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Thread: Keep Turning Left's Dylan Winter gets Google's pink slip.

  1. #1
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    Default Keep Turning Left's Dylan Winter gets Google's pink slip.

    Interesting story for those who enjoy the series and the work he does, and the problems with Google and Adsense:

    http://www.duckworksmagazine.com/11/...nter/index.htm

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Keep Turning Left's Dylan Winter gets Google's pink slip.

    Heres hoping that good common sense prevails .........

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    Default Re: Keep Turning Left's Dylan Winter gets Google's pink slip.

    Maybe his best bet is to get adsense reinstated only on his trucking youtubes. I hope it works out because I have really enjoyed KTL.
    Will

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    Default Re: Keep Turning Left's Dylan Winter gets Google's pink slip.

    The Google slogan is “Don’t Be Evil”. You could not make it up.
    . . .
    Simpler is better, except when complicated looks really cool.

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    Default Re: Keep Turning Left's Dylan Winter gets Google's pink slip.

    Maybe I am naive, I had no idea there was so much money to be made with Google. This paragraph disturbs me a little
    27_TrafficSources: they are subscribers. I promote the site through keepturningleft on YouTube and by being active in the sailing forums in the UK, USA and Australia. This is a classic 1,000 true fans operation. They are keen sailors and they are watching my well produced sailing films
    Dylan was clearly and blatantly in contravention of the rules here too. I think he'll sort it out to some advantage but I think he more that skirted the grey areeas of the rules for long enough.

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    Default Re: Keep Turning Left's Dylan Winter gets Google's pink slip.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hwyl View Post
    Maybe I am naive, I had no idea there was so much money to be made with Google. This paragraph disturbs me a little
    Dylan was clearly and blatantly in contravention of the rules here too. I think he'll sort it out to some advantage but I think he more that skirted the grey areeas of the rules for long enough.
    Maybe - but don't Google's policies of rewarding high search results to sites with lots of links to them play a role here? What I mean is that if you play Google's game for one aspect, should you be penalized for what that does elsewhere?

    Not saying you're wrong - just asking....

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    Default Re: Keep Turning Left's Dylan Winter gets Google's pink slip.

    I agree, I guess I'm talking from the point of view of a contributor to this forum and somewhat hypocritically because I tangentially promote my own business on here. I've thought for a while though that Dylan was juggling a lot of balls. I have no opinion as to the Google rules, I thought residuals or whatever they are called would be in the $5 a week range. This is a whole new arena for me

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    Default Re: Keep Turning Left's Dylan Winter gets Google's pink slip.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hwyl View Post
    I agree, I guess I'm talking from the point of view of a contributor to this forum and somewhat hypocritically because I tangentially promote my own business on here. I've thought for a while though that Dylan was juggling a lot of balls. I have no opinion as to the Google rules, I thought residuals or whatever they are called would be in the $5 a week range. This is a whole new arena for me
    I hear ya -

    AdWords is Google's flagship advertising product and main source of revenue. Google's total advertising revenues were USD$23 billion in 2009
    (bold red mine)

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AdWords

  9. #9
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    Default Boiling tin cans and google pink slips

    Quote Originally Posted by Hwyl View Post
    Maybe I am naive, I had no idea there was so much money to be made with Google. This paragraph disturbs me a little
    Dylan was clearly and blatantly in contravention of the rules here too. I think he'll sort it out to some advantage but I think he more that skirted the grey areeas of the rules for long enough.


    Thanks for your interest in the ongoing story of an attempt to film and explore the 20,000 mile long coastline of this small island from the cockpit of an 18 foot 50 year old boat.
    The Google Adsense story is just one incident of the unfolding odyssey – just like the setback when I holed the slug on the rocks off Cromer.


    Mea Culpa - as I said I broke the Google Adsense rules - but the contract and ancilliary information are well over 10,000 words long - and that is before you get into the pages of Faqs etc so there are plenty of rules you can break. In fact I doubt that there are many adsense users who are not already in breach.

    - did I read all the rules
    - nope

    But Google adsense are not alone in the length of the contracts we all click to agree

    - the youtube contract alone is 4,000 words - how many youtube sucribers read those?
    how many of us have read the contract we clicked when joining this forum?
    -they are not designed to be read by ordinary people – they are not there to protect us – they are there to protect the people who paid the expensive lawayers who drew them up.

    One of the ktl susbcribers is a lawyer and she offered to read the contract for me - after this thing blew up. Her reaction was "wow - these guys hire the best" - and I clicked in a box agreeing to let them do everything they did. But as I had not read all the contractual stuff that did not stop it being a surprise.

    As for the money I was earning from the truck films on youtube - I am amazed that it has come as a surprise to you – that information is a just a click or two away using a well known search engine owned by the people who own adsense and also own Youtube.

    - but I did it before I knew that I was not allowed to tell people stuff that was already in the public domaine because any fool knows that is how it works

    - for me it was somewhere between $1 and £1 per thousand views –to save you looking it up - but I have no real idea how they calculated it - it seemed to go up and down - and adsense would not reveal why.

    Why am I revealing it again – because the information is just a click away (type "how much do youtube partners earn" into Google - and also Google make it completely clear that their decision about stopping an account is final. Absolution is not possible. A ban is irrevocable there is no appeal to a human being - my goose is cooked.

    However, the trucking films have had 20 million hits - this one alone has had 13,000,000

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDyx0JyHelo

    An hours worth of TV show that reached 20 million people would have a budget a good bit bigger than $20,000

    I also have a youtube space about rodeos and ranching
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjR4XzogY00


    and then there are the sailing films
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8B8iAaLmuLM
    that one got 25,000 hits – the best hitting sailing film I made – but sailing is a tiny compared to trucks or rodeos

    So you can earn okay money provided you can deliver the sort of hits that sailing films never, ever will. Certainly not ones made by an ugly man in an ugly boat making films for small boat sailors.


    One way or another I ended up making truck and rodeo films for google to make money by placing adverts against them. They were, still are, getting between $5 and $25 per thousand - again you can check thesse figures using a well known search engine.


    The low hits on the sailing films meant that they were never going to cover their costs on youtube. Some sailors were obvioulsy enjoying the films - they were getting 5,000 pretty quick hits and then tailing away - so they were keen - they were asking for DVDs and I was filming in HD – to see my nicely shot films compressed by Youtube is pretty depressing so I tried the subscription model.


    It is a well established pattern - photogenic ladies do it all over the web.


    So I tried d doing it with photogenic boats, lovely rivers, an offbeat take on British History and an obvious love of the sea and the coastal margins.

    $4.99 a quarter – a new film every week - 6 hours of film and 700 blokes have now stumped up the price of a pint of beeer – I am sure you can do the maths.

    Still not enough – so I put the adsense blocks on the website. This was a stupid, stupid, naieve thing to do.

    I told the subscribers that I now had three sources of income – subscriptions, amazon and adsense.

    However, I thought that any fool knows that people get payed by click throughs – and not to have told the subscribers would have been breaking part of the relationship I have with ktl subscribers.

    They know that I am sailing a crap boat and eating tins of cheap curry because I am doing the journey and making the films on a shoestring. When bits fall off the slug its not because I am pretending that the boat is a 50 year old knackered plastic four knot ^&%$ box. Its because it really is - no-one in their right mind would do such a trip in £2,000 boat.

    Some of the subscribers now feel as though their money is making a serious contribution to a worthwhile and entertaining project. One bloke sent me £30 to replace my five year old Reeds because he hated the thought of me heading for bouys that Trinity House had moved three years ago.

    Is it worth while doing? - well some people see no reason why they should subsidise another blokes sailing. I completely understand why they should think that.

    Others - like the poor old ice bound North Americans who make up a big slice of the viewers - find that my films are the closest they can get to sailing between November and march. Others just seem to enjoy coming along for the ride and like listening to me say rude things about jetskis, Motorboats, Frenchmen and BMW drivers.


    I for one really wish that some-one like me could have filmed our coasts as they were 100 years ago – or even 200.

    Now technology has made this possible – and no-one has done it yet. Sure blokes have zipped around the UK in six weeks or six months – but none of them has been a professional cameraman.


    Technology also makes it possible for me to get the films to the sailors who are interested in the journey - and they come from all over the world.


    Sadly what technology gives it can also take away - and in a most inhumane way.


    Before Google threw me out of adsense I calculated that if I could get 1000 subscribers to the sailing site then I could use the trucking money to subsidise the ktkl project and keep the journey going while working on the sailing films almost full time - each 25 minuter takes about two weeks to cut, edit and mix.

    My openness on the sailing has cost me the trucking income and I now need 3000 subscribers to make the sailing films viable.
    Will I get that number before I run out of savings?...... dunno.

    will Google, who own Adsense, who own youtube take the ultimate revenge on me and kick all the the trucking films off youtube as well for breaking some of the rules in their 4,000 word contract. That will hit the sales of my trucking DVDs

    Dunno that either - but I am reasonably certain that in 100 years time blokes like you and I will be watching the films I have made - not because they are great films but to see 20 Thames barges racing, to see sandwharfs that have long gone, to see the Thames before the windfarms came and the Severn before the barrage was built.

    However, this thing is a lot bigger than just my little project - lots of the websites that we sailors use - such as windguru, tidal sites, harbour information and forums depend on adsense and others for their revenues. If some sailors decide they want to go clicking on adverts and not buying stuff then those websites could also get the pink slip.

    However, to bring this back to small boat sailing ----- on the front page of the keep turning left website there is a short film where I demonstrate that heating unpierced tin cans in a pan of boiling water is a perfectly safe way of cooking and saves a massive amount of washing up. Very useful on a small boat.

    Thanks for your interest chaps


    Dylan Winter
    Last edited by dylan winter; 12-26-2010 at 07:10 PM.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Keep Turning Left's Dylan Winter gets Google's pink slip.

    Gareth,

    I'll gently disagree with you. I've enjoyed Dylan's postings to the forum and I have enjoyed your posts at least as much.

    In the process of reading those posts I've learned that Dylan makes videos that I can watch, and that you deliver yachts. I don't feel that either of you has been advertising at me. I've never bought services from either of you, though I might choose to do so in the future.

    I'll add that I've discovered other services and products built by forum members in the course of reading their posts as well. I don't see anyone stepping over the line and blatantly advertising here at the moment.

    Just my opinion, Merry Christmas
    Yachting, the only sport where you get to be a mechanic, electrician, plumber and carpenter

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    Default Re: Keep Turning Left's Dylan Winter gets Google's pink slip.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Hunter View Post
    Gareth,

    .

    Just my opinion, Merry Christmas
    Mostly agreed and Happy Birthday

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    Default Re: Keep Turning Left's Dylan Winter gets Google's pink slip.

    I would say however that this quote from Dylan
    I promote the site through keepturningleft on YouTube and by being active in the sailing forums in the UK, USA and Australia.
    does not comply with this rule
    Don't sell stuff or services.

  13. #13
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    Default Re: Keep Turning Left's Dylan Winter gets Google's pink slip.

    It's been said for decades that everything a human can do a computer can do better. Google probably has the processing power to make half the world's population obsolete. They started with librarians, now human resources, and what about that car that drives itself?
    1947 Nordic Folkboat "Nina"

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