWOOD (ex-Poseidon II & ex-Boreas) has a wonderful history. She was purchased by her extremely knowledgable current owner's in 1983 in dire need of retrofitting, and was re-launched in 1986 after a major re-building and renovation. Over the past 18 years WINTERWOOD has received additional renovation, upgrading, outfitting, and normal yearly maintenance. She is a fast schooner that is quite at home on the classic racing course, having been a two-time great lakes schooner champion, a three time class B winner in the Great Chesapeake Bay Schooner Race, and a winner of the Glouchester Schooner races.



Image won't load for some reason. I was hoping to compare it to this photo of Drake. Note the bow profile in particular and the positioning of the portholes high up near the roof of the cabin in both boats.

[George Ray]

Great Chesapeake Bay Schooner Race: History/results

http://www.schoonerrace.org/longhistory.htm

[Dave Hadfield]

Bump, to illustrate Cetol 2,3 Plus in use on a boat (that's the house grade stuff) after 7 years, usually with 1 coat a year maintenance.

[lestat]

Greetings Mr.Hadfield,

Forgive this intrusion on your thread, perhaps you recall I had mentioned, a year or two ago, recalling your boat from my past?
Out of simple curiosity, and not meaning to pry, but did you manage to arrange a sail together with Pierre Charbonneau?
Fresh pictures and a story of that encounter would be most appreciated and rather fitting considering the "archeological"nature of this thread.
Mind you, I would certainly understand and respect your decision not to relate a story,should you consider it too personal or if,unfortunately, a sail together never managed to occur.
Thank you for bumping this thread into view,once again and happy haul-out!